Official Vent Thread: Titans

[frozen joe flacco fan]

Well, as upsetting as the news about smith and the last two weeks have been, feels a little better today with the W and with the steelers losing. Hopefully we can get some rest on the bye, fix some things and, just pray that our secondary gains some cohesion together. I'm a little concerned about Flacco though, he looked hesitant throwing the ball today, didn't step into it countless times.

Yep! Its time to start Tyrod. Like ya said, Joe didn't step into his throws several times. Or could

it be he had no place to step 'cause the pocket was collapsing around him? What did ya think about

his throw to Torrey in the endzone? It was probably a fluke. It prompted Steve Buerlein to comment

that Joe throws the deep ball as well as anyone in the league but what would he know? He was a pro

QB, unlike you.

Joe didn't look hesitant at all when he threw the deep ball to Steve Smith, who let it go right

through his hands. Granted, it was thrown into double or triple coverage but that's what separates

the sheep from the goats.

Nice jab! Try a right hook next time!

[cobrajet]

That's what I was saying

Sorry, I was just expanding on what you were saying.  You are right and I am in total agreement with you.

[rmcjacket23]

Yep! Its time to start Tyrod. Like ya said, Joe didn't step into his throws several times. Or could

it be he had no place to step 'cause the pocket was collapsing around him? What did ya think about

his throw to Torrey in the endzone? It was probably a fluke. It prompted Steve Buerlein to comment

that Joe throws the deep ball as well as anyone in the league but what would he know? He was a pro

QB, unlike you.

Joe didn't look hesitant at all when he threw the deep ball to Steve Smith, who let it go right

through his hands. Granted, it was thrown into double or triple coverage but that's what separates

the sheep from the goats.

Nice jab! Try a right hook next time!

I think if you actually go back and watch his throws (primarily in the first half), you'll find that the ability to step into the throws was there.

 

I remember specifically three plays where he literally threw off his back foot when the pressure wasn't within a square yard of him. It might have been coming had he held on for another 2 seconds or so, but that doesn't matter. I've never seen Joe throw so many fade away passes before, and a lot of them were unwarranted.

 

I definitely think the pass rush is getting to his head, and I'm not necessarily saying its his fault, but having bad mechanics from it will only lead to one possible long-term outcome, and its a bad one.

[frozen joe flacco fan]

Don't think we watched the same game. Wagner allowed one sack and false started once. Oher allowed 2.5 sacks.

 

Umm...

This O-line is average at best. Absolutely no pocket for Joe in the 1st half, bad snap by the center,

an unabated sack on our QB and a false start in a home game. Inexcusable! All we need for Christmas

is an O-line, a secondary and a legitimate #1 WR. Can you imagine where we would be without three

former Texan players and some of last year's Texans coaching staff? Thanks to Forsett, I haven't

missed Rice. Daniels is looking like an ageless wonder as Pitta's replacement and ya gotta luv JJ. He had another great runback today that was negated by a penalty, albeit a great block by Darian

Stewart. As for the difference between Caldwell's play-calling and Kubiak's, let's just say there's

no comparison.

If you're trying to make a case that Rick Wagner is better than Michael Oher, the jury is still out

IMO. I'd have to see how Wagner looks at LT.

[frozen joe flacco fan]

I think if you actually go back and watch his throws (primarily in the first half), you'll find that the ability to step into the throws was there.

 

I remember specifically three plays where he literally threw off his back foot when the pressure wasn't within a square yard of him. It might have been coming had he held on for another 2 seconds or so, but that doesn't matter. I've never seen Joe throw so many fade away passes before, and a lot of them were unwarranted.

 

I definitely think the pass rush is getting to his head, and I'm not necessarily saying its his fault, but having bad mechanics from it will only lead to one possible long-term outcome, and its a bad one.

So, what's the solution?

[The Raven]

This O-line is average at best. Absolutely no pocket for Joe in the 1st half, bad snap by the center,

an unabated sack on our QB and a false start in a home game. Inexcusable! All we need for Christmas

is an O-line, a secondary and a legitimate #1 WR. Can you imagine where we would be without three

former Texan players and some of last year's Texans coaching staff? Thanks to Forsett, I haven't

missed Rice. Daniels is looking like an ageless wonder as Pitta's replacement and ya gotta luv JJ. He had another great runback today that was negated by a penalty, albeit a great block by Darian

Stewart. As for the difference between Caldwell's play-calling and Kubiak's, let's just say there's

no comparison.

If you're trying to make a case that Rick Wagner is better than Michael Oher, the jury is still out

IMO. I'd have to see how Wagner looks at LT.

 

Wagner is head and shoulders above Oher and it's not even debatable. Going in to this game, he was the top ranked RT in the league according to Pro Football Focus, and the next closest RT was like five points away. 

[rmcjacket23]

This O-line is average at best. Absolutely no pocket for Joe in the 1st half, bad snap by the center,

an unabated sack on our QB and a false start in a home game. Inexcusable! All we need for Christmas

is an O-line, a secondary and a legitimate #1 WR. Can you imagine where we would be without three

former Texan players and some of last year's Texans coaching staff? Thanks to Forsett, I haven't

missed Rice. Daniels is looking like an ageless wonder as Pitta's replacement and ya gotta luv JJ. He had another great runback today that was negated by a penalty, albeit a great block by Darian

Stewart. As for the difference between Caldwell's play-calling and Kubiak's, let's just say there's

no comparison.

If you're trying to make a case that Rick Wagner is better than Michael Oher, the jury is still out

IMO. I'd have to see how Wagner looks at LT.

1. I don't need to see how Wagner looks at LT, because Oher will probably never be a LT again either without injury, nor did I really care how he performed at LT. He was a very, very, very below average RT when he played for the Ravens. I agree the jury is still out, because the sample size just isn't big enough. But if you compare our RTs for the last two seasons... its night and day. Wagner has been discussed by numerous media outlets as a potential All-Pro at RT. I never once heard that mentioned about Oher at any point in his career.

 

2. The O-line was bad today in pass protection. They've been better in prior weeks. Average at best is good enough to be a contender in this league as far as I'm concerned. I treat offensive lines like I treat special teams... you don't have to be great at it to win in this league... you just can't be bad at it.

[rmw10]

Wagner is head and shoulders above Oher and it's not even debatable. Going in to this game, he was the top ranked RT in the league according to Pro Football Focus, and the next closest RT was like five points away. 

 

I'm not one to take PFF as gospel, but a grade difference that large really isn't questionable.  If they have him rated that highly, it's clear that he's head and shoulders above the next best guy.

[rmcjacket23]

So, what's the solution?

1. Pass block better.

 

2. Joe gets the fear of being hit out of his head and steps into the pocket to throw. He's a statue in the pocket (not necessarily a bad thing), so therefore by definition of the position, he's going to get hit and he's going to get sacked. Its part of the job description.

 

Its a 50/50 combination of both based on what I saw today.

[Militant X 1]

I didn't get a chance to personally watch the game today so I have nothing to vent about.  Glad for the win!  However, I did read the game day thread and it seems like a major issue was the stalling offense...again!  How did they look?

[beanfigger]

I didn't get a chance to personally watch the game today so I have nothing to vent about.  Glad for the win!  However, I did read the game day thread and it seems like a major issue was the stalling offense...again!  How did they look?

 

Started 0/6 on third downs. That about sums it up.

[The Raven]

I didn't get a chance to personally watch the game today so I have nothing to vent about.  Glad for the win!  However, I did read the game day thread and it seems like a major issue was the stalling offense...again!  How did they look?

 

They had no answer for the Titan blitz. The Titans were throwing us 6-7 man blitzes every play and it killed us. I kid you not, we faced a nine man box at one point in the first half. 

[rmcjacket23]

I didn't get a chance to personally watch the game today so I have nothing to vent about.  Glad for the win!  However, I did read the game day thread and it seems like a major issue was the stalling offense...again!  How did they look?

Literally nothing impressive about our offense today. O-line played pretty poorly across the board, Flacco looked like a deer in the headlights for at least the entire first half, and our running game was nothing impressive.

 

If you look at the box score, it looks like Forsett had a great game. He did not. None of our RBs were overly impressive today, nor was the blocking for them.

 

Defense was awful in the first quarter in my opinion, played exceptionally well the last three quarters.

[BmoreBird22]

I noticed that early on, the Titans were having success blitzing and really getting to Flacco for pressures or hits and that seemed to get to him mentally. After a really rough game at the Steelers and a not so great game against the Bengals, Flacco probably thought much of the same. I saw so many throws off the back foot when he had time, and I'm thinking it's because he thought it was because the Titans would get there. It wasn't until the run game got going that Joe really started to feel comfortable. I hope Joe gains comfort with the line over the break

[Militant X 1]

Started 0/6 on third downs. That about sums it up.

 

They had no answer for the Titan blitz. The Titans were throwing us 6-7 man blitzes every play and it killed us. I kid you not, we faced a nine man box at one point in the first half. 

 

Literally nothing impressive about our offense today. O-line played pretty poorly across the board, Flacco looked like a deer in the headlights for at least the entire first half, and our running game was nothing impressive.

 

If you look at the box score, it looks like Forsett had a great game. He did not. None of our RBs were overly impressive today, nor was the blocking for them.

 

Defense was awful in the first quarter in my opinion, played exceptionally well the last three quarters.

 

Thanks to you all!

[frozen joe flacco fan]

1. Pass block better.

 

2. Joe gets the fear of being hit out of his head and steps into the pocket to throw. He's a statue in the pocket (not necessarily a bad thing), so therefore by definition of the position, he's going to get hit and he's going to get sacked. Its part of the job description.

 

Its a 50/50 combination of both based on what I saw today.

I agree with #1.

I don't agree with #2. Joe has no fear. He takes as many vicious hits as anybody in the league and

just gets up and re-loads.

[rmcjacket23]

I agree with #1.

I don't agree with #2. Joe has no fear. He takes as many vicious hits as anybody in the league and

just gets up and re-loads.

Yes, but when he was getting up and re-loading today, he was drifting back from the pocket and throwing off-balance and off his back foot.

 

Regardless of whether there's actual pressure or not, QBs don't perform well when they have mechanics like that.

 

Like I indicated earlier, I think a lot of his bad-mechanically throws from today were manufactured by the perception of pressure, not actual pressure itself.

[ravensdan]

Was anyone else pissed off at that substitution where we had to wait for them and call a TO. They need to change that rule.

No. It's a well known rule. I don't know how the announcers didn't know it.

[frozen joe flacco fan]

Literally nothing impressive about our offense today. O-line played pretty poorly across the board, Flacco looked like a deer in the headlights for at least the entire first half, and our running game was nothing impressive.

 

If you look at the box score, it looks like Forsett had a great game. He did not. None of our RBs were overly impressive today, nor was the blocking for them.

 

Defense was awful in the first quarter in my opinion, played exceptionally well the last three quarters.

Absolutely ludicrous! A deer in the headlights??? Really???? Joe had the ball for three playsin the

1st quarter and we had less plays than the Titans had 1st downs at one point in the 1st half. The TOP was a lop-sided 19 plus minutes to 10 plus minutes. If Joe looked like a deer lost in the

headlights, it must have been when he was discussing what was working with his OC on the sidelines while our defense was on the field. Now, if you want to talk about some deer caught in the headlights, let's start with our defensive secondary in the 1st half. Otherwise, your analysis was right on the

mark and antler high!

[rmcjacket23]

No. It's a well known rule. I don't know how the announcers didn't know it.

Correct, it is the rule.

 

BUT... the announcers do make a good point that a savvy defense can easily exploit it. 

[frozen joe flacco fan]

Yes, but when he was getting up and re-loading today, he was drifting back from the pocket and throwing off-balance and off his back foot.

 

Regardless of whether there's actual pressure or not, QBs don't perform well when they have mechanics like that.

 

Like I indicated earlier, I think a lot of his bad-mechanically throws from today were manufactured by the perception of pressure, not actual pressure itself.

I noticed the bad mechanics on certain throws but that doesn't always equate to fear. He simply

didn't have enough room to step into some of his throws due to poor pass protection and blitzes that weren't picked up. Some QBs can get away with poor mechanics. Have you ever noticed Peyton Manning's nervous feet?

[ravensdan]

Correct, it is the rule.

BUT... the announcers do make a good point that a savvy defense can easily exploit it.

Yes. If you want to go hurry up you can't sub. Harbaugh knew clearly.

[rmcjacket23]

Absolutely ludicrous! A deer in the headlights??? Really???? Joe had the ball for three playsin the

1st quarter and we had less plays than the Titans had 1st downs at one point in the 1st half. The TOP was a lop-sided 19 plus minutes to 10 plus minutes. If Joe looked like a deer lost in the

headlights, it must have been when he was discussing what was working with his OC on the sidelines while our defense was on the field. Now, if you want to talk about some deer caught in the headlights, let's start with our defensive secondary in the 1st half. Otherwise, your analysis was right on the

mark and antler high!

That's all great and cute and all, but the Ravens had five offensive possessions in the first half. Three of those drives moved for a combined 6 yards. That's 9 players for 6 yards. We had a total of 84 yards on five possessions in the first half, which if my math is correct, means we averaged about 17 yards per possession.

 

Even agreeing that the Ravens didn't have the ball in the first quarter, they had the ball plenty in the 2nd quarter, where Joe went 6 for 13 for 66 yards.

 

Needless to say, I think my original comments are a pretty good synopsis based on what actually happened on the field.

[rmcjacket23]

I noticed the bad mechanics on certain throws but that doesn't always equate to fear. He simply

didn't have enough room to step into some of his throws due to poor pass protection and blitzes that weren't picked up. Some QBs can get away with poor mechanics. Have you ever noticed Peyton Manning's nervous feet?

Yup, I have, just like I noticed in the past how Stafford made a lot of throws that looked precisely like Joe's today... sense of pressure when there actually is no pressure. Its one of the main reasons why Caldwell was brought into Detroit... to stop a good QB from making bad mechanical routines that allow him to throw 15-20 INTs per season consistently.

 

Remember, there's a significant difference between PERCEIVED pressure and ACTUAL pressure. He faced actual pressure last week, and he faced some pressure this week, though not nearly as much as people think. He just simply perceived pressure, and thus faded in the pocket and threw off his back foot.

 

I'll be more than happy to point out numerous types these happened in the first half particularly when I got a chance to grow photos later this week.

[rmcjacket23]

Yes. If you want to go hurry up you can't sub. Harbaugh knew clearly.

Right, Harbaugh knew the rule.

 

The point being... if the offense subs in, say, 5 seconds, that doesn't mean the defense only has that amount of time to sub. They can take 15-20 seconds if they want to, and its the offense fault.

 

That's where the announcers feel there is a disadvantage. The Ravens aren't the first team to see this issue either... I see it almost weekly throughout the league. I watched the same thing happen to Brady about two weeks ago.

[ravensdfan]

Joe looked out of sorts today . I thought he might be somewhat injured but who knows with his facial expressions - All the same . Where was Smith Sr. other then dropping a key 3rd down pass ? Ngata almost had his 3rd pick . It would certainly be embarrassing If he ended up the season as the pick leader .

 

He definitely did look out of sorts today. Wasn't stepping into his throws at all that first half. Did better in the 2nd half by far but still didn't seem like he was getting the usual zip on the ball.

[Florida Ravens Fan]

It was the classy thing to do, because the Titans had 3 time outs and did not use them. Why not take a knee instead of adding insult to injury.

Teams like the Broncos, patriots, and packers just keep on throwing tds even with huge leads, even when playing lesser teams. Greenbay up 35-0 in the first half and they keep throwing for tds.

[redlobster]

Sorry, I was just expanding on what you were saying. You are right and I am in total agreement with you.

Haha wasn't sure what was going on , then I reread your post and saw what you were stating .

[GrimCoconut]

Flacco probably felt pressure because of poor play from Monroe and especially Zuttah. Nothing worse than pressure coming from the two worst places on the OL to allow pressure. No excuse, but I think Flacco might need some counseling for PTSD. 

[CalvinSmoke]

1. I don't need to see how Wagner looks at LT, because Oher will probably never be a LT again either without injury, nor did I really care how he performed at LT. He was a very, very, very below average RT when he played for the Ravens. I agree the jury is still out, because the sample size just isn't big enough. But if you compare our RTs for the last two seasons... its night and day. Wagner has been discussed by numerous media outlets as a potential All-Pro at RT. I never once heard that mentioned about Oher at any point in his career.

2. The O-line was bad today in pass protection. They've been better in prior weeks. Average at best is good enough to be a contender in this league as far as I'm concerned. I treat offensive lines like I treat special teams... you don't have to be great at it to win in this league... you just can't be bad at it.

we. Have to wait and see, Michael Oher had a great rookie season as well. Only time will tell