who still believes trading boldin was a bad idea?

[RobFuseRaven]

If you look just at the trade Boldin for a 6th. Yeah loser trade and if he walked this year we possibly could have got a 4th in comp pick. All around tho we were able to sign other players to fill gaps which we still have going into this year. In hindsight not a bad trade but also not a very good one either. Call it even.

 

We used the 6th round pick to move up and get Arthur Brown, so it can't be that bad.

[Ravenseconbeast]

It'll only be an issue if the same putrid offense shows up again.   I said it from the beginning before boldin was ever traded that it was going to hurt us.   He did a lot of little things other receivers just will not do and do well.    

 

That said, i think we got a great season and a glimpse of serious optimism about where our offense is headed.   We will all find out by end of 2014.   This is going to be either a genius move or another spiral of  doom for ravens offense.

[harfordravenfan]

We got Steve Smith... I'm over it and ready to move on

[Ravenslifer]

I don't think the problem was ever trading away Q - if we hadn't done it we couldn't have rebuilt the defense the way we did and everyone would be upset about that.  It's that you trade a former pro bowler who was a top 20 lock before a poor 40 time dropped him in his draft class, and then you expect to replace him with a 4th round pick and have no drop off in production.  And I never counted Dennis as Q's replacement - we needed Q, Dennis and Torrey to win, so it never seemed to work to me that we could replace Q with Dennis' production and somehow the combo of Tandon Doss and Ed Dickson would fill the 2012 Dennis role.  As much as I like Arthur Brown, we could have had Keenan Allen, and then I don't think this would be a question.  As it is, I expect for this year anyway that Steve Smith will do just as well as Q would have done for us.

[gabefergy]

I was just happy to get a draft pick for him. He was about to be released. I know he had a "good" season in SF, but he was still the same player, SF just utilized him better. There were still games last year where he was completely taken away.

 

In the end, it all comes down to the money. Trading him allowed us to retool the defense, and while the offense was crap last year, our defense would have been that much worse without guys like Doom and Canty. 

[The Mom Gene]

It'll only be an issue if the same putrid offense shows up again.   I said it from the beginning before boldin was ever traded that it was going to hurt us.   He did a lot of little things other receivers just will not do and do well.    

 

That said, i think we got a great season and a glimpse of serious optimism about where our offense is headed.   We will all find out by end of 2014.   This is going to be either a genius move or another spiral of  doom for ravens offense.

We have a completely different offense, so I wouldn't even begin to think that "the same" offense shows up.

[ravensnick]

I think the main problem wasn't getting rid of Boldin, it was then having Jacoby and Pitta get hurt and see Boldin tear it up.

[ravensnick]

I don't. It had to be done. It's not the reason we had a mediocre season. If we had an oline. We were a playoff team.

It's inconviniet that we didn't have a WR of his caliber, but we did get steve smith to replace him.

And for those who believe "only a sixth rounder". If Ozzie could get any more, he would've. It was a lot better than flat out cutting him. As a matter of fact ANY GM would've taken the higher offer. No GM is that stupid

If we beat the bengals in the last game, we were going to the playoffs. Imagine that.

[PurpleCityLights]

It's all moot anyways since there's a high likelihood that he would have walked in FA this offseason. We weren't going to pay $6M for an aging receiver that never surpassed 1,000 yards here, especially with all of the other FAs we had to worry about. The point is that he's gone, he wasn't the difference in us winning a Super Bowl last year or not, and he allowed us to bring in some new players, although some didn't work out. I said at the time that it happened that it was the right move and I'm sticking by that. From a personal standpoint, it sucked. From a business standpoint, the move had to be made. Too many people made it personal and not business related.

It wasn't his fault not getting over 1k yards here, John & Cams system sucked. No way you can look at what Q is doing with the 49ers & say hes not worth the money.......People keep saying get over it, how I can't wait till its time to say bye bye to Flacco just so I can see the people on this site cry me a river.

[rmw10]

It wasn't his fault not getting over 1k yards here, John & Cams system sucked. No way you can look at what Q is doing with the 49ers & say hes not worth the money.......People keep saying get over it, how I can't wait till its time to say bye bye to Flacco just so I can see the people on this site cry me a river.

 

Please read my response again.  Boldin was not the difference between us and a championship last year.  If we had kept him, he would have signed elsewhere this offseason.  Instead, we got a few nice defensive pieces that we wouldn't have signed otherwise.  I'll say it again.  Get over it.  He's gone.  It's been over a year.

[GrimCoconut]

There's a lot that goes into this. It's more than just "was this the right move" because as others stated, even if he was here last year I don't necessarily think he would've helped us win the Super Bowl. Our offensive line never did it's job and more importantly we never got hot. I blame the coordinator more than anything.

As for what Boldin helped us get, eh. I don't know. I suppose you could say the writing was on the wall for Huff, who Oakland fans told us wasn't very good. Ozzie messed up there. Then we signed DT from the Cowboys, Marcus Spears, whom we cut as well during the season.

Not that those two broke the bank but they definitely were a poor use of funds in hindsight. But the bottom line remains that we wouldn't have gone much if any further with Boldin than we did without. So, we got a draft pick out of it and some more players. Not bad at all.

I was fine with the trade and honestly, after Marlon had his shot, I'm glad. I don't Brown would've had much of a shot of real experience if he stayed.

[descent into the maelstrom]

I've moved on from the Boldin trade, but to respond to the original topic, no I don't think it was a good idea.  From the responses I've seen it seems like people thought it was either Boldin or Doom + Canty + Arthur Brown + Daryl Smith + Michael Huff and whomever else.  I just don't buy that we wouldn't have picked up anyone worth having on defense had we signed Boldin.  Plus, everyone is acting like we are a great playoff team this year and we're not even to preseason yet.  All we truly have is an 8-8 record from last year and having missed the playoffs.  I think Boldin would have been enough to make one or two close losses into wins, and that in turn would have been enough to get us into the playoffs.  Once there, no I don't think we would have won a Super Bowl, but I would rather find that out by playing Peyton "biggest choker under pressure in history" Manning in January than sitting at home and watching Seattle take advantage of his choker status.  Boldin was crucial to our Super Bowl win and, as a reward, he was asked to take a massive pay cut.  I am very happy we got that 6th rounder for him, given the alternative of cutting him.  Still, I think we were a playoff team with him and that is far better than 8-8 and talking about a bunch of great defensive additions, all of whom watched the Super Bowl on tv. 

Rant over, glad to have our team healthy going into the preseason!

[display name]

There's a lot that goes into this. It's more than just "was this the right move" because as others stated, even if he was here last year I don't necessarily think he would've helped us win the Super Bowl. Our offensive line never did it's job and more importantly we never got hot. I blame the coordinator more than anything.

As for what Boldin helped us get, eh. I don't know. I suppose you could say the writing was on the wall for Huff, who Oakland fans told us wasn't very good. Ozzie messed up there. Then we signed DT from the Cowboys, Marcus Spears, whom we cut as well during the season.

Not that those two broke the bank but they definitely were a poor use of funds in hindsight. But the bottom line remains that we wouldn't have gone much if any further with Boldin than we did without. So, we got a draft pick out of it and some more players. Not bad at all.

I was fine with the trade and honestly, after Marlon had his shot, I'm glad. I don't Brown would've had much of a shot of real experience if he stayed.

The o-line was obviously a serious hindrance last year, but don't you think Boldin would have been open on some of those passes that ended up as interceptions? 

[rmw10]

The o-line was obviously a serious hindrance last year, but don't you think Boldin would have been open on some of those passes that ended up as interceptions? 

 

It's tough to say.  Boldin can't separate, so it really wouldn't have opened up any more passing lanes for Joe.  Boldin won with his physicality which is nice, but it's still low percentage.  I'm sure he would have come down with some more balls than the likes of Dallas Clark and Brandon Stokley did, but I don't see it changing much.  The team would have been sitting at home watching the Super Bowl with or without Boldin.

[display name]

It's tough to say.  Boldin can't separate, so it really wouldn't have opened up any more passing lanes for Joe.  Boldin won with his physicality which is nice, but it's still low percentage.  I'm sure he would have come down with some more balls than the likes of Dallas Clark and Brandon Stokley did, but I don't see it changing much.  The team would have been sitting at home watching the Super Bowl with or without Boldin.

Yeah I know that we would still probably not have gotten to the SB even if we had him, but if Boldin was here in 2013 I doubt that Flacco would have still thrown 22 interceptions.

[rmw10]

Yeah I know that we would still probably not have gotten to the SB even if we had him, but if Boldin was here in 2013 I doubt that Flacco would have still thrown 22 interceptions.

 

He might have thrown 2 or 3 less.  I don't see it being a huge difference.  The OL and the WRs not being able to separate were the biggest culprits.  Boldin doesn't change either of those things.

[GrimCoconut]

The o-line was obviously a serious hindrance last year, but don't you think Boldin would have been open on some of those passes that ended up as interceptions?

Probably but perhaps it wasn't all that bad. If Boldin was here maybe we made the playoffs but we weren't beating Seattle regardless of how we did in the playoffs. Our run defense wasn't good enough. That's the bottom line. I'd rather have a better draft pick.

[GrimCoconut]

He might have thrown 2 or 3 less. I don't see it being a huge difference. The OL and the WRs not being able to separate were the biggest culprits. Boldin doesn't change either of those things.

And two RB that just didn't ever catch fire. That was a major issue of ours last year.

[rmw10]

And two RB that just didn't ever catch fire. That was a major issue of ours last year.

 

Exactly.  Boldin may have helped us get into the playoffs, but there's no question that there were many too many issues for another SB to be realistic.

 

I'll always love Boldin as a player.  I think he was the epitome of what it meant to me a Raven.  Regardless, it's over now and we had to move on eventually.  It would have been nice to have him around for another year, but we made it blatantly obvious that it was more of a transition year last year. Boldin didn't fit with that transition.

[gabefergy]

Our defense would have been putrid last year without Dumervil and Canty. We don't get Dumervil and Canty if Boldin is on the roster.

We dont make the playoffs even if the offense is 10% better, but the defense can't stop anyone.

[Inqui]

Our defense would have been putrid last year without Dumervil and Canty. We don't get Dumervil and Canty if Boldin is on the roster.

We dont make the playoffs even if the offense is 10% better, but the defense can't stop anyone.

I think our firing offence during the SB run made everyone forget just how bad our defence was. Don't get me wrong, the Superb Owl was great to watch and a real highlight for me as a Ravens fan, but watching Frank Gore run on us at will (brand me a heretic, but I think if they'd run just once on us during that goalline stand we'd be hearing San Fransixco or some equally painful pun) and seeing Colin Kaepernick of all people target Ray Lewis was hard to watch.

 

That needed to be improved in a big way and the salary had to come from somewhere.

[BloodRaven]

Our defense would have been putrid last year without Dumervil and Canty. We don't get Dumervil and Canty if Boldin is on the roster.

We dont make the playoffs even if the offense is 10% better, but the defense can't stop anyone.

 

The problem with that is we didn't make the playoffs anyway.

[Hardbaugh]

It was a bad move for a number of reasons. Flacco and Boldin was clicking during the historic playoff run. Someone could make a good case that the two could have built on that last season. The Ravens could have made the money work if they wanted the player.  The Boldin can't get separation slam while true (it's only half the story)  says more about the person writing the smear than it does about Boldin.

 

 Boldin is open when he's covered and proved it time and again when he was here.  The quarterback only needs good ball placement.

 

The Ravens front office couldn't have thought awarding a quarterback who didn't deserve it the richest NFL contract and expect the receiver who helped that quarterback pave the way for his new contract to take a cut.  No competitor out of the Boldin mold would go for that insult.

 

It was a bad move, the front office stated it. I feel they rectified it by acquiring Smith .

[BmoreBird22]

I never thought it was a bad move. I always felt it was a good move, but I knew it would take a lot to make up for the production. Sadly, Pitta and Jacoby got hurt and the offensive line was in complete shambles, so it intensified to the problem.

A lot of people are saying they think the Ravens would make the playoffs with Boldin, but I disagree. The offense might be better, marginally (no run game or offensive line), but the defense would be far from good. The Ravens could keep Boldin and get Dumervil or keep Boldin and get Canty and Smith. With just Dumervil, the offensive line would he relying on several young and very inexperienced guys like Tyson and Williams, who wouldn't be ready to start, or would have to put Terrance Cody back in and slide Ngata over. Does the defense even click as well without Smith making the calls? I'd rather not have Josh Bynes and Arthur Brown (who may not be a Raven) starting. In scenario two, you miss out on the second most productive pass rusher in terms of sacks, hurries, pressures, and hits based on snaps. I know Suggs slowed down at the end of the year, but could you imagine him without Dumervil on the other side? It'd be really ugly. Without that pass rush, would Jimmy and Ihedigbo break out like they did? Maybe Jimmy would, but I'd doubt it with Ihedigbo. Does Webb continue to return to form?

Plus, as many pointed out, he's likely gone this year anyway, and honestly, I'll take five years of Smith and Dumervil and three years of Canty and Steve Smith over one of Boldin. Right move, just many things went wrong that were not a problem at the time of the trade.

[Tiz]

I think the main problem wasn't getting rid of Boldin, it was then having Jacoby and Pitta get hurt and see Boldin tear it up.

Agreed. If we avoided injuries on offense we wouldn't have had an issue with the trade

To have pitta, jones, k.o. And rice get hurt we saw our offense become sluggish so the loss of boldin was noticeable despite his Tds being replaced by brown. Healthy pitta and rice would have also replaced boldins third down numbers IMO

[PerpetuallyBored74]

In the short term, it was a terrible move.***

Trade away your best possession WR / press coverage beating WR / blocking WR when you don't have a suitable replacement? And Boldin would have produced under Caldwell because Caldwell would have kept Boldin in the slot, running quick routes underneath like he did in Arizona and is now doing in SF. He would've been worth the 6 million cap hit, if anything he would've been a steal AND YES we would've returned to the playoffs with Boldin because Flacco would've had considerably fewer INTs and sacks / more 1st downs & points--look at how having WRs who get immediately open made all the difference for Brady and the Pats when his O-line was a shambles last year because of injuries.

When you don't have an O-line, you absolutely need a Boldin (or a creative OC who knows how to design and teach a short underneath passing scheme) to allow your QB to get rid of the ball FAST. Also with Boldin, teams couldn't double Torrey all game, so Torrey would've been more of a factor instead of disappearing like he did in the 2nd half of the season.

As for Boldin not re-signing once his contract was up--maybe he would have and maybe the Ravens would've wanted him back if he produced like he has in the past. As for the extra 2 million in savings from trading Boldin, Huff and Spears were wasted money. We would've been better off keeping Boldin instead of getting them.

 

In the long term though, who knows how it will all work out. That 6th rounder from the Boldin trade was needed to move up and draft Arthur Brown. So if he develops into a great player than that changes things. And Steve Smith is a suitable (and cheaper) replacement. So perhaps in the long term it will turn out to be a great move. But we won't know that anytime soon.

 

(*** Assuming that Boldin would've stayed healthy last year. Which was hardly a given considering how among our skill position players everyone not named Torrey, Tandon and Ed Dickson got hurt last year, even Marlon missed 1 game because of a minor injury.)

[busterblue52]

The biggest problem with the trade is that Pitta couldn't play. I think we benefit the more years that go on because Marlon got to get valuable experience and Q is only getting older.

[H8R]

I never had a problem with the trade.

[Militant X 1]

Why are some cats in here still beating a dead horse with this issue?  Boldin is long gone and happy as a 49er.  He hasn't looked back at the Ravens organization since his departure.  Let it go!  Let him go!  It's done!

 

 

#Mili

[gabefergy]

The problem with that is we didn't make the playoffs anyway.

My point is we don't make the playoffs either way. At least now we have Dumervil as a center-piece of the defense. That's a lot better than watching Boldin walk in FA and getting nothing but a comp pick.