Brandon Flowers

[Bullrush]

Not really directing this at you, more in general. Why do so many people seem to think it's just so easy for a CB to convert into a FS. Being a good FS is about way more then just playing center field and being a good tackler.

 

Have you looked around the league? It's pretty common. Do you think it's easy for a pass rushing DE to go switch from a 3 point stance to standup and play OLB? It's no different. If you have the skills it only makes sense. Whether you're gonna end up being good at it is another thing that remains to be seen. There are no guarantees, no matter what position you play and whether you switch positions or not. It's not like Flowers lit it up at CB last year...

[Ozzsome]

Have you looked around the league? It's pretty common. Do you think it's easy for a pass rushing DE to go switch from a 3 point stance to standup and play OLB? It's no different. If you have the skills it only makes sense. Whether you're gonna end up being good at it is another thing that remains to be seen. There are no guarantees, no matter what position you play and whether you switch positions or not. It's not like Flowers lit it up at CB last year...

 

It is completely different

[ellicottraven]

This has to be demoralizing for Chykie and Asa!  They're bringing in almost every available CB to possibly play over these two.

I am sure it has nothing to do with Chykie or Asa other than they are not playing well enough right now. Look, Steve Bisciotti has reiterated over and over again, that he would like to make sure the young guys we draft play for us. That is borne out by us not signing or drafting a RT this year. Ricky Wagner and Jensen are doing well enough at the position that they think it isn't necessary. However, with the CBs, it is clear that neither Chykie or Asa are up to it right now.

That is the reason they are going all out trying to sign a veteran as our insurance policy!

[Bullrush]

They're not gonna take it personal, I'm sure they realize that we don't have any really proven guys behind Jimmy/Webb. We could use one more veteran with starting experience to compete with Asa/Brown.

[cushrinada1986]

And I highly doubt that they'll be as good as Flowers was before his scheme change... If we could get THAT Brandon Flowers then our defense would be a top 5 one.

With that type of coverage with a healthy Suggs, Doom, and Ngata, thats gonna allow our new guys like Kapron lewis and Timmy Jernigan to do what they do best, beat guys off the ball, slice through the line, and get to the QB. I think if we can get the old Flowers, that may solidify our defense enough to take us real deep into the playoffs.

[Ravenskid52752]

@RavensInsider: Source says Patriots are also in the mix for Brandon Flowers. Ravens have maintained interest

[rmw10]

Jason La Canfora ‏@JasonLaCanfora  2m

Free agent CB Brandon Flowers not negotiating w/teams yet. Will spend the next 2 days in SD. BAL, PIT, MIN among those monitoring closely

[SecretAgentMan]

@RavensInsider: Source says Patriots are also in the mix for Brandon Flowers. Ravens have maintained interest

Oh dear god. The media attention this would get

[Inqui]

Oh dear god. The media attention this would get

I wonder who'd get more excited. Skip Bayless or WalterFootball.

 

Rather see him go there than Pittsburgh though. He'd hate that city anyway.

[SecretAgentMan]

I wonder who'd get more excited. Skip Bayless or WalterFootball.

 

Rather see him go there than Pittsburgh though. He'd hate that city anyway.

Now all Skip is missing is Tim Tebow

[BmoreBird22]

I wouldn't mind bringing him in to play FS here. He's got a little bit of Ed Reed in him in terms of their playing style. Good tackler, physical, great in zone, leadership, he's rather short, has decent ball skills & instincts. Not in the same league as Reed or even close to Reed obviously but he could make a good center fielder if the FO doesn't have faith in Brooks getting it done as a rookie.

He's a much better man coverage cornerback than he is a zone corner, but eve still, free safety is a big transition for younger guys. Sure, you may see some very veteran cornerbacks like Woodson or Barber go back there to safety, but it's not a common practice because it is a different position with different responsibilities

[BmoreBird22]

Have you looked around the league? It's pretty common. Do you think it's easy for a pass rushing DE to go switch from a 3 point stance to standup and play OLB? It's no different. If you have the skills it only makes sense. Whether you're gonna end up being good at it is another thing that remains to be seen. There are no guarantees, no matter what position you play and whether you switch positions or not. It's not like Flowers lit it up at CB last year...

The switch from DE to OLB is very different. Wasn't Freeney reportedly struggling quite a bit with that transition? And if it's so easy, why was there so much pre draft, and still a fair amount now, about how Clowney would fit into the 3-4?

[sflegend89]

Flowers won't go to the Pats.. they already have Revis, Browner, Dennard, Arrington. What's the point of having starting caliber guys like Dennard and Arrington getting paid good money to get buried on the depth chart and barley play? Move wouldn't make much sense on the Pats end, it's not a move that maximizes the players they already have and just sounds like a media driven headline. They may have contacted Flowers but that's really not that uncommon when a player of his caliber get's cut, then the media just ran with it because they "contacted him".

 

Big difference between preliminary contact and being legitimately interested in signing him

[Inqui]

Flowers won't go to the Pats.. they already have Revis, Browner, Dennard, Arrington. What's the point of having starting caliber guys like Dennard and Arrington getting paid good money to get buried on the depth chart and barley play? Move wouldn't make much sense on the Pats end, it's not a move that maximizes the players they already have and just sounds like a media driven headline. They may have contacted Flowers but that's really not that uncommon for when a player of his caliber get's cut, then the media just ran with it because they "contacted him".

That's your point right there.

 

Not that I expect him to go there because I think someone will pay more than the most they're prepared to come with. But still, highest bidder and all.

[dhstandard]

Flowers won't go to the Pats.. they already have Revis, Browner, Dennard, Arrington. What's the point of having starting caliber guys like Dennard and Arrington getting paid good money to get buried on the depth chart and barley play? Move wouldn't make much sense on the Pats end, it's not a move that maximizes the players they already have and just sounds like a media driven headline. They may have contacted Flowers but that's really not that uncommon when a player of his caliber get's cut, then the media just ran with it because they "contacted him".

 

Big difference between preliminary contact and being legitimately interested in signing him

 

If he is smart he would go somewhere that already has some good corners.  Keep the pressure off of him after a poor season.  Have a top corner already on the team so he isn't forced to cover the opposing teams best receiver.  Guy is already 32 and if he wants to stay in the league he shouldn't try to be a teams franchise corner.

[DomMcRaven]

If he is smart he would go somewhere that already has some good corners.  Keep the pressure off of him after a poor season.  Have a top corner already on the team so he isn't forced to cover the opposing teams best receiver.  Guy is already 32 and if he wants to stay in the league he shouldn't try to be a teams franchise corner.

I thought Flowers was like 28 (could be wrong).

[rmw10]

If he is smart he would go somewhere that already has some good corners. Keep the pressure off of him after a poor season. Have a top corner already on the team so he isn't forced to cover the opposing teams best receiver. Guy is already 32 and if he wants to stay in the league he shouldn't try to be a teams franchise corner.

As said above, Flowers is only 28...

[Bullrush]

He's a much better man coverage cornerback than he is a zone corner, but eve still, free safety is a big transition for younger guys. Sure, you may see some very veteran cornerbacks like Woodson or Barber go back there to safety, but it's not a common practice because it is a different position with different responsibilities

 

It is absolutely common practice. Big corners that come out usually face the same decision they have to make when making the jump to pro football, similar to small DE's that would have to switch to LB. And I'm not sure if you've followed Flowers or not. He's a natural zone cover corner, he brings all the intangibles needed to be a very good centerfielder. When he came out scouts actually viewed him as a CB/S tweener, some scouting reports (NFL.com) even had him listed as a safety prospect.

 

By the way, for every Freeney there are about 50 John Abraham's, Robert Mathises. Even Freeney who has struggled at first is now effective rushing the QB as an OLB despite the fact that he's getting up there in age. He already showed signs of slowing down a few years ago when he played DE so this isn't really position related, more about him just being close to being finished. He probably has only 1-2 more good seasons left. Besides, when a DE gets up there in age it's usually a bad idea to move him to LB because athletically it's a lot more demanding unless all you do is rush the QB. That's why you don't see many 30+ year old guys switch from DE to LB. With corners it's a lot different, the older they get the more it makes sense to move over to free safety because athletically it's a lot easier on your body than playing corner. As a corner it's more about being explosive, having quick twitch muscles. At 30-35 years of age you lose those. However your experience goes up, your instincts improve, your ability to read QB's, the game slows down. So moving to safety is absolutely natural. You see this with every good corner that hits a certain age now, guys in their early / mid 30s. Right now that applies to Charles Tillman, Champ Bailey, Brandon Browner and a bunch of other guys. Revis in about 3-4 years potentially. It only makes sense for certain guys because it's natural for them. For others it's not. So saying switching from corner to safety is easy/hard doesn't make sense. For somebody who has those skills/intangibles, like a Tillman, a Bailey, a Woodson, McCourty, it's not a big deal, it's the easiest thing in the world. Webb is even being considered by some of the people here to play FS for us. I think he could be a good FS as well. But Jimmy Smith? Totally different story, I don't think he'd make a good safety. So it all depends on the player, not the switch itself.

 

That being said, I only threw it out there with Flowers because I liked the idea, I think he could be a very good centerfielder. But obviously he's still too young to make that switch, he's not gonna do it. And he's not stupid, he realizes that he can make a lot more money playing corner. Wait another 3-5 years, I'm sure he'll have to switch to safety at that point if he wants to stick around in the NFL and have an impact and continue to start. Right now he's not gonna consider that move for obvious reasons.

[JoeyFlex5]

webb, jimmy, and flowers would all get near equal playing time if that were to happen, in this days nfl, 3rd CB is crucial because theyre on the field so much more often, webb is a starting caliber corner who is best in the slot and is a enforcer against the run as a CB, but with an injury history, so signing an ideal #2 CB like flowers allows us to monitor webbs snap count to hopefully help prevent another major injury, and he is also being used to his max potential, while flowers and jimmy are doing the same on the outside. 

 

we would make LOB sit down and cry if we were to sign flowers. 

 

all moot though, it wont happen.

[sflegend89]

https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora

 

Brandon Flowers is visiting the Chargers via Jason La Canfora, will re-evaluate whether to take more visits after visiting SD.

 

Definitely not good news, players don't usually walk out of a visit without a contract unless they have second thoughts about signing their or fail their physical. All we can do is hope that the Ravens have peaked Flowers interest and he'll want to visit after SD to weigh his options. If he get's a visit here it's a done deal, easier said then done however.

[jazz1988]

https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora

 

Brandon Flowers is visiting the Chargers via Jason La Canfora, will re-evaluate whether to take more visits after visiting SD.

 

Definitely not good news, players don't usually walk out of a visit without a contract unless they have second thoughts about signing their or fail their physical. All we can do is hope that the Ravens have peaked Flowers interest and he'll want to visit after SD to weigh his options. If he get's a visit here it's a done deal, easier said then done however.

 

I think he's going to The Chargers. He be their number one cornerback right away, they went to the playoffs last year so it's not like he's going to a bad team,  and he get some revenge against his old team.

[BmoreBird22]

If he is smart he would go somewhere that already has some good corners.  Keep the pressure off of him after a poor season.  Have a top corner already on the team so he isn't forced to cover the opposing teams best receiver.  Guy is already 32 and if he wants to stay in the league he shouldn't try to be a teams franchise corner.

He's 28...

[BmoreBird22]

It is absolutely common practice. Big corners that come out usually face the same decision they have to make when making the jump to pro football, similar to small DE's that would have to switch to LB. And I'm not sure if you've followed Flowers or not. He's a natural zone cover corner, he brings all the intangibles needed to be a very good centerfielder. When he came out scouts actually viewed him as a CB/S tweener, some scouting reports (NFL.com) even had him listed as a safety prospect.

Flowers is considered a natural off man coverage cornerback

By the way, Woodson, Barber, Freeney, Mathis, and Abraham were all over 30 when they made their switches.

[Bullrush]

That's a nice way of saying he's too slow to play tight man coverage, which is a huge part of playing the corner position. If you can't do that you're better off at safety. And off man coverage is pretty similar to playing zone...

[BmoreBird22]

That's a nice way of saying he's too slow to play tight man coverage, which is a huge part of playing the corner position. If you can't do that you're better off at safety. And off man coverage is pretty similar to playing zone...

Off man coverage is an extremely difficult coverage to play. It's not a nice way of saying he can't play tight coverage considering that off man requires a lot of ability to break on the ball and read your man. It's not an easy coverage at all. Remember, though, Webb is probably most natural in off man and he was one of the best in 2011 and showed signs of that form again as the season wore on in 2013. Desmond Trufant was probably the best off man coverage cornerbacks in the NFL last year and most consider him a top 10 cornerback already based on that one season.

Off man is probably the most popularly used scheme in the NFL right now, so saying that if you can't play it you should be a safety is just flat out ignorant.

 

But no, it's not similar to zone. Zone is in and of itself a very complex coverage which requires far more awareness than simple man coverage. Man coverage just asks you to trail a man. Zone does not ask simply that. I can't exactly explain how intricate it is, but I will try to find you an article on the differences because they are fairly vast.

[rmw10]

Off man coverage is an extremely difficult coverage to play. It's not a nice way of saying he can't play tight coverage considering that off man requires a lot of ability to break on the ball and read your man. It's not an easy coverage at all.

 

But no, it's not similar to zone. Zone is in and of itself a very complex coverage which requires far more awareness than simple man coverage. Man coverage just asks you to trail a man. Zone does not ask simply that. I can't exactly explain how intricate it is, but I will try to find you an article on the differences because they are fairly vast.

 

As you said, zone requires a lot more awareness.  Instead of focusing on one guy, you kind of have to read the routes of every receiver.  If a guy enters your zone, it then becomes a decision of breaking on the ball, mirroring the receiver, pulling up, looking for safety help, etc.  It requires a lot of thinking and quick reactions.

 

That's probably not the greatest explanation, but I tried to keep it in simpler terms.  Regardless, Flowers has tons of value because he can play off man and zone.  He struggles in press, which is to be expected from a 5'9 CB.

[BmoreBird22]

As you said, zone requires a lot more awareness.  Instead of focusing on one guy, you kind of have to read the routes of every receiver.  If a guy enters your zone, it then becomes a decision of breaking on the ball, mirroring the receiver, pulling up, looking for safety help, etc.  It requires a lot of thinking and quick reactions.

 

That's probably not the greatest explanation, but I tried to keep it in simpler terms.  Regardless, Flowers has tons of value because he can play off man and zone.  He struggles in press, which is to be expected from a 5'9 CB.

I know that little tidbit, but I saw an article explaining zone once and I was like, "Wow, didn't know that was so complicated..." it was in reference to the Falcons-Seahawks playoff game

[Bullrush]

Off man coverage is very similar to zone coverage and that was my point. Man coverage, tight man coverage is mostly just you using your athletic ability to stick like glue to the receiver. Playing off is not as much about athletic ability but more about the mental side of it. You have to use your instincts, it's more about reading the routes, playing the ball. That's what young corners always struggle with. They're all 80-90% better at playing man to man, tight coverage, because all it really takes is athletic ability. The really good football players (corners) that lack those athletic skills however are almost always really good in off coverage, because that's what they've been doing in college for years in order to get by. They would have not survived if they'd played tight man coverage. So they are way ahead mentally. Jimmy is a good example. Patrick Peterson is. Milliner is. All those big, athletic freaks. They're all studs in press coverage and tight man coverage. Off coverage? Zone? Not so much. Not saying Jimmy can't play zone or off, but he's a natural press corner, that's his strength. Flowers is the exact opposite. And those guys are usually the ones to make a successful transition to FS if they're being asked to.

[sflegend89]

blow up his twitter. @BFlowers24

 

Let him know that he needs to make a visit to Baltimore before he makes a decision! Chargers don't know how to win in the playoffs, would be a mistake to sign there unless he cares about the whether more then winning lol 

[Cillmatic]

Due to the recent signings I doubt the FO is still in pursuit of Flowers. As long as Pittsburg don't sign him I'm happy