Welcome to Baltimore, Breshad Perriman

[Inqui]

One thing I really hate, as far as comparisons go, is comparing college players to current NFL players. There's a huge gap in talent difference between the NFL and college ranks, so it's already flawed, and most players don't stay the same in the NFL. Most will improve, even if it's only by a little. 

 

I wish analysts would dig deeper and compare the players to NFL players as they were coming out of college. Then, instead of hearing about how Perriman compares to Torrey Smith or Stephen Hill, we'd hear about how he compares to Julio Jones or Andre Johnson. Personally, I think it means more to compare them to former college players that are now in the NFL because it shows the potential for a player to develop and get better because almost no college prospect (outside of Luck) is perfect.

I think those kinds of comparisons come with the implied caveat that it's a vague look at the mould of player they're in. Busts happen and players outperform expectations, but when I say Perriman could become a Stephen Hill or a Demariyus Thomas, that's just me saying I think that's the kind of guy we're getting - as opposed to a Jeremy Maclin or Doug Baldwin or something. It's not saying he will be DT/Hill/Julio/anyone else - but when discussing how the Ravens will look down the line those kinds of comparisons are a really good starting point.

[BmoreBird22]

I think it would be premature as those players didn't come into the league with problems and just wake up and have them all corrected. They worked on them. I think it is fair to say that a player has the potential to become someone but to say that is who they will become is a bit premature and leads to players being overhyped and being pressured by too much expectations.

I'm not saying that if we put the college comparison of Andre Johnson to Breshad Perriman that it means Breshad will be Johnson, but it gives you an idea of how well he can develop and how he could possibly turn out. When someone sees a pro player comparison of Torrey Smith, they'll likely get the wrong idea and I think that's what's happening with the lesser draft intensive fans.

[BmoreBird22]

I think those kinds of comparisons come with the implied caveat that it's a vague look at the mould of player they're in. Busts happen and players outperform expectations, but when I say Perriman could become a Stephen Hill or a Demariyus Thomas, that's just me saying I think that's the kind of guy we're getting - as opposed to a Jeremy Maclin or Doug Baldwin or something. It's not saying he will be DT/Hill/Julio/anyone else - but when discussing how the Ravens will look down the line those kinds of comparisons are a really good starting point.

And that's my point. If you say he compares to Andre Johnson coming out of college, it doesn't mean he will be Johnson, just that the two were similar coming out of college and needed similar things to be worked on and hopefully Breshad can be even 80% of what Johnson was/is.

[808Blackbirds]

Just no on the Sammie coates comparison .

Tell me how much better Perriman is then?i know Perriman is better than Coates but by how much in your eyes? The gap isnt that huge that people make it seem. Coates is the Torrey Smith clone but he fights and goes up for balls with bad hands. i was just saying the steelers got another players that CAN boom thats what im worried about.

[52520Andrew]

I'm not saying that if we put the college comparison of Andre Johnson to Breshad Perriman that it means Breshad will be Johnson, but it gives you an idea of how well he can develop and how he could possibly turn out. When someone sees a pro player comparison of Torrey Smith, they'll likely get the wrong idea and I think that's what's happening with the lesser draft intensive fans.

I guess you could say that but people do see the potential in Perriman, I don't think that is getting by people. I think the biggest concern with people is the 14% drop rate and the fact that he is a bit raw in his routes. I think most people realize that if he gets it corrected, then he should become a really good player. Plenty of people have brought up his potential to be an elite WR. I agree players aren't complete once they make the pros but you can't dismiss the developmental aspect because that is how players get overhyped like Tommy Streeter or Stephen Hill.

[Inqui]

I'm not saying that if we put the college comparison of Andre Johnson to Breshad Perriman that it means Breshad will be Johnson, but it gives you an idea of how well he can develop and how he could possibly turn out. When someone sees a pro player comparison of Torrey Smith, they'll likely get the wrong idea and I think that's what's happening with the lesser draft intensive fans.

That I agree with to an extent. Comparing a rookie to an established pro can be misleading, but at the same time that kind of thing is relevant in whether we take a step back next season.

 

As a hypothetical, if Jimmy Smith retired this offseason and we'd taken Jalen Collins, comparing a pro Jimmy to a rookie Jalen is relevant because it means our CB quality took a massive hit for the next season. But in the longer term, it really depends on Jalen and that's where the above comparisons come in handy.

 

It's two different discussions and to me it seems like the people bringing up Torrey are more comparing what we're getting from day one, but I could be wrong though. That saying, I think people will be surprised by how different the two are even in Perriman's rookie year - I don't think Perriman has the kind of top-end speed we loved from Torey (still quick, but not the pure burner Torrey was) but he'll be a much better possession receiver than people realise.

[Inqui]

I guess you could say that but people do see the potential in Perriman, I don't think that is getting by people. I think the biggest concern with people is the 14% drop rate and the fact that he is a bit raw in his routes. I think most people realize that if he gets it corrected, then he should become a really good player. Plenty of people have brought up his potential to be an elite WR. I agree players aren't complete once they make the pros but you can't dismiss the developmental aspect because that is how players get overhyped like Tommy Streeter or Stephen Hill.

That's a really important point imo, especially for players who aren't as pro-ready as others. I remember the post-draft hype after we took Matt Elam and, well, I think we all know how that turned out.

[beasy2487]

And that why coates is a 3rd rounder.

And was probably still a reach at that point.

[52520Andrew]

That's a really important point imo, especially for players who aren't as pro-ready as others. I remember the post-draft hype after we took Matt Elam and, well, I think we all know how that turned out.

 

Yeah I can guarentee you Carolina fans are saying that Funchess is a guy who has concentration issues as well. 

 

I also wouldn't be so quick to dismiss Coates as some are doing here, I think he landed in the perfect situation where he gets great coaching and isn't being asked to do much early. I thought Martavis Bryant was a guy who would likely never develop and he surprised me last year. 

[Crabcakes&Football]

Tell me how much better Perriman is then?i know Perriman is better than Coates but by how much in your eyes? The gap isnt that huge that people make it seem. Coates is the Torrey Smith clone but he fights and goes up for balls with bad hands. i was just saying the steelers got another players that CAN boom thats what im worried about.

Can't knock em, they had a good draft. Coates was solid value in the third. Perriman is hands down the better prospect though. Coates can become a weapon with Ben, but Perriman's upside is right there with some of the best in the game today.

[JoeyFlex5]

And that why coates is a 3rd rounder. 

youre the one who said, and i quote, "to me they are the same player" 

 

thats just not true, not even close.

[JoeyFlex5]

Tell me how much better Perriman is then?i know Perriman is better than Coates but by how much in your eyes? The gap isnt that huge that people make it seem. Coates is the Torrey Smith clone but he fights and goes up for balls with bad hands. i was just saying the steelers got another players that CAN boom thats what im worried about.

perriman is that much better than coates, im not saying coates is bad, but he belonged in the 3rd round for a reason. there is a chance that coates becomes absolutely nothing, he isnt running a 4.2 or 4.3, he ran a 4.42, and watching the tape you can see that perriman is faster. coates is a big strong man for sure, but all that muscle mass doesnt do much for him if he lacks the body control to turn himself around and highpoint the ball, he will make his living by hoping he can outrun db's and having the qb deliver the ball perfectly to him in stride, and if that doesnt work out for him on a regular basis(like it did for torrey) then he will bust, if it does work out for him, well then that appears to be his ceiling, a straight line burner who body catches. 

 

perriman has a complete skillset and better athletic traits overall, better hands, and he has alot of the things that seperate a trackstar from a real wr. 

 

dont get me wrong, if we were to get a guy like agholor or dorsett, someone who was a very safe pick to play a possession role with some speed, then i would have had coates on my radar just to pair the 2 up, but i would take perriman and williams over one of those combinations any day

[Cville-Raven]

Tell me how much better Perriman is then?i know Perriman is better than Coates but by how much in your eyes? The gap isnt that huge that people make it seem. Coates is the Torrey Smith clone but he fights and goes up for balls with bad hands. i was just saying the steelers got another players that CAN boom thats what im worried about.

Perriman's game is far more complete and versatile than Coates'. Coates isn't much more than a downfield burner. Edited May 4, 2015 by Cville-Raven

[808Blackbirds]

youre the one who said, and i quote, "to me they are the same player" 

 

thats just not true, not even close.

 

not even close is like saying coates is 5'9 slow cant catch anything. hahah im done

[808Blackbirds]

perriman is that much better than coates, im not saying coates is bad, but he belonged in the 3rd round for a reason. there is a chance that coates becomes absolutely nothing, he isnt running a 4.2 or 4.3, he ran a 4.42, and watching the tape you can see that perriman is faster. coates is a big strong man for sure, but all that muscle mass doesnt do much for him if he lacks the body control to turn himself around and highpoint the ball, he will make his living by hoping he can outrun db's and having the qb deliver the ball perfectly to him in stride, and if that doesnt work out for him on a regular basis(like it did for torrey) then he will bust, if it does work out for him, well then that appears to be his ceiling, a straight line burner who body catches. 

 

perriman has a complete skillset and better athletic traits overall, better hands, and he has alot of the things that seperate a trackstar from a real wr. 

 

dont get me wrong, if we were to get a guy like agholor or dorsett, someone who was a very safe pick to play a possession role with some speed, then i would have had coates on my radar just to pair the 2 up, but i would take perriman and williams over one of those combinations any day

 4.42 is slow now?

[BmoreBird22]

I guess you could say that but people do see the potential in Perriman, I don't think that is getting by people. I think the biggest concern with people is the 14% drop rate and the fact that he is a bit raw in his routes. I think most people realize that if he gets it corrected, then he should become a really good player. Plenty of people have brought up his potential to be an elite WR. I agree players aren't complete once they make the pros but you can't dismiss the developmental aspect because that is how players get overhyped like Tommy Streeter or Stephen Hill.

 

 

That I agree with to an extent. Comparing a rookie to an established pro can be misleading, but at the same time that kind of thing is relevant in whether we take a step back next season.

 

As a hypothetical, if Jimmy Smith retired this offseason and we'd taken Jalen Collins, comparing a pro Jimmy to a rookie Jalen is relevant because it means our CB quality took a massive hit for the next season. But in the longer term, it really depends on Jalen and that's where the above comparisons come in handy.

 

It's two different discussions and to me it seems like the people bringing up Torrey are more comparing what we're getting from day one, but I could be wrong though. That saying, I think people will be surprised by how different the two are even in Perriman's rookie year - I don't think Perriman has the kind of top-end speed we loved from Torey (still quick, but not the pure burner Torrey was) but he'll be a much better possession receiver than people realise.

And Andrew, you're touching on exactly what I mean when I say they should compare the incoming rookies to former college players coming out. If I say he compares favorably to Julio Jones or Andre Johnson when they came out, which he does, then I'm saying he's like how they were when they came out. Big, fast, raw receivers with hands that needed a little work. With Johnson and Julio, they both developed into very good players and that shows a lot of potential for what Perriman can become. If I say Perriman compares favorably to Torrey Smith as a pro (as many analysts will say), that's kinda like saying all he will ever be is Torrey Smith. It doesn't leave room to say he's got a ton higher potential or that he could be better than Torrey. It's almost like saying that his career arc will be what Torrey's is, which I disagree with. 

 

And when you do actually compare it to a former college player, especially the greats like Johnson and Julio, you're reminded that these guys weren't great receivers from the get go. They had to work on things and get better, much like how Perriman will. 

 

Inqui, I'm not getting at people comparing their production, I'm talking the actual skill sets, like if we compared Marcus Peters to Jimmy Smith, which is actually a very favorable college comparison, in many ways. I understand people talking about replacing Torrey's production, but I'm talking how his career could potentially unfold.

Edited May 4, 2015 by BmoreBird22

[52520Andrew]

And Andrew, you're touching on exactly what I mean when I say they should compare the incoming rookies to former college players coming out. If I say he compares favorably to Julio Jones or Andre Johnson when they came out, which he does, then I'm saying he's like how they were when they came out. Big, fast, raw receivers with hands that needed a little work. With Johnson and Julio, they both developed into very good players and that shows a lot of potential for what Perriman can become. If I say Perriman compares favorably to Torrey Smith as a pro (as many analysts will say), that's kinda like saying all he will ever be is Torrey Smith. It doesn't leave room to say he's got a ton higher potential or that he could be better than Torrey. It's almost like saying that his career arc will be what Torrey's is, which I disagree with. 

 

Inqui, I'm not getting at people comparing their production, I'm talking the actual skill sets, like if we compared Marcus Peters to Jimmy Smith, which is actually a very favorable college comparison, in many ways. I understand people talking about replacing Torrey's production, but I'm talking how his career could potentially unfold.

 

I think what you are missing though is that people are saying he can become a Julio or Andre Johnson, they are comparing him to Torrey but saying that he has the potential to be that elite WR. I think one of the Ravens articles said he compared to Julio. If there are people saying he can't be better than Torrey, then they are wrong because he certainly can. I just don't think it is fair to dismiss the work that goes into becoming an Andre or Julio from what they were coming out of college. I saw a lot of people looking for the next Antonio Brown this year but he is one of the hardest working players in the league and didn't become the player he is today just like that. It reminds me of people looking for the next JJ Watt or Richard Sherman, I think it is a bit of a waste of time as every player is different. I think if you compare a player to Andre or Calvin, then you get the opposite problem to what you described and that is the less informed fans expecting that type of player straight out the box which rarely happens. I think a player similar to Torrey Smith is a fair expectation for Perriman this year with the potential to develop into an elite WR down the road and I think that is what most people are getting at with the comparisons.

[BmoreBird22]

I think what you are missing though is that people are saying he can become a Julio or Andre Johnson, they are comparing him to Torrey but saying that he has the potential to be that elite WR. I think one of the Ravens articles said he compared to Julio. If there are people saying he can't be better than Torrey, then they are wrong because he certainly can. I just don't think it is fair to dismiss the work that goes into becoming an Andre or Julio from what they were coming out of college. I saw a lot of people looking for the next Antonio Brown this year but he is one of the hardest working players in the league and didn't become the player he is today just like that. It reminds me of people looking for the next JJ Watt or Richard Sherman, I think it is a bit of a waste of time as every player is different. I think if you compare a player to Andre or Calvin, then you get the opposite problem to what you described and that is the less informed fans expecting that type of player straight out the box which rarely happens. I think a player similar to Torrey Smith is a fair expectation for Perriman this year with the potential to develop into an elite WR down the road and I think that is what most people are getting at with the comparisons.

I've seen a lot of analyst that have said that his ceiling is Torrey Smith and his floor is Stephen Hill and that's my issue with the debate.

[beasy2487]

 4.42 is slow now?

 

I think the thing to note about Coates is that he absolutely has the size and speed to be as good a receiver as anyone in the league, so much as the draft, but his catching ability (or lack thereof) is so bad that it dropped him two full rounds. He's Stephen Hill with a little more toughness, because of that I think he sticks around the league and has a career but I don't think coaching fixes the issues he has catching the ball.

[JoeyFlex5]

 4.42 is slow now?

never said 4.42 is slow, im saying he is a straight line burner, while perriman is a much more well rounded receiver, and is still faster than coates. 

 

and to the post you quoted me on earlier, "not even close is like saying coates is 5'9 slow cant catch anything. hahah im done" 

 

really? youre just reaching now to stir the pot. you said they are literally the same player, ok so they are similar heights, fast, are considered raw, and have dreads, that makes them literally the same player? how about the part where perriman catches with his hands and coates is almost completely unable to? how about the part where coates has no ability to go in and out of breaks? how about the part where coates struggles greatly to adjust to the ball? how about the total lack of body control? 

 

youre right, same exact player, zero differences, and if i say otherwise then coates must be 5'9" and slow...

[Inqui]

I've seen a lot of analyst that have said that his ceiling is Torrey Smith and his floor is Stephen Hill and that's my issue with the debate.

That I can agree with. The point is that they are two different discussions and convoluting the two can be misleading - though honestly I haven't seen an awful lot of it on here.

[Inqui]

 4.42 is slow now?

40 times (without pads or DBs trying to cover you) are singularly the most overrated way to judge a prospect. Even highlight tapes are better.

[52520Andrew]

I've seen a lot of analyst that have said that his ceiling is Torrey Smith and his floor is Stephen Hill and that's my issue with the debate.

 

Yeah I think we all can agree on that, Perriman has a very high ceiling. 

[ravensnick]

Another thing I like about Perriman is his work ethic. He was a 2 star coming out of high school and UCF was one of the only schools that offered him. His dad played at Miami and then was a 2nd round pick. Miami didn't even look at Breshad. Perriman says he's willing to work hard as anyone out there to get ready for the NFL and I believe him. Seems like he is a high character guy. 

 

It's also interesting, because both Max William's granddad and dad played in the NFL. We got some bonafide bloodlines in the draft. 

Edited May 4, 2015 by ravensnick

[allblackraven]

I've seen a lot of analyst that have said that his ceiling is Torrey Smith and his floor is Stephen Hill and that's my issue with the debate.

I wonder how many Perriman to Torrey Smith comparisons would have been made if Torrey never played for Ravens. It's nothing else but people's lazyness. Wearing purple at one stage of their careers is pretty much the only similarity these two guys will ever share. And SB rings.

[Inqui]

Another thing I like about Perriman is his work ethic. He was a 2 star coming out of high school and UCF was one of the only schools that offered him. His dad played at Miami and then was a 2nd round pick. Miami didn't even look at Breshad. Perriman says he's willing to work hard as anyone out there to get ready for the NFL and I believe him. Seems like he is a high character guy. 

 

It's also interesting, because both Max William's granddad and dad played in the NFL. We got some bonafide bloodlines in the draft. 

Yeah, don't sleep on the fact that his production has improved every year so far. And his best year came without the best QB he's ever had (until now, but you know what I mean). He could still bust, but that's an encouraging sign I can pretty much guarantee the FO will have noticed.

[beasy2487]

Yeah, don't sleep on the fact that his production has improved every year so far. And his best year came without the best QB he's ever had (until now, but you know what I mean). He could still bust, but that's an encouraging sign I can pretty much guarantee the FO will have noticed.

 

Yea Ozzie mentioned that point during one of the pressers. I think our entire staff took this draft personally and we're going to see that on the field.

[GrimCoconut]

Yeah, don't sleep on the fact that his production has improved every year so far. And his best year came without the best QB he's ever had (until now, but you know what I mean). He could still bust, but that's an encouraging sign I can pretty much guarantee the FO will have noticed.

What impressed me most about him is what he did with a new QB on a team running a pro style offense over the spread. For this reason I think he's more pro ready than most and while his drops concern me, I trust they can be improved. If not, we still have some big targets that can catch.

[GrimCoconut]

Yea Ozzie mentioned that point during one of the pressers. I think our entire staff took this draft personally and we're going to see that on the field.

Rumor (not really, it's a joke) has it that Ozzie Newsome sent Jerry Coleman of 105.7 The Fan a personally signed picture of Perriman holding up his jersey in response to his stupid question during the draft press conference.

[808Blackbirds]

never said 4.42 is slow, im saying he is a straight line burner, while perriman is a much more well rounded receiver, and is still faster than coates. 

 

and to the post you quoted me on earlier, "not even close is like saying coates is 5'9 slow cant catch anything. hahah im done" 

 

really? youre just reaching now to stir the pot. you said they are literally the same player, ok so they are similar heights, fast, are considered raw, and have dreads, that makes them literally the same player? how about the part where perriman catches with his hands and coates is almost completely unable to? how about the part where coates has no ability to go in and out of breaks? how about the part where coates struggles greatly to adjust to the ball? how about the total lack of body control? 

 

youre right, same exact player, zero differences, and if i say otherwise then coates must be 5'9" and slow...

Disappointing hands that led to too many drops in college

Lacks polish and technique to the position

Raw in his routes, relying on speed and athleticism over precision

Fights the ball at times, especially when working back to the quarterback

Redirected in his routes more than expected for a receiver his size

 

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