Let's talk about Pernell McPhee

[gabefergy]

McPhee has had an up and down career so far with the Ravens, beginning with an impactful rookie season that was followed by a couple of injury riddled years in which his production dropped.

 

He is currently listed as an OLB on the depth chart, but he plays all over the DL and is capable of being a very productive pass-rusher all over as well.

 

I think he deserves some recognition for the work he is putting in, and I'm also curious about what the Ravens do with him in the future. He will be our most valuable FA IMO, and I really hope the Ravens resign him in the off-season. I think it's possible to bring him in for a reasonable contract considering his numbers aren't amazing, but his value is greater to the team than what the numbers might suggest. I would love to sign him to a 4 year deal in the $15-18 million range. I think that is a fair deal, although if his pressures start turning into sacks he could be worth quite a bit more on the open market. I would try to extend him now if possible.

[GrimCoconut]

I think that's a fair deal but I don't think he'll take an extension at this point. I think he'll try the open market. That's just my guess though.

[The Raven]

Agreed. I'd like to get him extended now. He and Upshaw are possibly the future bookends, especially if we transition toward that 4-3 front. He's had a great start to this season, and he's sort of flown under the radar. He's been dominant.

[The Raven]

I think that's a fair deal but I don't think he'll take an extension at this point. I think he'll try the open market. That's just my guess though.

 

If he was smart he would. Guarantee some DE needy team would pay him big bucks to play in a 4-3.

[GrimCoconut]

Agreed. I'd like to get him extended now. He and Upshaw are possibly the future bookends, especially if we transition toward that 4-3 front. He's had a great start to this season, and he's sort of flown under the radar. He's been dominant.

I think he would be a terrific fit with the Bears it Buccaneers. I'd even throw the Cowboys in there but I think their money goes to Bryant. His coverage isn't great but it's decent. He's a great fit for a 4-3 front.

[izvoodoo]

If he was smart he would. Guarantee some DE needy team would pay him big bucks to play in a 4-3.

Yeah, God made McPhee to rotate in a 4-3

[The Raven]

I think he would be a terrific fit with the Bears it Buccaneers. I'd even throw the Cowboys in there but I think their money goes to Bryant. His coverage isn't great but it's decent. He's a great fit for a 4-3 front.

 

I was actually thinking Vikings if their young guys don't pan out.

 

Now that you mention it, Tampa Bay is a perfect fit. Penetrating Tampa 2 and it's close to home. He'd be silly not to go if they wanted him.

[gabefergy]

I don't know why you guys don't think he would want to stay here. He is used creatively and is making an impact. Maybe the Ravens won't want to pay him, but with how thin they are going to be on the DL and the age of the OLBs it makes sense for him to stick around unless he gets paid a lot on the open market,

[rmcjacket23]

Two words... he gone.

[Gordo52]

Agreed. He's arguably been our most productive pass rusher so far this season. His versatility makes him even more valuable. I love the way Pees has been using him pretty much everywhere. Yesterday he was a constant force.

I think he'll test the market but I really hope we're able to resign him. Wouldn't surprise me to see him get a nice contract though if he keeps this pace up.

[GrimCoconut]

I don't know why you guys don't think he would want to stay here. He is used creatively and is making an impact. Maybe the Ravens won't want to pay him, but with how thin they are going to be on the DL and the age of the OLBs it makes sense for him to stick around unless he gets paid a lot on the open market,

I think he would want to stay here but you have to wonder if he'll be fine with the pay he'll likely receive. I think he'll give us a chance but I wouldn't fault him for chasing the money if he did. I think he could get around $5M on the open market.

[gabefergy]

I think he would want to stay here but you have to wonder if he'll be fine with the pay he'll likely receive. I think he'll give us a chance but I wouldn't fault him for chasing the money if he did. I think he could get around $5M on the open market.

Maybe, but I think that would be the ceiling of what he gets. He just doesn't have the numbers to command a really big contract. I would hope the Ravens know his worth better than anyone and give him $5M a year if that's what it takes.

[rmcjacket23]

Maybe, but I think that would be the ceiling of what he gets. He just doesn't have the numbers to command a really big contract. I would hope the Ravens know his worth better than anyone and give him $5M a year if that's what it takes.

Dumervil, who granted is older, got just over $5M a season with pretty small amounts of guaranteed money. McPhee has basically never been a starter, has about 4 sacks in the last two seasons, and has never been anything more than a situational role player.

 

He MIGHT get that money from a desperate team, but I doubt it, and he certainly won't get that money from us. I think he leaves for less than that, and likely goes to play somewhere where he has a better opportunity at starting and at playing time.

[gabefergy]

Dumervil, who granted is older, got just over $5M a season with pretty small amounts of guaranteed money. McPhee has basically never been a starter, has about 4 sacks in the last two seasons, and has never been anything more than a situational role player.

 

He MIGHT get that money from a desperate team, but I doubt it, and he certainly won't get that money from us. I think he leaves for less than that, and likely goes to play somewhere where he has a better opportunity at starting and at playing time.

I think if the Ravens offer him at somewhere between the $4-5M range he will stay, and I think that is a reasonable number for what he brings to the table.

[rmcjacket23]

I think if the Ravens offer him at somewhere between the $4-5M range he will stay, and I think that is a reasonable number for what he brings to the table.

I certainly don't... I think he's worth maybe half of that. I'm not even really sure what he brings to the table.

 

At the $4-5M range for a non-every down player, he better be getting to the QB a LOT more than he is right now.

 

But I think this is all moot, because I doubt we will have $4-5M a year available to give to a guy like him anyway.

[gabefergy]

I certainly don't... I think he's worth maybe half of that. I'm not even really sure what he brings to the table.

 

At the $4-5M range for a non-every down player, he better be getting to the QB a LOT more than he is right now.

 

But I think this is all moot, because I doubt we will have $4-5M a year available to give to a guy like him anyway.

I think you are vastly underrating what he does, and by your own admission have no clue what he brings to the table. He is the most versatile player on our defense and consistently pressures QBs no matter where he is lined up. He is absolutely worth $4-5 million a year.

[BmoreBird22]

I think you are vastly underrating what he does, and by your own admission have no clue what he brings to the table. He is the most versatile player on our defense and consistently pressures QBs no matter where he is lined up. He is absolutely worth $4-5 million a year.

According to PFF, he has one hurry on the left side and no hits. He has six hurries and two hits on the right. His pass rushing productivity on the left is fifth lowest (2.2) and lowest amongst those that registered a productivity rating, but on the right, he has the highest grade (15.2). He has two interior hurries.

[rmcjacket23]

I think you are vastly underrating what he does, and by your own admission have no clue what he brings to the table. He is the most versatile player on our defense and consistently pressures QBs no matter where he is lined up. He is absolutely worth $4-5 million a year.

And that would be true... if he's an every down player. $4-5M for a situational pass rusher, who is currently and has been playing less than half the defensive snaps, is awfully steep, and is essentially a likely unaffordable luxury item for a team like the Ravens.

 

I know that if he brought as much to the table as you seem to think he does, he'd be playing a lot more than 45% of the snaps...

[Static]

I think you are vastly underrating what he does, and by your own admission have no clue what he brings to the table. He is the most versatile player on our defense and consistently pressures QBs no matter where he is lined up. He is absolutely worth $4-5 million a year.

 

Most versatile is Upshaw but Mcphee does alot for us. I could tell in preseason he was different this year he has crazy ability to get consistent pressure.  I fear someone will pay him to be their premium pass rusher. 

[rmcjacket23]

Most versatile is Upshaw but Mcphee does alot for us. I could tell in preseason he was different this year he has crazy ability to get consistent pressure.  I fear someone will pay him to be their premium pass rusher. 

That, I guarantee, will not happen.

[gabefergy]

And that would be true... if he's an every down player. $4-5M for a situational pass rusher, who is currently and has been playing less than half the defensive snaps, is awfully steep, and is essentially a likely unaffordable luxury item for a team like the Ravens.

 

I know that if he brought as much to the table as you seem to think he does, he'd be playing a lot more than 45% of the snaps...

Well he has played 130 out of 255 snaps, so he is over 50% of the snaps. And that is not that far different than other OLBs for the Ravens. Suggs has played 178, Dumervil 142, and Upshaw at 130. There is clearly a rotation of players and he has been very good in that rotation. It's failry common for defensive line players to rotate.

[gabefergy]

Most versatile is Upshaw but Mcphee does alot for us. I could tell in preseason he was different this year he has crazy ability to get consistent pressure.  I fear someone will pay him to be their premium pass rusher. 

Upshaw is not lining up at DT and getting pressure on the QB. McPhee is doing that well.

[rmcjacket23]

Well he has played 130 out of 255 snaps, so he is over 50% of the snaps. And that is not that far different than other OLBs for the Ravens. Suggs has played 178, Dumervil 142, and Upshaw at 130. There is clearly a rotation of players and he has been very good in that rotation. It's failry common for defensive line players to rotate.

I had him at 45% through week 3, didn't have the week 4 numbers yet.

 

Fully aware of how defensive players rotate, and fully aware of what it takes to get $4-5M as a pass rusher in this league. It takes more than 50% of the snaps, and it takes more than being the 3rd situational pass rusher on a defense.

 

He's going to have to have a Paul Kruger-like season if he's going to get paid and treated like a top-end pass rusher in this league. I don't see that happening.

[rmcjacket23]

And remember, this entire argument is predicated on the Ravens even having $4-5M to spend on a situational player, which I doubt they will. They are already likely to face some significant and challenging salary cap decisions in the coming offseason, and needless to say, resigning McPhee probably won't be a priority.

 

There are other key personnel that need to be addressed first.

[gabefergy]

I had him at 45% through week 3, didn't have the week 4 numbers yet.

 

Fully aware of how defensive players rotate, and fully aware of what it takes to get $4-5M as a pass rusher in this league. It takes more than 50% of the snaps, and it takes more than being the 3rd situational pass rusher on a defense.

 

He's going to have to have a Paul Kruger-like season if he's going to get paid and treated like a top-end pass rusher in this league. I don't see that happening.

I don't know what numbers you are looking at, but 4-5M a year is not top-end pass rusher numbers. That's the range that rotational, but productive players get.

 

Erik Walden: 4 years, 16 million

 

Jarret Johnson: 4 years, 19 million

 

Willie young: 3 years, 9 million

 

William Hayes: 3 years, 10.25 million

 

Manny Lawson: 4 years, 12 million

 

Chris Clemons: 4 years, 17.5 million

 

McPhee has the added ability to line-up at DT which only adds to his value, but as you can see the numbers I suggest are pretty much right in line with comparable players.

[gabefergy]

And remember, this entire argument is predicated on the Ravens even having $4-5M to spend on a situational player, which I doubt they will. They are already likely to face some significant and challenging salary cap decisions in the coming offseason, and needless to say, resigning McPhee probably won't be a priority.

 

There are other key personnel that need to be addressed first.

Like who exactly? The only other "key" personnel that is set to be a FA is Torrey Smith, and right now I would think McPhee is bringing more value to the team than Smith is. 

[rmcjacket23]

Like who exactly? The only other "key" personnel that is set to be a FA is Torrey Smith, and right now I would think McPhee is bringing more value to the team than Smith is. 

Well, for starters, if we make no additions or subtractions, we'd probably be about $10M over the salary cap as it is.

 

Ngata will require an extension or get cut, as likely will somebody like Yanda. Jimmy Smith would be in the final year of his deal, and Torrey needs a new deal. And that excludes the fact that most of the "bigger" deals aren't really releasable, as most of them are new. In short... I'd expect money to be tight as it is.

 

The idea that McPhee brings more value than Torrey is simply laughable to me, because all that would be is an overreaction to Torrey's slow start this season. Nobody thought McPhee brought more value to the Ravens than Torrey ANYTIME in the past three seasons, yet they've been here for the exact same amount of time. Frankly, the Ravens could find a Pernell McPhee in the draft next year if they really wanted to. Finding anybody to replace Torrey, even with as little statistical production he's having right now, is a lot more difficult.

 

There isn't a guy on that bench that can do half of what Torrey does. There's already at least two guys on the roster who do what McPhee does, and arguably better than he does (and they are both locked into long term contracts).

 

Just an overreaction at this point.

[rmcjacket23]

I don't know what numbers you are looking at, but 4-5M a year is not top-end pass rusher numbers. That's the range that rotational, but productive players get.

 

Erik Walden: 4 years, 16 million

 

Jarret Johnson: 4 years, 19 million

 

Willie young: 3 years, 9 million

 

William Hayes: 3 years, 10.25 million

 

Manny Lawson: 4 years, 12 million

 

Chris Clemons: 4 years, 17.5 million

 

McPhee has the added ability to line-up at DT which only adds to his value, but as you can see the numbers I suggest are pretty much right in line with comparable players.

Several of those players are either every down linebackers or not pass rushing specialists at all (Jarret Johnson).

[PuRock]

Personally I would really like to see McPhee stay here as well.  He's a very versatile piece on our defense and his arrow is pointing up.  Would like to see him get even more snaps.  He's that type of magnet player where he always seems to be around the play causing havoc.  

 

But I can see the reasoning as to why he would leave.  He's always been kind of a second thought (or even third/fourth thought) when it comes to our defense.  I think he could find more money and a better opportunity to make himself a household name elsewhere.  

[ravensdan]

I don't know what numbers you are looking at, but 4-5M a year is not top-end pass rusher numbers. That's the range that rotational, but productive players get.

Erik Walden: 4 years, 16 million

Jarret Johnson: 4 years, 19 million

Willie young: 3 years, 9 million

William Hayes: 3 years, 10.25 million

Manny Lawson: 4 years, 12 million

Chris Clemons: 4 years, 17.5 million

McPhee has the added ability to line-up at DT which only adds to his value, but as you can see the numbers I suggest are pretty much right in line with comparable players.

I agree with you on McPhee. I was thinking of posting something similar about resigning him. The other thing about these numbers no one seems to be taking into account is the cap has stayed relatively flat, but as evidenced by many deals coming out this season many forward thinking teams realize the cap is going up exponentially over the next several years. Not small increments.

As for his value to the team the inside rushing and his overall versatility is extremely valuable. I believe the ravens will recognize this. And I expect him to be a key contributor the test of the year.