Torrey Smith / Andre Johnson Value?

[Bruce_Almty]

You can't buy the Lombardi, you have to build to it. Torrey is a solid building block in the Raven offense. He's never going to be "elite" (which is why I was hoping for OBJ) but he'll be worth the money we pay him in his next contract & he wants to be a Raven. We won't get stuck with any outlandish Torrey contract b/c there won't be any, just a valuable Raven.

[gabefergy]

Scoring has always been the knock on Johnson, and you pointed the finger at the Texans offensive system but what that tells us is that he won't improve his numbers in our system, especially as he ages.

You wouldn't want 100+ catches for 1400+ yards?

It's not like Torrey is scoring tons of TDs either.

If you could tell me we would have Torrey for the next 5 years at a reasonable rate I would take it, but he's a FA after this season and he could be looking to get paid.

[Inqui]

I'd be happy to take AJ on as another WR, but I'm not in favour of trading Torrey. Our WR situation is alright as it is, but depth is the main concern. Swap our WR in his prime for a declining guy with an injury history and depth becomes even more of a concern.

[rmw10]

I'd absolutely love to have Johnson here, but I don't think it's a realistic possibility.  He has a large salary and is 32 years old.

 

I don't see any way that Torrey leaves anyways.  The FO has made it pretty known that he's a priority and I doubt they let him walk.

[ravensdan]

Andre Johnson coming off of a season where he caught 109 balls for 1400+ yards is on the decline? Some of ya'll crack me up.

A closer parallel is randy miss who went for a fourth but Andre doesn't carry the baggage. I almost guarantee we are crunching the numbers on a potential deal. A third and McPhee I am thinking.

[allblackraven]

Do you trade long-term security, for a chance at another title this year or next?

Trade such as this one is not likely to determine our chances at winning another Super Bowl in next 2 years. If anything, chances should be better with Torrey, considering he is entering his prime and $ difference can be used to help getting good player elsewhere on the team.

[ravensnick]

The funny part is Andre would be a huge upgrade. Yet when Andre and Jacoby were the Texans' 1 and 2 in 2011, they still felt receiver was their top need. 

Because Jacoby is an absolutely terrible #2. 

[cursona pirate]

He is worth about 4

[TDubbs]

No offence, but thats a Madden trade. Also, the title of 'Torrey Smith's Value' is misleading for a topic of conversation when the text is as such. I love Torrey Smith, his value to us is that of a #1 WR. Andre Johnson is an awesome WR with a proven track record who MAY be on the trading block. The trade that was presented would be ridiculous lol. 

[FastEddie]

You can't buy the Lombardi, you have to build to it. Torrey is a solid building block in the Raven offense. He's never going to be "elite" (which is why I was hoping for OBJ) but he'll be worth the money we pay him in his next contract & he wants to be a Raven. We won't get stuck with any outlandish Torrey contract b/c there won't be any, just a valuable Raven.

 

Couldn't have said it any better myself. Hopefully we can land a number one somewhere down the road to suit up with Torrey, Pitta, Camp, and Brown as this looks like our future.

[flynismo]

Scoring has always been the knock on Johnson, and you pointed the finger at the Texans offensive system but what that tells us is that he won't improve his numbers in our system, especially as he ages.

Not only would it not improve, but it would likely drop quite a bit (assuming S Smith is still a good player and Marlon avoids a sophomore slump ); between AJ, Smith, Marlon, Pitta and Daniels -- as well as Rice, that's a lot of mouths to feed.

[Bltravens]

You're a fool if you trade Torrey Smith for Andre Johnson in the long term.  Which is what a GM is supposed to do.  Johnson will be in Steve Smith's position in 3 years whereas Torrey still has at least 7 years with which is speed will remain.  Not only that we're supposed to take on a 12mil cap hit this year, a 16 next year and 14 the next?

You can't be serious.  With how QB is these days Flacco will play until he's like 37 and still be a better than average QB because his arm strength won't deteriorate to poo arm levels.  You'd essentially be reverting back to our Derrick Mason WR days and bringing in old veterans to stop gap while we hope we can draft a WR that's even half decent.  Which has happened once, Torrey Smith.

[jaege]

No.

[flynismo]

A closer parallel is randy miss who went for a fourth but Andre doesn't carry the baggage. I almost guarantee we are crunching the numbers on a potential deal. A third and McPhee I am thinking.

If we gave up a 3rd, much less a 3rd AND McPhee for AJ, I would personally stomp into the castle and give Ozzie a swift kick in the beanbag

[Cville-Raven]

uh no

 

 

I would trade a couple picks for him. 

[1/28/01]

If we gave up a 3rd, much less a 3rd AND McPhee for AJ, I would personally stomp into the castle and give Ozzie a swift kick in the beanbag

You wouldn't give up a 3rd for Andre Johnson?

[TDubbs]

Torrey Smith and a mid round pick ... LOL, I don't understand the logic there. I would however give up a 2nd-4th rounder for Andre in a heartbeat! All he does is produce, keep clean off the field and has the desire to win. Torrey/Steve/Andre ... my god what a trio. Especially with Andre (and Daniels) history under Kubiak ... 

[gabefergy]

People don't understand a. how good Johnson is and b. Torrey is a free agent after 2014.

[T3hRaven]

People don't understand a. how good Johnson is and b. Torrey is a free agent after 2014.

 

Apparently not.  Dude is a HoFer in my book.

[gabefergy]

Apparently not. Dude is a HoFer in my book.

Same. He's been a top 5 WR in the NFL for like 9 years. He has 221 receptions and 3000 yards the past 2 seasons alone. That's decline?

[SecretAgentMan]

If we gave up a 3rd, much less a 3rd AND McPhee for AJ, I would personally stomp into the castle and give Ozzie a swift kick in the beanbag

I'd happily do that trade. 

[SecretAgentMan]

Same. He's been a top 5 WR in the NFL for like 9 years. He has 221 receptions and 3000 yards the past 2 seasons alone. That's decline?

Yep. Even on the crappiest of teams I considered him before Megatron broke out to be the best in the league(Including Randy Moss during his time with the Patriots). 

 

Before AJ, and Julio broke out, Calvin and Andre were the clear cuts 1 & 2 by far. What both of em could do was awesome. 

[SecretAgentMan]

A closer parallel is randy miss who went for a fourth but Andre doesn't carry the baggage. I almost guarantee we are crunching the numbers on a potential deal. A third and McPhee I am thinking.

Just curious. Why McPhee? I don't think they'd ever want him. 

[PurpleReign22]

I would never trade Torrey for Johnson but there's not a doubt in my mind that he's worth a 2nd day draft pick or an early 3rd day pick, he hasn't had a major drop off in production, he still boast some of the best hands in the league, has both a great football character and off the field persona. Although i don't see it happening because Oz isn't exactly an advocate of giving up picks, if we did i wouldn't mind.

[rmw10]

Just curious. Why McPhee? I don't think they'd ever want him.

Yeah McPhee seems like an odd name to throw in there.

[gabefergy]

And c. Ppl way overrate Torrey Smith.

[GrimCoconut]

I wouldn't trade Torrey but then again that's because he's young and this new WR coach and Steve could really help his game. I would certainly trade a third round pick for Johnson. That's for sure. I don't see the McPhee trade but perhaps for something else. They're pretty decent at OLB. Just added Clowney. I can see maybe something else but it depends. I doubt they're interested in Tyrod lol

[SecretAgentMan]

And c. Ppl way overrate Torrey Smith.

That's true... I don't think he's a #1.

 

That being said, I think he has developed nicely. Not into the WR you'd want him to be, but he's no longer just a one trick pony(imo. He's a more developed route runner, but doesn't have the hands you'd want. And he's terrible with contested catches... If his hands were better and he were stronger he'd be a #1). He's one of the better #2s in the NFL. 

 

Steve at this point is also one. But Andre is still a top 10 WR. Not the freak he used to be, but he's still a stud.

 

He and Torrey would make a hell of a duo. Throw Steve in, and you may have an old WR corps, but it's a good one.

 

Just dreaming. Ozzie won't do it.

[bMore Heathen]

People don't understand a. how good Johnson is and b. Torrey is a free agent after 2014.

It's a complex problem. If Torrey wants something like 9-10M a year, then yes, I would make that trade. If Torrey is reasonable and asks for 4-5M a year (which is probably closer to his value) then I would say no to the trade. If we were going to be paying that much to keep him, I would rather have Andre for a couple M more.

I don't think that it's debatable that Andre is a better, more consistent receiver then Torrey even at his age. It comes down to the money involved.

[SecretAgentMan]

This is the only way this happens

 

IDC about our WR needs.

 

I am just waiting for Faxgate Part Two. Andre Johnson.

 

Rick Smith: Andre, you're getting old and we just drafted a young talent to complement you.

 

Andre: What the hell are you saying?

Smith: I am saying that we need to restructure your contract. Or you will be a free agent.

 

Andre: Oooh, does that mean that I get to ride in your private Jet and you get to take me out to steak dinner?

 

Smith: No... That means I will cut you if you do not lower your contract value (even though you are an all pro caliber player still)

 

Andre: Ok.

 

 

Skip Bayless: The Andre Johnson restructuring better be worth it in the long run.... He's getting old, but is on the second best team in the AFC. Still second best WR in the NFL.

 

Heath Evans: Still one of the class acts in the game helping out his truly elite QB.  I hope he gets a good deal...

 

*One week passes*..

 

Andre(on the phone with Smith). Ok I have sent in the agreement via fax.

Smith: Yeah.... About that. The fax machine broke.

Andre: WHAT

Smith: So... technically you are a FA

Andre: Excellent! 

 

 

Ravens PR person: Yo Ozzie! Andre Johnson was just released. Most teams don't have the cap to go after him. We need to get negotiating NOW.

 

Ozzie: *gets on the phone with AJ*

 

Skip: Wow. The elite Shaub lost a mediocre WR. No big deal. Still second best team in the AFC

Heath: I hope Andre goes to the Saints. Give Brees another elite weapon, like I was.

 
Andre: I have come down to two choices. Ravens and Texans.

 

Smith: We will invite you to have steak dinner at Outback, and fly in our private Jet.

Ozzie: We will give you all of that, cept the Steak Dinner will be from Ruth's Chris, and you get more money!

 

*Cuts Leach to make Room for him*

 

 

Andre: DEAL.

 

Smith: No!

 

Skip: What a bad move for BMore, OVERRATED. And with the less than elite Flukeo, he will suck.

Heath: The Ravens have gotten another weapon to cover up Flacco's near INTs. SMH NFL.

Texan Fans: RAVENS ARE CHEATING *start crying*

 

 

 

 

Pipe Dream IK.... But I would lmao if that was our Texan steal