[News] Late For Work 5/14: Appreciating Genius Of Ozzie Newsome After Turning Frustration Into Fortune

[riseNConquer81]

Now you're just reaching. There's still another 11 completions for almost 150 yards from the mid-3rd quarter on that were done with completely and utterly "non-shady" formations.

150 yards only gets you one TD according the football rules I'm familiar with.

In order to beat a 14 point lead, you need at least two TDs...

im not seeing your point.

not to mention that looking purely at quantitative data is a flaw ive pointed out MANY times before in similar conversations. Football is a game of situations...it only takes one play to make a ripple.

 

We gave up two legitimate passing TDs in the first half,

i spoke pretty specifically of the second half...dont see how this is at all relevant. Edited May 14, 2015 by riseNConquer81

[rmcjacket23]

Why should we boycott the Ravens because we dont like Tom Brady cheating?

They only have 8 away games, you really think 8 undersold games out of 256 is gonna make a dent in NFL revenue? They'll still be pulling in tv money btw, and there are plenty fo bandwagon fans all over the country who will tune into watch Brady...

So what you're saying is that people are outraged, yet they aren't willing to do anything about it to actually show their outrage, other than (lol at this notion)... booing somebody?

 

Stop and think about this notion for a minute... the response to something is allegeding so outraging is to boo. There is no single greater indicator of fake outrage than having your maximum amount of action being booing somebody.

[hen826957]

I truly believe we have the most talented roster in the NFL today. Ozzie did a great job assemble this team. No weaknesses in my book whatsoever got depth at corner check, depth at D-Line check, depth at O-line check, depth at saftey check, etc. The only one thing that I want Ozzie to do now is to extend Marshal Yanda so that we could have a chance to sign K.O. next season. We can't let both of these two hit free agency as so as Tucker but we could sign Tucker next year because he would be easy to sign. If you extend Marshal Yanda it would free cap room and plus reduce Joe's cap hit we will have a lot of space with less to worry about. The two important free agents we will have next year will be only K.O. and Tucker. Then you have Will Hill as well which he won't cost as much. We will be in great shape if we extend Yanda.

[rmcjacket23]

150 yards only gets you one TD according the football rules I'm familiar with.

In order to beat a 14 point lead, you need at least two scores...

im not seeing your point.

not to mention that looking purely at quantitative data is a flaw ive pointed out MANY times before in similar conversations. Football is a game of situations...it only takes one play to make a ripple.

 

i spoke pretty specifically of the second half...dont see how this is at all relevant.

LOL, nice try.

 

150 yards was the amount of legitimate passing yardage that was given up by the defense of the Baltimore Ravens on "non-shady" plays in the second half., particularly from mid-3rd quarter on. Two TD passes was the amount of passing TDs the Ravens gave up in the second half on "non-shady plays" (they gave up 3 total on the second half, but you already knew that).

 

The ripple argument is nice and all, but that basically just means that we were mentally weak. If using "shady plays" on ONE drive is so devastating to our defenses psychy that we then allow two more legitimate TD drives (almost exclusvely through the air mind you) after that, then we didn't deserve to win the game anyway.

 

But I'll bite on this notion that we were "sound" in the 2nd half... please provide examples. Which specific players were allegedly "sound" and what did they actually do to perform at that level? If we are not going to go quantitative, then we should have no problem going qualitative.

 

Its one thing to be upset because the Patriots used allegedly "shady plays" to score a TD, but its completely different to stereotype the entire half as such when its simply not true.

[stixfix69]

From our starters all the way down to our UDFA, we do have a lot of talent....Training camp will be a lot of fun to watch this year.....

[stixfix69]

At then end of the day, the Pats had to pull off every trick in the book to beat us, they even walked the line on the WR ineligible play, which is now a more defined rule...I couldn't have been more proud of our team last year for what they accomplished with all the injuries, and not once did we make excuses...

[hen826957]

Hope Dennis Pitta returns make our team even more scarier.

[riseNConquer81]

So what you're saying is that people are outraged, yet they aren't willing to do anything about it to actually show their outrage, other than (lol at this notion)... booing somebody?

 

Stop and think about this notion for a minute... the response to something is allegeding so outraging is to boo. There is no single greater indicator of fake outrage than having your maximum amount of action being booing somebody.

No what im saying is that people arent going to "do something" futile and pointless that punishes the wrong people just for the sake of saying they did something. Because that's dumb.

The only way what you're suggesting works is if the Pats fan base grows a conscious and participates...otherwise, all you're really doing is dropping next years salary cap a little bit.

[RavensBaltimore]

I don't understand how the Raven players are dropping so far down in the top 100. They had a far better year last year than 2013. Suggs goes from 26 to 84 unbelievable!

It's nothing but a popularity contest. In 2013, the Ravens were coming off a SB win, so there was a little more hype surrounding the team. The Ravens aren't normally one of the more nationally hyped teams, so when the SB hype dies down, our players get overlooked. NFL players apparently get influenced by all that stuff just as much as the fans. The fact that some players can have a far better year and take a huge drop in the rankings show these lists don't mean anything.

[January J]

In a matter of 3 weeks oz has gotten almost all fans to go from being "skeptical" to pretty darn confident in this roster. I mean seriously- a few weeks ago we were all talking about how thin our WR corps was- and now were pretty much set and trying to figure out who's actually gonna be the odd man out. We had a very questionable situation at tight end with pittas injury and the lack if experience with Crockett and supernaw- and in one stroke Ozzie takes care of it with flying colors. And finally the last real weak spot on the team was the secondary and he makes a pretty big pickup with a veteran corner and suddenly things are looking really good. I know some of you think it was just an easy common sense pickup and that Arrington kind of just fell on our lap- but a lot of things had to happen for things to go so smoothly . If we hadn't worked out those deals with jimmy etc. our cap situation wouldn't be what it was now- and another team may have outbid us. I'm sure we weren't the only team interested in his services- and I'm pretty sure New England actually was going to try to bring him back as well. This is just one if those times we need to truly appreciate our general manager. I know we still have some work to do- but like him and John said- they're not done yet.

[runcontrol]

I could honestly care less about the top 100. The only people that should care are the players themselves and even that is stretching it a little. It's based on fan voting, enough said. The only thing that I care about is how other teams feel when they have to play the Ravens. And that is FEAR! Especially in the playoffs. Go Ravens!

 

The Top 100 isn't voted on by fans, its voted on by players.  Its cool to know that we already have 20% of the current list(counting Ngata), but there are only a few players left that can make the list.  Steve Smith and Dumervil are the only ones that come to mind.  Jimmy Smith belongs on the list but with the injury I don't know if he makes it. 

[Minionhunter]

The Patriots Ravens game was also influenced both times on the comebacks by not taking the usual TV timeout and letting the momentum subside or letting the Ravens defense rest. Highly unusual for them to not take the TV timeouts. Bizarre even. It was like they found a way to gain the effect of turning the lights out without turning them out and in a way few people even noticed. Magic trick to keep the Ravens down. I know a rabid patriot fan who was at the game and said that in all his years it was the weirdest game he had ever been to.

[riseNConquer81]

LOL, nice try.

 

150 yards was the amount of legitimate passing yardage that was given up by the defense of the Baltimore Ravens on "non-shady" plays in the second half., particularly from mid-3rd quarter on. Two TD passes was the amount of passing TDs the Ravens gave up in the second half on "non-shady plays" (they gave up 3 total on the second half, but you already knew that).

WHY does someone always have to try it?

You have to sustain a drive and get in range to throw that legit TD pass.

They used those formations to convert two first downs on a day they were catching 3 and outs every where despite our patchwork secondary. This is basically the "yeah, we definitely cheated but it was a blow out so it doesnt count argument."

Which is also dumb. They dont get credit for making a legit play after using the janky loophole to get out of trouble.

 

The ripple argument is nice and all, but that basically just means that we were mentally weak.

translation: "yeah you're right and i got nothing here, but I'm not gonna tell you that."

 

But I'll bite on this notion that we were "sound" in the 2nd half... please provide examples. Which specific players were allegedly "sound" and what did they actually do to perform at that level? If we are not going to go quantitative, then we should have no problem going qualitative.

Its one thing to be upset because the Patriots used allegedly "shady plays" to score a TD, but its completely different to stereotype the entire half as such when its simply not true.

*sigh* here you go...i make a point and now you wanna argue vocabulary.

You know what i mean...the job was getting done.

and i didnt stereotype anything...there's a turning point in every game, and that was it. Now you're just trying to strawman me.

Edited May 14, 2015 by riseNConquer81

[Rich McG]

Not a nice way to welcome a new player to the Ravens by saying we got him "on the cheap". Oz signed the young man for a reasonable price. Arrington is a top pro player from a most successful organization. We hope both parties are happy. Welcome aboard Kyle.

[RavensBaltimore]

So what you're saying is that people are outraged, yet they aren't willing to do anything about it to actually show their outrage, other than (lol at this notion)... booing somebody?

 

Stop and think about this notion for a minute... the response to something is allegeding so outraging is to boo. There is no single greater indicator of fake outrage than having your maximum amount of action being booing somebody.

In many situations, outrage makes people MORE interested in something, not less. Most people spend money to see their home team play, not the away team, and Pats fans are too far in denial to be outraged. If the home team doesn't sell out games unless there's a big attraction coming into town, the fact that people hate the visitor and want to see them stomped will make people more likely to spend money and potentially see it happen. When it comes to entertainment and competition, if you think outrage makes people more likely to ignore something, you don't understand human nature.

 

If everyone was cheating, or if people were outraged at the league itself, then you may have a point. But that's not the case. People aren't going to stop rooting for their team and being a fan of the league itself because of one team.

[stixfix69]

Oz got this baby!!!!!!!!!, and he ain't done yet.....

[bioLarzen]

"One day, #Ravens fans will appreciate the genius of Ozzie Newsome..."

 

I dunno who this Nestor Aparicio guy is, but what makes him think we're not appreciating it already?

[rmcjacket23]

WHY does someone always have to try it?

You have to sustain a drive and get in range to throw that legit TD pass.

They used those formations to convert two first downs on a day they were catching 3 and outs every where despite our patchwork secondary. This is basically the "yeah, we definitely cheated but it was a blow out so it doesnt count argument."

Which is also dumb. They dont get credit for making a legit play after using the janky loophole to get out of trouble.

 

translation: "yeah you're right and i got nothing here, but I'm not gonna tell you that."

 

*sigh* here you go...i make a point and now you wanna argue vocabulary.

You know what i mean...the job was getting done.

and i didnt stereotype anything...there's a turning point in every game, and that was it. Now you're just trying to strawman me.

 

All of the statistics I have provided occurred 100% AFTER THE ENTIRE DRIVE where the players used "shady" plays. I know exactly the drive you are talking about, where the TE caught back to back like 20 yard passes down the middle when Vereen was marked as ineligible. Gronk caught a 5 yard TD pass on that drive.

 

The 150 yards and two TDs the Ravens gave up that I am referring to occurred AFTER that drive, on completely separate drives, with completely valid and "non-shady" formations where the Ravens knew who was eligible.

 

AFTER the "shady" drive, the Patriots had the ball three more times where they were actually attempting to score. The first one, Brady completed back to back passes for 19 yards, and then Edelman completed the 51 yard TD pass on a HB pass to tie the game (a play in which our secondary looked incredibly foolish). We gave up 3 passes for 70 yards on that drive, resulting in a TD.

 

The next drive, the Pats went three and out, which I guess somehow validates the "sound" defensive play of the second half.

 

The next drive, the game winning drive, Brady went 8 for 9 for 72 yards, culminating in a 23 yard TD pass, and they never ran a 3rd down play on that entire drive.

 

So, again, you really are just stereotyping an entire half of football based on ONE drive where they used "shady" plays to score a TD. That has zero impact on the fact that in two drives after that drive, the Ravens allowed 11 of 12 balls to be completed, for over 140 yards... all out of completely "non-shady" formations.

 

If your assertion is that because of that "shady" drive it created a ripple effect that unraveled our entire defense, then again, all you're really saying is that we were too mentally weak on defense to win that game.

Edited May 14, 2015 by berad
keep the snark out of it

[The Mom Gene]

So what you're saying is that people are outraged, yet they aren't willing to do anything about it to actually show their outrage, other than (lol at this notion)... booing somebody?

 

Stop and think about this notion for a minute... the response to something is allegeding so outraging is to boo. There is no single greater indicator of fake outrage than having your maximum amount of action being booing somebody.

Jacket...  There is nothing else you can do as a fan of another team.  You can boycott the NFL, but as was said...Br*dy is Br*dy; and she will cry for her flags.  He's been known to even sit on the bench and pout.  The reality of the situation is as it is, and there is little we can do except make the Patriots lives a little more uncomfortable at M&T...  as other teams will as well.  They may laugh it off? 

 

But the NFL will get the message that the fans weren't happy if they should decide to decrease the punishment. 

 

AND THAT is what is important.

[The Mom Gene]

.

...there's a turning point in every game, and that was it..

So much so that Dan Patrick hosts a show called "Turning Point" on NBCSports.  It's awesome.  I have a DVD with 2012's Ravens run to the Super Bowl on it.  Every single one of those games had a turning point as well..... 

[rmcjacket23]

In many situations, outrage makes people MORE interested in something, not less. Most people spend money to see their home team play, not the away team, and Pats fans are too far in denial to be outraged. If the home team doesn't sell out games unless there's a big attraction coming into town, the fact that people hate the visitor and want to see them stomped will make people more likely to spend money and potentially see it happen. When it comes to entertainment and competition, if you think outrage makes people more likely to ignore something, you don't understand human nature.

 

If everyone was cheating, or if people were outraged at the league itself, then you may have a point. But that's not the case. People aren't going to stop rooting for their team and being a fan of the league itself because of one team.

But that's the thing... its not about just one team.

 

We know that the Patriots cheated... twice. We also know the Saints cheated, the Browns cheated, and the Falcons cheated. And those are just the cheaters that we actually know of, completely excludes the one's we think happened.

 

THEN... you throw in the Ray Rice case, Adrian Peterson and others, and the outrage that came from the NFL's perceived incompetence in handling it... AND REVENUE STILL INCREASES.

 

The same people that think Brady should be banned for life are the same people who portray this alleged outrage over most if not all of these incidents, and yet, the maximum response they can come up with is "booing"? Seriously?

[stixfix69]

I think it is clear, with Brady and the Pats organization fighting this thing, only shows more guilt....You would seriously think, since the punishment was handed down, Brady would step, and prove his innocence, to not only exonerate himself but the organization, but he isn't, so that kind of tells me he is guilty....

[Crusader]

Just goes to show the OZ knows whats going on more than us fans. He probably knew that about Kyle. That's why he had to make room.

[rmcjacket23]

Jacket...  There is nothing else you can do as a fan of another team.  You can boycott the NFL, but as was said...Br*dy is Br*dy; and she will cry for her flags.  He's been known to even sit on the bench and pout.  The reality of the situation is as it is, and there is little we can do except make the Patriots lives a little more uncomfortable at M&T...  as other teams will as well.  They may laugh it off? 

 

But the NFL will get the message that the fans weren't happy if they should decide to decrease the punishment. 

 

AND THAT is what is important.

But that's my entire point... the NFL won't get that message. At all. Roger Goodell gets loudly booed every single time he comes to the podium to announce a draft pick on draft day, and its been that way for years. Does the NFL care? Of course not. If they were that concerned about it, then he wouldn't be announcing the picks at all... they'd let some lacky do it. He doesn't even need to be there, and the event would do just fine.

 

The NFL reacts to "unhappiness" in the fanbase when the fanbase actually takes actions that effect the NFL. How loud the fanbase boos somebody doesn't have any effect on the NFL. At best, you may get a smirk out of Brady, and even that's a stretch.

 

Plus, I certainly don't buy the notion that reducing Brady's punishment is going to make somebody boo louder. You were already going to boo him before he was even caught cheating, and his suspension being reduced really has nothing to do with him, because that's not his call, so you're really booing the wrong person.

 

In a circle back kind of way, it actually would probably mean that Goodell just gets booed louder when the 2016 draft comes around, but we already know neither he nor the NFL cares about that.

[NorthDakotaRaven]

Here's a conspiracy theory for everyone - the NFL needs to generate news/headlines after the draft until training camp begins - last year was the RR scandal and this season Deflate gate punishment. (I don't really believe this, just think it's funny/coincidental & Shady and the Deflatriots are guilty btw) Good way to generate some off season ratings though....

[Crusader]

On Brady.

4 games. Look what Matt C did when Brady got hurt last time besides they could really only lose to Pitts. How nice for us. 2 NFC and 2 AFC.

1 million dollars. Kraft makes that in on hour.

One 1st round and a 4th. Your never really sure they work out. look at Matt Elam and they are normally picking last anyway. Their such BABIES.Take your medicine and stop cheating.

[RavensBaltimore]

But that's the thing... its not about just one team.

 

We know that the Patriots cheated... twice. We also know the Saints cheated, the Browns cheated, and the Falcons cheated. And those are just the cheaters that we actually know of, completely excludes the one's we think happened.

 

THEN... you throw in the Ray Rice case, Adrian Peterson and others, and the outrage that came from the NFL's perceived incompetence in handling it... AND REVENUE STILL INCREASES.

 

The same people that think Brady should be banned for life are the same people who portray this alleged outrage over most if not all of these incidents, and yet, the maximum response they can come up with is "booing"? Seriously?

The Saints, Browns, and Falcons were all penalized, and that's just a handful of teams over the last few years, which isn't going to bring down the league as a whole. There will always be players/teams that try to cheat, and that won't tarnish the entire league, unless it becomes the norm for the majority and the league doesn't do anything about it. When it's just an incident here and there, that's about as little as you can expect.

 

The Rice and Peterson situations were personal situations that had nothing to do with football. I don't see why people would stop watching the NFL because of a few off the field incidents, especially when the league listened to them and created harsher penalties. The league has, what, 1,500 players? You take 1,500 people from any profession, and you're going to have some criminal acts. As far as being an NFL fan is concerned, someone's personal life is not relevant to cheating on the field.

 

And I don't see how just booing means that people aren't outraged. What else are they supposed to do? Again, they're not going to stop rooting for their team and and watching football because of one repeat offender. You're basically saying since there's nothing that people can do about it, then they must be faking their outrage.

[The Mom Gene]

All of the statistics I have provided occurred 100% AFTER THE ENTIRE DRIVE where the players used "shady" plays. I know exactly the drive you are talking about, where the TE caught back to back like 20 yard passes down the middle when Vereen was marked as ineligible. Gronk caught a 5 yard TD pass on that drive.

 

The 150 yards and two TDs the Ravens gave up that I am referring to occurred AFTER that drive, on completely separate drives, with completely valid and "non-shady" formations where the Ravens knew who was eligible.

 

AFTER the "shady" drive, the Patriots had the ball three more times where they were actually attempting to score. The first one, Brady completed back to back passes for 19 yards, and then Edelman completed the 51 yard TD pass on a HB pass to tie the game (a play in which our secondary looked incredibly foolish). We gave up 3 passes for 70 yards on that drive, resulting in a TD.

 

The next drive, the Pats went three and out, which I guess somehow validates the "sound" defensive play of the second half.

 

The next drive, the game winning drive, Brady went 8 for 9 for 72 yards, culminating in a 23 yard TD pass, and they never ran a 3rd down play on that entire drive.

 

So, again, you really are just stereotyping an entire half of football based on ONE drive where they used "shady" plays to score a TD. That has zero impact on the fact that in two drives after that drive, the Ravens allowed 11 of 12 balls to be completed, for over 140 yards... all out of completely "non-shady" formations.

 

If your assertion is that because of that "shady" drive it created a ripple effect that unraveled our entire defense, then again, all you're really saying is that we were too mentally weak on defense to win that game.

Come on Man...  Jacket...  You gonna sit here and tell us that you don't believe that what the Patriots were doing wasn't shady?  They ran that play with the ineligible receivers like 3 times.  Not only that, I still maintain, that if Torrey had fought off that last interception, we'd have won that game....   That was 1st down on that play.  There was plenty left to get the rest of the way down the field.

[The Mom Gene]

But that's the thing... its not about just one team.

 

We know that the Patriots cheated... twice. We also know the Saints cheated, the Browns cheated, and the Falcons cheated. And those are just the cheaters that we actually know of, completely excludes the one's we think happened.

 

THEN... you throw in the Ray Rice case, Adrian Peterson and others, and the outrage that came from the NFL's perceived incompetence in handling it... AND REVENUE STILL INCREASES.

 

The same people that think Brady should be banned for life are the same people who portray this alleged outrage over most if not all of these incidents, and yet, the maximum response they can come up with is "booing"? Seriously?

I'm not counting the "domestic cases".

All of those teams were sanctioned by the NFL...  ALL of them paid fines for their cheating.  Why shouldn't the Patriots?  Those other teams???  Mostly first offenses...  These guys are consistent....  And I haven't heard one person say that he should be banned for life.  That's a little over the top...  I believe that there are folks that believe that he should have gotten more than four games...  but he DOES deserve more than one or two for sure.

[January J]

I thought this was kind of funny- article about the explanation the pats came up with for some of the strange texts. https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/patriots-absurd-explanation-why-employee-161111297.html