Controversial Ravens Draft History topic

[mgridda]

Prepare for some scandalous what ifs!

 

 

Recently, I was reading an article on this website about Mark Clayton, and he was saying how he was a dreamer. He was talking about "what ifs." Particularly, the what if that the Dallas Cowboys would have drafted him instead. I found it insulting, but thought to myself: hey, Mark, what if we drafted Roddy White instead of you?

 

 

Obviously a single year's draft is a stand alone because had we actually drafted like this in any one year, it would have changed the course of the franchise and changed our future draft spots, so maybe we wouldn't be able to nab someone like Terrell Suggs 10th overall in 2003 or Haloti Ngata in 2006 since we'd probably be going to the superbowl every year if we drafted like this. Obviously, I like who we have and have had (for the most part) but this is a fun little exercise.

 

2000 NFL Draft was removed since it might affect the Superbowl victory here.

 

01 NFL Draft

31st Overall - Todd Heap (some might argue for Chad Johnson, but I'd rather have Heap since there are a lot of good receivers the Ravens could have drafted in this era, actually. Others might argue for Drew Brees, and while I love Brees, I don't know if he'd make it in the Ravens system, Drew didn't mature until 4 years after he was drafted, and only once Rivers was drafted did he do well. He didn't even do that great, until coming off an injury and hooking up with Sean Payton's spread offense. Would Drew Brees do well under Billick's offense? Who knows.)

62nd Overall - Steve Smith instead of Gary Baxter. Baxter was a good corner, but no Steve Smith. He's one of the few non Ravens who "plays like a Raven"

92nd Overall - Ryan Diem instead of Casey Rabach. 

126th Overall - Edgerton Hartwell (this draft wasn't very deep)

161st Overall - T.J. Houshmandzadeh instead of Chris Barnes, RB. One of the few non Ravens who "plays like a Raven."

194th Overall - Antonio Pierce instead of Joe Maese, C

231st Overall - Tom Ashworth instead of Dwayne Missouri, DE.

 

02 NFL Draft

24th Overall - Ed Reed (best player in the whole draft)

91st Overall - Brian Westbrook instead of good DE Anthony Weaver

112th Overall - Dave Zastudil great punter.

123rd Overall - Scott Fujita instead of Ron Johnson, WR

155th Overall - Aaron Kampman instead of Terry Jones, can never have enough pass rushers

195th Overall - Bart Scott instead of Lamont Brightful, even though we might sign him UDFA

206th Overall - Ma'ake Kemoeatu instead of Javin Hunter

207th Overall - Chester Taylor good runningback

209th Overall - James Harrison instead of Chad Williams. Harrison went undrafted. Almost forgot about him twice. If we make this draft pick here, and keep Harrison on the roster along with Boulware, Adalius Thomas, Cornell Brown and guys like McCrary as we're transitioning to the 3-4 then we'd ultimately probably end up winning a few rivalry games that we lost, including the one in Pittsburgh this year.

236th Overall - Brett Keisel he's really the BPA here, and a good 3-4 DE

 

03 NFL Draft

10th Overall - Terrell Suggs What if the Ravens drafted Polamalu here? Both are DPOY caliber guys.

41st Overall - Keep it instead of trading up for Kyle Boller and grab Anquan Boldin. Boldin is one of select few people who "play like a Raven."

77th Overall - Brandon Lloyd instead of RB Musa Smith. Sometimes apathetic or aloof, but undeniably talented, best WR in 2010

109th Overall - Asante Samuel instead of Jarrett Johnson, this was tough. I might amend this

134th Overall - Robert Mathis as much as I like Ovie Mughelli and his 2 years or so, you can never have enough pass rushers and Mathis is an all time leader in sacks.

146th Overall - Dave Diehl instead of good NT (down the line for the 9ers) Aubrayo Franklin

173 Overall - Antonio Gates instead of Pashos since we already have Diehl. Gates went undrafted.

182nd Overall - Yeremiah Bell instead of Gerome Sapp, this is a screamer, don't know why we didn't see this

223rd Overall - Quintin Mikell instead of Trent Smith. Mikell also went undrafted.

250 Overall - Kris Dielman instead of Mike Mabry. Dielman also went undrafted.

258th Overall - Brendon Ayanbadejo instead of Antwoine Sanders. Romo was undrafted, but I didn't want Romo at all. Not even as a back up.It was tough to pass up Mat McBriar, the punter, but I had to go with this special teams ace instead.

 

2004 NFL Draft

21st Overall - Vince Wilfork instead of trading up to get Kyle Boller. Who knew that Kyle Boller would cost this franchise both Anquan Boldin in the 2nd round of 2003, and Vince Wilfork in the 1st round of 2004?

51st Overall - Nick Hardwick instead of Dwan Edwards. Other options were Chris Cooley, Greg Jones, Darnell Dockett and Randy Starks.

82nd Overall - Jared Allen instead of Devard Darling. You can never have enough pass rushers. Picked him over Shaun Phillips.

153rd Overall - Mike Turner instead of Rodrick Green.

187th Overall - Vonta Leach instead of Josh Harris. Leach went undrafted.

199th Overall - Wes Welker instead of Clarence Moore. Welker went undrafted.

244th Overall - Jason Peters instead of WR Derek Abney. Peters went undrafted.

246th Overall - Tyson Clabo instead of Brian Rimpf. Clabo went undrafted.

 

2005 NFL Draft

22nd Overall - Logan Mankins instead of Mark Clayton. That's right, I'd rather have Mankins than Clayton OR Roddy White. Other options included: Aaron Rodgers, Michael Roos. If Tom Brady isn't on the roster and this is stand-alone, then obvious Rodgers is the pick here, but the interesting thing is Kyle Boller and Aaron Rodgers both came from Tedford's Cal offense and Boller's failure is what caused people to steer clear of Rodgers. Rodgers also benefited from holding a clipboard and practicing for 3 years behind a legend.

53rd Overall - Vincent Jackson instead of Dan Cody. Oh what fools were we in 05'.

64th Overall - Justin Tuck instead of Adam Terry. Other options include, Frank Gore and Evan Mathis.

124th Overall - Jason Brown (hey we got this one right!) Couldn't hold on to him, though. I kind of like Trent Cole here, too.

158th Overall - Chris Myers instead of FB Justin Green #33. Lots of good o-line depth

213th OVerall - Jay Ratliff instead of Derek Anderson. Anderson was by no means a bad pick, but had we known what a nose tackle Jay Ratliff would become he's the easy choice here. 

234th Overall - Brandon Browner instead of LB Mike Smith. Josh Cribbs is tempting here, as is Cameron Wake, but I couldn't pass up a good cornerback since they are hard to find.

 

2006 NFL Draft

12th Overall - Haloti Ngata what a great pick this guy was.

56th Overall - Devin Hester instead of Chris Chester. MJD and future pro bowler Tim Jennings were available, but Hester is the greatest returner of all time. He vindicates passing up on guys like Dante Hall and Josh Cribbs.

111th Overall - Brandon Marshall instead of Demetrius Williams. What the hell were we thinking?????????? Elvis Dumervil was also available, but he doesn't compare.

132nd Overall - Kyle Williams instead of PJ Daniels, Kyle has probably been the best nose tackle of the last 8 years.

146th Overall - Brent Grimes instead of Dawan Landry. I know Dawan was a force his rookie year, but I can't discount Grimes here. Grimes went undrafted.

166th Overall Tramon Williams instead of Quinn Synewpski or whatever. Maybe we're sensitive to it now, but like Ozzie says "you can never have too many good cornerbacks."

203rd Overall Sam Koch I actually like Koch quite a bit. 

208th Overall Cortland Finnegan instead of Derrick Martin. His fiery nature is exactly what being a Raven is all about. 

219th Overall Matt Prater instead of Ryan Lacasse, just because I don't like Miles Austin and also because Matt Stover is 38 in 2006 and this would save us from the gap between Stover and Tucker.

 

2007 NFL Draft

29th Overall Ben Grubbs while I love Grubbs and offensive linemen in general, coverage masters like Eric Weddle, and big ten linebackers like LaMarr Woodley and Paul Posluszny were also tempting. Ultimately, Ed Reed, Suggs and Ray have the fort down.

74th Overall Paul Solai instead of Yamon Figurs great 3-4 d-lineman. 

86th Overall Marshal Yanda this is one of the greatest Raven draft picks of all time. We've always been good at drafting in the 1st round, but this one was a total great pick.

134th Overall Corey Graham instead of Antwan Barnes. 

137th Overall Le'Ron McClain I'd say we got this one right too. BPA.

174th Overall Ahmad Bradshaw instead of Troy Smith. Can never have too many good runningbacks

207th Overall Mike DeVito instead of Prescott Burgess. DeVito turns out to be a great 3-4 defensive end, real underrated guy.

 

2008 NFL Draft

18th Overall Joe Flacco is BPA. Good job Ravens. If it wasn't stand alone and we had Tom Brady, Aqib Talib or Brandon Flowers would be a good pick. Chris Johnson hasn't stood the test oft time.

55th Overall Ray Rice say what you will. No one comes close to being as good as Ray Rice between this pick and the Ravens' next pick.

71st Overall Jamaal Charles instead of Tavares Gooden. Wouldn't it be nice if we had Charles?

86th Overall Cliff Avril instead of Zbikowski. I really rooted for Tommy, but he's not NFL caliber. Great article about Zib : http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24245389/tom-zbikowski-retires-from-nfl-to-become-chicago-firefighter

99th Overall Brandon Carr instead of Oniel Cousins

106th Overall Danny Amendola instead of Marcus Smith. Amendola went undrafted. Is it racism that causes good white wide receivers to go undrafted?

133rd Overall Carl Nicks instead of David Hale. Again, what were we thinking? Cousins and Hale over Nicks?

206th Overall Wesley Woodyard instead of Haruki Nakamura. Tried to be like Polamalu. Wasn't like Polamalu. 

215th Overall Kyle Arrington instead of Justin Harper. So many good cornerbacks of late.

240th Overall Danny Woodhead instead of RB Allen Patrick. Same position. Easy

 

2009 NFL Draft

23rd Overall Clay Matthews instead of Michael Oher I've gotten a lot of heat for this when Oher used to be here, but now that he's gone I doubt anyone would disagree with these two first picks.

57th Overall Sebastian Vollmer instead of Paul Kruger. I think we'd play better with these two guys and would still win a superbowl in 2012 if the draft looked like this instead.

88th Overall Lardarius Webb there isn't anyone I'd rather have between this pick and the next Ravens pick.

137th Overall Dannell Ellerbe instead of Jason Phillips. Funny that Ellerbe is the one who went undrafted.

149th Overall Zach Miller instead of Davon Drew, TE.

185th Overall Arian Foster instead of Cedric Peerman. What a great story it is though of Foster, for him to have gone undrafted.

 

 

2010 NFL Draft

We should have traded up one spot to get Dez Bryant or Demaryius Thomas. But we didn't do that, here's what we should have done after trading back

43rd Overall NaVorro Bowman instead of Sergio Kindle. Bowman would drop to the 3rd round, but he's the BPA after round 1. 

57th Overall Gino Atkins instead of Terrence Cody. This is a no brainer, so much depth in this draft. Atkins is a force and one of the best DTs in the league.

70th Overall Jimmy Graham instead of Ed Dickson. Can you believe it? We could have Graham and Pitta. Graham was a steal.

114th Overall Kam Chancellor instead of Dennis Pitta. Oh boy! Tricked ya. This would probably be wildly unpopular and controversial, but I'd say that Graham + Chancellor >> Graham + Pitta. Then again what do I know?

156th Overall Antonio Brown instead of David Reed. I really wonder who was in charge of scouting the MAC conference and who was in charge of scouting the Mountain West Conference, because who ever said draft this kid David Reed instead of Antonio Brown needs to be fired.

157th Overall Arthur Jones I like him.

194th Overall Victor Cruz instead of Ramon Harewood. Imagine Flacco with Brown, Cruz and Graham, maybe even Pitta.

 

2011

27th Overall Jimmy Smith as it stands now I wouldn't draft Lamarr Houston or DeMarco Murray over him. I think our running game is fine. 

58th Overall Torrey Smith call me biased, and maybe we need more time to decide, but I'd rather have Torrey than the other options drafted after Torrey

85th Overall Julius Thomas over Jah Reid

123rd Overall Richard Sherman over Tandon Doss. This is a no brainer, but my brain can't help but think we had Sherman rated pretty highly, and just thought we could get him a little later. Our next pick we ended up getting Chykie Brown so I think we wanted a cornerback around there, and maybe we thought Sherman would drop to that pick. He plays so much like a Raven, can you imagine if we would have drafted Smith and Sherman in the same draft?

 

 

The rest of the draft and this process doesn't matter, I've literally given myself an aneurysm upon realizing Richard Sherman was pick 154, and 10 picks later at 164 we took Chykie Brown. Who was scouting the Pac-10? David Blackburn? Lonnie Young? Joe Horitz? Why didn't we trade up?

 

I have to go to the hospital, brb.

 

I can just imagine Joe Flacco saying he wants Tandon Doss so instead of grabbing Sherman in the 4th, we grab Doss thinking Sherman would be there later.  

 

 

 

 

Look at that early era receiving corps for Tom Brady. I mean, many of those guys are still in the league. Imagine a Ravens receiving corps consisting of guys like Steve Smith, Todd Heap, Antonio Gates, Anquan Boldin and TJ Houshmandzadeh, Laveranues Coles and Ronald Curry from day one. 

 

 

I by no means want all these picks. If I could just just pick a few, these are clearly the most important:

 

191 Overall - Tom Brady instead of Cedric Woodard from Texas

62nd Overall - Steve Smith instead of Gary Baxter.

41st Overall & 21st Overall - Anquan Boldin and Vince Wilfork instead of Kyle Boller.

22nd Overall - Logan Mankins/Aaron Rodgers/Roddy White instead of Mark Clayton.

111th Overall - Brandon Marshall instead of Demetrius Williams. 

70th Overall Jimmy Graham instead of Ed Dickson

123rd Overall Richard Sherman over Tandon Doss. 

 

These are clearly the 7 most important, where we definitely got them wrong.

[Dewy101]

hindsight is 20/20

[1/28/01]

hindsight is 20/20

The sky is blue.

[AsianRice]

mega millions 2014 with 321mil

 

9-15-24-39-41. Mega Ball: 1

 

I should had picked these numbers.....

[52520Andrew]

I should have taken Ellington over Ball in fantasy this year

[codizzle]

You guys are tough lol...

But yea.. Oh well.. Every draft every year always has a head scratcher.. Never fails

[TDubbs]

57th Overall Gino Atkins instead of Terrence Cody. This is a no brainer, so much depth in this draft. Atkins is a force and one of the best DTs in the league. <----- That makes me very sad lol.

[BmoreBird22]

57th Overall Gino Atkins instead of Terrence Cody. This is a no brainer, so much depth in this draft. Atkins is a force and one of the best DTs in the league. <----- That makes me very sad lol.

How would he do in the 3-4, though?

[allblackraven]

You definitely did some work here, props to you.

 

Looking back at the draft is always funny and some choices are impossible to explain. That 2010 "what if" draft is on another level though. Mind boggling.

[TDubbs]

How would he do in the 3-4, though?

 

Tough to say but he would have easily made more of an impact than Cody has made on this team lol.

[K-Dog]

every  draft is the same thing.

A gamble.

[Gordo52]

It's cool looking back but I don't like thinking of what could've been. Would the Ravens have won the Super Bowl in 2012 had we drafted one player over another? There's unlimited scenarios with what could've happened...Maybe we win multiple, don't know though.

[Maryland]

If you knew the best players from every draft you could win damn near every SB   but as stated, hindsight is 20/20.

 

Unless you had a personal affinity for some player your GM overlooked who turned out to be good (I get this all of the time as a Wizards fan watching Grunfeld draft), there isn't much purpose to dwell on it. Every team in the league had a shot at Joe Montana, Tom Brady, and so on. 

[mgridda]

Well, I think we can learn from the past by studying it. I might not be the only one. I think we can look at what we did, and what we were thinking and learn that some players would do better than others. What I want to see on the Ravens is the Steve Smiths, the Anquan Boldins, the Richard Shermans. But, also there are guys like ex-basketball tight ends that seem to do just extremely well in the NFL like Julius Thomas and Jimmy Graham. Of course, both of these guys have the best QBs in football.

[Tru11]

good read .

[Tenacious Faulker]

I like a little revisionist history from time to time and "N IF L" is a fun little mid exercise. There is a lot to consider on that OP and I haven't reviewed it all yet.  I will say this:  The Ravens absolutely sucked at cultivating young WRs and QBs back in 2000.  Clayton was the right pick imo, but Bmore has proven terrible at not only getting the most out of that talent but properly uitlizing them too.  QBs too.  It wasn't until Kyle Boller that they found they could scheme their offense to protect/hid QB inexperieince and deficiencies by adding better elements around him.  He was 5-4 his rookie season.  By the time Joe came along they had the formula down.  I don;t think that Tom Brady would've made it here.  It took a coach like Belichick to get him to shine.

 

While QB is less of an issue, even today they don't appear to know how to cultivate WRs.  A 13 year vet is still our #1 WR and the one we drafted has regressed under a new OC.  It would also appear now too that the team has regressed as of late its ability to assess DB talent too.

 

Drafting is a gamble a gamble and a BPA pick doesn't always mean that they'll be world beaters as a pro.  Many of those top recruits do burn out and see entry into the pros as the end of their journey, not the beginning.  Players like Lewis, Ogden, Reed, Heap, Ngata, Suggs, Flacco, and now Mosely are prime examples of players that value the sport and their place in it.

[Torreysmithforthewin]

Wow romo and foster went undrafted??

[rmw10]

Really good work.  As has already been stated, hindsight is 20/20.  It is interesting to go back and wonder "what if" though.  You never really know if a superstar would be a superstar elsewhere, but it's still an interesting thought.

[kassaiscool]

A+ for effort. What I notice about the Ravens is they fail really hard at WR/CB/Rbs/TEs and to some extent QB. Their has been big time WR/RB/TE in the mid rounds and the ravens haven't drafted them. Even this year we drafted a blocking TE in Glimore in the 3 round? He ran about a 4.9 at the combine. I am pretty sure you could have got him later. I wish I could draft skill players for the Ravens and let them handle the trench players because they got no swag at drafting those positions lol.

[Purple Punishment]

One major tangible in your draft correction is Coaching and Development. Therein lies the issue. Dickson may have had more potential than Jimmy Graham, but our coaching staff didn't make it happen. I'm just saying that the players themselves don't develop by themselves. Difference coaching, different fundamentals. It all may have been different

[K-Dog]

One major tangible in your draft correction is Coaching and Development. Therein lies the issue. Dickson may have had more potential than Jimmy Graham, but our coaching staff didn't make it happen. I'm just saying that the players themselves don't develop by themselves. Difference coaching, different fundamentals. It all may have been different

Very valid point.

One other thing to consider is the team its self. Look at Justin Forsete. Lackluster with three ( ? ) other teams. Gets with us and becomes explosive.

[Tenacious Faulker]

Another thing about N if L discussions like this is that one change causes a string of events that have ramifications down the time line.  For instance:  If the Ravens decided to forgo Boller and drafted Vince Wilfork we may never have draft Haloti Ngata.  Who does he take in 2006 then?  Jonathan Joseph, Tamba Hali, Chad Greenway, Antonio Cromartie, Santonio Holmes, and Nick Mangold where all taken soon after Ngata.  It's possible that Ozzie still takes Ngata as a pure BPA, but he wouldn't be necessary.  

 

Its one thing to say "we could've taken this guy" but "who" would they have ended up taking without using the benefit of history since then.  It's impossible to be certain, but still fun.

[Tenacious Faulker]

Very valid point.

One other thing to consider is the team its self. Look at Justin Forsete. Lackluster with three ( ? ) other teams. Gets with us and becomes explosive.

It's all opportunity.  Forsett was drafted along with Ray Rice - Forsett in the 7th, Rice in the 2nd.  The Ravens took RB Patrick Allen in the 7th too and I don't remember much about him.  Forsett was always a good but used as a b/u and as a change of pace guy -- never a feature back on any team he was on because of his size.  Even here, that was his role until the Rice issue and Pierce's injury.  He finally got his chance to prove he can carry the load and its been great so far.  Even Rice, similar in size in 2008, was a part time starter oin a 3 back committee.

[mgridda]

One major tangible in your draft correction is Coaching and Development. Therein lies the issue. Dickson may have had more potential than Jimmy Graham, but our coaching staff didn't make it happen. I'm just saying that the players themselves don't develop by themselves. Difference coaching, different fundamentals. It all may have been different

 

Absolutely a valid point that others have alluded to as well. I think Tom Brady would have done well no matter where he went. When people describe Brady's nature and how good he was just from the jump, I get an idea of this. I think it clicked for Brady somewhere in college, so he matured late but after that he was really an elite Quarterback with little opportunity. Brady went to the Patriots, who had an amazing defense and a clutch kicker. He would have had the exact same thing with the Ravens. Ozzie Newsome, not sure if you guys know this, was one of Belichick's guys in Cleveland before getting the GM job here. We're one of few teams that due our own scouting and have all these young 20 year old assistants working 80 hour weeks making 20,000 a year. That's a belichick thing. Of course, on the coaching platform a guy like Billick and a guy like Belichick are different.

 

But I think Billick could have succeeded with Tom Brady. 

 

I also think Ozzie doesn't draft need, and would have jumped at the opportunity to have both Wilfork and Ngata. My point is that if we drafted good guys earlier in this exercise, like say Steve Smith, Tom Brady, TJ Houshmandzadeh, then we'd be drafting in the bottom 5 almost every year, which would mean we wouldn't draft high enough to have guys like Suggs or Ngata. However, I think we would still be able to scoop down and get the guys in rounds 2-7 like Brandon Marshall, Antonio Brown, Richard Sherman, Mike Wallace, etc

 

 

==

[mgridda]

Ultimately, we can learn two things from this exercise:

 

1) We can see the cost of trading up, in looking at what we missed by nabbing Travis Taylor and Kyle Boller. 

2) Some of the best players in the NFL at their position were drafted rounds 3-5.

3) We can review what we were thinking when we drafted Marcus Smith, Harper, Derrick Martin, Demetrius Williams, etc instead of valuing guys like Brandon Marshall, Antonio Brown, TJ Houshmandzadeh or Cortland Finnegan or Richard Sherman. Or Vincent Jackson instead of Dan Cody.

 

 

Imagine if along with Ray, Suggs, Ngata we had, in 2014 WRs like this (after Welker and Marshall went on to play elsewhere):

 

WR: Anquan Boldin

WR: Steve Smith Sr.

WR: Torrey Smith

WR: Victor Cruz (IR)

WR: Antonio Brown

WR: Devin Hester

 

and CBs that look like this:

 

CB: Richard Sherman

CB: Jimmy Smith (IR)

CB: Brandon Browner

NB: Lardarius Webb

DB: Brent Grimes

CB: Tamon Williams

[gabefergy]

Impressive amount of work put into that compilation, but the draft is such a crapshoot. There is no way to know what players will definitely pan out and which ones won't at the time of the draft. A lot of players considered "safe" picks still go on to be complete busts. It's really easy to look back and see what could have been, and I don't really think there is anything that can be gleaned from this exercise other than the realization that even the best GMs and scouts get it wrong at an awfully high rate.

[rmw10]

Impressive amount of work put into that compilation, but the draft is such a crapshoot. There is no way to know what players will definitely pan out and which ones won't at the time of the draft. A lot of players considered "safe" picks still go on to be complete busts. It's really easy to look back and see what could have been, and I don't really think there is anything that can be gleaned from this exercise other than the realization that even the best GMs and scouts get it wrong at an awfully high rate.

 

Yep.  For every Antonio Brown and Richard Sherman that is found late, there are hundreds of Jason Phillips and Davon Drews.  It's how the draft works.

[orangle123]

The only two that get me are the Sherman pick (which I agree, I think we got greedy and thought he would drop) and the B Marshal pick, which boggles my mind.  Unless we were worried about character...  I'm a part time bears fan, and I love watching him do work.  I also am pretty surprised at the Jimmy Graham pick, I wonder if we thought "Well he can't block, and we're smash mouth, so let's go with Dickson!" lol

[gabefergy]

The only two that get me are the Sherman pick (which I agree, I think we got greedy and thought he would drop) and the B Marshal pick, which boggles my mind.  Unless we were worried about character...  I'm a part time bears fan, and I love watching him do work.  I also am pretty surprised at the Jimmy Graham pick, I wonder if we thought "Well he can't block, and we're smash mouth, so let's go with Dickson!" lol

Sherman - we already drafted 2 CBs in that draft. It would have been nice to take him over a guy like Chykie Brown, but Sherman wasn't a very highly rated player. His measurables were good in terms of size, but his speed and quickness were questionable and apparently the Stanford coaching staff did not speak well of him. That is something that scouts spend a lot of time on and if the coaches are somewhat down on him it says a lot.

 

Brandon Marshall also had some character concerns and was a very raw prospect coming from an unheralded school. There were questions about what position he would play, was he fast enough to play WR? He really had a rough go of it for the first 6-7 years he was in the NFL. Even if the Ravens drafted him do you think he would still be on the team? I doubt it.

 

Jimmy Graham was an incredibly raw talent ( there is a theme here among the players you mentioned). He was a converted basketball player with very little football experience. He was all about the measurables, and if you look at Dickson when he was a collegiate player there was a lot to like. He was a lot more polished prospect.

 

These are three perfect examples of how the scouting process is very hit and miss. Getting back to 2011 for example, how many people on this board were pining for Jon Baldwin? Size and Speed! Well he went in the first round and was a complete bust. I was high on Titus Young that year, and while he had some moments on the football field he was also a complete nutjob.

[rmw10]

 

These are three perfect examples of how the scouting process is very hit and miss. Getting back to 2011 for example, how many people on this board were pining for Jon Baldwin? Size and Speed! Well he went in the first round and was a complete bust. I was high on Titus Young that year, and while he had some moments on the football field he was also a complete nutjob.

 

I was also very high on Titus Young, and while I knew about the character concerns, there was no way any of us knew he'd turn out how he did.

 

 

 

At the end of the day, the GMs, coaches, and other execs have so much more information than we do.  There's definitely a reason for why we took some guys over others.  We'll never know, but I find it hard to question the staff when we don't have near as much information at our disposal.  It doesn't always work, but as has been alluded to many times in this thread, there's no telling whether some of these stars would have reached their full potential here.  The draft is a complete crapshoot in the later rounds, and even a bit in the early rounds.