Arthur Brown at OLB? (speculation)

[ravensnick]

I still say we could field a dominate 4-3 defense.

 

LE: Courtney Upshaw/Elvis Dumervil, Brent Urban

DT: Timmy Jernigan, DeAngelo Tyson, Kapron Lewis-Moore

NT: Haloti Ngata, Brandon Williams

RE: Terrell Suggs

SLB: Daryl Smith, Albert McClellan

MLB: CJ Mosley

WLB: Arthur Brown, Zach Orr

 

Tell me those pieces don't fit. Dumervil could go back to RE and Suggs to LE if need be but man, that could be something.

It could be a decent idea, but Doom plays a lot better as a 2 point OLB than a 3 point DE. I think if we transition to a 4-3, Ngata is definitely gone. Upshaw would greatly improve as I think he is more of a Strong end in a 4-3 than a OLB. I think we could possible make the change depending on the draft but the 3-4 has worked so great for so long and the 3-4 is starting to become more popular in the NFL.

Edited February 8, 2015 by ravensnick

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

Even if we lost Ngata that front 4 would be deadly.

[BSHU_Miami]

I've always felt that we were drafting for a 4-3 defense. It just makes too much sense I will say within the next year or two the 4-3 will be our primary defense. It's always good to get a little experience in the 3-4 too.

[BmoreBird22]

Pees used to run a 4-3 in New England, so it wouldn't be unheard of for him to run that defense here. The Ravens also had Spags, who ran the 4-3. Maybe they were leaning that way and drafting for it.

That would be Brown's best chance to start and actually play. He could be a good Will, but right now, he's just too small

[rmw10]

We do run a ton of 4-3 under, so the baseline is there.  Put the focus of 4-3 principles and I don't question that we could make it work.  I've made it no secret that I'm a fan of the base 4-3 since I'd prefer to have the better athletes on the field in the state of today's NFL.  In the end though, I expect this to be another year of false hope lol.

[ellicottraven]

This topic is tantamount to saying we get Will Hill or Matt Elam to play OLB. Brown is the smallest LBer we have on our team and you expect him to be an OLB on a 3-4 D where he consistently has to go up against tackels that outweigh him by a 100 lbs??

[GrimCoconut]

This topic is tantamount to saying we get Will Hill or Matt Elam to play OLB. Brown is the smallest LBer we have on our team and you expect him to be an OLB on a 3-4 D where he consistently has to go up against tackels that outweigh him by a 100 lbs??

Well, Forsett did block guys with a lot more weight than him. Lol

[CalvinSmoke]

This topic is tantamount to saying we get Will Hill or Matt Elam to play OLB. Brown is the smallest LBer we have on our team and you expect him to be an OLB on a 3-4 D where he consistently has to go up against tackels that outweigh him by a 100 lbs??

The last time I looked Brown up he was listed 240+, that's about average in today's nfl I thought

[redrum52]

Art Brown for safety...

[rmw10]

The last time I looked Brown up he was listed 240+, that's about average in today's nfl I thought

 

He's not that big.  I know during camp, some said that him rising to 235 was pretty embellished.  Of course, we don't have an actual number, but it's widely been speculated that he's stuck in the mid 220s.

[ellicottraven]

Well, Forsett did block guys with a lot more weight than him. Lol

Blocking is one thing because all Forsett needed to do was just create enough pause in the rusher to allow Flacco time to move or throw. But, now we are asking Art Brown to bull doze through an offensive line to get at the QB.

[Yatagarasu]

We all seen this before...

 

Our LB Corps is that good that Arthur Brown is a benchwarmer for us, while a starter for many.

 

I say we just let it ride since we need the depth and if one of our two stud LBs get injured.

 

Paul Kruger didn't do anything for almost 3 years and then he blew up in the last year to get his contract.

Edited February 9, 2015 by Yatagarasu

[Tru11]

his best chance is to become part of the rotation @ ILB.

 

probably on passing down when smith starts to slow down in pass coverage or on inside blitzes.

 

brown would be a terrible olb in our current scheme cause he aint a natural pass rusher.

if he wants to become one I guess dumerville is the 1 who he should alter his game around but I don't see it happening.

 

right now he is insurance for mosley and daryl.

 

BTW he played pretty well in his rookie season so he can play though.

its just smith and mosley are better with smith relying a lot on his veteran instinct.

people just need to accept these guys where 3 down lbers who where healthy so no reason to sub them out or to activate brown.

[Purple_ICE 81]

Hopefully we do something with him...get something out of the 2nd rounder we wasted on him. Just plain and simple USE him, find a place for him somewhere on defense where he can contribute.

[izvoodoo]

He isn't active because he's bad at special teams.  If Daryl Smith got hurt Arthur Brown would play pretty much every snap. 

[Pirate88]

This isn't backed up by facts at all. But could he play there? The middle is going to be pre occupiued for another 2-3 years, shall we let him put his speed to use while he can learn behind a smaller technician in Doom?

First issue here is the ravens will have a need at LB before another 3 yrs. Darryl Smith is 33 and already has lost a half step that's evident in his range and coverage skill!! He gets by due to his smarts and sound tackling technique. Like other LBs learned its hard to continue to excel once they start losing half steps every year. Just ask Urlacher and Lance Briggs he will be a liability in the ravens defense eventually!! When a LB or cornerback begins relying on smarts they won't be playing up to their standard much longer in the nfl. Edge rushers can actually counter losing a half step with skill and technique. But a standard LB not quite so much. I'm actually questioning if he has another pro bowl caliber year left next year. Especially when there are 2 great replacements available this off season at bargain rates!!

The first lb the ravens should consider is Sean Weatherspoon. He is explosive, plays with good instincts, hits hard and can cover TEs and RBs or patrol a zone as well as many Strong Safety's thanks to his speed,agility and instincts. He is a 3 down LB in the mold of Mosley or Navorro Bowman. And he will be a bargain cuz he is coming off an injury just as Darryl Smith was cheap after coming off an injury. He is however much younger than Daryll Smith. He would easily play even better than before in our defense cuz of our DLine is far more talented and physical than any he has ever played with in Atlanta. He would be free to run hit and cover on our defense like he never had the luxury of before. He and Mosley would form the NFL's best physical 3 down LB tandem.

The other elite physical 3 down defender we could consider is Daryl Washington. Very similar size and skill of CJ Mosley. He can run, slip blocks with a mixture physicality and athleticism, cover and hit hard. He is coming off some off field probs but has worked hard to prove he is more focused and better person. He could be had cheap and is the prototype 3 down LB like Mosley. We have the coaching and locker room to keep him straight and get rewarded with a great player.

Just my opinion but I think ilbs and 4-3 LBs are more needed than ever. The position has been devalued due to the RBs being devalued. However having LBs with safety speed/ athleticism yet still physical makes them more important than before. Slower LBs that get burned in coverage is as bad as LBs that can't tackle shed or play physical. Either way the defense gets burned. You have some coverage LBs that are to soft for a LB then you have LBs like Brandon Spikes and Hightower that can shed tackle and hit but get burned in coverage. Sad thing is most teams are happy with these 2 down run defending physical tacklers whom leave the field on third downs which is totally Rediculous!! IN TODAYS GAME TEAMS DONT WAIT TIL DOWN#3 TO THROW THE BALL!! The better offenses throw on early downs often!! If your 2 down LB is getting torched by RBs and TEs you won't have to worry bout him having to leave the field on down3 cuz The better QBs will smoke your defense and put up points b4 they see a third down!! Especially the better qbs like Brady who get rid of the ball fast to the middle of the field and make fast reads and exploit slow 2 down LBs!! My opinion that's the reason physical yet athletic ilbs that can run with RBs and TEs and patrol a zone and close on the intended WR in a flash like a safety is as important as shutdown corners, edge rushers or ball hawking FS. If Daryl Smith has to leave the field next year on third down then he is a liability especially against the better QBs!! Daryll Smith may still be good enough in coverage next year but if a longterm lb that is not expensive is available this off season to partner up with Mosley the ravens should at least consider it in my opinion.

As for Arthur Brown fans, are hoping his issues were just how well Mosley and Daryll Smith played. If he really does have physicality and tackling issues along with likely technique issues then adding 10-15lbs may not help all that much. It would likely help him but if he is to soft and weak at 230 then he won't be anything to write home about at 245. Physical LBs and hard hitters are more naturally gifted than built in the gym. Adding muscle just makes physical hard hitting LBs and safety's into feared monsters. Players like Mosley Daryll Washington Lavonte David are physical forces and hard strikers at 230 lbs but become terrors that strike literal fear in ball carriers after getting bigger and stronger. The greatest in Ray Lewis when he weighed 225 knocked bigger power RBs backward and threw TEs to the ground like rag dolls and after bulking up to 245 then 255 eventually struck fear in ball carriers to the extent they looked for places to lay down before he got there. But he was already a hard striker who knocked bigger ball carriers backward even before bulking up. Mosley and Daryl Washington at 230 lbs can rock a fullback or TE and fight through blocks. Yet explosive enough to get depth in their drops and destroy Gronkowski's and Julian Nerdelman's that catch or attempt to catch in their zones in the middle of the field cuz they can close as fast as safety's!! Ed Reed could really lay wood at only 205 lbs. Will Hill when he was unfocused with the giants and unconditioned and rarely in the weight room played very physical and took down TEs like ragdolls even though he was on the thin side. Now that he is spending his off season in the weight room and is looking to finally fill his big frame out to 215-223, he is going to really lay some wood cuz he is already a physical tackler. If Arthur Brown isn't the replacement for Daryll Smith the ravens will need his replacement very soon cuz he is 33 and has lost a half step so far.

Edited February 10, 2015 by Pirate88

[CalvinSmoke]

Pirate you must be trying to get a job on the site writing these 12 chapter novels lol.

[Pirate88]

Thanks dude lol. We need to beat the patriots next year. They will be our competition to reach the superbowl for another year. I was a patriots fan b4 a ravens fan and know what it takes to beat them cowards.

[BMORE21]

arthur brown shows a lot of flashes.. we need to keep him on the roster because soon enough darryl smith will be finished 

[RavenManiac#7]

He hasn't sucked though. It was only a bad draft pick because the FO can't get past their BPA mindset.

I tend to agree with that. Although Ozzie has his great reputation, and has had some awesome drafts, think about the last few years. Last year's was amazing, but he had the 17th pick. Look at the couple of drafts before that, when we were in our customary very late draft position. There's been quite a number of misses. He is definitely committed to the BPA philosophy, and I think it would be ok to follow that in general. But, I believe that there are some times when you have to maybe abandon that just a little and drop a few spots on your board if you have to in order to fill a glaring need your team has. It looks to me like Ozzie almost Refuses to consider that. Thus, often we find ourselves with players that hardly ever get on the field because we didn't need them unless there was an injury. To me, sometimes you take the player your team needs Now, not just if an injury occurs. Depth is great, but so is filling needs. That's why I don't think one should be Married to a single idea like BPA. Sometimes it's better to be adaptable. Course, Ozzie's a hundred times smarter than me so, bottom line, you gotta go with him. He's put a darn good product on the field, despite some misses, for a long time.

[RavenManiac#7]

He's not that big.  I know during camp, some said that him rising to 235 was pretty embellished.  Of course, we don't have an actual number, but it's widely been speculated that he's stuck in the mid 220s.

That really surprises me. It's hard to believe that Ozzie would move up in the 2nd rd to draft a linebacker that weighed somewhere in the mid 220s. That is Way too small for an NFL linebacker. I can only assume that he felt that the trainers could get him into the weight room and bulk him up. I mean, there Are safeties in this league at that weight. It just sounds like a very iffy draft choice at best, and a foolish one at worst.

[rmw10]

That really surprises me. It's hard to believe that Ozzie would move up in the 2nd rd to draft a linebacker that weighed somewhere in the mid 220s. That is Way too small for an NFL linebacker. I can only assume that he felt that the trainers could get him into the weight room and bulk him up. I mean, there Are safeties in this league at that weight. It just sounds like a very iffy draft choice at best, and a foolish one at worst.

I know he's weighed in multiple times in the 235-240 range, which would be perfect for the role I think we envisioned. His problem isn't necessarily bulking up, it's keeping the weight on. I remember talks during training camp were saying that his weight fluctuates a lot in that range of 220-240. I'm truly of the belief that it's not a talent issue. It's an issue that many teams thought wouldn't be there, but it's starting to show that a 4-3 really is his best match.

[Clmraven]

I hope Arthur gets a chance this year, it's unfortunate that he's stuck behind two really good linebackers, but seeing how McPhee is probably gone this year why not give Brown a chance to be a situational blitzer? He's not a natural pass rusher like McPhee but he looked pretty good blitzing up the middle in college, he's got great speed, I think we should give him a chance in preseason to come in like McPhee and be the guy they can move all over the line, and unlike McPhee, brown can cover well so that just opens up more possibilities for pees to utilize

[Willbacker]

I hope Arthur gets a chance this year, it's unfortunate that he's stuck behind two really good linebackers, but seeing how McPhee is probably gone this year why not give Brown a chance to be a situational blitzer? He's not a natural pass rusher like McPhee but he looked pretty good blitzing up the middle in college, he's got great speed, I think we should give him a chance in preseason to come in like McPhee and be the guy they can move all over the line, and unlike McPhee, brown can cover well so that just opens up more possibilities for pees to utilize

Not a bad idea.

[rmw10]

I hope Arthur gets a chance this year, it's unfortunate that he's stuck behind two really good linebackers, but seeing how McPhee is probably gone this year why not give Brown a chance to be a situational blitzer? He's not a natural pass rusher like McPhee but he looked pretty good blitzing up the middle in college, he's got great speed, I think we should give him a chance in preseason to come in like McPhee and be the guy they can move all over the line, and unlike McPhee, brown can cover well so that just opens up more possibilities for pees to utilize

 

He doesn't have the weight to stick consistently at ILB.  There's literally 0 possibility he could play with his hand in the dirt.

[Clmraven]

He doesn't have the weight to stick consistently at ILB.  There's literally 0 possibility he could play with his hand in the dirt.

I'm not saying put him at DE, just use him as a move pass rusher kinda like McPhee, mcphee often blitzed right up the middle off the LOS, I don't see why Arthur couldn't do that.

[rmw10]

I'm not saying put him at DE, just use him as a move pass rusher kinda like McPhee, mcphee often blitzed right up the middle off the LOS, I don't see why Arthur couldn't do that.

 

McPhee is 270+ lbs.  Brown is 220-230 lbs.  Huge difference there.

[Clmraven]

McPhee is 270+ lbs.  Brown is 220-230 lbs.  Huge difference there.

I am aware of that, I'm not trying to say he's gonna be a McPhee clone im just saying he was a good blitzer in college why not give hime a chance in a similar role? i mean there is little to no chance we re-sign McPhee so we're gonna have to find someone to help replace his production anyway, I am in no way saying hes guaranteed to have success in that role im just trying to make a suggestion instead of labeling Brown a Bust already.

[rmw10]

I am aware of that, I'm not trying to say he's gonna be a McPhee clone im just saying he was a good blitzer in college why not give hime a chance in a similar role? i mean there is little to no chance we re-sign McPhee so we're gonna have to find someone to help replace his production anyway, I am in no way saying hes guaranteed to have success in that role im just trying to make a suggestion instead of labeling Brown a Bust already.

 

He's not going to have success.  Lining up a 220 pound LB on the line against a 300+ pound OL at the LOS is not going to work.  It doesn't work that way.  If he's widely considered to be too small to play ILB in the 3-4, there's literally not even a shred of possibility that he can play in the trenches.

[Clmraven]

He's not going to have success.  Lining up a 220 pound LB on the line against a 300+ pound OL at the LOS is not going to work.  It doesn't work that way.  If he's widely considered to be too small to play ILB in the 3-4, there's literally not even a shred of possibility that he can play in the trenches.

I still don't think your understanding what I'm trying to say. I'm not saying put him right on the LOS against a guard or something, maybe put him off the LOS and bring him in on some delayed blitzes and such to take advantage of his speed. And Daryl Washington and Mychal Kendricks seem to do fine rushing from the ILB position even though they are in the 230lbs range.