Is Joe Flacco Becoming a Good QB?

[3-4ravdef509]

First, what you call a good play by the defender and a wr mistake could be your opinion. I think the throw to Torrey last week was a bad throw and decision and I don't know which play your talking about where the defender made a good play. You can say Torrey should fight to break it up and I can say he shouldnt have made that throw with that coverage. Next, I'm not calling him a turnover machine, but I would like for there to be less picks. Isn't this suppose to be a quick read offense meant to cut down on interceptions? If that's the case, why is he on pace for his about his career average? That's all I meant by wanting less picks. I also understand performances dipping when facing different levels of competition, but the fluctuation is way to high for my liking. Also, those 2 turnovers in the previous game cost us 10 points.

The interception where the defender made a good play was the second int against the Falcons. Guy came off his guy because of film study watching the qb andandandde the pick, when that's most likely a touchdown otherwise.

Everybody knows the other pick against Atlanta was all Torrey.

One against the Browns he got pummeled and ball floated up in the air.

Torrey got jammed and hit in the head stopping his route leading to an interception.

I agree the other pick to Torrey wasn't a good decision, but other times Joe has fit balls into tight Windows like that and succeeded, so sometimes you gamble and I'm fine with that.

Other pick to Torrey against Colts was all on Joe.

The other one against the Bengals week 1 was Joe's.

That's three picks that he could have avoided, 4 that they only way he avoids is by not throwing the ball, which is silly because he gets paid to throw the ball, receivers get paid to make plays on those throws.

And defenders get paid to make plays, sometimes they will win. It happens.

If you're expecting him to somehow throw less picks he'd have to throw the ball considerably less, or the surrounding cast had to step up

[MrPlankton]

The interception where the defender made a good play was the second int against the Falcons. Guy came off his guy because of film study watching the qb andandandde the pick, when that's most likely a touchdown otherwise.

Everybody knows the other pick against Atlanta was all Torrey.

One against the Browns he got pummeled and ball floated up in the air.

Torrey got jammed and hit in the head stopping his route leading to an interception.

I agree the other pick to Torrey wasn't a good decision, but other times Joe has fit balls into tight Windows like that and succeeded, so sometimes you gamble and I'm fine with that.

Other pick to Torrey against Colts was all on Joe.

The other one against the Bengals week 1 was Joe's.

That's three picks that he could have avoided, 4 that they only way he avoids is by not throwing the ball, which is silly because he gets paid to throw the ball, receivers get paid to make plays on those throws.

And defenders get paid to make plays, sometimes they will win. It happens.

If you're expecting him to somehow throw less picks he'd have to throw the ball considerably less, or the surrounding cast had to step up

Out of Flacco's 7 INTs, 5 of them have been when throwing to Torrey Smith.

[3-4ravdef509]

Out of Flacco's 7 INTs, 5 of them have been when throwing to Torrey Smith.

In fairness two or three of those were more on Joe then Torrey, but Torrey didn't do a good job fighting for or coming back for the ball

[The Raven]

Out of Flacco's 7 INTs, 5 of them have been when throwing to Torrey Smith.

 

This says a lot. How many picks came targeting Daniels, Smith Sr, or Pitta... aka the reliable targets?

[3-4ravdef509]

This says a lot. How many picks came targeting Daniels, Smith Sr, or Pitta... aka the reliable targets?

Think other two were to Daniels and juice

[1/28/01]

Stats aren't everything, but he's on pace for:

* Touch over 4k yards

* 28 TDs (due to a 5TD game, otherwise it would be around 22-24 TDs)

* 14 INTs

And all of that with a pretty stout oline, good run game and on pace for just 18 sacks.

He's good, not great.

[3-4ravdef509]

Stats aren't everything, but he's on pace for:

* Touch over 4k yards

* 28 TDs (due to a 5TD game, otherwise it would be around 22-24 TDs)

* 14 INTs

And all of that with a pretty stout oline, good run game and on pace for just 18 sacks.

He's good, not great.

Would agree that he is regular-season good, but you have to admit at the very least he's great in the postseason

[jazz1988]

Oh you misinterpret me if you think that I want the situation that Matt Ryan has. I think the situation we have Flacco in, and the team we have around him is good. However, where we are lacking is at quality receiving weapons. I don't mean to say that he needs top tier number one draft pick talent, but someone that can run a simple slant route against man coverage besides an aging 35-year-old receiver, and maybe some tight ends second stay on the field for more than four games a season would be nice as well. The trouble right now is that against any team with good cornerbacks like we've seen twice against the Bengals and once against the Colts, our passing game can be shut down quite effectively because our receivers can't beat man coverage. And without healthy tight ends to attack the middle of the field, we see how easy the Bengals defense was able to shut down Flacco. His first two reads were always covered, and by the time he's able to get to his third or fourth ones, even the best of offensive lines are going to break down in pass coverage by then.

Also, you're really not earning any points here with being rude and just deciding that you're going to ignore the entirety of someone's post well engaging in a debate with them. It's against proper decorum, and makes me not want to even give you the time of day. I take the time to read the entirety of your posts, respond to the entirety of them, and take time out of my day to form my responses. You could return the courtesy by reading the entire thing and responding accordingly.

 

I really don't understand why they are having trouble with beating man coverage so much . I first thought it was because our previous offense just suck at getting our receiver open or that maybe our previous receiver coach Jim Hostler wasn't good at teaching them how to run routes and etc but I guess they just not physical enough. I would think our new receiver coach Bobby Engram would help our  receiver alot as route runners especially with the help of  Steve Smith but it doesn't seem like it has translated yet but this is their first year here and stuff like this doesn't  happens over nite.

[Moderator 3]

From today's Late For Work:

Torrey An ‘Interception Magnet’

Quarterback Joe Flacco has seven interceptions this season. And five of those came on passes intended for receiver Torrey Smith, including two last Sunday in Cincy.

“In a span of a year, [Torrey Smith] went from Flacco's top target to an interception magnet,” wrote Hensley.

Those five interceptions are tied with Cowboys wide receiver Dez Bryant in terms of targeting a receiver.

The five picks came on just 42 passes thrown to Smith, while Flacco only threw two interceptions while throwing 237 passes to the rest of his receivers. Flacco and Smith have connected on just 46.2 percent of targets.

“There has been a disconnect with Flacco and Smith a year after Smith led the Ravens with 65 receptions,” Hensley wrote.

[3-4ravdef509]

I really don't understand why they are having trouble with beating man coverage so much . I first thought it was because our previous offense just suck at getting our receiver open or that maybe our previous receiver coach Jim Hostler wasn't good at teaching them how to run routes and etc but I guess they just not physical enough. I would think our new receiver coach Bobby Engram would help our  receiver alot as route runners especially with the help of  Steve Smith but it doesn't seem like it has translated yet but this is their first year here and stuff like this doesn't  happens over nite.

 

Torrey just isn't made to be a physical receiver. Steve is physical but small. Brown seemingly just isn't that good at route running to get open consistently, honestly Companaro and Aiken have looked more promising at times but Camp got hurt and Aiken did drop a touchdown and his timing was a bit off or Flacco over threw him on one play.

 

From today's Late For Work:

Torrey An ‘Interception Magnet’

Quarterback Joe Flacco has seven interceptions this season. And five of those came on passes intended for receiver Torrey Smith, including two last Sunday in Cincy.

“In a span of a year, [Torrey Smith] went from Flacco's top target to an interception magnet,” wrote Hensley.

Those five interceptions are tied with Cowboys wide receiver Dez Bryant in terms of targeting a receiver.

The five picks came on just 42 passes thrown to Smith, while Flacco only threw two interceptions while throwing 237 passes to the rest of his receivers. Flacco and Smith have connected on just 46.2 percent of targets.

“There has been a disconnect with Flacco and Smith a year after Smith led the Ravens with 65 receptions,” Hensley wrote.

 

Again, two or three of em can't really be put on Torrey, Joe threw way off target on the one against the Colts, the first one, though Torrey could have come back to the ball and he didn't, was a throw into I think triple coverage. Another one Joe was hit as he threw. But it stands to say Torrey is part of the problem on offense.

[frozen joe flacco fan]

C'mon people! Your back & forth banter is beating a dead horse. Kamar Aiken has to catch the ball Joe

threw right at him in the end zone on 4th & 1. It was an accurate throw and was thrown intentionally

low so that only he could catch it. It was similar to the throw Joe made to Michael Campanero who

caught the ball in the middle of the field. We can have honest disagreements whether the Ravens

should have gone for it on 4th & goal from the one yard line and the play call but we cannot debate

why the play failed. Kamar Aiken dropped a certain TD just like Evans had a ball jarred loose on an accurate TD throw to him two years ago. The simple answer to the original post in this thread is NO.

Joe isn't becoming a good QB. He's been a good QB for 5 years and like a fine wine he's getting

better with age. As one post correctly pointed out, he's on the verge of becoming an elite QB, no

matter how any of you define "elite." There are only 5 QBs that are better than Joe at this moment in time. They are Rodgers, P. Manning, Brees, Brady and Rothlisberger. That's it! Lastly, how many of

the afore-mentioned elite QBs could make the throw to Steve Smith that Joe made when the game was on the line? The answer is easy --- Zero. Cool Joe has a cannon! A 62 yard throw on the run! Wow! Double wow!! Wake up & smell some roses! Until & unless The so-called "Wizard of Oz" drafts some weapons of mass destruction like other teams have, Joe's greatness will go unheralded.

[ravens rule]

Define "awesome". Wins / QB Rating / yards/attempt?

Games where he played solid. No dumb turnovers. Doesn't have to be 5 Tds. I am talking  statistics and also the eye test.

[Inqui]

Aaron Rodgers would be the one..

If I needed a game winning drive like that, I'd rather have flacco than peyton

I'd take Andrew Luck and maybe Drew Brees, but I agree with your sentiment.

[Dfence4champs2052]

I think Joe is a good QB, well above average BUT there is something holding him back. He has flashed glimpses of brillance, but he just can't seem to sustain it. I wish he could. He has a SB and MVP under his belt and the whole winnning agument is very solid. I'm ready for statistics now. I know he is who he is, but anyone that says they don't look at what Roethlisberger did Sunday and not long for that is an outright liar! I want stats and I think Joe's ceiling is way higher than Ben's. The point isn't about Ben though it's just I'd like to see him do better statically AND we keep winning.

[Dfence4champs2052]

I'd take Andrew Luck and maybe Drew Brees, but I agree with your sentiment.

 

I think Rodgers is the better argument because both the two you named are 4th quarter INT throwers. Granted at the end of the day I'm taking Drew Brees over anyone not named Manning, Brady or Rodgers.

[codizzle]

I'd take Andrew Luck and maybe Drew Brees, but I agree with your sentiment.

Didn't add both of those just cause I don't see anything in those last minute drives that would make me want them over flacco

Let me see a little more of Luck in those situations especially postseason and yea I would prolly add him because he's a monster

[GrimCoconut]

I'd only take Aaron and Andrew over Joe. Wouldn't take Brees (35), Brady (37) or Manning (38). They're all much older now and are entering or have entered the twilight of their careers. Joe, while inconsistent, has time left in the league. Those guys may not necessarily have that luxury. Between the three of them, they're 110 years! Lol. 

[1/28/01]

I'd only take Aaron and Andrew over Joe. Wouldn't take Brees (35), Brady (37) or Manning (38). They're all much older now and are entering or have entered the twilight of their careers. Joe, while inconsistent, has time left in the league. Those guys may not necessarily have that luxury. Between the three of them, they're 110 years! Lol.

At 38, I'd trade Flacco for Manning in a second. He still has 2-83 good years left in him. Its scary how good he is at 38.

[codizzle]

At 38, I'd trade Flacco for Manning in a second. He still has 2-83 good years left in him. Its scary how good he is at 38.

Na.. If you wanna factor in cap hit

Even if not then I'd still say no

[GrimCoconut]

At 38, I'd trade Flacco for Manning in a second. He still has 2-83 good years left in him. Its scary how good he is at 38.

I understand why you say that. I would just rather have longevity than a guy who might be here another 2 years in the league.

[The Mom Gene]

I'd take Andrew Luck and maybe Drew Brees, but I agree with your sentiment.

I'm not even taking Drew Brees....  He's been inconsistent at all get out all season long....  We are over-reacting again...  The only guy I like if we are going to look at this scenario, is Rodgers.... and MAYBE... Luck.

[The Mom Gene]

Would agree that he is regular-season good, but you have to admit at the very least he's great in the postseason

Absolutely.

[1/28/01]

I'm not even taking Drew Brees.... He's been inconsistent at all get out all season long.... We are over-reacting again... The only guy I like if we are going to look at this scenario, is Rodgers.... and MAYBE... Luck.

Maybe Luck? Oh man, we'd be fools if in this hypothetical world we get offered Luck straight up for Flacco and we don't take it.

[beanfigger]

Maybe Luck? Oh man, we'd be fools if in this hypothetical world we get offered Luck straight up for Flacco and we don't take it.

 

I think you may be mixing conversations. This was not talking straight up trade, but a certain scenario.

[The Mom Gene]

Maybe Luck? Oh man, we'd be fools if in this hypothetical world we get offered Luck straight up for Flacco and we don't take it.

We were just discussing QB's that were better than Joe.....  I'm personally glad we have Flacco....  I will wait and hold my judgement until I see what he does in the next couple of years....  after he wins a playoff game.  People were saying the same thing about Romo.

[codizzle]

Maybe Luck? Oh man, we'd be fools if in this hypothetical world we get offered Luck straight up for Flacco and we don't take it.

This part of convo was only about scenario I mentioned not the entire player hence the hold off on Luck

Well at least thats why I didn't take luck here.. Overall yea.. I'd take luck in a heartbeat but

in scenario I mentioned in needing a drive like Sundays 57 seconds no timeouts..

I'd rather have flacco

[1/28/01]

I think you may be mixing conversations. This was not talking straight up trade, but a certain scenario.

My bad...I blame it on my kids.

[3-4ravdef509]

We can all agree if we need a hail Mary pass to win the game, Flacco is the man

[beanfigger]

We were just discussing QB's that were better than Joe..... I'm personally glad we have Flacco.... I will wait and hold my judgement until I see what he does in the next couple of years.... after he wins a playoff game. People were saying the same thing about Romo.

I can respect that, and I agree, but he did win a playoff game already. Just to keep it fair.

[The Mom Gene]

I can respect that, and I agree, but he did win a playoff game already. Just to keep it fair.

(a)...  Flacco has won how many????  9 and a Super Bowl?  If you wanna keep it fair.