Best QB in the league?

[Pats]

I still have no clue why people think peyton is the best, if i'm rating QB's i'm rating them on how well they do in clutch positions and if they can do well in the post season. And peyton did that only once when the colts won it every other time I have never seen him show up.

[ravensdan]

When people are placing him as the 5th best QB in the league and are already calling him a potential HOFer, I consider that being anointed.

I think there's a pretty huge difference between the fifth ranked QB which I could see and a hall of famer. Which I wouldn't even consider for another decade.

[ravensdan]

I still have no clue why people think peyton is the best, if i'm rating QB's i'm rating them on how well they do in clutch positions and if they can do well in the post season. And peyton did that only once when the colts won it every other time I have never seen him show up.

Actually Peyton really didn't play well in the playoffs that year. The defense played out of their minds.

[Pats]

Actually Peyton really didn't play well in the playoffs that year. The defense played out of their minds.

Exactly although I can attribute the comeback against the patriots mainly to him, and also that both defenses were crushed during the game.

[ratedr]

How long should people wait until that's ok in your book? And where do you rank him? I'm just curious, this is not an argument.

He's no higher than 7th in my opinion. Big Ben and Rivers are definitely better. 

[beanfigger]

He's no higher than 7th in my opinion. Big Ben and Rivers are definitely better.

That's fair. Five and seven aren't that far apart, though, that I'd call him the most overrated QB because some people mention him there.

[flynismo]

I don't know what he is being "anointed" with. I haven't heard anyone place him above Rodgers and Manning and the like. Just mentioning his name as one of the best in the league is not too far of a stretch for me. I love the excuses for his playoff wins already. I guess I should expect that on these boards, considering the constant Flacco debates. Luck has led countless game-winning drives in his first two years. He has done so with a mediocre defense and virtually no running game. He doesn't need to apologize to anyone for his accomplishments, as far as I'm concerned. It's not like the early years with Big Ben or Flacco where they only passed when absolutely necessarily, and the team could win when he played terribly.

 

 

Luck was not all that good as a rookie. He had some last second come from behind wins, but the guy threw 18 picks and completed 54% of his passes....which may explain why they were come-from-behind wins and not blowouts. I'll take Flacco's first two years over his.

[flynismo]

I still have no clue why people think peyton is the best, if i'm rating QB's i'm rating them on how well they do in clutch positions and if they can do well in the post season. And peyton did that only once when the colts won it every other time I have never seen him show up.

If that's the only criteria, then Flacco has to be either #1 or #2 playing today. I don't think even Flacco's biggest supporters would say he is the best QB in the NFL

[flynismo]

How long should people wait until that's ok in your book? And where do you rank him? I'm just curious, this is not an argument.

Do you think it's reasonable to call a QB with two years in the NFL a potential HOF? I mean guys like McNair and Warner did incredible things over their entire careers spanning 10+ years in the league, things that Luck can only hope to accomplish, and they are considered fringe HOF prospects.

[ratedr]

Luck was not all that good as a rookie. He had some last second come from behind wins, but the guy threw 18 picks and completed 54% of his passes....which may explain why they were come-from-behind wins and not blowouts. I'll take Flacco's first two years over his.

Agreed. He was the 3rd best QB in his class his rookie season. And even now I'm not totally convinced he's ahead of Russell Wilson.

[redrum52]

Exactly, the more I read about his system the more I think that contributes to his success rather than the other way around. I think he has plenty of traits that put him a tier. Same with Brees, good QB but if I'm a Saints fan I'd rather lose Brees than Payton. Brees is a good QB with the right supporting cast and the best system for him - and an example of what Joe can be if he ends up in similar circumstances.

 

I get what you're saying, but I think you're underestimating Brees.  He might be the most accurate qb in the league.  His placement is insane.  He makes receivers jobs real easy.  Brees still did well without Peyton.  The defense I think though was the worst in the league which Brees had no control over.

[redrum52]

Agreed. He was the 3rd best QB in his class his rookie season. And even now I'm not totally convinced he's ahead of Russell Wilson.

He's been asked to do the most for his team.  You have to give that to him.  Russell and I think Dalton came into pretty good situations.  The Colts had huge turnover personnel wise.  They don't have a great defense and the run game is hit or miss.  Look no further than trading a 1st for Richardson to show you how desperate they are at rb.  You gotta give Luck some credit.

 

 

Brady isn't the most accurate, but he doesn't need to be because the system plays to his strengths. I strongly disagree with your assessment of Brees' accuracy, though. I actually think that is one of his strongest characteristics.

 

Like I said in another post, he might be the most accurate qb in the league.  I feel like Brees is constantly ignored in the best qb comment.  Not that he doesn't get credit but people usually over look him.  He's like the Meg of the top 4.

[beanfigger]

Do you think it's reasonable to call a QB with two years in the NFL a potential HOF? I mean guys like McNair and Warner did incredible things over their entire careers spanning 10+ years in the league, things that Luck can only hope to accomplish, and they are considered fringe HOF prospects.

People say things like that all the time. I hardly think he's called hall of Famer Andrew Luck on a regular basis. I never said it, and I certainly never said anything about him being above Flacco on my list. I just think it's reasonable to mention his name among the best. There are no other QBs drafted the last six years who I think can even be considered, so it's exciting to see at least someone who may be worthy from that span. His first two years are very similar to Peyton's, only with much more team success. To look at him among the top 25% of the league is perfectly reasonable. Players come and go from that list (Eli, Palmer), so what's the harm in just mentioning his name? I think it's unreasonable to make some hard and fast rule about how long each player has to be in the league before consideration because each individual is completely unique. Luck throws a pretty ball, is among the best running QBs in the league, and does this annoying thing where he wins a bunch. Most teams would die for a QB like that.

[Pats]

If that's the only criteria, then Flacco has to be either #1 or #2 playing today. I don't think even Flacco's biggest supporters would say he is the best QB in the NFL

Well not really, he did have that very good post season when the ravens won it but other than that I wouldn't call him the most clutch QB ever. But even that post season alone I would call him better than manning purely because he got it all done when it mattered and he played a hugeee part in the ravens winning the superbowl by playing fantastic.

[flynismo]

I get what you're saying, but I think you're underestimating Brees.  He might be the most accurate qb in the league.  His placement is insane.  He makes receivers jobs real easy.  Brees still did well without Peyton.  The defense I think though was the worst in the league which Brees had no control over.

I'm not even sure if that is debatable. His placement and touch is out of this world. If he could put some velocity on his throws, he'd be unstoppable

[flynismo]

Well not really, he did have that very good post season when the ravens won it but other than that I wouldn't call him the most clutch QB ever. But even that post season alone I would call him better than manning purely because he got it all done when it mattered and he played a hugeee part in the ravens winning the superbowl by playing fantastic.

Well, far be it from me to argue with a fan of another team who actually gives Flacco credit....a lot of our own fans dont even do that!

 

All things considered, I put Flacco at #5 -- the usual suspects are the guys I put ahead of him (Brady, Manning, Rodgers and Brees)

[Pats]

Well, far be it from me to argue with a fan of another team who actually gives Flacco credit....a lot of our own fans dont even do that!

 

All things considered, I put Flacco at #5 -- the usual suspects are the guys I put ahead of him (Brady, Manning, Rodgers and Brees)

Yeah if I want a QB to win it all for me first players i'm picking are brady,rodgers and post season flacco. Russell wilson may not have pretty stats but I feel he doesn't make many mistakes and manages the game pretty well and has the option to run as well which makes him pretty nifty.

[ravensdan]

Yeah if I want a QB to win it all for me first players i'm picking are brady,rodgers and post season flacco. Russell wilson may not have pretty stats but I feel he doesn't make many mistakes and manages the game pretty well and has the option to run as well which makes him pretty nifty.

Many don't realize outside of his one Super Bowl winning run Rodgers packers have not won in the playoffs....

09 - one and done wild card loss to Arizona

10- Super Bowl run

11 - one and done divisional to New York

12 - wild card win over Minnesota, divisional loss San fransisco

13 - one and done wild card loss San Francisco.

Why does Rodgers get a pass????

[ravensdan]

Best active QB playoff records?

Big Ben 10-4

Joe flacco 9-4

Eli 8-3

[beanfigger]

I'm not even sure if that is debatable. His placement and touch is out of this world. If he could put some velocity on his throws, he'd be unstoppable

 

Yeah, someone earlier said he wasn't accurate. Give me a break. It isn't that hard to see Brees excels there.

[beanfigger]

Best active QB playoff records?

Big Ben 10-4

Joe flacco 9-4

Eli 8-3

 

One issue with that is that Brady, though his percentage might not be as high, has the record for playoff wins. He deserves a mention due to that. Also, Wilson is now 4-1, but it is early for him to be mentioned on this list. Finally, Eli's 8 wins came in his two championship years. That means he is only 0-3 the other 8 years combined, with 5 no-shows in the postseason. People that claim Flacco's run is a fluke should just look at these facts.

[ravensdan]

Yeah, someone earlier said he wasn't accurate. Give me a break. It isn't that hard to see Brees excels there.

Almost all of his picks are either under extreme duress or trying to fit a ball into an opening most would never try to complete. Which btw is what all of these championship caliber QBs have in common. Although both manning and Brady have become less of risk takers which I believe is a direct correlation to their not winning as many postseason games as they once did. Once you get to the playoffs those higher risk throws you have to complete because the opponents are so much better while the higher percentage lower risk offense for a great QB brings the gawdy regular season won/lost records.

[Pats]

Many don't realize outside of his one Super Bowl winning run Rodgers packers have not won in the playoffs....

09 - one and done wild card loss to Arizona

10- Super Bowl run

11 - one and done divisional to New York

12 - wild card win over Minnesota, divisional loss San fransisco

13 - one and done wild card loss San Francisco.

Why does Rodgers get a pass????

Because we also take into account that sometimes your team around you gives you no help and it's hard to win games when that happens, but peyton has purely given away many games and thrown pick sixs a plenty among other things in the playoffs a lot. Hell brady left the field with the lead in both superbowls with the giants and the defense couldnt hold on for a little longer and that's hardly his fault and we don't put it against him for not winning the game.

[RavensDE]

Rogers

[ravensdan]

Because we also take into account that sometimes your team around you gives you no help and it's hard to win games when that happens, but peyton has purely given away many games and thrown pick sixs a plenty among other things in the playoffs a lot. Hell brady left the field with the lead in both superbowls with the giants and the defense couldnt hold on for a little longer and that's hardly his fault and we don't put it against him for not winning the game.

I don't know... I ranked Rodgers one because I believe from a talent stand point he pretty much does everything. But after looking closer at these playoff losses yes there are a couple shoot outs in there but don't we give Brady , Ben and joe even Eli credit when they win those playoff games?

[Pats]

I don't know... I ranked Rodgers one because I believe from a talent stand point he pretty much does everything. But after looking closer at these playoff losses yes there are a couple shoot outs in there but don't we give Brady , Ben and joe even Eli credit when they win those playoff games?

Yeah we do because they control the offense so if they score a lot of points or end the game with the lead or with barely any time left then they have done there jobs well, the defense doing its job is out of their control. Would you call joe flacco a bad QB because his O-line was garbage last season?

[PerpetuallyBored74]

Many don't realize outside of his one Super Bowl winning run Rodgers packers have not won in the playoffs....

09 - one and done wild card loss to Arizona

10- Super Bowl run

11 - one and done divisional to New York

12 - wild card win over Minnesota, divisional loss San fransisco

13 - one and done wild card loss San Francisco.

Why does Rodgers get a pass????

 

Green Bay's defenses have been awful recently, their running game before they got Lacy was pretty bad too and Rodgers has been victimized by drops from his receivers at the worst times in some of those playoff games, most notoriously with at least 6 drops against the Giants in 2011.

Hard to beat a great team when you're the only one who is playing great.

 

As you can see by his playoff performances, Rodgers is not the reason they keep falling short.

(click to enlarge the picture)

 

[George70]

My top three are Flacco, Peyton Manning and Nick Foles - just because they have done so well.