[News] Late For Work 6/19: 8 Things We Learned From Minicamp

[RavensBaltimore]

Always been a misleading number though...

 

What percentage of those 19 players would you say would have been "integral" to our success even if they were healthy?

 

You've essentially got four "starters"... Pitta, Jimmy, Wagner, and Asa.

 

You've got three rookies who probably would have been "role" players at best.... Taliaferro, Urban, and Brooks.

 

The rest is basically just a long group of backup players and depth who wouldn't have played even if they were healthy. Guys like Gorrer were only even on the roster because of injuries to other players.

 

Keep in mind also that while it sounds like a lot from a volume perspective, there were still 6 other teams in the league that had more players on IR, and I'd argue that from a "key personnel" standpoint, it was one of our healthier seasons in recent years.

 

We won a SB without full seasons out of Ray Lewis, Webb and Suggs, who was the reigning DPOY.

You can say that most of our IR players were backups, but when the starters get hurt, those backups become starters. The biggest problem, more than having 19 total players on IR, was having 5 players on IR at the same position. A lot of teams have solid depth if a starter goes down, but no one is deep enough to account for 5 players going down at one position. That's why we were much healthier in our SB year. Webb was the only key player to miss the playoffs, and we didn't  have to go past 2nd string to replace him. Last year, after Jimmy went down, we had to go to the backup to the backup to the backup........ I'm not even sure how long to keep going with that. Bell's injury is an extremely lame excuse for why the Steelers lost. Besides the fact that we totally dominated them, Jimmy was at least as important to us as Bell was to them, plus we had several other key starters out, and as I mentioned, we couldn't just replace Jimmy with a 2nd string corner. We were down to about 6th string.

[Purple&Black]

What happened to Oher? Remember his rookie year when he was mauling everyone in front of him? Then all sudden he got soft. So confusing.

[rmcjacket23]

You can say that most of our IR players were backups, but when the starters get hurt, those backups become starters. The biggest problem, more than having 19 total players on IR, was having 5 players on IR at the same position. A lot of teams have solid depth if a starter goes down, but no one is deep enough to account for 5 players going down at one position. That's why we were much healthier in our SB year. Webb was the only key player to miss the playoffs, and we didn't  have to go past 2nd string to replace him. Last year, after Jimmy went down, we had to go to the backup to the backup to the backup........ I'm not even sure how long to keep going with that. Bell's injury is an extremely lame excuse for why the Steelers lost. Besides the fact that we totally dominated them, Jimmy was at least as important to us as Bell was to them, plus we had several other key starters out, and as I mentioned, we couldn't just replace Jimmy with a 2nd string corner. We were down to about 6th string.

And all of those things are true. Losing Bell isn't a sufficient excuse to justify them losing to us at home.

 

BUT, keep in mind... the Steelers had essentially six days to deal with losing Bell. He was injured on Sunday night, and they played us on Saturday night. There's a difference between having six days to overcome an injury and roughly almost three months, which is what we had to overcome Jimmy's injury. When you play more games in your season without a player than with, you sort of lose the ability to use him as a crutch for why you aren't playing well (save maybe a quality QB).

 

We already had experience playing without Jimmy... we had been doing it for quite a long time, just like we already had a few games without Wagner and almost an entire season without Pitta.

 

A key player getting injured in late December has a very different effect on a football team than a key player getting injured in August, September, October, etc. The later in the season, the worse it gets, because there's just less time to develop gameplans and learn how to play without a high quality player that you've been depending on.

[roamingcharges]

I was a bit ashamed for Michael Oher when I read that story a couple of days ago. It's bad enough you weren't exactly worth the trade up in the first round, now you'll blame a movie that made you a household name for your ho hum play on the field?!! If Oher was above average at his position he'd be a perennial Pro Bowl player being as it is that that thing is a popularity contest and he has been the most recognizable lineman in the entire league for half a decade. Man up and own your play-- good or bad.

[terpmaniac]

Why the Pitt game is one of my all time favorites. Before the game, everybody, EVERBODY said "the Steelers will win WITH OR WITHOUR BELL." I heard it over and over again. The Steelers were SO much better they didnt need him. Really? Didn't Bell and Brown play earlier in the year when we won? Yes, the Pitt offense was good, better, but ours sure as hell was not bad, and far from awful and our defense was certaintly better. I just smelled a victory. Nearly everybody got it wrong that game and it all happened IN PITTSBURGH! Heaven.

[huntrgathrr]

I have to laugh when the Steelers spout off about being a great defense. They have a legitimate shot at being the worst defense in the NFL this year. Here's why:

1.They lost their HOF DC in Dick LeBeau.

2.They lost 90% of their NFL proven, experienced, players...Worilds, Polamalu, Keisel, and Taylor. That would be like the Ravens losing Reed, Lewis, Suggs and Ngata all in one year.

3. They have one proven NFL player on defense...Lawrence Timmons. They don't have a single player on defense that would start for the Ravens. This lack of talent is due to poor drafting.

4.They did absolutely nothing to upgrade this defense in the offseason. There is no reason to expect this defense will be any better than last year's poor unit that Flacco and Forsett shredded in last years playoff game.

To say that this is a rebuilding year for the Steeler defense is putting it mildly. They will most definitely be starting at the bottom. That is the best reason they might improve.

[Tenacious Faulker]

Oher needs to just dummy up. I have nothing against him and don;t think of him as a bust. Bu that movie gave him wealth and notariety outside of the league, so he's set for life even without Pro football. He was a good, not great, player that peeked in college and was less than stellar in the pros. He has a SB ring. If he wants to leave his mark and live up to his draft status and not the movie's image, then he's going to have the stop complaining and work for it. Otehrwise, pipe down and enjoy playing a game for a living. The pressure is off - it just depends on how you look at it and stop giving a crap about what pther people think.

[Dorota]

Tweaked hamstring in practice it was announced yesterday... Boyle took the rest of his snaps. Doesn't sound good at all. It puts him a step back behind the rest of the offense.

Thanks for the update! I hope it's minor and he gets to catch up soon.

[cbrook1862]

Michael Oher....just shut up, ya sound stupid.

[runcontrol]

Glad Butler had a great Minicamp....he will have his work cut out for him. Not sure how many WR's we keep this season but 6 is probably the max. 1. SSS 2. BPerriman 3. Marlon 4. Aiken that leaves Campanaro, Butler, DCarter, DWaller, and more to compete for two spots THat is tough and even tougher when you consider that Waller and Camp are draft picks (who the Ravens do not like to give up on). Carter has been highly touted! Not saying that Butler cant make it... just that he has a very uphill climb! Good Luck!

Because the team is probably keeping 4 tight ends, I can't see them keeping 7 receivers. I think this quote is very telling of who will make the team. "A lot was made of Breshad Perriman's hands yesterday. Much bigger issues with fellow rookies DeAndre Carter and Darren Waller in that realm.". I think Waller goes on IR and if Camp is healthy Carter goes onto the PUP List.

Everybody is all about Aiken, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Butler pass him some time this season. They are similar in size and both have received rave reviews all offseason, but with Butler having decent speed he could be more of a weapon.

[Ravensfanforever]

Michael Oher excuses don't help anybody in the business of life period.

[PalmBayRaven]

If Michael Oher's career ended today he at least has a Super Bowl ring. Some players never get them. If he didn't lead the league in false start penalties that might have helped his career. Moving him to RT and McKinney to the Blindside was the best move the Ravens made. McKinney was fresh because he was in the dog house all year but it was a great playoff run!

I think Karma gets the Defense this year for the Steelers. LeBeau was a great man to be treated so poorly for all he had given to them. He deserved a better send off. I hope they suck! Otherwise I'm loving what I am seeing with the Ravens! We have some weapons now and we are going to Light it Up.

[52liveforever]

I have to laugh when the Steelers spout off about being a great defense. They have a legitimate shot at being the worst defense in the NFL this year. Here's why: 1.They lost their HOF DC in Dick LeBeau. 2.They lost 90% of their NFL proven, experienced, players...Worilds, Polamalu, Keisel, and Taylor. That would be like the Ravens losing Reed, Lewis, Suggs and Ngata all in one year. 3. They have one proven NFL player on defense...Lawrence Timmons. They don't have a single player on defense that would start for the Ravens. This lack of talent is due to poor drafting. 4.They did absolutely nothing to upgrade this defense in the offseason. There is no reason to expect this defense will be any better than last year's poor unit that Flacco and Forsett shredded in last years playoff game. To say that this is a rebuilding year for the Steeler defense is putting it mildly. They will most definitely be starting at the bottom. That is the best reason they might improve.

 

They are definitely going to be in the bottom half as far as defense. However I think they may have a better group of guys on their way up than you give them credit for. Timmons you mentioned, but Shazier is right there at Mosely's level. Of course I like our guy more though. Bud Dupree is a beast and will give us fits in a couple of years. Jarvis Jones shouldn't be slept on either. Cortez Allen is developing into a solid corner and Senquez Golson is another guy i'll keep my eye out for. It's going to be building years for sure. they are going to take a while to rebuild, but before you know it they'll be back. They have always made a comeback. The bengals have had a couple of good seasons, but it could all fall apart at any time(when they fire marvin lewis for not being able to win a play off game).

 

 

whats a good Ravens-Steelers rivalry if the steelers suck? Less stressful, but not as fun

[TXRavensFan]

I'll just say this about the Oher comments: If someone made a movie about any one of our lives (especially one that portrayed us in an inaccurate and arguably unflattering light), and that movie led to us receiving an increased level of scrutiny at our jobs, including perhaps unrealistic expectations regarding our performance, any one of us could reasonably determine that the movie has been a net negative in our lives.

[thecommish]

runcontrol.... i hear you and for the most part I am in agreement with what you told steelcity but all bring something a little different to the table. Camp is a slot wr who runs good routes and creates athletic mismatches... Aiken has size and Butler brings a little more speed.... Waller brings the height and creates a mismatch especially in the redzone, so it will be interesting how they decide to compliment SSS and Perriman with the host of other complimentary WR's that we have... I feel like out of all of them Marlon has the ability to develop into a dominant WR... I dont think we will keep 7 however bc we will keep 4 TE's thats 11 between those two position or 3-4 more then we kept last year between the two ? it will be fun to see how this plays out. I am excited to see who elevates their game and takes the next step?

[thecommish]

The sqeelers have a great offense but they will struggle defensively. They are soft in the middle of their front 7. They are better on the edges but are very unproven and cant stay healthy on the edge. They have to replace Troy and IKe Taylor and that wont be easy. I dont think that Shamarko Thomas is that guy and their CB's are average at best. They have not depth anywhere on defense and now they lost lebeau! they will need to put up 30 points every game to have a chance to win and they better pray that Ben stays heatlhy (something that has been tough for him throughout his career)!

[thecommish]

if Maxx and Perriman prove to be what we think and can contribute like we hope... Joe will have a career year.... This offense is balanced, deep and talented and we can protect Joe very very well!

[Maryland]

I'm more inclined to believe that Schaub getting picked off by Elam repeatedly is more a sign of Schaub's decline than Elam's improvement, but I hope I'm mistaken.

And lol @ the Steelers trying to build an intimidating defense with that roster. I would not be the least-bit shocked if they have the 32nd ranked defense after losing LeBeau, Polamalu, Ike Taylor, Keisel, and Worilds. Granted, Polamalu and Taylor were washed up, but their defense is still worse than last year's, and their pass defense was 6th worst as it was. Kind of hard to win in this league with no pass rush and a terrible secondary.

[DomMcRaven]

And Steelers fans try to say OUR defense is older. Now THAT's funny.

[slowboater]

To Michael Oher: Your career is what it is not because of the book, but because your skills diminished instead of improved. Time to do some soul searching and look in the mirror and see things for the way they truly are.

[January J]

I'd give them Bell and the other 2-3 players they had on IR going into that game if they gave us back all 19 players we had on IR at the end of the season.

every team has injuries, in the end you just gotta roll with what you got. That's why depth is so important. We will definitely keep 4 tight ends if pitta is ready, so that means at the most we keep 6 Wrs. Perriman, SSS, Aiken, Brown, Waller- then butler, camp and carter will battle it out for the slot position. It helps that camp has experience returning kicks, but then you've also got the injury factor. Carter is also said to be in the mix for returner, and so far he has made a lot of noise and been a favorite of SSS. But then you got butler who supposedly had an absolutely amazing minicamp , and basically dropped nothing. Not sure but I haven't heard anything about him returning kicks. So you've got 3 players who are all bringing a lot of potential to the table and fightng for that slot position. Gonna be reeeeal interesting to see who gets it. I think it will definitely come down to who shows out in preseason, and injuries also might make the process of elimination a little easier. I think a guy like carter would be easier to stash on the practice squad than a 7th round draft pick in campanaro- who I think would definitely get snatched up.

[cobrajet]

I wanted Dick LeBeau to still be the Steelers DC. They finally realized what I knew to be true, he was a liability to that team.

[harfordravenfan]

every team has injuries, in the end you just gotta roll with what you got. That's why depth is so important. We will definitely keep 4 tight ends if pitta is ready, so that means at the most we keep 6 Wrs. Perriman, SSS, Aiken, Brown, Waller- then butler, camp and carter will battle it out for the slot position. It helps that camp has experience returning kicks, but then you've also got the injury factor. Carter is also said to be in the mix for returner, and so far he has made a lot of noise and been a favorite of SSS. But then you got butler who supposedly had an absolutely amazing minicamp , and basically dropped nothing. Not sure but I haven't heard anything about him returning kicks. So you've got 3 players who are all bringing a lot of potential to the table and fightng for that slot position. Gonna be reeeeal interesting to see who gets it. I think it will definitely come down to who shows out in preseason, and injuries also might make the process of elimination a little easier. I think a guy like carter would be easier to stash on the practice squad than a 7th round draft pick in campanaro- who I think would definitely get snatched up.

Agree with ya and don't think we have that much to worry about Carter going to PS. He has potential but with no NFL experience... Will a team take the udfa and put him on there active roster? My guess is no

I think camp goes to pup, butler gets slot but that still leaves returner position open and unless Webb fair catches everything... Still kind of worried but that is pretty much only position I am concerned about which is great at this time of year.