[News] John Harbaugh Wants To See Breakout Season From Marlon Brown

[757RavensFan]

How is it not objective?

 

1.Snap count is an accurate way to look at it, but if you want targets, according to footballoutsiders.com, Brown and Aiken had 31 and 32 targets, respectively, and again, Aiken had much better production across the board. Campanaro had a small sample size, but he had about twice as many yds/target as Brown, and Camp caught a higher % of his targets. Those are objective facts.

 

2. Smith was one of the leaders in catches and yds early on, and he clearly dropped off. Also, the fact that Aiken had more than 100 fewer offensive snaps than Marlon, but the same amount of targets, shows who Joe trusts more.

 

3. Maybe the defender did make a good play, but when a 6'5 receiver is consistently getting bested by smaller defenders, it shows he doesn't know how to take advantage of his size. If it was just mini camp, I wouldn't be concerned, but can you think of a play at all last season where he boxed out someone smaller and won a jump ball? I can't. Even with most of his TDs in 2013, he found soft spots in zones. I've rarely seen him take advantage of his size against man coverage.

 

1.  Camp made 7 catches out of 9 targets.  Why are you even using him in this comparison at all?

 

2.  It doesn't show that Joe trust Aiken more than Brown, that's an assumption you're making and there's no way you can validate that assumption.  The only thing that proves is Aiken was open more than Brown.  

3. I can think of many opportunities when he used his height to make a catch.  Best example, he used every bit of his 6'-5" frame to make the game winning catch vs the Vikings.  Camp, Aiken, SSS, or T. Smith don't make that catch and keep their feet in bounds. 

[Purplepowers88]

Just exactly how good of a season could you expect from Marlon Brown when a Hall of Fame receiver comes in his 2nd year and basically cut his time by 75%?  The time Brown was on the field his rookie year and the limited time at the end of the last season, he played extremely well. If you look at his small sample size of his playing time OBJECTIVELY, there's no reason to suggest he would get cut.  

I would expect him to display his strengths as a wide receiver. Being a bigger, stronger receiver he should be able to at win out on jump balls and be a weapon in the red-zone. He did neither last season. He had zero touchdowns which is unacceptable even with limited playing time. Campanaro and Aiken showed greater potential last year in limited roles. You could make a case that Steve Smith, Breshad Perriman, Michael Campanaro, Kamar Aiken, and Darren Waller or Jeremy Butler are all better options than Marlon Brown. Again, I am pulling for him to start this year. He's a great story (coming back from torn ACL in college) and seems like a quality dude.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Purplepowers88

[757RavensFan]

I would expect him to display his strengths as a wide receiver. Being a bigger, stronger receiver he should be able to at win out on jump balls and be a weapon in the red-zone. He did neither last season. He had zero touchdowns which is unacceptable even with limited playing time. Campanaro and Aiken showed greater potential last year in limited roles. You could make a case that Steve Smith, Breshad Perriman, Michael Campanaro, Kamar Aiken, and Darren Waller or Jeremy Butler are all better options than Marlon Brown. Again, I am pulling for him to start this year. He's a great story (coming back from torn ACL in college) and seems like a quality dude.

 

If you're looking at his career as a Raven, there's no way you can say; Camp, Butler (a guy who hasn't played yet) and 2 rookies are better options than Marlon Brown.  Harbaugh is expecting a big year from Brown, but you see him as the 7 best WR option.  Just stop. 

Edited June 28, 2015 by 757RavensFan

[GO_Ravens]

Marlon Brown caught every ball thrown in his direction last year which is amazing. I say we get the ball in his hands more often.

[Raven_Don]

You can't use last season as an example of Marlon's growth and development... if you know anything of Kubiak system... there is usually a big drop off when you look at production in his system from your X.. Y.. and Z receivers... SSS dominated the field and usually came off the field for a snap or two... 3 WR sets weren't really used often until Pitta went down... And opportunities were few and far in between... Marlon was used as a gunner on ST... and was the blocking WR... plus he was used a decoy on many plays... ran a lot of rub routes to get Owen open over the middle... so please stop picking on my dude... he's humble and a hard worker...

[deacfan]

1.  Camp made 7 catches out of 9 targets.  Why are you even using him in this comparison at all?

 

 

Don't forget Camp's 4 catches against the patriots for a total of 11!! hahaha

[RavenManiac#7]

I like what it said about the Red Zone offense. I'd like to see Brown, Waller, if he makes the team and if not, maybe Perriman, and the best pass catching TE lined up on those plays. All that height, and Perriman's speed along with his 6'2" height sounds pretty good to me. Even a three receiver set with those guys, a TE, and our best short yardage back should do well. And if they want to run, go to the two tall receivers, the best blocking TE, an extra blocker, and again, our best short yardage RB. Seems like we gotta score better than last year with all those options and weapons.

[Fastynart]

If Harbaugh is so interested in seeing a "breakout season for Brown", then Brown should be in the game. All too often Brown is not on the field. This guy was a star in college before getting hurt. He was a steal, yet, somehow, the Ravens keep him on the sidelines and play balldroppers in his place. Ridiculous. If he is not where they expected him to be, it is their fault, not his.

[RavensBaltimore]

1.  Camp made 7 catches out of 9 targets.  Why are you even using him in this comparison at all?

 

2.  It doesn't show that Joe trust Aiken more than Brown, that's an assumption you're making and there's no way you can validate that assumption.  The only thing that proves is Aiken was open more than Brown.  

3. I can think of many opportunities when he used his height to make a catch.  Best example, he used every bit of his 6'-5" frame to make the game winning catch vs the Vikings.  Camp, Aiken, SSS, or T. Smith don't make that catch and keep their feet in bounds. 

1. I already acknowledged Camp had a small sample size, but still, in his 9 targets, he had about half as many yds as Brown. He also went up and caught a TD in traffic, despite being hit, something that Marlon was not able to do. And the fact that Aiken had better production in less playing time disproves the "Steve Smith took away all my targets" excuse.

 

2. You could be right about that, and I think it's actually a combination of the two. Either way, if Aiken is getting open more than Brown, and/or Joe trusts him more, Aiken should clearly be ahead of him.

 

3. The question was about last season, and the play you're referring to was 2 seasons ago. You couldn't even come up with one example. Even in the play against Minnesota, he didn't beat a smaller defender, like I asked. He found a soft spot in the zone in the back of the end zone. I figured you would reference that play though, because it's the only memorable one he's ever made. You can go through all of his catches last year, and you won't find him winning a single "50/50" jump ball, because it didn't happen. I'm not sure if he's ever done that in his career.

 

 

 

If you're looking at his career as a Raven, there's no way you can say; Camp, Butler (a guy who hasn't played yet) and 2 rookies are better options than Marlon Brown.  Harbaugh is expecting a big year from Brown, but you see him as the 7 best WR option.  Just stop. 

If we're going by careers as a Raven, then Jacoby Jones would still be on the team. It's about who has the talent to help the team in the future. If Camp, Butler, and 2 rookies provide a skill set to help the team more than Marlon, then they are better options than Marlon. Last year, you could have said, "there's no way a practice squad castoff was a better option than Marlon." But he was. And you have no idea if Harbaugh is expecting a big year from Brown. He was answering a question, and he would say that about anyone if asked. Of course he isn't going to say, "we're expecting him to be a rotational guy at best." 

[757RavensFan]

1. I already acknowledged Camp had a small sample size, but still, in his 9 targets, he had about half as many yds as Brown. He also went up and caught a TD in traffic, despite being hit, something that Marlon was not able to do. And the fact that Aiken had better production in less playing time disproves the "Steve Smith took away all my targets" excuse.

 

2. You could be right about that, and I think it's actually a combination of the two. Either way, if Aiken is getting open more than Brown, and/or Joe trusts him more, Aiken should clearly be ahead of him.

 

3. The question was about last season, and the play you're referring to was 2 seasons ago. You couldn't even come up with one example. Even in the play against Minnesota, he didn't beat a smaller defender, like I asked. He found a soft spot in the zone in the back of the end zone. I figured you would reference that play though, because it's the only memorable one he's ever made. You can go through all of his catches last year, and you won't find him winning a single "50/50" jump ball, because it didn't happen. I'm not sure if he's ever done that in his career.

 

 

 

If we're going by careers as a Raven, then Jacoby Jones would still be on the team. It's about who has the talent to help the team in the future. If Camp, Butler, and 2 rookies provide a skill set to help the team more than Marlon, then they are better options than Marlon. Last year, you could have said, "there's no way a practice squad castoff was a better option than Marlon." But he was. And you have no idea if Harbaugh is expecting a big year from Brown. He was answering a question, and he would say that about anyone if asked. Of course he isn't going to say, "we're expecting him to be a rotational guy at best." 

 

 

I'll name one for you from last season, as a matter of fact it was a very high pass that he caught vs the Chargers and he came down on his head.  If I recall correctly, he suffered a concussion and had to sit out the next game.

[Crusader]

Brown will if he gets the ball thrown to him. Last year was Torrey chance to step into the number one position and that limited Browns chances especially since the Ravens were running the ball so well. I have a feeling the offense will be the best the Ravens ever had.

[January J]

Brown will if he gets the ball thrown to him. Last year was Torrey chance to step into the number one position and that limited Browns chances especially since the Ravens were running the ball so well. I have a feeling the offense will be the best the Ravens have ever had..

I agree with everything you just said.

[Purplepowers88]

If you're looking at his career as a Raven, there's no way you can say; Camp, Butler (a guy who hasn't played yet) and 2 rookies are better options than Marlon Brown.  Harbaugh is expecting a big year from Brown, but you see him as the 7 best WR option.  Just stop. 

 

1) No one ever said anything about comparing careers - why would you ever compare careers when you're discussing rookies? According to that logic, Odell Beckham Jr never should have started because the career of the player he was replacing was better than his (assuming he wasn't a rookie). I said their skill sets and talents could translate better into the Ravens offense than Marlon Browns skill-set.

 

2) John Harbaugh never said he was expecting a big year out of Marlon Brown. He said he had high hopes for him (which coaches say all the time) and he wanted him to have a break-out year.

 

3)  You make it sound like Marlon Brown has had an illustrious Ravens career. His 2014 stats: 25 receptions, 255 yards, 0 TDs.

 

Again, I am pulling for him but if you can't see how it's viable that other receivers on their roster could replace him than I don't know what to tell you.

[757RavensFan]

1) No one ever said anything about comparing careers - why would you ever compare careers when you're discussing rookies? According to that logic, Odell Beckham Jr never should have started because the career of the player he was replacing was better than his (assuming he wasn't a rookie). I said their skill sets and talents could translate better into the Ravens offense than Marlon Browns skill-set.

 

2) John Harbaugh never said he was expecting a big year out of Marlon Brown. He said he had high hopes for him (which coaches say all the time) and he wanted him to have a break-out year.

 

3)  You make it sound like Marlon Brown has had an illustrious Ravens career. His 2014 stats: 25 receptions, 255 yards, 0 TDs.

 

Again, I am pulling for him but if you can't see how it's viable that other receivers on their roster could replace him than I don't know what to tell you.

 

1. I didn't compare careers, I said if you look at MARLON's career.

 

2.  "It should be a big year for Marlon,” Harbaugh said.

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/article-1/John-Harbaugh-Envisions-Big-Year-From-Marlon-Brown/c2188c96-082a-4dba-b802-cd8c467a83b8

 

3. No, I'm making it seem as though his overall career with the Ravens (his 1st and 2nd year), puts him ahead of players who've yet to see a single snap at WR.

[Purplepowers88]

1. I didn't compare careers, I said if you look at MARLON's career.

 

2.  "It should be a big year for Marlon,” Harbaugh said.

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/article-1/John-Harbaugh-Envisions-Big-Year-From-Marlon-Brown/c2188c96-082a-4dba-b802-cd8c467a83b8

 

3. No, I'm making it seem as though his overall career with the Ravens (his 1st and 2nd year), puts him ahead of players who've yet to see a single snap at WR.

1) If you look at Marlons career then what exactly? From pure stats I see a receiver that had less than half of receptions and yards in his second year than he had posted in his first. He also went from 7 touchdowns to 0 touchdowns. Secondly, you said based on that "there's no way Butler and two rookies are better"? You have just said a logic, which if true would mean no rookie should start ever. You do realize that correct?

 

2) John Harbaugh has said numerous things about many receivers if you comb through many articles. It's training camp. However, if he felt so strongly about Marlon Brown he would be consistent in saying "I expect a big year out of him", which he did not state in this article. He has also said that this is the year where Marlon Brown must step up. Bottom line is this: He has the size and potential to have a much bigger impact on the game than he had last year. If he continues to underachieve (as he did last year) than he will be replaced.

 

3) Your first and third points contradict each other. You first say that you are not comparing careers and than you say if you compare "his overall career with the Ravens that puts him ahead of other players who have yet to see a single snap at WR" (which is a comparison of their careers). 

[757RavensFan]

1) If you look at Marlons career then what exactly? From pure stats I see a receiver that had less than half of receptions and yards in his second year than he had posted in his first. He also went from 7 touchdowns to 0 touchdowns. Secondly, you said based on that "there's no way Butler and two rookies are better"? You have just said a logic, which if true would mean no rookie should start ever. You do realize that correct?

2) John Harbaugh has said numerous things about many receivers if you comb through many articles. It's training camp. However, if he felt so strongly about Marlon Brown he would be consistent in saying "I expect a big year out of him", which he did not state in this article. He has also said that this is the year where Marlon Brown must step up. Bottom line is this: He has the size and potential to have a much bigger impact on the game than he had last year. If he continues to underachieve (as he did last year) than he will be replaced.

3) Your first and third points contradict each other. You first say that you are not comparing careers and than you say if you compare "his overall career with the Ravens that puts him ahead of other players who have yet to see a single snap at WR" (which is a comparison of their careers).

1. First of all, if you OBJECTIVELY look at Marlon's production since he's joined the team, what makes you think RIGHT now he would be behind Butler or 2 rookies who have yet to contribute. I'm not exclusively talking about his limited but EFFECTIVE season last year, but his career as a whole.

2. You said, "John Harbaugh never said he was expecting a big year out of Marlon Brown" When I proved to you that he did say it, you change your argument. Just b/c he didn't say it in this article doesn't void the fact that he said it in a previous article. That being said, reread your own comment.

3. Honestly, you need to reread what I said, b/c I have yet to compare careers of Marlon with the other WRs. It's been stated numerous times by the coaches that new players have to earn their starting spot. And right now, none of them have EARNED a position of Marlon. It's funny that most Ravens analysts and Ravens writers (who actually get to see the practices) have Marlon as one of the 4 locks on the team with SSS, Perriman, and Aiken. But folks on the outside still question his roster spot. Brilliant.

I'm done responding to you. Have a good day. I'll let you have the last word. I'm used to it I've been married for 15 years. Peace.

[Grapple Raven]

Knock it off.