The good, the bad, and the really bad vs Eagles

[Guest]

Honestly, this game reminded me of the 2012 preseason game against the Lions. We started out the first series with a good running game but turnovers ended our drives. the offensive plays were good consdering Marlon was wide open but Flacco simply overthrew him. You can't blame the OC when the QB simply make a bad play.

 

In the lions game, Stafford went 12/17 for 184 yards and 2 touchdowns with Calvin Johnson having 111 yards and a touchdown. Cary Williams and Jimmy Smith got abused in that preseason game and everyone was freaked out over our struggle. This game was similar to that game in that we simply werent' prepared for what the other team ran. I am not worried in the long run. We just need to learn from the fast paced sets that the Eagles run and focus on covering the underneath plays. 

 

The penalties were simply bogus with us getting flagged on every single possession.

 

Once the Refs disagreed with the righteous tackle of Bradford by Suggs and Suggs argued it, we never got the benefit of the doubt. All calls were construed against us. It was B.S.

2nd team defense has looked terrible in both games.

Schaub is painful to watch for the most part.

Looked like a team attempting to find itself and having no luck.

Eagles appear to have a better understanding of who they are on both sides of the ball.

Our defense appears much like last years. Can't get off the field.

 

Really worried about our Defensive Line, but Brandon Williams laid a hit on Bradford that is making him wonder if he really wants to play this game.  I think we'll be better than we showed.

Waller belongs in the NFL, the Ravens no doubt will keep him. I love watching him play. Big and super fast dude for a WR. Gonna have a bright future here. 

 

Really liked the TD because he learned from the same play when he took off too quick on Schaub. This time he waited, went up and caught a less than perfect ball and followed his blocker right in.

Ngata is one of those players no one appreciates until he's gone. Jernigan williams and carl davis loom like good players, but between losing Ngata and McPhee the front took a big big loas.

 

I think we will miss Ngata agree Jernigan and Williams will make plays.

Not worried. Would rather have flacco screw up now than in a big game. Just sayingZ

 

On the 1st Pick, Flacco was flushed from the pocket due to the makeshift line and threw across his body. The ball was slightly underthrown, but Aiken didn't adjust for it either. It was a lucky tip drill pick.  On the 2nd Pick, not sure Marlon Brown ran the correct route. You can put it on Flacco, but I'm not as sure.

... and unfortunately it is not fast enough.

 

PI? Maybe, but you can't count on that and Aiken could get no separation. We need someone to stretch the field and there is only one on the roster that can ... and we wait. 

 

Aiken gave us on that play what he has. He is not dynamic.  We have 2 players that can spread the field and maybe 3 because Carter is capable if he stays.

calling it now, kendrick lewis is going to have an awful season.

I did not like what I saw of K. Lewis, but we'll give him a couple games to shake it off. I don't know why we can't draft a decent Safety it is a paramount need.

Edited August 23, 2015 by Danny D

[redlobster]

Albert clearly punched some dude

Freaking idiot

Video?

[Moderator 2]

Interesting article about the refs: http://www.footballzebras.com/2015/08/20/12857/ The are experimenting also. Whenever Jerome Boger refs a Ravens game the team needs to play cleaner then clean, if y'all remember he called Sizzle for 'Malice in his heart' years ago.

^^^^^^ all that being said Flacco took responsibility for his over throws and int. That is what I love about him.

[polynesian15]

Can someone give a newbie like me a quick run through of Chip's fast paced offense. 

-The media seems to hype it

-Eagles fans seem to brag about the number of plays being run etc.

If it's so effective why aren't more teams running a similar scheme?
Is it a gimmick or are teams missing out?

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

Can someone give a newbie like me a quick run through of Chip's fast paced offense.

-The media seems to hype it

-Eagles fans seem to brag about the number of plays being run etc.

If it's so effective why aren't more teams running a similar scheme?

Is it a gimmick or are teams missing out?

It is a very beatable gimmick. The Eagles just happen to load it with talent. Hence it being effective. NFL Defenses have already figured it out. Problem is, sometimes their offense has too much talent for the said defense to overcome.

If it was the regular season we'd probably walk all over them if we were healthy. That defense of there's isn't very impressive and we were able to get pressure without really game planning.

[Static]

Chip Kelly played Harbs and joint practices need to never happen again.

[Runnin Raven]

Given a night to sleep on it, I'm not gonna get worked up.  We were vanilla I think on both O & D.  Chip's got a unique fast-break O that we simply hadn't spent time preparing for.  Disappointed that Joe wasn't better.  Funny thing is, you know if this were a playoff game Joe would have been razor sharp.  I'd like more consistency out of the guy during the reg season, that's all.  At WR I hope they are just protecting Camp by not playing him.  I mean, he's made the team as long as he's healthy. Waller needs to given the opportunity to replace Perriman.  He's the only one with the size/speed combo and he's earned it. Heady stuff for a 6th rounder but he seems to be a fast learner and makes plays when the lights come on.

 

On D...Sizzle blew his lid early after the personal foul and that set the tone.  That's when a leader like himself needs to rally the troops.  Arthur Brown is fast, really fast.  Man if he could just get the mental part down.  Jernigan was kinda quiet I think.  Also I'm calling it - Tray Walker will be a star in this league.

 

We need to get healthy on the O-line obviously.

[rmw10]

It was hard to tell in the video because the player just exited the frame before I could see the second number, but it looks like the biggest culprit was Tramain Jacobs on the outside for Barner's PR TD.  He way overran the play.  Levine and Trawick slightly overran it, but they were responsible for holding the outside.  Orr missed the tackle and it was off to the races.

[polynesian15]

Given a night to sleep on it, I'm not gonna get worked up.  We were vanilla I think on both O & D.  Chip's got a unique fast-break O that we simply hadn't spent time preparing for.  Disappointed that Joe wasn't better.  Funny thing is, you know if this were a playoff game Joe would have been razor sharp.  I'd like more consistency out of the guy during the reg season, that's all.  At WR I hope they are just protecting Camp by not playing him.  I mean, he's made the team as long as he's healthy. Waller needs to given the opportunity to replace Perriman.  He's the only one with the size/speed combo and he's earned it. Heady stuff for a 6th rounder but he seems to be a fast learner and makes plays when the lights come on.

 

On D...Sizzle blew his lid early after the personal foul and that set the tone.  That's when a leader like himself needs to rally the troops.  Arthur Brown is fast, really fast.  Man if he could just get the mental part down.  Jernigan was kinda quiet I think.  Also I'm calling it - Tray Walker will be a star in this league.

 

We need to get healthy on the O-line obviously.

Would you mind elaborating on that 'fast-break O'? (why wouldn't they prepare for the game?)

PS. Is Chip messing up by showing his cards too early (2nd pre season game)?

Edited August 23, 2015 by polynesian15

[GrimCoconut]

Given a night to sleep on it, I'm not gonna get worked up. We were vanilla I think on both O & D. Chip's got a unique fast-break O that we simply hadn't spent time preparing for. Disappointed that Joe wasn't better. Funny thing is, you know if this were a playoff game Joe would have been razor sharp. I'd like more consistency out of the guy during the reg season, that's all. At WR I hope they are just protecting Camp by not playing him. I mean, he's made the team as long as he's healthy. Waller needs to given the opportunity to replace Perriman. He's the only one with the size/speed combo and he's earned it. Heady stuff for a 6th rounder but he seems to be a fast learner and makes plays when the lights come on.

On D...Sizzle blew his lid early after the personal foul and that set the tone. That's when a leader like himself needs to rally the troops. Arthur Brown is fast, really fast. Man if he could just get the mental part down. Jernigan was kinda quiet I think. Also I'm calling it - Tray Walker will be a star in this league.

We need to get healthy on the O-line obviously.

I've noticed this too and forgot to mention it. I've noticed that since Suggs took on a bigger role as a leader we've melted down on defense when questionable flags are thrown. That simply has to stop.

[GrimCoconut]

After listening to Harbs, Sizzle, and a few of the other players in their locker room interviews, it appears that we were without communication all of the first half of the game. Harbs said we didn't have it for most of the first half at all, and when it did start to come back it was very crackly and the guys could get or understand the calls.

Harbs seemed to indicate that it was preseason and they didn't do any game planning as they are still evaluating players and looking for players at certain positions, which is normal for us at this point in preseason. Sizzle said they didn't game plan and they definitely didn't see any of that in practice. Sizzle also alluded to the fact that generally no one is familiar with Chip's style of offense except those that probably see it most within the division.

Would seem that ole' Chip kind of gave us a shot to the bough by game planning a bit more than we were expecting, lol. It would make sense as he has a lot to prove to validate all his offseason changes. Granted we did have a lackluster performance by the ones at points, but it does put some things in perspective! It is kind of hard to perform in an away stadium with little to no communication on a preseason game plan when your opponents have both.

That's certainly strange. Hasn't this happened to us before? I'm surprised it's just coming out now because I didn't see any indication of it during the game. I don't want to be pessimistic but it almost sounds like an excuse.

I do believe Chip held out in practices but that's expected. He doesn't exactly seem like the most honest guy lol. He still looked sharp and we looked dull. It sucks but oh well.

I'm not really worried yet. These things happen. I'm more concerned with intangibles than anything. The slew of injuries to our OL has me concerned along with the lack of discipline after calls didn't go our way early. The fact that everyone looked lost out there certainly does lend credence to the reason Harbaugh gave regarding our performance.

Edited August 23, 2015 by GrimCoconut

[balfan23]

Interesting article about the refs: http://www.footballzebras.com/2015/08/20/12857/ The are experimenting also. Whenever Jerome Boger refs a Ravens game the team needs to play cleaner then clean, if y'all remember he called Sizzle for 'Malice in his heart' years ago.

^^^^^^ all that being said Flacco took responsibility for his over throws and int. That is what I love about him.

We could consider whatever experiment that crew was trying to perform a complete failure, however, I don't think it was the positioning of the officials that was the issue. It was their incompetence combined with their deep level of involvement in the flow of the game. That's a really bad combo. 

 

The game was hideous and the refs were an integral part of it. When in doubt ... officiate less and the game will be the better for it. 

[lgcs27288]

I don't think K. Lewis is as bad as people think, however, I do wish we would run less Cover 1 with him in the back.

[johnmike72]

This thread should be titled, The Bad, The Worse, And The Really Atrocious.

[Ravensfan23]

This was the type of game that you needed a game plan on defense and that wasn't the focus at this point. Wasn't too concerned because it's hard to perform against that type offense without a plan. The Eagles scheme was better then the individual players of the Ravens.

Offensively, the offense was flat because of Flacco imo. The run game was decent early and the WRs/TEs found space on occasion but Joe was off. I honestly think the 1st Int was just Flacco giving Aiken a chance to prove he could be a downfield threat. In a real game i think Flacco makes the smart play and hit Smitty wide open on the cross. However on that play Aiken has to be agressive to the ball. He didn't have any separation and should have high pointed the ball.

Overall i think it was a great learning opportunity for the team because they got to spend 3-4 days in Philly. Now the players at least has a sense of what it'll be like to stay on the road for a week. These guys were away from their comfort zone all week and had no game plan so it makes sense that they came out flat.

[redlobster]

Suggs hit was questionable and not really necessary but was Brandon Williams flagged for his hit? If so why?

[SorryNotSorry]

My short story after watching the first half 3 times...

On Defense...I don't understand many things from this game. 

First and foremost the 2-4 is not a good base nickel defense with the DL we currently have on the roster(no dominant 3-4 DE Ngata, Mcphee). I would personally run 3-3 and move D. Smith outside on third downs. Daryl Smith played like a rookie mlb, jumping the first route  to come across the middle only to leavehe middle WIDE open for any other receiver crossing into the middle of the field. Playing in the same gap as the dl a couple of times.  Then there is Dean Pees... I was completely lost at what his planning or thought process was for most of the game. He kept overloading to the weak side in their shotgun formations, only to have them run to the strong side where there was no one there to impede the ol from getting to our mlb's.

 

Daryl Smith played like a rookie mlb, jumping the first route  to come across the middle only to leave the middle WIDE open for any other receiver crossing into the middle of the field. Playing in the same gap as the dl a couple of times. Timmy Jernigan looks utterly disinterested in anything that does not involve rushing the passer... Brandon Williams is a NT and nothing else, so why does Pees keep trying him at 3-4 DE. CJ Mosley is going to have be the savior of this front 7 run defense against most option offenses. Lawrence Guy is probably our best overall DL at this point. Our secondary can be really good if our lb's show at least a little interest in helping out across the middle. Will Hill played horrible but it's only one game. Carl Davis and Zadarius look decent... it'll take at least another year before they are impact players. Rashaan Melvin is Cary Williams 2.0... Tray Walker is my favorite rookie because he's the only other big strong corner besides jimmy smith. Arrington is hot and cold, but an upgrade nonetheless! Without Mcphee, Suggs is going to bring his A game on a much more consistent basis in the pass rush department. Doom...is still Doom. Upshaw does a good job setting the edge, but rarely does anything else. I don't see a competition at mlb that everyone else does... Arthur Brown is by far and away better than Orr and Mcllelan, maybe not at special teams which is important as a backup, but at actually playing Mlb... go watch the film and i'll leave it at that. 

 

On Offense... I would put no stock into this film because 1.) Trestman was trying to test his running potential against a very underrated eagles front 7 2.) They never got the tight ends involved in the first half, which i'd like to think won't be the case in real games 3.) The flats were open all game and flacco almost seemingly intentionally ignored it (after lighting up the saints in the flats on the first drive last week) 4.) Osemele, Zuttah, and Wagner were out (Zuttah played later...idk if he got benched or what?!)

 

Otherwise Joe Flacco learned nothing from the Patriots loss a year ago. He continues to take unnecessary chances downfield on EARLY downs into tight coverage. Steve smith was wide open on the first interception on 1st down btw... but he decides to chuck it 50 yards into tight coverage to kamar aiken who cannot be considered a deep threat at this point. Which leads to my next point... Where are our deep threats at wr? We have a logjam of possession wr's... like 8 or 9 to be exact. This would be fine, except for the fact that Joe Flacco is never going to stop throwing the deep ball because of his amazing arm strength. So if Perriman isn't ready to go it could be a really bad first half of season with all the road games they have.  

 

Overall, a bad game for the offense, mainly Joe Flacco. I expect them (him) to be better next game. Defense is worrisome, against runs out of shotgun we looked especially clueless and helpless. San Fransico, Seattle, Cincy, Denver (week 1), KC all love to run out of shotgun. I have no doubt in their ability to stop traditional offenses, with FB's going extinct Pees has to learn how to stop the modern running game.   

[lgcs27288]

[quote name="SorryNotSorry" post="2193432"

Did you take in any consideration for what Harbaugh and Suggs said about the communication? Or the fact that there was no game planning?

I think that will answer most of your questions and concerns for defense.

Edited August 23, 2015 by lgcs27288

[MTRavensFan]

That's certainly strange. Hasn't this happened to us before? I'm surprised it's just coming out now because I didn't see any indication of it during the game. I don't want to be pessimistic but it almost sounds like an excuse.

I do believe Chip held out in practices but that's expected. He doesn't exactly seem like the most honest guy lol. He still looked sharp and we looked dull. It sucks but oh well.

I'm not really worried yet. These things happen. I'm more concerned with intangibles than anything. The slew of injuries to our OL has me concerned along with the lack of discipline after calls didn't go our way early. The fact that everyone looked lost out there certainly does lend credence to the reason Harbaugh gave regarding our performance.

Didn't it happen during our SB? When the lights came back on, our headsets didn't come back up, and Harbs refused to resume play until they were either fixed, or SF gave theirs up?

[GrimCoconut]

Didn't it happen during our SB? When the lights came back on, our headsets didn't come back up, and Harbs refused to resume play until they were either fixed, or SF gave theirs up?

I think so. I do recall that as well, but I wasn't sure if it happened again.

[salamander]

Headsets were definitely an issue at the Super Bowl. Ours weren't working and Harbs insisted that both teams play either with them or have the 49ers stop using theirs. I think they got them working because I don't recall a big deal after the game about the impact of playing without them.

[MTRavensFan]

That's how I remember it, too. Ours came back up pretty quickly after Harbs told them to fix it one way or the other.

[ALSKAN RAVEN FAN]

The team did not look like a Raven team on all 3 sides of the game offense, defense and special teams however I know from the front offices all the way down to the undrafted free agents the Ravens have pride in themselves and are going to fix all the issues we watched last night. I am not making any excuses but the officials need to do some fine tuning in their game calling as well.

Edited August 23, 2015 by ALSKAN RAVEN FAN

[kassaiscool]

Somethings I notice in general that I don't like about the offense and defense. On defense the ravens lack players who can play in space. Especially  in the front 7 when the outside linebackers have to cover. You can really see that when you play a wide open offense that's up tempo like the eagles. On offense I noticed their isn't a dynamic option for Joe. Steve Smith will get the job done but hes 36. I know Breshad is the deep threat, but their is no speed from the tight end position, and their is no true stud in the backfield yet. Another point about the TE position Max Williams looks border line sluggish out there, I don't know if its the humidity or him being out of shape. To be honest I don't see any difference from hes game and Crockett Gilmore's.

Edited August 23, 2015 by kassaiscool

[codizzle]

Video?

https://twitter.com/deadspin/status/635286589925629953

Best I could do right now

[Guest]

https://twitter.com/deadspin/status/635286589925629953

Best I could do right now

Looked like a good punch to me.  Real nice leverage, shift of weight into and body rotation. That had to take the air out of him.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

If you remember, last year in preseason the Eagles offense looked unstoppable. I recall a game against the Saints I believe where they just dismantled them.

Without a gameplan, Chip Kelly's offense is darn near impossible to stop because it's predicated on reading what the defense is in and always having an alternative play to beat it. If you don't have a scheme where you purposely bluff what you're doing to draw them into running the obvious adjustment you're toast.

And without communication it was even more a lost cause. Don't put too much into this performance.

I'll have to go back and watch the tape, but being at the game we kept noticing that every time the Ravens weren't penalize on D the Eagles couldn't get consecutive 1st downs on their own.

There were so many phantom calls and plays where we stopped them, caused a turnover and then the refs would throw a flag WELL AFTER the play was over. It was the worst, most blatantly one-sided officiating I've ever seen.

Even if we played well there was no overcoming the lack of game planning, no communication and officiating. We didn't play well which only exponentiated the disaster.

But I'm confident that we're still a far superior team to the Eagles and still a legitimate SB contender.

[polynesian15]

On Offense... I would put no stock into this film because 1.) Trestman was trying to test his running potential against a very underrated eagles front 7 2.) They never got the tight ends involved in the first half, which i'd like to think won't be the case in real games 3.) The flats were open all game and flacco almost seemingly intentionally ignored it (after lighting up the saints in the flats on the first drive last week) 4.) Osemele, Zuttah, and Wagner were out (Zuttah played later...idk if he got benched or what?!)

 

Otherwise Joe Flacco learned nothing from the Patriots loss a year ago. He continues to take unnecessary chances downfield on EARLY downs into tight coverage. Steve smith was wide open on the first interception on 1st down btw... but he decides to chuck it 50 yards into tight coverage to kamar aiken who cannot be considered a deep threat at this point. Which leads to my next point... Where are our deep threats at wr? We have a logjam of possession wr's... like 8 or 9 to be exact. This would be fine, except for the fact that Joe Flacco is never going to stop throwing the deep ball because of his amazing arm strength. So if Perriman isn't ready to go it could be a really bad first half of season with all the road games they have.     

It seems you accounted for Flacco's risk taking right there. Flacco's decision regarding the first INT didn't bother me, Aiken could have tried to make a play on the ball. Even then, that was a lucky tip for the INT.

However, the second INT didn't look good. Either Joe messed up or Brown's route was off - guess we'll never know.

 

Somethings I notice in general that I don't like about the offense and defense. On defense the ravens lack players who can play in space. Especially  in the front 7 when the outside linebackers have to cover. You can really see that when you play a wide open offense that's up tempo like the eagles. On offense I noticed their isn't a dynamic option for Joe. Steve Smith will get the job done but hes 36. I know Breshad is the deep threat, but their is no speed from the tight end position, and their is no true stud in the backfield yet. Another point about the TE position Max Williams looks border line sluggish out there, I don't know if its the humidity or him being out of shape. To be honest I don't see any difference from hes game and Crockett Gilmore's.

I've been thinking about this as well. His running style looks very laboured and heavy with short staccato strides. Certainly not a fast guy but we already knew that, hopefully he can develop crafty routes and better blocking.

[Static]

 

[rmw10]

I'm really starting to not understand PFF.  Some of these grades make no sense to me.