Ravens Signings and Re-signings (actual and speculation)

[Moderator 3]

@RavensInsider: Ravens sign Keith Wenning, Bryn Renner, Victor Hampton, Quinton Pointer, Marcel Jones, Allen Reisner, Konrad Reuland to reserve-future deals

@RavensInsider: Ravens also signed Kiero Small (Cardinal Gibbons), Zach Thompson to reserve-future deals

Nothing earth-shattering, but time to get this thread started.

[rmw10]

Interesting that we left off 5 of our PS guys. Usually we re-sign them all but I guess that's what happens when you continually lose guys and have to promote others.

[GrimCoconut]

I know this is a quiet signing, but I really liked Victor Hampton coming out of college from the Gamecocks. That could quietly be a nice addition to the team. 

[Sunday QB]

Please resign McPhee!

[hn68wb4]

I wanted us to draft Renner late last year, so i think that could be good signing. Thought he looked alot like Flacco skill wise - tall QB with underrated mobility and an arm that can make all the throws. He should be good competition for that backup spot.

Edited January 13, 2015 by hn68wb4

[B-more Ravor]

Interesting that we left off 5 of our PS guys. Usually we re-sign them all but I guess that's what happens when you continually lose guys and have to promote others.

 

At least for 3 of those 5 - 2 OL and a RB - they were signed really late when injuries to Wagner, Monroe and Taliaferro happened.  So, they may just have been signed as insurance, as opposed to coming in for a real look (although, there's nothing saying they can't be signed tomorrow or sometime later).

 

In fact, the DE they just signed, Thompson, was actually released from the PS when they signed the 2 OL, so he wasn't even on the PS anymore.

Edited January 13, 2015 by B-more Ravor

[rmw10]

At least for 3 of those 5 - 2 OL and a RB - they were signed really late when injuries to Wagner, Monroe and Taliaferro happened.  So, they may just have been signed as insurance, as opposed to coming in for a real look (although, there's nothing saying they can't be signed tomorrow or sometime later).

 

In fact, the DE they just signed, Thompson, was actually released from the PS when they signed to 2 OL, so he wasn't even on the PS anymore.

 

Figured that's how it'd be viewed but still interesting, nonetheless.  I would have liked to see Aldrick Robinson stick around, even though there's still a chance for that as you said.  He's been a nice deep threat in his NFL chances so far, and I think it'd be nice to have someone like that around even if he doesn't have a huge shot at actually making the team.

[B-more Ravor]

Figured that's how it'd be viewed but still interesting, nonetheless.  I would have liked to see Aldrick Robinson stick around, even though there's still a chance for that as you said.  He's been a nice deep threat in his NFL chances so far, and I think it'd be nice to have someone like that around even if he doesn't have a huge shot at actually making the team.

 

Yeah, who knows? 

 

It's also possible that he might have decided to look elsewhere for a better opportunity.  As a Ravens fan, that kind of sounds funny, but right now Robinson would be 7 down the depth chart (SSSr, Brown, Aiken, Jacoby, Campanero, Butler) and you've got to figure that if Torrey isn't re-signed they are going to sign/draft a WR.  So, that would push Robinson even further down.

[rmw10]

Yeah, who knows? 

 

It's also possible that he might have decided to look elsewhere for a better opportunity.  As a Ravens fan, that kind of sounds funny, but right now Robinson would be 7 down the depth chart (SSSr, Brown, Aiken, Jacoby, Campanero, Butler) and you've got to figure that if Torrey isn't re-signed they are going to sign/draft a WR.  So, that would push Robinson even further down.

 

Also true.  Ultimately, none of these signings probably even matter.  Wenning might be the only guy, and maybe another 1 could round out the bottom of a roster.  Most will end up being camp bodies with another shot at the PS, though.

[B-more Ravor]

Figured that's how it'd be viewed but still interesting, nonetheless.  I would have liked to see Aldrick Robinson stick around, even though there's still a chance for that as you said.  He's been a nice deep threat in his NFL chances so far, and I think it'd be nice to have someone like that around even if he doesn't have a huge shot at actually making the team.

 

You got your wish.  Ravens just announced that he's been signed to a 2015 Future contract.

 

Baltimore Ravens ‏@Ravens 1m1 minute ago

The Ravens have signed WR Aldrick Robinson to a Reserve/Future contract.

[rmw10]

You got your wish.  Ravens just announced that he's been signed to a 2015 Future contract.

 

Baltimore Ravens ‏@Ravens 1m1 minute ago

The Ravens have signed WR Aldrick Robinson to a Reserve/Future contract.

 

I like it.  I think he's a guy well worth a shot in camp, especially with Torrey's future up in the air.

[Gordo52]

Aldrick's signing must've made the forum go down lol

[rmcjacket23]

I like it.  I think he's a guy well worth a shot in camp, especially with Torrey's future up in the air.

I don't know too much about him, but any chance he gets a look as the primary kickoff returner if we cut Jacoby?

[rmw10]

I don't know too much about him, but any chance he gets a look as the primary kickoff returner if we cut Jacoby?

 

He's never returned a kick in his career, so you could say no, but never say never.  He's pretty much just a straight line deep threat, though.  He's obviously nothing special, and it's doubtful he'd make the team unless there are some extenuating circumstances, but he's a good guy to have around in camp if the injury bug hits.

[Static]

Jacoby gotta go. His return game was just frustrating. 

[rmcjacket23]

Jacoby gotta go. His return game was just frustrating. 

He's a tough case. Not much salary cap relief from letting him go, and nobody on the roster currently that stands out as a better bet to replace him, or at least not on KO duties.

[Static]

He's a tough case. Not much salary cap relief from letting him go, and nobody on the roster currently that stands out as a better bet to replace him, or at least not on KO duties.

 

I personally like Camp for it but that might not work.

[balfan23]

He's a tough case. Not much salary cap relief from letting him go, and nobody on the roster currently that stands out as a better bet to replace him, or at least not on KO duties.

I think there is a good chance that we'll make him a post June 1st cut. He'll save decent money ($2.5M) if we wait until then. 

 

Of course, the downside of a post June 1st cut is that the cap space isn't freed until that date. Still, that's about the right amount of money that will still work for that time frame, as we can then be right up against the cap during the FA signing period and use that $2.5M for rookie signings and for any other minor pickups from other teams cuts later in the summer. 

 

Camp is a potential punt return replacement, but true, KO returner would be an open spot. It is a tough call, on one hand JJ's current salary is too much for a simple KO return guy, but on the other, it was only a few years ago when D. Reed got fumbleitis and we had Zibby and other sub-par return guys ... and we all just prayed for a touchback on every kick. That was painful. 

[GrimCoconut]

He's a tough case. Not much salary cap relief from letting him go, and nobody on the roster currently that stands out as a better bet to replace him, or at least not on KO duties.

Nobody offers the same type of dynamic return abilities on KO (Campanaro seems to be the guy on punts), but I think it's possible a guy falls to us in the draft or undrafted who can possibly provide some of the KRS role, and it's certainly possible Asa Jackson could fill that role for us as well. Asa was used on KO returns, IIRC. So he is a guy we could lean on for KO duties. The problem I foresee for Jacoby is that he is limited as a WR and now is slowing down as a RS, which limits his overall contributions to the team. I think it's a mostly matter of roster spot and not necessarily money. 

[Pirate88]

I agree Jacoby is just taking up cap space. Any relief cutting him is worth it. They could restructure him as just a Returner then cut him next year so his cap hit isn't all in one year. I never liked signing him as a starting WR. I always thought he just caught lightning in a bottle during the championsip run. He couldn't even do anything opposite Andre Johnson in his prime.

The most important player to bring back is Will Hill. Real good complete safety's are tough to find. And with an offseason where he can participate in practices and conditioning he should be even better. He has legit all pro talent at FS or SS. Mcphee I think is just above average, a good player but nothing special. The $6-7mil a year he could cost could be put to better use with some impact WRs\TEs or even corner or safety. I would like to draft a good explosive speed edge rusher to be the guy to learn from Suggs and Dumervil like Beasley or Harold/Dupree. Mcphee isn't an elite edge crusher and resigning him takes up cap space during a great market for very talented WRs/TEs who will be bargains due to bad QBs throwing to them while there is still going to be a need for a dynamic edge rusher as Suggs n Dumervil are over 30. Sign Mcphee and we still need another dynamic edge rusher anyways cuz Mcphee isnt that guy. Better to draft the #3 edge rusher to rotate in who will be far more explosive than Mcphee and be that pro bowl 15 sack player once Suggs gets to old.

Edited January 22, 2015 by Pirate88

[rmcjacket23]

I think there is a good chance that we'll make him a post June 1st cut. He'll save decent money ($2.5M) if we wait until then. 

 

Of course, the downside of a post June 1st cut is that the cap space isn't freed until that date. Still, that's about the right amount of money that will still work for that time frame, as we can then be right up against the cap during the FA signing period and use that $2.5M for rookie signings and for any other minor pickups from other teams cuts later in the summer. 

 

Camp is a potential punt return replacement, but true, KO returner would be an open spot. It is a tough call, on one hand JJ's current salary is too much for a simple KO return guy, but on the other, it was only a few years ago when D. Reed got fumbleitis and we had Zibby and other sub-par return guys ... and we all just prayed for a touchback on every kick. That was painful. 

Yeah, but I really hate post June-1 cuts, and I think clearly Ozzie does as well. You're not gaining anything long-term from doing that, and you're just pushing almost $2M in cap hit to 2016 for a player that is long gone from your roster.

 

I only see that, much like Webb, IF the Ravens find a player they like that late in the year, and they really need the money. That's pretty rare generally. Even guys that we equate to be coming in "late" in terms of FA like Daryl Smith at least get signed by April or May usually.

 

I think Jacoby stays this year and is easily the last year he will be a Raven.

[rmw10]

Yeah, but I really hate post June-1 cuts, and I think clearly Ozzie does as well. You're not gaining anything long-term from doing that, and you're just pushing almost $2M in cap hit to 2016 for a player that is long gone from your roster.

 

I only see that, much like Webb, IF the Ravens find a player they like that late in the year, and they really need the money. That's pretty rare generally. Even guys that we equate to be coming in "late" in terms of FA like Daryl Smith at least get signed by April or May usually.

 

I think Jacoby stays this year and is easily the last year he will be a Raven.

 

We've done it before.  No reason to think we wouldn't do it again if it's a player we no longer want on our roster.  We did it with Bernard Pollard.

 

To be fair though, I'd much rather wait and make that decision after June 1st rather than making it in March and designating him as a post June 1st.  It gives time to see how the roster shapes up and if that money is necessary and whether or not Jacoby has a realistic shot at the team.

[rmcjacket23]

We've done it before.  No reason to think we wouldn't do it again if it's a player we no longer want on our roster.  We did it with Bernard Pollard.

 

To be fair though, I'd much rather wait and make that decision after June 1st rather than making it in March and designating him as a post June 1st.  It gives time to see how the roster shapes up and if that money is necessary and whether or not Jacoby has a realistic shot at the team.

Pollard wasn't a post June-1 cut I don't believe. He was released in March.

[GrimCoconut]

We've done it before.  No reason to think we wouldn't do it again if it's a player we no longer want on our roster.  We did it with Bernard Pollard.

 

To be fair though, I'd much rather wait and make that decision after June 1st rather than making it in March and designating him as a post June 1st.  It gives time to see how the roster shapes up and if that money is necessary and whether or not Jacoby has a realistic shot at the team.

I agree. This is how I think it goes down. I don't see us just cutting Jacoby, as I expect us to make him compete for his spot. I just think that he, like Bernard Pierce, could end up losing their roster spots by simply losing to other options. I think roster spots are going to be a premium, and as a result, it could well push Jones and Pierce off the squad. 

[rmw10]

Pollard wasn't a post June-1 cut I don't believe. He was released in March.

 

He was released in March, but was designated as a post-June 1st cut.

[GrimCoconut]

Pollard wasn't a post June-1 cut I don't believe. He was released in March.

He was a post-June 1st cut. 

 

http://russellstreetreport.com/2013/03/15/baltimore-ravens-salary-cap/pollard-release-saves-only-500k-in-cap-space-until-june-1/

 

 

According to the NFL’s official transactions report, the Ravens’ release of Safety Bernard Pollard was made with a “Post June 1 Designation”.  This means that Pollard will remain on the Ravens Salary Cap until June 1, at which time the team will receive the Cap savings from his release.

[rmcjacket23]

He was a post-June 1st cut. 

 

http://russellstreetreport.com/2013/03/15/baltimore-ravens-salary-cap/pollard-release-saves-only-500k-in-cap-space-until-june-1/

Yeah, I should have seen that before I posted.

 

Still for me, completely don't see the benefit of it. Its one thing to make the decision after June 1, but designating a post June-1 three months earlier is basically just slapping a band aid on a bigger problem. I understand they were desperate for cap space that season because of a flat cap, but you got a guy carrying $1.5M in cap space two seasons after he's been gone.

 

It probably doesn't mean as much with lower contracts like theirs, but when you talk about somebody like Webb... there's not much to like about the idea of carrying a $4M and $6M cap hit in back to back years for a player that won't even be playing for your team in either of those seasons.

[balfan23]

Yeah, I should have seen that before I posted.

 

Still for me, completely don't see the benefit of it. Its one thing to make the decision after June 1, but designating a post June-1 three months earlier is basically just slapping a band aid on a bigger problem. I understand they were desperate for cap space that season because of a flat cap, but you got a guy carrying $1.5M in cap space two seasons after he's been gone.

 

It probably doesn't mean as much with lower contracts like theirs, but when you talk about somebody like Webb... there's not much to like about the idea of carrying a $4M and $6M cap hit in back to back years for a player that won't even be playing for your team in either of those seasons.

Yeah - no way they are doing Post June 1 with Webb, for the reasons you stated. I think they have no choice, given his contract and their desperate lack of depth at the position, to ride Webb out for this season and pray he gives us reason to believe he can play somewhere in the general vicinity of his contract. 

 

I think Jones could be a different story. The amount isn't that prohibitive and it sets them up, not only to get a late player, but to give them the ability to spend right up to the cap during the FA period, instead of having to maintain enough room to sign their draft picks. I'm just not convinced either that they don't view him as being on the margins of the team's roster as it is.

 

But true - as you say, it is a form of "kicking the can down the road", and as a general rule, we don't like to do it. 

[Pirate88]

I forgot bout cutting a players before June and still designating it. I would prefer splitting his salary over a couple seasons than taking the whole hit all next season. Especially in a free agent season that's one of the best ever and loaded with value especially elite value talent at WR/TE due to bad QB play for players like Housler Britt Crabtree Gresham Moore and likely Vernon Davis cut. I never liked the Jacoby Jones signing. He got a big contract for a good playoff run and dancing with stars. I believed ha had a nice playoff run but wouldn't stay consistent. He never became anything playing opposite Andre Johnson. I never thought he was a starting WR and signing him hurt our cap space and handcuffed the progress of the passing game cuz they really thought they were fine at WR in 2013 with Torrey and Jacoby. Joe's 2013 season was no surprise with him forcing the ball to one trick subpar WRs. After cutting Boldin they should have aggressively pursued Deandre Hopkins who plays like a fast athletic Boldin. But they had confidence in Jacoby for some reason.

Edited January 24, 2015 by Pirate88

[rmcjacket23]

I forgot bout cutting a players before June and still designating it. I would prefer splitting his salary over a couple seasons than taking the whole hit all next season. Especially in a free agent season that's one of the best ever and loaded with value especially elite value talent at WR/TE due to bad QB play for players like Housler Britt Crabtree Gresham Moore and likely Vernon Davis cut. I never liked the Jacoby Jones signing. He got a big contract for a good playoff run and dancing with stars. I believed ha had a nice playoff run but wouldn't stay consistent. He never became anything playing opposite Andre Johnson. I never thought he was a starting WR and signing him hurt our cap space and handcuffed the progress of the passing game cuz they really thought they were fine at WR in 2013 with Torrey and Jacoby. Joe's 2013 season was no surprise with him forcing the ball to one trick subpar WRs. After cutting Boldin they should have aggressively pursued Deandre Hopkins who plays like a fast athletic Boldin. But they had confidence in Jacoby for some reason.

There's no way I'd want to take a $6M hit in 2016 for Webb. 2016 is a big year for us cap space wise.

 

You've got Joe's cap # doubling to about $28M, and if he doesn't agree to restructure/extend, you've got a problem there (and he has all the leverage in that season). You'd also have Jimmy Smith up for a potentially big contract, and you'd have both Yanda and KO has UFAs that season if Yanda doesn't get an extension.