Cap Situation-Struggles and Updates

[dhstandard]

How come it seems that year after year we are always right up against the cap limit while teams with equal or better talent manage to have so much room?

 

If someone wants to break down our deals that would be nice.  It sucks watching great players that Ozzie drafts in later rounds to be signed away after finally bursting out of their shell and reaching their prime.  

 

We lose guys like Ellerbe, Jones, Graham and probably McPhee in free agency every year and still struggle to be under cap.  I'm not fond of watching our talent being swept out from under us leaving our team with undrafted free agents and rookies still learning before getting picked off once they reach their potential.

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

We backload the contracts and some of our guys are getting old? 

 

The cap is about to go up anyway so we shouldn't be pressed against the cap right now actually. 

[dhstandard]

We backload the contracts and some of our guys are getting old? 

 

The cap is about to go up anyway so we shouldn't be pressed against the cap right now actually. 

 

I checked the cap website people use around here and even with the inflated numbers we are still very close the the limit, though I think a good deal of that money is from cutting Ray Rice.

[rmw10]

That's what happens when you have to pay a good QB after their rookie deal expires.

[TDubbs]

That's what happens when you have to pay an actual good QB after their rookie deal expires.

 

Yes, thats a huge factor. Thats what the 49ers found out, and the Seahawks are about to find out. 

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

Well if that's the case I want us to trade Ngata then... Better to get something for him rather than lose him for nothing

[usmccharles]

I dont really see what there is to complain about.  Every year we go through this and yet we always field a good team, easily better than average.  Ozzie believes in building young talent then letting them walk rather than paying big contracts to guys 

[GrimCoconut]

Well, for one if I am being honest we made some bad deals; or rather, some deals that didn't pay the dividends we expected. The deal with Foxworth is one of them, which hindered the team quite substantially for a couple of years with dead money that made him unmovable here. Then you had guys like Jacoby Jones, who was re-signed and never became a great WR and never showed any more development but continues to be a good return specialist, albeit an overpaid one for this particular team. Then you had guys like Haloti Ngata just not perform up to standard for a couple years, whether it was due to injuries or what. And of course let's not forget the deal for Webb, in which he has been injured for essentially all of it and has never really played up to his contract. 

 

Just a lot of substantially bad deals, if I am being honest. Ngata's deal wasn't terrible, but the others were considerably bad. Jones isn't awful but it certainly isn't great. 

[usmccharles]

Its easy to say they were "bad" deals after they get injured or under perform, but the time of the deals, or at least most of them i think most people here would agree that it was the right call.  Clearly looking at webb's deal now, its terrible considering he hasnt played much due to being hurt, if hes healthy and plays great, its a good deal.  You cant win them all and i feel like more often or not we make good deals than not.  Hell, i was happy we signed rice long term, clearly a very bad deal now. 

[frozen joe flacco fan]

Continuing to build our team through the draft is the proper course to take. With or without Forsett,

Pitta & Daniels, we are a beast mode RB, a Gronk type TE, a tall Chris Matthews #1 WR, a CB and a

Safety away of returning to the SB. That sounds like a lot but one great draft and one or two free

agent signings can make it happen. Today's SB should serve to show why our offense has bouts of

inconsistency. How do our top four receivers compare to 6'-3" Chris Matthews (undrafted free agent),

Rob Gronkowski, tough as nails Julian Edelman and Danny Amendola. The honest answer is they don't

compare favorably. Still, I understand that 48 of the Packers' current 53 players were drafted by the

Pack. If we can pick up a great WR or CB thru free agency, we should but otherwise we should stay the

course and build the team thru the draft, especially in light of the salary cap issues! The hero of the SB was a rookie, named Malcom Butler.

[GrimCoconut]

Its easy to say they were "bad" deals after they get injured or under perform, but the time of the deals, or at least most of them i think most people here would agree that it was the right call.  Clearly looking at webs deal now, its terrible considering he hasnt played much due to being hurt, if hes healthy and plays great, its a good deal.  You cant win them all and i feel like more often or not we make good deals than not.  Hell, i was happy we signed rice long term, clearly a very bad deal now. 

That's why I specified that we had deals that didn't pay the expected dividends. 

 

 

Well, for one if I am being honest we made some bad deals; or rather, some deals that didn't pay the dividends we expected. 

And I wasn't happy we re-signed Ray Rice, to be honest. At the time I questioned that deal and only a few others did as well. I have to admit I was happy we re-signed Webb. Another deal that could hurt us is Pitta, although that remains to be seen. I'm not sure I would've let him go either, because he's such a great player, but he's coming back from an injury and now he's hurt again. We've just been really unfortunate with these extensions, that's all. Suggs has worked out well, though. 

[usmccharles]

I wont start the Rice resign debate again.  I just think we have had extremely bad luck of the injuries suffered to our signed players, but i still prefer taking the risk of signing them and seeing what happens compared to just letting those guys walk.  I cant remember the foxworth deal so i wont speak on it.  But Pitta, Webb, Rice....it would of blew the roof off my doors if we let them walk. 

[FlackAttack]

I wont start the Rice resign debate again.  I just think we have had extremely bad luck of the injuries suffered to our signed players, but i still prefer taking the risk of signing them and seeing what happens compared to just letting those guys walk.  I cant remember the foxworth deal so i wont speak on it.  But Pitta, Webb, Rice....it would of blew the roof off my doors if we let them walk. 

lol you mean, it "would have" blew the roof off my doors. and yes, chances are we are letting 2 if not all 3 of those players walk. smh.

[The Raven]

How come it seems that year after year we are always right up against the cap limit while teams with equal or better talent manage to have so much room?

 

If someone wants to break down our deals that would be nice.  It sucks watching great players that Ozzie drafts in later rounds to be signed away after finally bursting out of their shell and reaching their prime.  

 

We lose guys like Ellerbe, Jones, Graham and probably McPhee in free agency every year and still struggle to be under cap.  I'm not fond of watching our talent being swept out from under us leaving our team with undrafted free agents and rookies still learning before getting picked off once they reach their potential.

 

What teams with more talent have more cap room? 

[HomeoftheBRAVENS]

One reason were always cap strapped is because we're horrible with contract negotiations.A guy like Webb had one breakout year and we paid him $10M+ per season which is Sherman and Revis type of money.We haven't gotten anything close to that 2011 season after giving him that money. He's always injured, he's lost a large amount of his speed and he's too short to cover the big elite WR's in the league.Then on top of all that we don't have leverage to fix it because we'd save very little cap if we cut him. Situations like that where you don't give yourself an out until the final year are why we always seem to lose so many of our younger talents.

[The Raven]

One reason were always cap strapped is because we're horrible with contract negotiations.A guy like Webb had one breakout year and we paid him $10M+ per season which is Sherman and Revis type of money.We haven't gotten anything close to that 2011 season after giving him that money.He's always injured,he's lost a large amount of his speed and he's too short to cover the big elite WR's in the league.Then on top of all that we don't have leverage to fix it because we'd save very little cap if we cut him.Situations like that where you don't give yourself an out until the final year are why we always seem to lose so many of our younger talents.

 

So what you're saying is we're bad at contract negotiations because of a freak injury? Hmm. Okay.

[Bltravens]

One reason were always cap strapped is because we're horrible with contract negotiations.A guy like Webb had one breakout year and we paid him $10M+ per season which is Sherman and Revis type of money.We haven't gotten anything close to that 2011 season after giving him that money.He's always injured,he's lost a large amount of his speed and he's too short to cover the big elite WR's in the league.Then on top of all that we don't have leverage to fix it because we'd save very little cap if we cut him.Situations like that where you don't give yourself an out until the final year are why we always seem to lose so many of our younger talents.

At the time the Webb signing was a no brainer. A #1 corner who slide inside to play nickel in that package is great value considering the difficult nature of nickel. Guy blows out his knee twice, I mean that's just bad luck. Not going to fault Ozzie there. There was a time when I really think based on his total versatility and play Webb was a top 10 CB. Granted it was for like 1.5 years but it was a damn good 18 months lol.

[Dewy101]

At the time the Webb signing was a no brainer. A #1 corner who slide inside to play nickel in that package is great value considering the difficult nature of nickel. Guy blows out his knee twice, I mean that's just bad luck. Not going to fault Ozzie there. There was a time when I really think based on his total versatility and play Webb was a top 10 CB. Granted it was for like 1.5 years but it was a damn good 18 months lol.

Top 2 corner in coverage in 2011 according to PFF only Revis was better. What could have been is all I can only wonder

[ratedr]

Well, for one if I am being honest we made some bad deals; or rather, some deals that didn't pay the dividends we expected. The deal with Foxworth is one of them, which hindered the team quite substantially for a couple of years with dead money that made him unmovable here. Then you had guys like Jacoby Jones, who was re-signed and never became a great WR and never showed any more development but continues to be a good return specialist, albeit an overpaid one for this particular team. Then you had guys like Haloti Ngata just not perform up to standard for a couple years, whether it was due to injuries or what. And of course let's not forget the deal for Webb, in which he has been injured for essentially all of it and has never really played up to his contract.

Just a lot of substantially bad deals, if I am being honest. Ngata's deal wasn't terrible, but the others were considerably bad. Jones isn't awful but it certainly isn't great.

Gotta add Pitta and Rice to that list.

[ratedr]

One reason were always cap strapped is because we're horrible with contract negotiations.A guy like Webb had one breakout year and we paid him $10M+ per season which is Sherman and Revis type of money.We haven't gotten anything close to that 2011 season after giving him that money.He's always injured,he's lost a large amount of his speed and he's too short to cover the big elite WR's in the league.Then on top of all that we don't have leverage to fix it because we'd save very little cap if we cut him.Situations like that where you don't give yourself an out until the final year are why we always seem to lose so many of our younger talents.

Agreed. Not sure how we agreed to give Pitta so much money after his injury either. Just stupid.

[0_o]

Maybe I can shed some insight here. The Cap isn't as gloom as others have led you to believe. Don't trust the websites that strictly give a definitive number or claim the Ravens don't have enough room to maneuver with in Free Agency. 3 areas to watch in the upcoming months where the Ravens can manipulate big cap savings.

 

1.) Several key contracts that we're currently trying to extend and/or restructure (Yanda, Ngata, Webb) who collectively can save anywhere from $0 to $16Million+ in cap savings. Extending Yanda and Ngata make too much sense. Negotiating a reduced salary for Webb with performance and playing time escalators, also makes a lot of sense.

 

2.) Several veteran contracts whose cap numbers don't warrant a roster spot at their current salary (Canty, Jones, Koch). If all 3 were released, it would be a cap savings of $7.5M+

 

3.) Then there are the bubble players, for instance Gino Gradkowski and Albert McClellan; who may not even make the roster at all, especially given their roles and contracts. Releasing just those two players would create an additional $2M in salary cap space.

 

Also, consider the Ravens don't have to dip heavily into the FA market to add premier players. There's always the via trade route. Making a smart trade for a key player would allow us to upgrade our roster at a reduced price, by avoiding prorated cap space that was already committed. For example, Brandon Marshall (who has been rumored on this board quite a bit), recently received a 3yr/ $30M contract extension in 2014, which averages a salary cap number of about $10M per year. If the Ravens were to assume his contract rights via trade, the Bears in turn, would absorb the prorated signing bonus, leaving the Ravens to account for $23M in salary cap over the next 3 years. Or in other words, a contract that could easily be renegotiated longer which would result in a reduced 2015 cap figure in the $3-5M range and a 2016 cap # in the $5-7M range.

 

Point being, the salary cap is extremely easy to manipulate and there are a plethora of clever ways  to work around it in order to upgrade the roster. It's not as big of a deal as others have been stressing. When it's all said and done we'll have enough to add the players we need to take us over the hump. 

[Pirate88]

In all honesty Rice was a terrible signing. His wear andctear was getting up there and he clearly had started losing burst. Remember besides his near 400 touches a year with us he took a pounding in college and was a workhorse there as well. And RBs with that many miles on his tires why on earth was he signed longterm to big $$. Why is the contract set up for a workhorse RB to count so much against the cap in 2015 which is season8 for him. even lynch they know he could breakdown soon and are reluctant. Just a terrible terrible signing especially with RBs coming off practice squads running for 200 yards in a game. So why pay the RB like he will be a game changer in coming years when its more likely he was slowing down.

Webb I can't argue it was a terrific signing as he was a easily a top 5 corner. In spite of height he was fine covering taller WRs. My only prob was we could have got him a little cheaper. He was another year from Being a FA so we had leverage. He would have accepted slightly below market price for garunteed $$ cuz if he got hurt then he would have got far less, which he did get hurt. We could have got him for $8mil a year and had he refused we would have ended up getting him far cheaper cuz he did get injured. You can't question the signing cuz he was lights out at time!! And he hasn't lost his speed, he just was stiff after surgery but he lookedlooked more like Webb down the stretch as he recovered from the surgery he started regaining his athleticism. We should have signed him a Lil cheaper but if he didn't get injured it was a great signing.

Letting Graham walk was nuts and inexcusable and a huge mistake as well btw!! You don't let corners walk that just arrived as a good corner in this passing league!! Jimmy Smith was injured and yeah had he played were in the Superbowl. BUT had we resigned Graham were likely there. Graham would have intercepted the Lafell TD

Inexcusable letting him walk. Corners are tough to find. Even in Round1 corners bust yet Ravens are fortunate enough to find them then let them walk after coaching them up. Makes no sense. Just ask bill belicheat who has drafted 17 cornerback busts since 2005 with zero long term starters.

Pitta needs to go!! Injury settlement trade whatever he needs to go!! Even if he does play he won't be the same player at 30 and 2 major hip injuries and surgeries. Jacoby contract was as bad as Ray Rice's deal. Dude catches lightning in a bottle for a couple games and plays dancing with the stars and gets a contract!! The loser couldn't do anything opposite a prime Andre Johnson and was cut. They don't need to make the same mistake with another one trick Torrey. I just think we should sign or trade for complete WRs and a young healthy talented TE. just my opinion I try not to overrate a players probable or likely ceiling just cuz we are already acclimated to rooting for him in a ravens uniform. My uncle is the acc scout and likes Torrey back at a lower price if he is complimented by a consistent go to WR and says I'm a little to rough on him but in my opinion we can get a deep threat with sharper route running cheaper and prefer to find other options cuz he has value i agree but there is just so much he can't and or does not do that other WRs could perhaps offer us. And pitta is just really wishful thinking at this juncture and some fans holding on to his play in 2012. Missing Superbowl pitta or rating Torrey on his community gestures and being a nice guy won't get the job done!! And as for the pi's people try padding his stats with, those or on Joe being a great deep thrower. Wilson's a great deep thrower and how many flags coulda shoulda been thrown in the game.

As for our salary cap first off Joe could have appreciated the team making him the highest payed qb but accepted a fair contract to give cap space. I'm not a cap expert. I just watch college prospects and NFL FA prospect tape to get a sneak peak on the next season and what our team has going on the sport I watch and occasionally play. However that the actual salary cap ## and what the team is actually paying out is 2 different things. If teams are willing to Write checks and pay big $$ up front and restructure with signing bonus $$ up front to keep moving $$ back then more players could be retained than most fans believe could. The cap can and has been manipulated to sign and keep players by moving $$ around. All the cap trouble certain teams are said to be in has never been for more than a season. Where the team takes the hits and starts fresh. There's always $$ that can be moved back if the owners are willing to pay $$ up front then most of that $$ doesn't have to count til later years if necessary. And the next year other contracts can be restructured to up front $$ that doesn't count much toward that years cap. And so on but like I said the owners would have to be able and willing to write $$ up front. Not saying all players can be retained with new talent signed but definitely more players can be had than fans would think. My opinion Corey Graham could and should have been resigned. We are a Lil tight to the cap but with it going up as much as $7-8mil and a couple restructures, cuts and retirements the ravens could easily have $20 or more to fill needs this year and make a championship run. As close as we are hopefully they get Joe a couple weapons as well as fill at least another hole like safety WR or whatever. N'gata is a tough decision to restructure or cut/trade. He played Lil better this year after family probs or is he no longer THE Haloti N'gata?? Big decision in a great DT draft.

[Pirate88]

Maybe I can shed some insight here. The Cap isn't as gloom as others have led you to believe. Don't trust the websites that strictly give a definitive number or claim the Ravens don't have enough room to maneuver with in Free Agency. 3 areas to watch in the upcoming months where the Ravens can manipulate big cap savings.

 

1.) Several key contracts that we're currently trying to extend and/or restructure (Yanda, Ngata, Webb) who collectively can save anywhere from $0 to $16Million+ in cap savings. Extending Yanda and Ngata make too much sense. Negotiating a reduced salary for Webb with performance and playing time escalators, also makes a lot of sense.

 

2.) Several veteran contracts whose cap numbers don't warrant a roster spot at their current salary (Canty, Jones, Koch). If all 3 were released, it would be a cap savings of $7.5M+

 

3.) Then there are the bubble players, for instance Gino Gradkowski and Albert McClellan; who may not even make the roster at all, especially given their roles and contracts. Releasing just those two players would create an additional $2M in salary cap space.

 

Also, consider the Ravens don't have to dip heavily into the FA market to add premier players. There's always the via trade route. Making a smart trade for a key player would allow us to upgrade our roster at a reduced price, by avoiding prorated cap space that was already committed. For example, Brandon Marshall (who has been rumored on this board quite a bit), recently received a 3yr/ $30M contract extension in 2014, which averages a salary cap number of about $10M per year. If the Ravens were to assume his contract rights via trade, the Bears in turn, would absorb the prorated signing bonus, leaving the Ravens to account for $23M in salary cap over the next 3 years. Or in other words, a contract that could easily be renegotiated longer which would result in a reduced 2015 cap figure in the $3-5M range and a 2016 cap # in the $5-7M range.

 

Point being, the salary cap is extremely easy to manipulate and there are a plethora of clever ways  to work around it in order to upgrade the roster. It's not as big of a deal as others have been stressing. When it's all said and done we'll have enough to add the players we need to take us over the hump.

Exactly, I was gonna touch on individual contracts that can be reworked including $$ up front that doesn't count for much against the 2015 cap. Including Webb takes a pay cut/restructure and he wins cuz its still more than he would get from another if we cut him while we get him back with hopefully no more injuries at far lower cap hit. It can be easily be maneuvered if the owners will pay big bonuses up front. We need to upload some talent. No more losing to the deflatriots over missing one player we could a had.

[HomeoftheBRAVENS]

Agreed. Not sure how we agreed to give Pitta so much money after his injury either. Just stupid.

 

I forgot about the Pitta contract.He should have gotten a Kapernick/Dalton type of contract after taking an injury like that.One where you can back out of it in any year of it and not be crippled by dead cap.

[rmcjacket23]

Maybe I can shed some insight here. The Cap isn't as gloom as others have led you to believe. Don't trust the websites that strictly give a definitive number or claim the Ravens don't have enough room to maneuver with in Free Agency. 3 areas to watch in the upcoming months where the Ravens can manipulate big cap savings.

 

1.) Several key contracts that we're currently trying to extend and/or restructure (Yanda, Ngata, Webb) who collectively can save anywhere from $0 to $16Million+ in cap savings. Extending Yanda and Ngata make too much sense. Negotiating a reduced salary for Webb with performance and playing time escalators, also makes a lot of sense.

 

2.) Several veteran contracts whose cap numbers don't warrant a roster spot at their current salary (Canty, Jones, Koch). If all 3 were released, it would be a cap savings of $7.5M+

 

3.) Then there are the bubble players, for instance Gino Gradkowski and Albert McClellan; who may not even make the roster at all, especially given their roles and contracts. Releasing just those two players would create an additional $2M in salary cap space.

 

Also, consider the Ravens don't have to dip heavily into the FA market to add premier players. There's always the via trade route. Making a smart trade for a key player would allow us to upgrade our roster at a reduced price, by avoiding prorated cap space that was already committed. For example, Brandon Marshall (who has been rumored on this board quite a bit), recently received a 3yr/ $30M contract extension in 2014, which averages a salary cap number of about $10M per year. If the Ravens were to assume his contract rights via trade, the Bears in turn, would absorb the prorated signing bonus, leaving the Ravens to account for $23M in salary cap over the next 3 years. Or in other words, a contract that could easily be renegotiated longer which would result in a reduced 2015 cap figure in the $3-5M range and a 2016 cap # in the $5-7M range.

 

Point being, the salary cap is extremely easy to manipulate and there are a plethora of clever ways  to work around it in order to upgrade the roster. It's not as big of a deal as others have been stressing. When it's all said and done we'll have enough to add the players we need to take us over the hump. 

There's certainly some valid points here, but I think you're making some pretty easy assumptions that I don't think hold true...

 

1. Remember, things like extensions/restructures are two-way streets. In the case of Ngata and Yanda, I agree that extensions make sense. The problem is getting two parties to agree on terms, which anybody should know is far more complicated than I think anybody understands. With Ngata, even if you give him an extension, his cap number is still very likely to be in the $10-12M range this season anyway, because he's still got a large portion that must be recognized this year regardless, and there would certainly be a signing bonus and small salary. So the cap savings, while significant, would probably only be in the $4-5M range.

 

2. Webb in particular is an extremely difficult case, because he has a ton of the leverage. Its easy to say "make him take a paycut with incentives", which I agree is the appropriate course and possibly the most likely one, but what if Webb simply says no? Then you've got the decision to make... cutting him this season only saves $2M (and we know you can't replace his production for $2M), and you have yet another hole in a secondary that is already full of them. If you post June-1 cut him, you can save some quality space this season, but you're pushing $6M in cap space to 2016, which is a substantial amount for a player that will then be two years removed from being a contributor.

 

3. I agree that you can pick up some space with cutting guys like Canty and Koch, but by other respected analysts accounts, those cuts will mostly just bring the Ravens in-line with where they need to be after they tender their RFAs just to get under the cap.

 

4. This obviously assumes that we allow some of our key FAs to walk as well, which we have no idea what the FO's plan is for them right now.

 

Bottom line for me... if the FO decides to go full cuts and lets both Webb and Ngata go (amongst the others discussed), its probably going to be with the goal of re-signing our own FAs (Torrey, McPhee, Forsett, etc.), in which case the cap space from those cuts is mostly gone and we're basically the same team + draft picks.

[rmcjacket23]

I forgot about the Pitta contract.He should have gotten a Kapernick/Dalton type of contract after taking an injury like that.One where you can back out of it in any year of it and not be crippled by dead cap.

Right, but the problem is... why would Pitta agree to that contract?

 

I think too many fans are looking at contract negotiations strictly from "what the franchise did" standpoint instead of putting yourself in the players shoes.

 

What do you think the fanbases response would have been if we took that stance with Pitta, he declined to sign, and he went to FA and signed with somebody else? What if we did the same thing with Webb, Rice or Ngata? We are all saying in HINDSIGHT those were not the greatest contracts, yet they were wildly praised when they were handed out.

 

It was unfathomable for this fanbase that we let Ray Rice walk in FA after a huge season, because frankly, at the time, he was the unanimous best weapon on this team and it wasn't close. Imagine the utter chaos on these boards and everywhere when the Ravens traded away Boldin after the SB, and then the very next offseason, let Joe's "favorite weapon" walk in FA without replacing either.

 

Hindsight is a luxury we all have, but its also a useless luxury, because it never accomplishes anything. All of these contracts we are talking about got a pretty unanimous stamp of approval from the fanbase when they were handed out, so it seems sort of hypocritical for us to backtrack on them now.

[HomeoftheBRAVENS]

At the time the Webb signing was a no brainer. A #1 corner who slide inside to play nickel in that package is great value considering the difficult nature of nickel. Guy blows out his knee twice, I mean that's just bad luck. Not going to fault Ozzie there. There was a time when I really think based on his total versatility and play Webb was a top 10 CB. Granted it was for like 1.5 years but it was a damn good 18 months lol.

 

I agree that signing Webb was a no brainer and I also agree that he was a top 10 CB in 2011.The only problem I have with the contract is that it was given to him in response to that one season.Every other CB with a big contract played at that level for atleast 3 year before getting it.I just think the size and length of the contract was kind of an overreaction and I'm not just saying that in hindsight.I was shocked back in 2012 when they first announced the contract.

[HomeoftheBRAVENS]

Right, but the problem is... why would Pitta agree to that contract?

 

I think too many fans are looking at contract negotiations strictly from "what the franchise did" standpoint instead of putting yourself in the players shoes.

 

What do you think the fanbases response would have been if we took that stance with Pitta, he declined to sign, and he went to FA and signed with somebody else? What if we did the same thing with Webb, Rice or Ngata? We are all saying in HINDSIGHT those were not the greatest contracts, yet they were wildly praised when they were handed out.

 

It was unfathomable for this fanbase that we let Ray Rice walk in FA after a huge season, because frankly, at the time, he was the unanimous best weapon on this team and it wasn't close. Imagine the utter chaos on these boards and everywhere when the Ravens traded away Boldin after the SB, and then the very next offseason, let Joe's "favorite weapon" walk in FA without replacing either.

 

Hindsight is a luxury we all have, but its also a useless luxury, because it never accomplishes anything. All of these contracts we are talking about got a pretty unanimous stamp of approval from the fanbase when they were handed out, so it seems sort of hypocritical for us to backtrack on them now.

 

 

They weren't all praised by me and I'm not complaining about all of them.I'm only complaining about the two we should've saw coming in Webb and Pitta and the fact that our players contracts seem to be the only ones in the league that you can't get out of until the final year.Go look at the cap space Sherman,Peterson and Haden's teams would save if they released them after any given year of the contract.I think I have a legitimate point in questioning why we don't leave ourselves that leverage when negotiating these deals.

[rmcjacket23]

They weren't all praised by me and I'm not complaining about all of them.I'm only complaining about the two we should've saw coming in Webb and Pitta and the fact that our players contracts seem to be the only ones in the league that you can't get out of until the final year.Go look at the cap space Sherman,Peterson and Haden's teams would save if they released them after any given year of the contract.I think I have a legitimate point in questioning why we don't leave ourselves that leverage when negotiating these deals.

If you're using Overthecap or even Spotrac as a reference, as of now, they aren't up-to-date... they don't update fully guaranteed salaries until that year begins.

 

1. Sherman's deal is essentially a 3-4 year deal, just like Webb's was. He has $40M guaranteed, which includes a $10M signing bonus AND 3 years of base salaries AND $5M more in 2017. He's essentially not releaseable in his first three seasons, and there's virtually nothing gained in year 4 by doing so.

 

2. Peterson got $48M guaranteed, $15.3M in a signing bonus. He, like Sherman, has 3-4 years of guaranteed salaries, so he's locked in for 3-4 seasons as well.

 

3. I don't have Haden's contract details, but he got $45M guaranteed as well in 2014.

 

In summary, every single one of those guys is locked in for a minimum of 3 years, and most are realistically a minimum of 4.

 

If you'll notice, Webb just completed year 3 of his deal and is heading into year 4, which is precisely why the debate about whether to cut him or not is happening now. Those teams will be having those same debates with those players 3 years from now too as well...

[Willbacker]

Big signing bonuses and backloaded contracts is what gives us heck. No way out. lol.