terrence brooks

[Ravenseconbeast]

Not really true. Brook only spent 1 week with the 3rd team, not a large portion of camp. Since about half way through the 2nd week of Camp he has been running with the 2nd team defense. When I went out to camp two weeks ago he was running with the 2nd team and because we rotate so much actually played with some of the first team guys. From what I hear he's moved pasted Levine and Miles, not just as a Nickle Back, but as a S as well.

Imo the biggest thing that sets Stewart apart is his familiarity with the NFL, Brooks just isn't as familiar with the speed of the game right now. Much like Huff and Elam last year, Stewart isn't a lock to be the guy. Brooks has the talent and skill set to raise his level to the guys he's playing against and around. I feel if he's exposed to 1st team reps, he won't fall back down imo. But of course we'll see.

Brooks has been struggling hardcore. He belongs with the #2/#3s. But considering his a 3rd rounder, they'll give him the spot by default.

[Ravensfan23]

Brooks has been struggling hardcore. He belongs with the #2/#3s. But considering his a 3rd rounder, they'll give him the spot by default.

The Ravens don't give any rookie a key role by default of there draft status. If that were the case Brandon Williams as a 3rd pick wouldn't have only seen action in 5 games last year. They would have just gave him snaps.

Also Brooks has been struggling hardcore how?

[BmoreBird22]

Am I the only one who honestly sees the FS spot as Will Hill's and that Brooks will be switching over to cornerback due to prior experience and overall thin depth

[rmw10]

Am I the only one who honestly sees the FS spot as Will Hill's and that Brooks will be switching over to cornerback due to prior experience and overall thin depth

 

I never thought Will Hill would step in immediately, but I thought he'd eventually work his way into being a starter if he stays clean.  However, I'm beginning to question that.  Even though he's suspended, if we thought of him as a serious option to play a significant role, he'd be getting more than a few snaps on the 3rd team D.

[BmoreBird22]

I never thought Will Hill would step in immediately, but I thought he'd eventually work his way into being a starter if he stays clean.  However, I'm beginning to question that.  Even though he's suspended, if we thought of him as a serious option to play a significant role, he'd be getting more than a few snaps on the 3rd team D.

How much of that do you think had to do with him being unfamiliar with the playbook and then the Ravens not wanting to give up valuable snaps to a player who won't be around for six weeks?

I don't think it's unreasonable for him to work his way into the starting role after they bye week. He's ultra talented, but was unfamiliar with the offense and by the time games rolled around, why give him first team reps over players who need to get chemistry with each other?

[rmw10]

How much of that do you think had to do with him being unfamiliar with the playbook and then the Ravens not wanting to give up valuable snaps to a player who won't be around for six weeks?

I don't think it's unreasonable for him to work his way into the starting role after they bye week. He's ultra talented, but was unfamiliar with the offense and by the time games rolled around, why give him first team reps over players who need to get chemistry with each other?

 

But how else do you really know what you have in him?  He can't practice for 6 weeks so we won't be able to see anything there either.

 

I understand the whole reps argument as well, but you'd think he'd at least get some sort of looks against some actual NFL competition.  As long as he stays clean, I do think there's a roster spot open for him after his suspension.  I'm just not seeing it as a significant role at this point in time.

[BmoreBird22]

But how else do you really know what you have in him?  He can't practice for 6 weeks so we won't be able to see anything there either.

 

I understand the whole reps argument as well, but you'd think he'd at least get some sort of looks against some actual NFL competition.  As long as he stays clean, I do think there's a roster spot open for him after his suspension.  I'm just not seeing it as a significant role at this point in time.

It's very possible that he's showed enough against the third stringers and the Ravens are relying on his past tape with the Giants to guide them. They may be relying on Spags and his connections back to the Giants. 

 

It's also very possible the Ravens want to keep him for one year to see if he can stay clean and out of trouble, then re-sign him and incorporate him more next season.

[rmw10]

It's very possible that he's showed enough against the third stringers and the Ravens are relying on his past tape with the Giants to guide them. They may be relying on Spags and his connections back to the Giants. 

 

It's also very possible the Ravens want to keep him for one year to see if he can stay clean and out of trouble, then re-sign him and incorporate him more next season.

 

The latter is more of what I'm expecting.  He'll come back from suspension and play in a ST and deep rotational role.  If he stays clean all year, we'll look at re-signing him (he's an RFA) and let him battle it out next year.

[BmoreBird22]

The latter is more of what I'm expecting.  He'll come back from suspension and play in a ST and deep rotational role.  If he stays clean all year, we'll look at re-signing him (he's an RFA) and let him battle it out next year.

I would wholeheartedly expect him to win any battle the Ravens have and then just move Terrance Brooks to cornerback.

[ravensdan]

If he stays clean hill will be starting in the late season push and playoff games. He's more talented than any safety on the team. It's not really close.

[gabefergy]

If he stays clean hill will be starting in the late season push and playoff games. He's more talented than any safety on the team. It's not really close.

Yup, Hill is going to end up being a starter for us if he stays clean. I'm fairly confident about that sentiment. The question is when? He can't play preseason snaps with the 1's because we have players that are going to have to start for at least 6 games, and they have work to do still.

Will Hill was the ultimate no risk, high reward signing. Once he gets back from the suspension he will be given an opportunity, and if his talent hasn't washed up he's going to force himself into meaningful playing time. He's just a better player than Stewart and Brooks at this point.

[Ravensfan23]

Yup, Hill is going to end up being a starter for us if he stays clean. I'm fairly confident about that sentiment. The question is when? He can't play preseason snaps with the 1's because we have players that are going to have to start for at least 6 games, and they have work to do still.

Will Hill was the ultimate no risk, high reward signing. Once he gets back from the suspension he will be given an opportunity, and if his talent hasn't washed up he's going to force himself into meaningful playing time. He's just a better player than Stewart and Brooks at this point.

 

I really don't get the whole preseason snaps thing. Ok I understand why you might not get him first team reps, but Hill didn't get onto the field until 9:49 left in the 4th quarter. The only guys still on the field who even had a shot at making the team were the other Safeties still rotating in, Jacobs and Simon. I just don't see the treatment of a guy the team expects to be a starter right now. Can he be one later? of course, but if he was in the plans like many suggest, I think he would have at least gotten quality snaps with guys he'll be actually playing with. Again Asa Jackson played a lot with the 2nd team defense last year even though he was gonna be suspended the first 6 games.

 

I can't say what the coaches thinking is with Will Hill, but right not it doesn't look like the treatment of a guy you expect to contribute much.

[BmoreBird22]

I really don't get the whole preseason snaps thing. Ok I understand why you might not get him first team reps, but Hill didn't get onto the field until 9:49 left in the 4th quarter. The only guys still on the field who even had a shot at making the team were the other Safeties still rotating in, Jacobs and Simon. I just don't see the treatment of a guy the team expects to be a starter right now. Can he be one later? of course, but if he was in the plans like many suggest, I think he would have at least gotten quality snaps with guys he'll be actually playing with. Again Asa Jackson played a lot with the 2nd team defense last year even though he was gonna be suspended the first 6 games.

 

I can't say what the coaches thinking is with Will Hill, but right not it doesn't look like the treatment of a guy you expect to contribute much.

The Ravens are going to likely be relying on a heavy rotation of three safety sets this year, so getting all the safeties involved who could possibly play a role this year could be keeping Hill off the field

[KBoum]

I really don't get the whole preseason snaps thing. Ok I understand why you might not get him first team reps, but Hill didn't get onto the field until 9:49 left in the 4th quarter. The only guys still on the field who even had a shot at making the team were the other Safeties still rotating in, Jacobs and Simon. I just don't see the treatment of a guy the team expects to be a starter right now. Can he be one later? of course, but if he was in the plans like many suggest, I think he would have at least gotten quality snaps with guys he'll be actually playing with. Again Asa Jackson played a lot with the 2nd team defense last year even though he was gonna be suspended the first 6 games.

 

I can't say what the coaches thinking is with Will Hill, but right not it doesn't look like the treatment of a guy you expect to contribute much.

 

you got that point but the only explanation I see is that Asa Jackson was fighting for his roster spot last year, they could have cut him and be done with him so they wanted to test him out. I really don't think they'll cut Will Hill his spot is pretty safe so far and I'm sure he'll be added on the roster after his suspension.

 

training camp on offense is to get in synch and run the playbook and things like that. On defense its all about making the right reads/plays, beating your man 1 on 1. They don'T gameplan at all on defense they test players. You wanna test this UDFA CB, cover 0 man to man him and see how he responds. 

 

So I think they don't wanna test Hill because they know what they got in him and they got other safeties fighting for their roster spot so they wanna give all the reps to them. 

 

Oh and you mentioned John Simon, I really liked the pick but it'll be hard for him to make the team. Hasnt impressed much so far. Lets hope he can be a great ST player

[Ravensfan23]

The Ravens are going to likely be relying on a heavy rotation of three safety sets this year, so getting all the safeties involved who could possibly play a role this year could be keeping Hill off the field

 

That's even more reason to allow him to play. If you are rotating guys, it's easier to get Hill involved. If it were a position like oline where you don't rotate as much I could see getting 1 guy a lot of reps over another. However you are running a bunch of 3 safety sets and this guy who is supposed to be a big part of your defense at some point only gets reps with Omar Brown?

 

 

you got that point but the only explanation I see is that Asa Jackson was fighting for his roster spot last year, they could have cut him and be done with him so they wanted to test him out. I really don't think they'll cut Will Hill his spot is pretty safe so far and I'm sure he'll be added on the roster after his suspension.

 

training camp on offense is to get in synch and run the playbook and things like that. On defense its all about making the right reads/plays, beating your man 1 on 1. They don'T gameplan at all on defense they test players. You wanna test this UDFA CB, cover 0 man to man him and see how he responds. 

 

So I think they don't wanna test Hill because they know what they got in him and they got other safeties fighting for their roster spot so they wanna give all the reps to them. 

 

Oh and you mentioned John Simon, I really liked the pick but it'll be hard for him to make the team. Hasnt impressed much so far. Lets hope he can be a great ST player

 

 

Do they really know what they have in Will Hill. This guy is only 24 years old, has played for 2 seasons, started 10 games and had some success. He doesn't know our system, isn't familiar with how things are run and lets be honest, still needs to prove he can consistently play at a high level in the NFL. That's like Marlon Brown getting suspened and the Ravens saying oh based off his success last season we know what we got. I just don't buy that. Will Hill is talented no doubt but you are talking about the Ravens and Harbs who makes everyone compete and all of a sudden this guy gets special treatment because we know what we got with him? I can't see it.

 

If anything you make compete with your starters or top backups and truly see what you got. You don't just look at a guy's performance from another team and say, oh yea we know he'll be great for us. I doesn't work that way. Again I like Hill and based off his success last year and our current options at FS, he's certainly the better option right now and his suspension sucks. I get how and way you wouldn't give him a ton of reps because of his situation but you at least want to get him familiar and as comfortable as possible with the guys you hope he'll play around.

 

The most important thing from a defense in preseason or otherwise is communication. Getting comfortable hearing the guy you will be taking calls from. Getting familiar with how certain guys play. Who likes to play off coverage, who likes to press, when this call is made, how will this guy play it opposed to that guy. All this is important for a FS and even if Hill isn't an option for the first 6 games, he's only a 3 year player that is still developing himself. I get the impression that people think he's a seasoned vet. No, he's a young player that was seemingly coming into his own last year, but how many times have we seen a player have one great year and fall? No way are the Ravens banking on his talents alone, nothing about our history suggest that. imo

[BmoreBird22]

That's even more reason to allow him to play. If you are rotating guys, it's easier to get Hill involved. If it were a position like oline where you don't rotate as much I could see getting 1 guy a lot of reps over another. However you are running a bunch of 3 safety sets and this guy who is supposed to be a big part of your defense at some point only gets reps with Omar Brown?

Not necessarily. Right now, Hill is out for six games. That's six games he won't contribute. They're looking for the immediate contributors and right now, the two biggest competitors are Jeromy Miles and Terrance Brooks. Right there, that's four safeties  competing for major roles on the defense in Elam, Miles, Stewart, and Brooks. No need to hinder their progress for a player who won't be available for the first six weeks. 

 

I know you're not really buying into the whole past experience because it's a new system, but you have to consider that he is getting familiar with the system just by being in training camp and by even being with the threes. He's getting reps and learning the playbook. On some level, that's really big. He was also there just a year after Spags left and I'd imagine Spags still has really good connections over there with the Giants coaching staffs to get recommendations and help vouch for the guy. He definitely wasn't cut for talent.

 

I'm not saying any of this is true, but I am trying to throw out every possible scenario. I'm starting to buy into the possibility that he is here for the one year to prove he can stay clean, get re-signed in the offseason, and then be the starter next year.

[acranfor]

From hunting the web for more analytical articles over strictly opinionated, I have found the following which do a pretty good breakdown of our safety (namely FS) situation:

 

http://baltimoresportsandlife.com/baltimore-ravens/22-breakdown-ravens-free-safeties-part-ii-multiple-part-series/

http://baltimoresportsandlife.com/baltimore-ravens/22-breakdown-ravens-free-safeties-part-iii-welcome-will-hill/

http://baltimoresportsandlife.com/baltimore-ravens/22-breakdown-ravens-free-safeties-part-iv-expect-terrence-brooks/

 

Summary is that Stewart is a strong safety and does not have the skills to play true Cover 1 or Cover 3 free safety. With Stewart and Elam on the field, we will have to play a lot of Cover 2 with both Elam and Stewart having deep zone responsibilities. This does not optimize the skill set of either of them. The best way to optimize Elam's skill set is to have a single deep Free safety with Elam focusing on responsibilities close to the line - coverage or run support. He is still not able to do this which is why he has had a quiet off-season. Looks like things will not really change for Elam this year until we get Will Hill involved or Brooks breaks out.

[gabefergy]

I really don't get the whole preseason snaps thing. Ok I understand why you might not get him first team reps, but Hill didn't get onto the field until 9:49 left in the 4th quarter. The only guys still on the field who even had a shot at making the team were the other Safeties still rotating in, Jacobs and Simon. I just don't see the treatment of a guy the team expects to be a starter right now. Can he be one later? of course, but if he was in the plans like many suggest, I think he would have at least gotten quality snaps with guys he'll be actually playing with. Again Asa Jackson played a lot with the 2nd team defense last year even though he was gonna be suspended the first 6 games.

 

I can't say what the coaches thinking is with Will Hill, but right not it doesn't look like the treatment of a guy you expect to contribute much.

Did you not hear Pees heaping praise on him? It doesn't make any sense to start him in the preseason when the secondary is a mess right now. Players who are actually going to be playing for the first 6 weeks haven't looked great, so the priority is to get them comfortable.

 

He will start this year, because the Ravens need him to. He can do much more on the back-end then Stewart and Brooks is barely seeing any time at safety because of the CB situation.

[5aiah]

From hunting the web for more analytical articles over strictly opinionated, I have found the following which do a pretty good breakdown of our safety (namely FS) situation:

 Looks like things will not really change for Elam this year until we get Will Hill involved or Brooks breaks out.

I think it ends up being even more important than that. Not only will Elam not be as efficient but this secondary won't stand a chance come clutch/playoff time unless we get a true FS. In a year where the Pats and Broncos are the only true contenders in the AFC, yet could easily fall apart in the playoffs this would be a waste. Not that the Saints/Seahawks/Niners/Packers are likely to lose to an AFC team anyway. 

[Static]

Can we all calm down about Will Hill. He has done literally nothing in a purple uniform.

[Sami84]

i watched will hill last year and he was EASILY the best DB the giants had all season. He was awesome. The 2nd ranking in PFF was no fluke. If he stays out of trouble..when hes back on game 6 or 7 we have a top 10 FS in the league. He really is very very good.

[BmoreBird22]

From hunting the web for more analytical articles over strictly opinionated, I have found the following which do a pretty good breakdown of our safety (namely FS) situation:

 

http://baltimoresportsandlife.com/baltimore-ravens/22-breakdown-ravens-free-safeties-part-ii-multiple-part-series/

http://baltimoresportsandlife.com/baltimore-ravens/22-breakdown-ravens-free-safeties-part-iii-welcome-will-hill/

http://baltimoresportsandlife.com/baltimore-ravens/22-breakdown-ravens-free-safeties-part-iv-expect-terrence-brooks/

 

Summary is that Stewart is a strong safety and does not have the skills to play true Cover 1 or Cover 3 free safety. With Stewart and Elam on the field, we will have to play a lot of Cover 2 with both Elam and Stewart having deep zone responsibilities. This does not optimize the skill set of either of them. The best way to optimize Elam's skill set is to have a single deep Free safety with Elam focusing on responsibilities close to the line - coverage or run support. He is still not able to do this which is why he has had a quiet off-season. Looks like things will not really change for Elam this year until we get Will Hill involved or Brooks breaks out.

These are pretty good, but I don't like how he breaks down just one play and almost makes it seem as if that one play is true for everything.

I don't agree with his entire assessment. Stewart isn't a liability in deep coverage, IF he's in a two high shell. He's got good instincts and awareness deep to make plays, but he doesn't have the speed or range to do it in a single high look.

He's not someone you want in man coverage. Just a liability because of a lack of lateral quickness and speed. He's definitely at his best when playing underneath coverage.

Good run defender, but way too many missed tackles

[Corvus]

Can we all calm down about Will Hill. He has done literally nothing in a purple uniform.

This. As others have said, Hill is an exceptional low risk high reward type of guy and he is no doubt one of our most talented safeties on paper but that's just it. Huff was still a solid safety his last year on a bad Oakland team and look at how he dropped off. Not at all saying Hill is the same seeing as how much younger he is but we as fans know next to nothing about him as a Raven. I'm intrigued by what he could bring to the team too but really he should be a total after thought to fans until week 7. Besides, who is to say that Stewart or Brooks won't really seize the starting job in the first six weeks. As others have said, we likely may play 3 safeties quite a bit this year but I don't see them just giving Hill the starting job if the scenario I've mentioned occurs. Lots of ifs on both sides of this debate which is why I'm reserving any further speculation on Hill.

[Sami84]

This. As others have said, Hill is an exceptional low risk high reward type of guy and he is no doubt one of our most talented safeties on paper but that's just it. Huff was still a solid safety his last year on a bad Oakland team and look at how he dropped off. Not at all saying Hill is the same seeing as how much younger he is but we as fans know next to nothing about him as a Raven. I'm intrigued by what he could bring to the team too but really he should be a total after thought to fans until week 7. Besides, who is to say that Stewart or Brooks won't really seize the starting job in the first six weeks. As others have said, we likely may play 3 safeties quite a bit this year but I don't see them just giving Hill the starting job if the scenario I've mentioned occurs. Lots of ifs on both sides of this debate which is why I'm reserving any further speculation on Hill.

 

 

Just going by my eye test. Its like when we signed Daryl Smith. I said he was legit.

 

Will Hill is legit. Ask Giant fans.

[Ravensfan23]

Not necessarily. Right now, Hill is out for six games. That's six games he won't contribute. They're looking for the immediate contributors and right now, the two biggest competitors are Jeromy Miles and Terrance Brooks. Right there, that's four safeties  competing for major roles on the defense in Elam, Miles, Stewart, and Brooks. No need to hinder their progress for a player who won't be available for the first six weeks. 

 

I know you're not really buying into the whole past experience because it's a new system, but you have to consider that he is getting familiar with the system just by being in training camp and by even being with the threes. He's getting reps and learning the playbook. On some level, that's really big. He was also there just a year after Spags left and I'd imagine Spags still has really good connections over there with the Giants coaching staffs to get recommendations and help vouch for the guy. He definitely wasn't cut for talent.

 

I'm not saying any of this is true, but I am trying to throw out every possible scenario. I'm starting to buy into the possibility that he is here for the one year to prove he can stay clean, get re-signed in the offseason, and then be the starter next year.

 

oh what you say definitely makes sense and I'm not saying you're wrong in what you say. What I'm saying is I just don't believe the Ravens are as sold on Hill being the definitely starter once he returns at some point. If either Brooks or Stewart really takes hold of that position they aren't just gonna be pushed aside just because Hill is active. He hasn't proven anything "with the Ravens" to suggest that.

 

However if things stay like they are right now, then I too believe he'll have a hellava shot to take over that FS position because none of our guys are really impressing at FS.

[Ravensfan23]

Did you not hear Pees heaping praise on him? It doesn't make any sense to start him in the preseason when the secondary is a mess right now. Players who are actually going to be playing for the first 6 weeks haven't looked great, so the priority is to get them comfortable.

 

He will start this year, because the Ravens need him to. He can do much more on the back-end then Stewart and Brooks is barely seeing any time at safety because of the CB situation.

 

A coach heaping praise on a player, yea I heard it and hear it every year. Did you hear the praise Doss got last year from practice? How'd that work out. Did you hear the praise that was heaped on Jensen from OTAs.

 

Again Hill is the only true FS on the team as Brooks is still developing into the position and Stewart is better suited for a SS imo, so it makes sense that he flashed in practice a few days. BTW who said start him in the preseason. I never once said start him, I said rotate him in. Which I don't see what the big deal is. Oh Jeremy Miles will miss out on 1-2 series while Hill plays and that's gonna ruin things? Right now Miles is no different from a guy like Jacobs so the same 3rd team reps Jacobs gets, Miles could get and develop.

 

Seems to make prefect sense to allow Hill to play around the guys he'll eventually be playing with. At least the backups. Again we are talking about a guy who has started 10 games in his NFL career. That's far too small a sample size for the Ravens to bank for him for anything imo. If you are not playing him it's because you don't see him as a big part of your plans. You know he'll be suspended for 6 games and you hope once he returns he can contribute in someway, you don't bank on him to be your Starter which it seems most of you guys are doing.

[dhstandard]

huff didnt have a learning curve like elam did, he is a longtime vet who was just really, really bad when he came to baltimore for some reason. and i agree with what you said about brooks, he may not be ready now, but thats why he needs those reps, because with enough exposure to playing against starters could get him enough familiarity to bypass stewart, he simply is more talented than stewart and the only thing holding him back is those valuable reps, something stewart doesnt need because he is a veteran with plenty of experience, throw brooks out there with the 1s for tonight and the 3rd preseason game, by the end of preseason week 3 we should have seen plenty and the team should know at that point whether he is ready to play or not, and if he isnt ready, put stewart in there, he knows the speed of the game and reps are simply not as important to him.

 

It really isn't.  I hate preseason mainly because people over-analyze everything.  I don't know if you played a lot of sports, but those reps are just not going to make or break him.  If he was good enough he would be running with the first team.  He is not. 

 

I doubt our coaches would impede the development of a player just to win a few games early in the season.  Shoving him in with the starters in a couple preseason games won't change anything.   

[BmoreBird22]

oh what you say definitely makes sense and I'm not saying you're wrong in what you say. What I'm saying is I just don't believe the Ravens are as sold on Hill being the definitely starter once he returns at some point. If either Brooks or Stewart really takes hold of that position they aren't just gonna be pushed aside just because Hill is active. He hasn't proven anything "with the Ravens" to suggest that.

 

However if things stay like they are right now, then I too believe he'll have a hellava shot to take over that FS position because none of our guys are really impressing at FS.

Most people are basing it off the situation as it stands right now. If Brooks came flying out of the gates and absolutely caught fire and was doing everything, no way he gets pushed out. But, if things are the way they are now, Hill is likely to start.

I am of the belief that Brooks will spend his rookie season at cornerback

[The Raven]

Can we all calm down about Will Hill. He has done literally nothing in a purple uniform.

 

Are we not allowed to be excited about a player with a boatload of potential? C'mon now.... 

[SecretAgentMan]

Are we not allowed to be excited about a player with a boatload of potential? C'mon now....

Especially one who's had proven sucess on the NFL level?