Cap Situation-Struggles and Updates

[H8R]

I'd rather have Crabtree, Shorts, and Johnson than Bowe.

Shorts and Bowe have head issues , an Crabtree is diva as hell... Not sure I'd want a locker room with all of those guys in it... Yikes.

[berad]

Seems like revisionist history to doubt Pitta's talents because his hip injuries have sidelined him. Or may just 'what have you done for me lately' sentiment. The guy's a good player.

[PurpleCity5]

Shorts and Bowe have head issues , an Crabtree is diva as hell... Not sure I'd want a locker room with all of those guys in it... Yikes.

I know, I was just saying the many people I'd prefer over Bowe. 

 

I'm not sure we'll sign either.... better yet any sign any legit WR. Our cap situation is already one of the worse and will get worse after the tendering process. IMO, none of those guys are worth going over the cap for. 

[BmoreBird22]

You don't have to be ready to but that contract declared him as an upper tier TE

  

Pitta has great hands, bad hip... It's unfortunate the way his injury deal went down but he was certainly ascending !

I was not a fan of that contract. I wanted to see him on a one year deal to see if could regain his form and build on that 2012 season. It's unfortunate he didn't get the chance, but that contract wasn't the smartest thing the Ravens have done

[berad]

I was not a fan of that contract. I wanted to see him on a one year deal to see if could regain his form and build on that 2012 season. It's unfortunate he didn't get the chance, but that contract wasn't the smartest thing the Ravens have done

I appreciate that. And, although I was happy to have Pitta back at the time, it is handcuffing us now if he can't play.

[allblackraven]

Are we tendering any guys? I would have thought we'd hear something by now. Or they're trying extending Ngata/Web/Yanda to the last second?

[berad]

Are we tendering any guys? I would have thought we'd hear something by now. Or they're trying extending Ngata/Web/Yanda to the last second?

They have until tomorrow to do so but Tucker and Will Hill are good bets to get tendered

edit - just checked Aaron Wilson's twitter

Aaron WilsonVerified account ‏@RavensInsider

Ravens have sent a second-round restricted tender $2.356 million to Pro Bowl kicker Justin Tucker, according to a source

https://twitter.com/RavensInsider/status/575015291798843393

[PurpleCity5]

Didn't think we'd actually 2nd rounder tender Tucker. I thought we'd designate it to Hill, maybe F.O can't put full trust in him yet.

[757RavensFan]

Are we tendering any guys? I would have thought we'd hear something by now. Or they're trying extending Ngata/Web/Yanda to the last second?

 

From what I read analysts say that; Tucker, Will Hill and one other (can't remember) will be tendered.

[The Mom Gene]

I had a feeling something like this was going to happen.....  the NFL is not happy about the early agreements.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000477438/article/nfl-sends-teams-memo-about-early-agreements

[berad]

I had a feeling something like this was going to happen.....  the NFL is not happy about the early agreements.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000477438/article/nfl-sends-teams-memo-about-early-agreements

Unless someone's put pen to paper there probably won't be an issue. To me, the beneficial part of this 3 day window is for the players and agents to become aware of all of the offers before making a final decision rather than be bombarded at the same time and feel you have to sign fast (however, it's almost a forgone conclusion that agents and teams communicated before the official start of FA). So all these are 'agreed to in principle' which, to me, shouldn't be a problem. If Team A offers you $10M per year and Team B offers you $6M per year, they've made your decision for you. Leaked information on players deciding on a team was to be expected.

It'd be interesting to see if the NFL finds anything or what they consider wrong-doing. Maybe I just don't understand the point of this 'legal tampering' at all.

[The Mom Gene]

Unless someone's put pen to paper there probably won't be an issue. To me, the beneficial part of this 3 day window is for the players and agents to become aware of all of the offers before making a final decision rather than be bombarded at the same time and feel you have to sign fast (however, it's almost a forgone conclusion that agents and teams communicated before the official start of FA). So all these are 'agreed to in principle' which, to me, shouldn't be a problem. If Team A offers you $10M per year and Team B offers you $6M per year, they've made your decision for you. Leaked information on players deciding on a team was to be expected.

It'd be interesting to see if the NFL finds anything or what they consider wrong-doing. Maybe I just don't understand the point of this 'legal tampering' at all.

These teams aren't supposed to be talking to the players at all.  Only discussing options with agents.  There's always leaked information...  as with Torrey.  He's not uttering a word about "where" he is going.  He didn't on the 98Rock interview this morning when they tried to trip him up about earthquakes and steep hills....  but I'm thinking there are definitely teams that have stepped over the lines here. There's just too much happening BEFORE tomorrow.

[rmcjacket23]

These teams aren't supposed to be talking to the players at all.  Only discussing options with agents.  There's always leaked information...  as with Torrey.  He's not uttering a word about "where" he is going.  He didn't on the 98Rock interview this morning when they tried to trip him up about earthquakes and steep hills....  but I'm thinking there are definitely teams that have stepped over the lines here. There's just too much happening BEFORE tomorrow.

He didn't say where he was going, but he also said where he wasn't going.

[BmoreBird22]

I appreciate that. And, although I was happy to have Pitta back at the time, it is handcuffing us now if he can't play.

Don't get me wrong, I really do like Pitta and think he could have been a very good tight end, but with his hip injury, I didn't think it was wise to sign him long term, especially not at the amount he got. Right now, I'd rather have Daniels because I think Daniels, while older and not as athletic as he used to be, is at least a consistent producer and with Pitta, we have no idea what happens.

[berad]

These teams aren't supposed to be talking to the players at all.  Only discussing options with agents.  There's always leaked information...  as with Torrey.  He's not uttering a word about "where" he is going.  He didn't on the 98Rock interview this morning when they tried to trip him up about earthquakes and steep hills....  but I'm thinking there are definitely teams that have stepped over the lines here. There's just too much happening BEFORE tomorrow.

True. I suppose I should've said, 'talking with the players representatives' and if the player has no agent and represents himself (what Ed Reed tried to do), they can't talk to them at all in the 3 day period.

 

[RavensFanMania]

What did the league expect would happen when they gave agents the legal right to talk to teams regarding other teams players.   Did they think it wouldn't be leaked.

[Bruce_Almty]

.... There's just too much happening BEFORE tomorrow.

The news tomorrow will happen b4 4:00 with teams announcing cap casualties. As you said, many of the big name player moves have already been reported.

[ALSKAN RAVEN FAN]

I had a feeling something like this was going to happen.....  the NFL is not happy about the early agreements.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000477438/article/nfl-sends-teams-memo-about-early-agreements

Good post Mom did not know abot this till I read it here. Hopefully they fix this.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

Ya know, I hadn't thought about it at all until this site posted the article today... but is anyone concerned about the possibility that another team may sign Will Hill?

 

I had been treating it like a foregone conclusion that he'd return, but that's not necessarily the case. Signing another team's RFA's is somewhat rare but not unprecedented. And with Hill's tender there isn't the cost of a draft pick to go along with him - simply offer a contract the Ravens can not or will not match, and one Hill agrees to.

 

I understand the knocks on him with the suspension and off-the-field red flags - there's a risk associated with him and he needs a stable environment around him to succeed. And he seems happy here in Baltimore and as if he plans on staying - even to the point of trying to recruit his former safety partner.

 

BUT - even with all that said - money talks. Hill is an immensely talented player, who is still very young and developing. He ranked in the top 15 of safeties in the league... playing in a new system (although with the familiarity of Spags), coming off a suspension, without the offseason to stay sharp and get reps. With that said, I can only imagine he would have played even better having had training camp.

 

There were several teams in the mix for McCourty, who will be looking for a Plan B. Several of those teams with tons of cap space and money to throw around.... some even that have to spend just to get above the cap floor. The Eagles come to mind as someone looking for a safety and with money to spend. 

 

Is anyone else concerned with this possibility? I feel like we're all, myself included, just assuming Hill is ours -- but the more I think about it, I'm starting to feel like there's going to be some serious interest in his services. Talented, young, and relatively cheap compared to the alternatives. I don't know that this low tender is going to hold up.

 

Please help convince me otherwise.... am I missing something?

[GrimCoconut]

Ya know, I hadn't thought about it at all until this site posted the article today... but is anyone concerned about the possibility that another team may sign Will Hill?

 

I had been treating it like a foregone conclusion that he'd return, but that's not necessarily the case. Signing another team's RFA's is somewhat rare but not unprecedented. And with Hill's tender there isn't the cost of a draft pick to go along with him - simply offer a contract the Ravens can not or will not match, and one Hill agrees to.

 

I understand the knocks on him with the suspension and off-the-field red flags - there's a risk associated with him and he needs a stable environment around him to succeed. And he seems happy here in Baltimore and as if he plans on staying - even to the point of trying to recruit his former safety partner.

 

BUT - even with all that said - money talks. Hill is an immensely talented player, who is still very young and developing. He ranked in the top 15 of safeties in the league... playing in a new system (although with the familiarity of Spags), coming off a suspension, without the offseason to stay sharp and get reps. With that said, I can only imagine he would have played even better having had training camp.

 

There were several teams in the mix for McCourty, who will be looking for a Plan B. Several of those teams with tons of cap space and money to throw around.... some even that have to spend just to get above the cap floor. The Eagles come to mind as someone looking for a safety and with money to spend. 

 

Is anyone else concerned with this possibility? I feel like we're all, myself included, just assuming Hill is ours -- but the more I think about it, I'm starting to feel like there's going to be some serious interest in his services. Talented, young, and relatively cheap compared to the alternatives. I don't know that this low tender is going to hold up.

 

Please help convince me otherwise.... am I missing something?

Will Hill is in an interesting place, and one I contemplated once I heard the tender. It's certainly a surprise, but I also wonder if we offered him that tender because we want the market to dictate his price. We want to see what other teams are willing to pay him. If teams aren't willing to offer him big money, then that means that we can dictate his price and not the player. Furthermore, while we designated him with that tender, I think that he would still provide compensatory compensation. I'm not 100% sure there, because there aren't many precedents where this have happened. Still, it's certainly a possibility. 

[B-more Ravor]

Dude, where ya been?

 

I normally wouldn't bring something like this back up, but the level of arrogance in these posts pretty much calls for it!

 

Actually our salary cap will be closer to $150M. A lot of articles have done a poor job speculating about incentives; whether likely to be earned or not, workout bonuses, escalators, restricted free agents, etc...Our books aren't as tight as many believe and the projected salary cap by both the NFL and NFLPA are still on the low range of what's to be expected. Those painting a different picture need to go back to art school and recalculate their figures.

 

So, what happened to the $150M Cap for the Ravens?

 

Seems us art school students did a better job of understanding the Cap than those of a much higher  intellect (allegedly). 

 

I can tell you take your hobby a little more seriously than others, and power to you. Nothing wrong with being an enthusiast! Anyway, It seems you feel slighted by something I've said? If that's the case im sorry you feel offended Ravor. Nothing was aimed towards you, directly or personally. Maybe you misunderstood? Or misinterpreted? None the less, since you've asked for my input i'm willing to oblige:

 

1 - If you're going to present something as fact (like number of RFA's for example), then the least you can do is get your facts straight before you submit your claim. A bit unfair to confuse those who know less by pretending to know more. Wouldn't you agree? Hard to paint an accurate picture without the detail.

 

2 - In general, if you're going to make projections with the NFLPA's public salary cap updates, it might be best to stay on par. Manipulating numbers as you see fit to keep everything in sync is kind of messy and a bit less genuine..

 

3 - If you want to inform others on the intricacies of the Salary Cap such as NLTBE incentives which were earned, then you probably shouldn't forget to include the players whom failed to reach their LTBE incentives or else it's a bit mute and you start to generate introduced errors. Rule of thumb - if you don't know, don't add. Moreover, it might be wise to simply make a note for future reference in order to give yourself an out when you finally do get the correct facts to compensate with.

 

4 - The CBA is a bit tricky. Don't feel bad. When it's misinterpreted a lot information tends to be ignored or subsequently left out.

 

But what's the point of debating semantics here? It's all just poor speculation on mostly everyone's part. In other words, it's probably best to just let Picaso paint the picture and enjoy his masterpiece instead of critiquing his every stroke. Unless you're the Kanye West of capology? Then I guess it's ok to speak on something you aren't fully aware of...

 

Anyway  Ravor, don't let the insiders fool you. Our cap situation isn't as ugly as many have been proclaiming. Best advice is just to wait...wait for the #facts

 

If the facts are too boring to wait on, I dont know? Maybe take up a Pottery class to fill in the downtime? Heard it's a blast!

 

 

On a sidenote - Free Agent vs Trade. More interesting than speculation.

 

There is just so much about this post that is so wrong, it's kind of funny - especially coming from someone telling others to read the CBA.

 

There's a lot of empty bluster in there, but it's pretty much totally bereft of any examples or facts.

 

So, to be clear, on this end, there's nothing misunderstood or misinterpreted, since the articles were pretty much dead on.  There's no manipulation of numbers and nothing left out. The numbers for the adjustments that make up the team's adjusted Cap (you know, the one that was $144.6M, when you said it would be $150M) were pretty much dead on. 

 

Lastly, thanks for the explanation of LBTE incentives versus NLTBE incentives.  What you failed to realize/understand/comprehend was that the Ravens don't often do LTBE incentives and there weren't any that counted in 2014, thus there were none to be carried over into 2015.

 

So, in closing, thanks for all of your efforts to assist in enlightening those of us who need your help.  Since you've been nowhere to be found, I assume that you've gone elsewhere to impart your vast knowledge to others. 

 

Or, perhaps, you are brushing up on the CBA..........

[arnie_uk]

Coming out of mobile to like the above post

[Sami84]

Will Hill is in an interesting place, and one I contemplated once I heard the tender. It's certainly a surprise, but I also wonder if we offered him that tender because we want the market to dictate his price. We want to see what other teams are willing to pay him. If teams aren't willing to offer him big money, then that means that we can dictate his price and not the player. Furthermore, while we designated him with that tender, I think that he would still provide compensatory compensation. I'm not 100% sure there, because there aren't many precedents where this have happened. Still, it's certainly a possibility. 

 

I don't think we are in a position to lose him IF we are trying to put our best team forward this year. We have  a lot of holes to fill. Letting him go basically tells me that this years season is a building period.

[ellicottraven]

  

I was not a fan of that contract. I wanted to see him on a one year deal to see if could regain his form and build on that 2012 season. It's unfortunate he didn't get the chance, but that contract wasn't the smartest thing the Ravens have done

Couldn't agree with you more. But, everything is 20-20 in hindsight. However, I don't doubt that the front office left no stone unturned to determine the potential for a relapse prior to signing. It was just a freak occurrence that caught even the best doctors and the front office unaware. I truly believe that. It was a hedge that went terribly wrong.