Dean Pees NFL.com Coordinator Ranking

[Tenacious Faulker]

I'm not a huge pees fan but this conversation always comes down to nostalgic comparisons to Marvin Lewis and Rex Ryan.

Dean Pees hasn't had nearly the consistency in personnel, has dealt with injuries to multiple key players every year he's been the coordinator, and frankly doesn't have the same talent those guys had.

He has talent yes, but not HOF talent at the 2 key positions that others had. An in prime ed reed and ray Lewis allow you to do SOOOOO MUCH and take so many chances/be as aggressive as you want bc you know Ray has the whole middle of the field covered and will clean up and Ed has sideline to sideline on anything deep.

Pees has won a Super Bowl (which Pagano and Ryan never did) with less. It's not always pretty, and won't be the dominate defense that dictates a game that we all grew to love, but he gets a defense to play efficiently and do enough to win deep into the season.

You can want more, but it's luxury wants at this point. Pees seems to have perfected the art of doing just enough to make you pull ur hair out, but also enough to consistently win games.

And if ur gonna be a Flacco defender and look past his down performances and point to his winning ways and postseason performances.... Well Pees is a lot like that. Ugly sometimes, but it's a consistent winning formula that cranks up in the playoffs.

Pretty much YUP.  Too mnay fans can;t separate the nostalgia from results and too often forget that as good as historical defenses and DCs were their teams usually ended up giving up the big plays.  That's why we had trouble with the best QBs - stack the box and let the corners and FS defense one on one.  

 

I do wonder what Pees and Pagano would be like if he had the same proven level of talent as Lewis and Rex.  

[Tru11]

I'm not a huge pees fan but this conversation always comes down to nostalgic comparisons to Marvin Lewis and Rex Ryan.

Dean Pees hasn't had nearly the consistency in personnel, has dealt with injuries to multiple key players every year he's been the coordinator, and frankly doesn't have the same talent those guys had.

He has talent yes, but not HOF talent at the 2 key positions that others had. An in prime ed reed and ray Lewis allow you to do SOOOOO MUCH and take so many chances/be as aggressive as you want bc you know Ray has the whole middle of the field covered and will clean up and Ed has sideline to sideline on anything deep.

Pees has won a Super Bowl (which Pagano and Ryan never did) with less. It's not always pretty, and won't be the dominate defense that dictates a game that we all grew to love, but he gets a defense to play efficiently and do enough to win deep into the season.

You can want more, but it's luxury wants at this point. Pees seems to have perfected the art of doing just enough to make you pull ur hair out, but also enough to consistently win games.

And if ur gonna be a Flacco defender and look past his down performances and point to his winning ways and postseason performances.... Well Pees is a lot like that. Ugly sometimes, but it's a consistent winning formula that cranks up in the playoffs.

 

+35

[Willbacker]

Everybody talks about how well Pees has done with a banged up secondary but really none of this credit should go to Austin or Spagnola. This defense is not clutch enough imo and has given up too many leads in the past and almost blew the SB win except for some horrendous playcalling by SF. Pees is very average and is ranked way too high. Throw stats out the window. A previus poster showed Mattison's D to be ranked 3rd and 10th respectively but yet nobody sits there and says he ran great defenses. Yes Pees doesn't run as many 3 man passrushes lol but the defense is way more soft compared to Ryan's,Lewis's or Pagano's defenses. Just use the eyeball test. Do you yall think we're feared at all. We used to be.

[gabefergy]

Lack of clutch stops isn't really something that should immediately be equated to the DC.

Playcalling is part of how well a defense will perform, but the players still have to execute the play. Missed tackles, penalties, blown assignments etc are all on the players.

It's also important to consider that yhe offense will almost always have the advantage in these situations when trailing at the end of the game. They run hurry up which is hard on the defense and also play with 4 downs which isn't given much considertion.

Finally, for the small number of blown leads that are remembered, there are for more dominant performances that are not.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

Everybody talks about how well Pees has done with a banged up secondary but really none of this credit should go to Austin or Spagnola. This defense is not clutch enough imo and has given up too many leads in the past and almost blew the SB win except for some horrendous playcalling by SF. Pees is very average and is ranked way too high. Throw stats out the window. A previus poster showed Mattison's D to be ranked 3rd and 10th respectively but yet nobody sits there and says he ran great defenses. Yes Pees doesn't run as many 3 man passrushes lol but the defense is way more soft compared to Ryan's,Lewis's or Pagano's defenses. Just use the eyeball test. Do you yall think we're feared at all. We used to be.

 

The defense alone may not be feared like it used to be.... but if you dont think every team in the AFC is afraid when the Ravens come to town in January youre kidding yourself.

 

The defense used to be feared and the offense was a joke. It was a mildly successful winning formula. And it was that way because EVERYTHING was invested in the defense and nothing on offense.

 

Now, we have a better offense, which is going to take some away from the defense. That's not all on the coordinator - he's missing some key ingredients those old defenses used to have. But the team overall - MUCH more feared.

[gabefergy]

Everybody talks about how well Pees has done with a banged up secondary but really none of this credit should go to Austin or Spagnola. This defense is not clutch enough imo and has given up too many leads in the past and almost blew the SB win except for some horrendous playcalling by SF. Pees is very average and is ranked way too high. Throw stats out the window. A previus poster showed Mattison's D to be ranked 3rd and 10th respectively but yet nobody sits there and says he ran great defenses. Yes Pees doesn't run as many 3 man passrushes lol but the defense is way more soft compared to Ryan's,Lewis's or Pagano's defenses. Just use the eyeball test. Do you yall think we're feared at all. We used to be.

You don't think the Ravens front 7 is feared anymore? You're wrong.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

I dont get it. The Patriots.... the model of consistency and hands down best team in the league over the past 15 years is most afraid of our team. They admit we're the toughest team to beat... and our defense is one of the hardest to figure out (hence needing trick plays to beat a depleted version of it)

 

Yet we want the Ravens of old. Dominating, tough as nails D.... that goes 6-10.

[Ravensfan23]

lol this thread boils down to what most debates among Ravens fan comes down to. The guy running things right now isn't as good as the guy running things in our glory years. It's pretty comical. The Ravens glory years always had at least 2 definite HOFers(Lewis, Reed) 2 possible HOFers(Ngata, Suggs), 1 pro bowl caliber CB(CMac) and a host of other talented players that raised their level of play surrounded by those great players. Now I'm not saying that Rex, Chuck and Marvin weren't great DCs because they were, but everybody can't be those guys. Imo it's laughable to expect any DC to be like those guys. 

 

 

Biggest personal issues with the defense - some scrubbly-dubbly QBs have had the games of their life against us. I'll make a list sometime later.

 

Couldn't agree more. I hate the late game collapses and bend but don't break approach against lesser QBs. But overall I think Pees is a heck of a coach and teaches the defense well. I wouldn't be pissed if he was replaced and I wouldn't be pissed to see him continue as he DC. 

[redrum52]

I was going to post this before and then fell back. For the DC rankings, he was 7 and Rod Marinelli was 1st. Don't put too much stock in it. I'm not a fan of Bucky Brooks by the way.

[stampedehero]

Its interesting to note that Teryl Austin is ranked 8th.

I saw that and was pleased he got into the list.  Detroit really improved their D in 014.

[Willbacker]

You don't think the Ravens front 7 is feared anymore? You're wrong.

Respected. Not feared. I'm not out here saying fire Pees or anything like that but he does have a great array of assistant coaches and he does have a lot of talent in the front 7 but yet I've seen a lot of posts saying we had better front 7's under Ryan. Not sure about that.

 

I saw that and was pleased he got into the list.  Detroit really improved their D in 014.

So was I. He did wonders with our secondary(as did Spags) but I'd like to see if he can continue that for another year after losing both starting DTs. Wouldn't be surprized to see them switch to a more hybrid 3-4 D than the standard 4-3.

[gabefergy]

Respected. Not feared. I'm not out here saying fire Pees or anything like that but he does have a great array of assistant coaches and he does have a lot of talent in the front 7 but yet I've seen a lot of posts saying we had better front 7's under Ryan. Not sure about that.

 

So was I. He did wonders with our secondary(as did Spags) but I'd like to see if he can continue that for another year after losing both starting DTs. Wouldn't be surprized to see them switch to a more hybrid 3-4 D than the standard 4-3.

We definitely had more talent under Ryan pretty much across the board. The 2006 defense was arguably the best defense of all time.

 

Also he had two absolute savants on the field in Ray Lewis and Ed Reed. 

[Inqui]

lol this thread boils down to what most debates among Ravens fan comes down to. The guy running things right now isn't as good as the guy running things in our glory years. It's pretty comical. The Ravens glory years always had at least 2 definite HOFers(Lewis, Reed) 2 possible HOFers(Ngata, Suggs), 1 pro bowl caliber CB(CMac) and a host of other talented players that raised their level of play surrounded by those great players. Now I'm not saying that Rex, Chuck and Marvin weren't great DCs because they were, but everybody can't be those guys. Imo it's laughable to expect any DC to be like those guys. 

 

 

 

Couldn't agree more. I hate the late game collapses and bend but don't break approach against lesser QBs. But overall I think Pees is a heck of a coach and teaches the defense well. I wouldn't be pissed if he was replaced and I wouldn't be pissed to see him continue as he DC. 

The Jeremy Zuttah of DCs. You could do better, and you could also do a whole lot worse. The main difference being that if you do a whole lot better you lose continuity when they get promoted to HC somewhere else.

[K-Dog]

I dont get it. The Patriots.... the model of consistency and hands down best team in the league over the past 15 years is most afraid of our team. They admit we're the toughest team to beat... and our defense is one of the hardest to figure out (hence needing trick plays to beat a depleted version of it)

Yet we want the Ravens of old. Dominating, tough as nails D.... that goes 6-10.

This post bears repeating.

And the bold needs bolding.

[ravensdfan]

Seems fair to me although even I think is perhaps a little high.  Still he's accomplied a lot with very little and everyone seems to forget that.  Glad it was recognized by someone somewhere.

 

The weakest link on this team is still a compliment.  It's not a bad thing to be the "worst Raven".  I'd take that over the best Raider.

 That was my quote.  See the above reply to arnie_uk and just know that Pees is the best we can get right now.  Fire him and who will you get to replace him?  Austin isn;t coming here for a lateral move, Rex is a HC again and Pagano (my favorite) is too.  The only "crapola" is what you think you know about defensive coordinators.  Pees had far less to work with than Rex every had.  Rex has been proven to be nothing without a slew of star players at his disposal, while Pees HAS.  

 

Hence the checkers and ches analogy is more valid than your well thought out "crapola argument"  Cheers.   

I wasn't trying to target you or anything. I honestly just remembered different things that had been said in discussions before.

 

Here's the thing: He's not playing chess. In chess, you position yourself strategically to then make a checkmate - corner your opponent. My issue with Pees, and why I equate him with Cam Cameron, is because he will be calling a good game. Sometimes, a great game. Then, late in the game, it is like he panics and switches to not just conservative, but ultra conservative mode. The bulk of our late game defensive melt downs have occurred because of that tendency. Cam used to do the exact same thing late in games. And it always cost us.

 

I will tell you this on Pees. The Bills lost a post season game by giving up a 32 pts lead. That is the biggest lead EVER lost in post season in NFL history. Pees defense very nearly came in #2 when they held a 27 pt lead and watched it wither away. If you think that Pees, up in the booth, had much to do with that goal line stand, better go watch the videos. It was Lewis & Reed coaching up that defense. Clearly evident in every single video of that goal line stand.

Edited June 27, 2015 by ravensdfan

[BmoreBird22]

My problem with people saying the Pees goes conservative and isn't aggressive in his play calling is that most people saying this probably don't actually observe closely to see what the defensive calls are, let alone even understand what types of plays could be called, but hey, that's none of my business.

[The Raven]

My problem with people saying the Pees goes conservative and isn't aggressive in his play calling is that most people saying this probably don't actually observe closely to see what the defensive calls are, let alone even understand what types of plays could be called, but hey, that's none of my business.

 

Sips tea

[redrum52]

I wasn't trying to target you or anything. I honestly just remembered different things that had been said in discussions before.

Here's the thing: He's not playing chess. In chess, you position yourself strategically to then make a checkmate - corner your opponent. My issue with Pees, and why I equate him with Cam Cameron, is because he will be calling a good game. Sometimes, a great game. Then, late in the game, it is like he panics and switches to not just conservative, but ultra conservative mode. The bulk of our late game defensive melt downs have occurred because of that tendency. Cam used to do the exact same thing late in games. And it always cost us.

I will tell you this on Pees. The Bills lost a post season game by giving up a 32 pts lead. That is the biggest lead EVER lost in post season in NFL history. Pees defense very nearly came in #2 when they held a 27 pt lead and watched it wither away. If you think that Pees, up in the booth, had much to do with that goal line stand, better go watch the videos. It was Lewis & Reed coaching up that defense. Clearly evident in every single video of that goal line stand.

People will knock Pees for giving up the 2 14 point leads against th3 Pats. Is it his fault Elam misses tackles or Melvin gives up a TD to LaFell? He can make perfect valls, but if the players don't execute who does he catch the blame for "bad calls"? Against th3 Bengals, if guys just do what they're suppose to, we most likely win those games. And why not credit Pees for making the call at the end of the SB where he went the COMPLETE OPPOSITE of conservative and sent the damn house.

[Greatness]

Good to see. I like him as a person, but I still don't trust him. lol

[ravensdfan]

People will knock Pees for giving up the 2 14 point leads against th3 Pats. Is it his fault Elam misses tackles or Melvin gives up a TD to LaFell? He can make perfect valls, but if the players don't execute who does he catch the blame for "bad calls"? Against th3 Bengals, if guys just do what they're suppose to, we most likely win those games. And why not credit Pees for making the call at the end of the SB where he went the COMPLETE OPPOSITE of conservative and sent the damn house.

I didn't mention the Pats game.

 

I don't trust that he had much to do with that call in the SB tbh. Nothing he's shown since then says he did and the videos of that goal line stand lead me to believe otherwise as well. Can you even name any close game at all where he's been aggressive at the end since then?

[redrum52]

I didn't mention the Pats game.

I don't trust that he had much to do with that call in the SB tbh. Nothing he's shown since then says he did and the videos of that goal line stand lead me to believe otherwise as well. Can you even name any close game at all where he's been aggressive at the end since then?

Wasn't singling you out for the Pats game. He did send blitzes against the Pats though. I remember him trying to in the a chargers game as well and their last drive. He did against the Steelers as well when the game was still somewhat close. I'm pretty sure on the Suggs pick, that was on a blitz. Also feel like in the Bengals games he tried as well, but not exactly sure. It's honestly tough to try and do though when you can't really trust the guys on the backend. Edited June 27, 2015 by Moderator 3

[arnie_uk]

If you think Pees was the weakest link this past season then I implore you to get glasses because you clearly couldn't see how our secondary was in shambles.

can't recall saying last season in my post

[BmoreBird22]

Sips tea

+35

[BmoreBird22]

I didn't mention the Pats game.

 

I don't trust that he had much to do with that call in the SB tbh. Nothing he's shown since then says he did and the videos of that goal line stand lead me to believe otherwise as well. Can you even name any close game at all where he's been aggressive at the end since then?

Then you're sorely mistaken, like really badly mistaken.

 

That play was actually the exact same play that he called against the Giants when Plaxico Burress caught the game winning touchdown to end the Patriots perfect season. It was called like Zero Cable, I believe. It wasn't the first time he'd used that play in a very crucial situation.

[Challenge Accepted]

Pees Is a good coordinator. But we simply didnt have the players/experience in the secondary to execute last year. That simple.

Edited June 27, 2015 by Challenge Accepted

[redrum52]

Then you're sorely mistaken, like really badly mistaken.

That play was actually the exact same play that he called against the Giants when Plaxico Burress caught the game winning touchdown to end the Patriots perfect season. It was called like Zero Cable, I believe. It wasn't the first time he'd used that play in a very crucial situation.

Flacco called the defense...

[Tru11]

I didn't mention the Pats game.

 

I don't trust that he had much to do with that call in the SB tbh. Nothing he's shown since then says he did and the videos of that goal line stand lead me to believe otherwise as well. Can you even name any close game at all where he's been aggressive at the end since then?

 

so according to you who made the call?

[BmoreBird22]

Flacco called the defense...

You sure it wasn't Tom Coughlin trying to get Pees to make the same call so that he'd lose two Super Bowls on that call?

[redrum52]

You sure it wasn't Tom Coughlin trying to get Pees to make the same call so that he'd lose two Super Bowls on that call?

Remember seeing Plax 1-1 with Hobbs and trying to figure who thought that was a good matchup.

[Cillmatic]

I will never understand the Pees hate, he's one of the best DC's in the league, maybe top 5. He turned a defense with no secondary into a top 10 defense two years in a row. He lost two of the best Defensive players in NFL history(Lewis, Reed) and the D actually got better statically. People treat him like Castillo, they hate him now but after this season they'll be on his jock.