gregreid5

Ravens & FSU Fans RE: Jernigan and Brooks

125 posts in this topic

Ravens are getting an absolute animal.  I could not be more excited.  Was the best player on the best defense in the country last year and the key player that made the defense run.  He was a leader on the field, VERY clean off the field and he is a mean SOB.

 

Watch this GIF of an example of his competitiveness.  

 

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1597275/TimmyJudo.gif

 

FSU asked him to play a lot of NT in our 3-4 this year which he did well but that led to a lack of stats as he was double teamed every play. 

8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ravens are getting an absolute animal.  I could not be more excited.  Was the best player on the best defense in the country last year and the key player that made the defense run.  He was a leader on the field, VERY clean off the field and he is a mean SOB.

 

Watch this GIF of an example of his competitiveness.  

 

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1597275/TimmyJudo.gif

 

FSU asked him to play a lot of NT in our 3-4 this year which he did well but that led to a lack of stats as he was double teamed every play. 

 

All may be true but we have so much depth on the D line - we're ignoring offense yet again and we have serious needs on that side of the ball.

 

All we ever give the offense are the scrub picks. It's getting beyond old now especially after we were told how now we were going to build our offense like we did defense for so many years.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All may be true but we have so much depth on the D line - we're ignoring offense yet again and we have serious needs on that side of the ball.

 

All we ever give the offense are the scrub picks. It's getting beyond old now especially after we were told how now we were going to build our offense like we did defense for so many years.

 

I agree but who did you want to take?  Lee was gone.  None of the other wideouts jump out as a good pick.  We dont need a TE and I liked Kouandijo but he was gone.  No OL worth the pick at that point.

 

I wanted Martin in rd 1 but he was taken.  Ozzie has taken 2 good players instead of two reaches for need.

5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nose Tackle is another underrated position. If you have a great one, your D is set compete. We haven't stuffed the run like we have in years past, and losing Art Jones would've left us depleted. I don't know if he takes Brandon William's spot, or if Williams can play DE next to him. Suggs, Ngata, Jernigan, Williams, and Upshaw is a lot of beef.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All may be true but we have so much depth on the D line - we're ignoring offense yet again and we have serious needs on that side of the ball.

 

All we ever give the offense are the scrub picks. It's getting beyond old now especially after we were told how now we were going to build our offense like we did defense for so many years.

 

I agree!  And this is why I'm not buying into all of the hype of our off-season moves and addition for the offense.  They mean nothing to me at this point UNTIL I see them on the field in the first 3 games.  Then, I'll know what we're working with!

 

#Mili

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree!  And this is why I'm not buying into all of the hype of our off-season moves and addition for the offense.  They mean nothing to me at this point UNTIL I see them on the field in the first 3 games.  Then, I'll know what we're working with!

 

#Mili

 

Outside of Rice, Flacco & Torrey - I'm trying to think if we've been successful drafting offense. Perhaps Ozzie doesn't have that "magic" on that side of the ball.

 

I don't know - we had a shot at a decent Safety or TE with our #17 but we go Mosely - who could very well turn out to be a great pick - I just don't see it.

-2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Outside of Rice, Flacco & Torrey - I'm trying to think if we've been successful drafting offense. Perhaps Ozzie doesn't have that "magic" on that side of the ball.

 

I don't know - we had a shot at a decent Safety or TE with our #17 but we go Mosely - who could very well turn out to be a great pick - I just don't see it.

 

 

Jamal Lewis, Priest Holmes, Ben Grubbs, Marshal Yanda, Brandon Stockley, Todd Heap just to name a few others.

Edited by Ravensuperfan1
4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jamal Lewis, Priest Holmes, Ben Grubbs, Marshal Yanda, Brandon Stockley, Todd Heap just to name a few others.

 

Yanda - I knew I was forgetting someone still playing on the team.

 

Holmes was an undrafted FA. Lewis was 14 years ago.

 

Grubbs - 7 years ago. Heap - 13 years ago.

 

Maybe it is time to focus on offense in the earlier rounds.

-1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jamal Lewis, Priest Holmes, Ben Grubbs, Marshal Yanda, Brandon Stockley, Todd Heap just to name a few others.

 

lol!  All of those cats were picks back in the day.  She's talking about now...in the present brah!  lol!

 

Yanda - I knew I was forgetting someone still playing on the team.

 

Holmes was an undrafted FA. Lewis was 14 years ago.

 

Grubbs - 7 years ago. Heap - 13 years ago.

 

Maybe it is time to focus on offense in the earlier rounds.

 

Again, I agree!  I am a HUGE stickler for a solid, fierce and ferocious defense however, the Ravens offense is lagging behind and we need to make up for that in FA and the draft.  We seem to always go defense heavy opposed to looking to load up the offense as well.  nothing has seem to change in this years draft.  Smh!

 

#Mili

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yanda - I knew I was forgetting someone still playing on the team.

 

Holmes was an undrafted FA. Lewis was 14 years ago.

 

Grubbs - 7 years ago. Heap - 13 years ago.

 

Maybe it is time to focus on offense in the earlier rounds.

 

 

wait Holmes was undrafted?  dang who did I confuse him with Musa Smith.  There's also Jermaine Lewis if your counting special teams.

 

We typically do alright with running backs and linemen.  Its WRs where I get worried. Ever since Mark Clayton I prefer us to go after free agents. Torrey was an iffy pick that turned out great.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Love this pick. He is a beast, he dominated when i saw him. Goes all OUT. Ravens need dline. Loss depth with Jones and Cody. Ngata might be hanging it up soon and expect his snaps to decline as well. Between Mosely and Jernigan they got much tougher and high motor guys who are winners. Great draft on paper, lets see how it really plays out.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

lol!  All of those cats were picks back in the day.  She's talking about now...in the present brah!  lol!

 

 

 

Ravens have only been a franchise for 18 years

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ravens have only been a franchise for 18 years

 

That line gets old man!  lol!  18 years is long enough and the Ravens are an "older" franchise now.  No excuses!  lol!

 

#Mili

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He's a ST player. Period.

Sure, that's why he had a 2nd round rating and ESPN called him a "steal" for us. You just go ahead and feel negative. Everything I'm reading is telling me otherwise. My only concern is his concussion history.

10

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really like Brooks for us, he is that rangy guy on the back end who we need. Love that pick. Jernigan will be fun as a DE for us as well and I have a feeling he will be a solid blue collar guy for us. 2 really good picks

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sure, that's why he had a 2nd round rating and ESPN called him a "steal" for us. You just go ahead and feel negative. Everything I'm reading is telling me otherwise. My only concern is his concussion history.

 

What I read - I thought it was only the one concussion that caused him to miss both times - but it is kind of vague so it could have been more than one.

 

  • Although he gets into position to finish the play by making an interception, his hands are remarkably poor. After examining every 2013 snap, Brooks dropped at least four interceptions that hit him in the hands. During an interview at the Senior Bowl, I asked Brooks what area he needs to improve upon the most, and he said his hands.
  • Didn’t play in man coverage more than a handful of times a game, if that. It was difficult to get a sense for his change of direction ability because he was rarely asked to play man.

He was a ST player for his first two years. He played more SS than FS in his junior and senior year. Not sure that he's going to be such an upgrade from Elam.

-10

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He can learn to catch if he doesn't have stone hands. Breaking up the pass is more important than getting picks, although picks are definitely game-changers.

Strengths

Fluid and flexible. Pedals and transitions smoothly. Has cornerback speed -- plays fast and covers ground. Has a 38-inch vertical jump. Patrols zones with awareness and anticipation to react to threats. Keys quickly, trusts his eyes and does not hesitate. Aggressive in run support -- swoops down with urgency, runs the alley and plays with abandon. Dependable makeup -- solid character. Tough and durable. Has ability and mentality to contribute on special teams.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What I read - I thought it was only the one concussion that caused him to miss both times - but it is kind of vague so it could have been more than one.

 

  • Although he gets into position to finish the play by making an interception, his hands are remarkably poor. After examining every 2013 snap, Brooks dropped at least four interceptions that hit him in the hands. During an interview at the Senior Bowl, I asked Brooks what area he needs to improve upon the most, and he said his hands.
  • Didn’t play in man coverage more than a handful of times a game, if that. It was difficult to get a sense for his change of direction ability because he was rarely asked to play man.

He was a ST player for his first two years. He played more SS than FS in his junior and senior year. Not sure that he's going to be such an upgrade from Elam.

 

That's kind of a moot point.  You very rarely ever ask your FS to play man coverage straight up.  Probably count on one hand how many times Ed played man coverage in a season when he moved to FS.

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First off as a Noles fan I couldn't be happier with the selection of Timmy and Brooks. But besides just being a fan, the Ravens really got two special players and both will help this defense get backinto the elite status.

As has already been touched on Timmy is better suited for the 3 tech, but because of his power, strength and being so stout at the point of attack we asked him to play a lot of nose and basically just eliminate the Center making it hard for teams to run. He's alot like Ngata for our system in the sense that he'll be able to move up and down the line at will. I've seen some people complain that this was a wasted pick because of our depth at the DL, well I strongly disagree because we don't currently have aguy as good as Timmy. Just knowing the upside of this guy, I think we more then replaced Art with this pick and if/when guys like Tyson, KPL and Williams continue to develop then great.

As for Brooks, anyone who thinks he's just a ST guy either hasn't seen the guy play and are just taking someone else's opinion(scouting report) as fact of you just simply don't understand football well enough imo because there is no way you can watch Brooks play and come away with the notion he's just a ST guy. He wasn't highly recruited out of HS and anyone who knows how spring practice works knows it's nearly impossible to be at the bottom of your recruiting class and get noticed in the spring. This is what lead to Brooks not seeing the much during his first 2 years. But even with a stacked FSU secondary Brooks forced his way into the field. Anyone who says he isn't good in man coverage I challenge you to go back and watch tape of 2011 when as a CB and watch his cover skills. He's smart, though, great football IQ, natural leader and a all around great guy. I can't remember what network it was but they called him a steal and I couldn't agree more. Imho the only reason Brooks isn't being talked about as ones ofthe top if not thy top FS in this draft is because he's still learning the position. He playedboth ways in HS as a WR/RB and CB, recruited to FSU as a CB and didn't start learning the FS position until 2012. He might end up being the best of the 3 defenders we've selected thus far and that's really saying something.

6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As for Brooks, anyone who thinks he's just a ST guy either hasn't seen the guy play and are just taking someone else's opinion(scouting report) as fact of you just simply don't understand football well enough imo because there is no way you can watch Brooks play and come away with the notion he's just a ST guy. He wasn't highly recruited out of HS and anyone who knows how spring practice works knows it's nearly impossible to be at the bottom of your recruiting class and get noticed in the spring. This is what lead to Brooks not seeing the much during his first 2 years. But even with a stacked FSU secondary Brooks forced his way into the field. Anyone who says he isn't good in man coverage I challenge you to go back and watch tape of 2011 when as a CB and watch his cover skills. He's smart, though, great football IQ, natural leader and a all around great guy. I can't remember what network it was but they called him a steal and I couldn't agree more. Imho the only reason Brooks isn't being talked about as ones ofthe top if not thy top FS in this draft is because he's still learning the position. He playedboth ways in HS as a WR/RB and CB, recruited to FSU as a CB and didn't start learning the FS position until 2012. He might end up being the best of the 3 defenders we've selected thus far and that's really saying something.

Nice post, and although I recognise your bias I've highlighted a few things that I love the sound of. Forcing his way onto the team like that's really cool. Sounds like he's more than up to the challenge of taking that starting jersey off Stewart. How well do you think he could play CB in the pros at a pinch?

 

I don't want to claim him as "my" guy because I'm only one of a ton of people who really liked him before the draft. I've been watching his tape, but haven't seen any of the 2011 stuff yet. I love how well he moves in space, how instinctive he seems to be and although his tackling technique seems inconsistent I think he's shown enough flashes to be fine in a few years.

 

Brooks was the pick I was most excited about. Jernigan could end up being a delayed reflex, but I'm liking him more as well.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Both Jernigan and Brooks will be great. Our defense will be real... we steal a cornerback with one of our four picks left and I say we have a defense that will definitely be in the Top 10, perhaps Top 5.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What I read - I thought it was only the one concussion that caused him to miss both times - but it is kind of vague so it could have been more than one.

 

  • Although he gets into position to finish the play by making an interception, his hands are remarkably poor. After examining every 2013 snap, Brooks dropped at least four interceptions that hit him in the hands. During an interview at the Senior Bowl, I asked Brooks what area he needs to improve upon the most, and he said his hands.
  • Didn’t play in man coverage more than a handful of times a game, if that. It was difficult to get a sense for his change of direction ability because he was rarely asked to play man.

He was a ST player for his first two years. He played more SS than FS in his junior and senior year. Not sure that he's going to be such an upgrade from Elam.

 

I attended 15 games between the 2 years and watched every game at least twice and you are 100% wrong.  Joyner played SS in 2012 and brooks played FS.  In 2013, we played a funky multiple nickel defense with joyner playing as a nickel corner/box safety and Jalen Ramsey our freshman safety played up while brooks played a full Ed Reed type centerfield role this year.  was almost never in the box

 

Brooks came to FSU as a man corner.  He moved to safety to get playing time.  When he was going into his junior year, our secondary was this

 

CB Xavier Rhodes First round pick to the vikings in 2013

CB Greg Reid 5 star CB who got booted for 3rd weed violation, tore his ACL, surgery went wrong and had it redone and he still, 2 years later got signed by the Rams.  First freshman corner to start game 1 at FSU since Deion Sanders

S Lamarcus Joyner 41 overall pick to the rams 

S Was supposed to be Karlos Williams the #1 Safety in the country and a 6'2 225 pound 5 star and #5 overall player in the country.  His brother vince williams (Steelers ILB) was already a starter.  5'10 terrance brooks worked his tail off and beat out karlos in camp.  Despite Karlos' talent, brooks wont the job and kept it which ended up forcing karlos to RB where he will be drafted next year

 

Brooks didnt start because FSU has an insane amount of DB talent.  Rhodes went first rd.  joyner went second rd.  Greg reid would have been drafted.  Our CBs now PJ williams and darby are projected top 100 picks if they leave early.  Brooks was a low 3 star who went in and won a job.  basically the equivalent of our best UDFA coming out of nowhere and beating out a second rd pick and having us cut the second rounder

 

Brooks is not a physical safety.  He is not afraid of contact but he is undersized.  He got burned during the clemson game his junior year and there were questions over his coverage skills.  I dont think we got beat deep once the entire year this year with him playing a centerfield role.  He got the nickname showtime and he became a fan favorite among FSU fans.  He was our most improved player and became an elite safety for us.

 

The ravens have matt elam and need a centerfielder.  Brooks played the role very well on a national championship team and proved his athleticism at the combine.  He will be a great compliment to elam and a great third rounder

 

in general, I wish the ravens paid more attention to offense but please dont comment and say things like he played SS when you have no idea what you are talking about

 

I am not on this board too often but feel free to ask any questions about jernigan and brooks

Edited by gregreid5
8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What I read - I thought it was only the one concussion that caused him to miss both times - but it is kind of vague so it could have been more than one.

 

  • Although he gets into position to finish the play by making an interception, his hands are remarkably poor. After examining every 2013 snap, Brooks dropped at least four interceptions that hit him in the hands. During an interview at the Senior Bowl, I asked Brooks what area he needs to improve upon the most, and he said his hands.
  • Didn’t play in man coverage more than a handful of times a game, if that. It was difficult to get a sense for his change of direction ability because he was rarely asked to play man.

He was a ST player for his first two years. He played more SS than FS in his junior and senior year. Not sure that he's going to be such an upgrade from Elam.

 

Oh boohoo, the safety has bad hands and not a lot of man coverage experience, therefore he's only a ST..... Lol c'mon

 

Anywho, super excited about these two. Going to watch tape eventually, but for now I'm just gonna be stoked because I hear good things about these two. 

Edited by The Raven
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Outside of Rice, Flacco & Torrey - I'm trying to think if we've been successful drafting offense. Perhaps Ozzie doesn't have that "magic" on that side of the ball.

 

I don't know - we had a shot at a decent Safety or TE with our #17 but we go Mosely - who could very well turn out to be a great pick - I just don't see it.

Pitta, KO, Peirce... recently

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tell ya this, though, this is a terrible draft pick unless we do go 4-3. I don't see this guy as a NT or a 3-4 DE in the NFL. From what I've seen and heard, he's the prototype  4-3 3 tech. 

Edited by The Raven
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tell ya this, though, this is a terrible draft pick unless we do go 4-3. I don't see this guy as a NT or a 3-4 DE in the NFL. From what I've seen and heard, he's the prototype  4-3 3 tech. 

 

played 3-4 NT the entire year and this was Pro Football Focus' review of him from the national championship game against an auburn team who ran over every team including bama

 

Jernigan is the best interior lineman that has played for FSU since Darnell Dockett

 

Jernigan Dominates Up Front

It was fairly obvious from the get-go that defensive tackle Timmy Jernigan was the best player on the Florida State defense, despite shots of him looking winded on the sideline at the end of the game. He played 63 of the 82 defensive snaps, graded at +5.9 overall on the night. He was virtually unblockable one-on-one in the running game as he dominated center Reese Dismukes and right guard Chad Slade on his way to a +5.8 grade against the run.

With Auburn running their usual power running game from the shotgun, Jernigan was a menace inside, whether two-gapping against Dismukes, or working across gaps, he managed to get in on six stops on the evening. While he didn’t do much as a pass rusher on his 23 attempts, he did get a hit on quarterback Nick Marshall. Don’t be fooled by Auburn’s high rushing totals, Jernigan had his way with the Auburn interior, and it was a good way to go out if it was indeed his last college game before heading to the NFL Draft.

Edited by gregreid5
3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

played 3-4 NT the entire year and this was Pro Football Focus' review of him from the national championship game against an auburn team who ran over every team including bama

 

Jernigan Dominates Up Front

It was fairly obvious from the get-go that defensive tackle Timmy Jernigan was the best player on the Florida State defense, despite shots of him looking winded on the sideline at the end of the game. He played 63 of the 82 defensive snaps, graded at +5.9 overall on the night. He was virtually unblockable one-on-one in the running game as he dominated center Reese Dismukes and right guard Chad Slade on his way to a +5.8 grade against the run.

With Auburn running their usual power running game from the shotgun, Jernigan was a menace inside, whether two-gapping against Dismukes, or working across gaps, he managed to get in on six stops on the evening. While he didn’t do much as a pass rusher on his 23 attempts, he did get a hit on quarterback Nick Marshall. Don’t be fooled by Auburn’s high rushing totals, Jernigan had his way with the Auburn interior, and it was a good way to go out if it was indeed his last college game before heading to the NFL Draft.

 

Yes, thank you for telling me what I already know. This is why I specified that I don't see him as a 3-4 DL in the NFL.

 

He's 6'2. He's barely 300, if that. His game is about penetrating gaps, not controlling them. What about him makes him a good fit for two-gap 3-4 in the NFL?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tell ya this, though, this is a terrible draft pick unless we do go 4-3. I don't see this guy as a NT or a 3-4 DE in the NFL. From what I've seen and heard, he's the prototype  4-3 3 tech. 

This is a huge point I agree with. If we don't switch to a 4-3, I think we've picked the wrong guys and created too much of the wrong kind of clutter for our roster.

 

It probably deserves its own thread because the more you look into it the more there is to consider, but I think taking Jernigan with Nix still on the board showed an intent to switch. I really didn't expect Jernigan so I haven't watched much tape or done whole lot of reading up on him yet, but from what I gather he projects to more of a 4-3 NT/DT. On the other side of it, Nix sounds more like a prototypical 3-4 NT.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong here though, I'm really not an expert on DL stuff.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice post, and although I recognise your bias I've highlighted a few things that I love the sound of. Forcing his way onto the team like that's really cool. Sounds like he's more than up to the challenge of taking that starting jersey off Stewart. How well do you think he could play CB in the pros at a pinch?

 

I don't want to claim him as "my" guy because I'm only one of a ton of people who really liked him before the draft. I've been watching his tape, but haven't seen any of the 2011 stuff yet. I love how well he moves in space, how instinctive he seems to be and although his tackling technique seems inconsistent I think he's shown enough flashes to be fine in a few years.

 

Brooks was the pick I was most excited about. Jernigan could end up being a delayed reflex, but I'm liking him more as well.

I think you'll have the flexibility to have him match up with a few WRs during the game, but if you're asking could he do it for a 2-3 game stretch, I'm sure he could, but much like the Webb to FS it probably wouldn't happen. Much like Jimmy, I think he'll play alot of ST early, even as a starter because that's just how Harbs is. I think in today's NFL we are forced to take the good with the bad when it comes to these young guys talking. Just hope you have a guy who's a pretty sound tackler and for the most part he is

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is a huge point I agree with. If we don't switch to a 4-3, I think we've picked the wrong guys and created too much of the wrong kind of clutter for our roster.

 

It probably deserves its own thread because the more you look into it the more there is to consider, but I think taking Jernigan with Nix still on the board showed an intent to switch. I really didn't expect Jernigan so I haven't watched much tape or done whole lot of reading up on him yet, but from what I gather he projects to more of a 4-3 NT/DT. On the other side of it, Nix sounds more like a prototypical 3-4 NT.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong here though, I'm really not an expert on DL stuff.

 

Jernigan, as I mentioned, is the perfect 4-3 DT. Putting him in our two gap 3-4 is an egregious misuse of his talent.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jernigan, as I mentioned, is the perfect 4-3 DT. Putting him in our two gap 3-4 is an egregious misuse of his talent.

That's what I've gathered so far. I'm just trying to figure out why we'd take him to play a two-gap DL role with a quality 0-tech guy still available. To me that says we're either planning a switch, or Ozzie Newsome - arguably one of the best assessors of DL talent in the league - misread Jernigan's talent and took the wrong guy, or that what I currently know of the DL guys on the board is way off base.

 

If it's the last one, I'd like to know. If it's either of the first two, I want to know if I should be excited or worried.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tell ya this, though, this is a terrible draft pick unless we do go 4-3. I don't see this guy as a NT or a 3-4 DE in the NFL. From what I've seen and heard, he's the prototype  4-3 3 tech.

Haloti Ngata was said to be a prototype 4-3 DT and look how that worked out for us. We basically created aposition for Suggs who was considered a hand in the dirt 4-3 DE. You can go off what you read, that's just someone else's opinion. What have you seen from him that leads you to this conclusion?

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think you'll have the flexibility to have him match up with a few WRs during the game, but if you're asking could he do it for a 2-3 game stretch, I'm sure he could, but much like the Webb to FS it probably wouldn't happen. Much like Jimmy, I think he'll play alot of ST early, even as a starter because that's just how Harbs is. I think in today's NFL we are forced to take the good with the bad when it comes to these young guys talking. Just hope you have a guy who's a pretty sound tackler and for the most part he is

I'm just thinking of how he might perform if something big happened (say Webb tears his ACL again and Chykie's out for two weeks with a concussion). If he can cover the role for a bit and look like he still has a place in the league, that makes him a more valuable player imo.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First off as a Noles fan I couldn't be happier with the selection of Timmy and Brooks. But besides just being a fan, the Ravens really got two special players and both will help this defense get backinto the elite status.

As has already been touched on Timmy is better suited for the 3 tech, but because of his power, strength and being so stout at the point of attack we asked him to play a lot of nose and basically just eliminate the Center making it hard for teams to run. He's alot like Ngata for our system in the sense that he'll be able to move up and down the line at will. I've seen some people complain that this was a wasted pick because of our depth at the DL, well I strongly disagree because we don't currently have aguy as good as Timmy. Just knowing the upside of this guy, I think we more then replaced Art with this pick and if/when guys like Tyson, KPL and Williams continue to develop then great.

As for Brooks, anyone who thinks he's just a ST guy either hasn't seen the guy play and are just taking someone else's opinion(scouting report) as fact of you just simply don't understand football well enough imo because there is no way you can watch Brooks play and come away with the notion he's just a ST guy. He wasn't highly recruited out of HS and anyone who knows how spring practice works knows it's nearly impossible to be at the bottom of your recruiting class and get noticed in the spring. This is what lead to Brooks not seeing the much during his first 2 years. But even with a stacked FSU secondary Brooks forced his way into the field. Anyone who says he isn't good in man coverage I challenge you to go back and watch tape of 2011 when as a CB and watch his cover skills. He's smart, though, great football IQ, natural leader and a all around great guy. I can't remember what network it was but they called him a steal and I couldn't agree more. Imho the only reason Brooks isn't being talked about as ones ofthe top if not thy top FS in this draft is because he's still learning the position. He playedboth ways in HS as a WR/RB and CB, recruited to FSU as a CB and didn't start learning the FS position until 2012. He might end up being the best of the 3 defenders we've selected thus far and that's really saying something.

 

I did say "from what I've read" so obviously I was talking scouting reports. Isn't that what they do though? Watch the guy play and pick strengths & weaknesses?

 

And that was my original complaint was that he was still learning the position.

 

I attended 15 games between the 2 years and watched every game at least twice and you are 100% wrong.  Joyner played SS in 2012 and brooks played FS.  In 2013, we played a funky multiple nickel defense with joyner playing as a nickel corner/box safety and Jalen Ramsey our freshman safety played up while brooks played a full Ed Reed type centerfield role this year.  was almost never in the box

 

Brooks came to FSU as a man corner.  He moved to safety to get playing time.  When he was going into his junior year, our secondary was this

 

CB Xavier Rhodes First round pick to the vikings in 2013

CB Greg Reid 5 star CB who got booted for 3rd weed violation, tore his ACL, surgery went wrong and had it redone and he still, 2 years later got signed by the Rams.  First freshman corner to start game 1 at FSU since Deion Sanders

S Lamarcus Joyner 41 overall pick to the rams 

S Was supposed to be Karlos Williams the #1 Safety in the country and a 6'2 225 pound 5 star and #5 overall player in the country.  His brother vince williams (Steelers ILB) was already a starter.  5'10 terrance brooks worked his tail off and beat out karlos in camp.  Despite Karlos' talent, brooks wont the job and kept it which ended up forcing karlos to RB where he will be drafted next year

 

Brooks didnt start because FSU has an insane amount of DB talent.  Rhodes went first rd.  joyner went second rd.  Greg reid would have been drafted.  Our CBs now PJ williams and darby are projected top 100 picks if they leave early.  Brooks was a low 3 star who went in and won a job.  basically the equivalent of our best UDFA coming out of nowhere and beating out a second rd pick and having us cut the second rounder

 

Brooks is not a physical safety.  He is not afraid of contact but he is undersized.  He got burned during the clemson game his junior year and there were questions over his coverage skills.  I dont think we got beat deep once the entire year this year with him playing a centerfield role.  He got the nickname showtime and he became a fan favorite among FSU fans.  He was our most improved player and became an elite safety for us.

 

The ravens have matt elam and need a centerfielder.  Brooks played the role very well on a national championship team and proved his athleticism at the combine.  He will be a great compliment to elam and a great third rounder

 

in general, I wish the ravens paid more attention to offense but please dont comment and say things like he played SS when you have no idea what you are talking about

 

I am not on this board too often but feel free to ask any questions about jernigan and brooks

 

"After spending two years in a reserve role, he started all 14 games at free safety in '12 and had 51-4-2 with one tackle for loss and one forced fumble. Started 13 games for the '13 national champions (five at free safety, eight at strong safety), "

 

I stand corrected - the original source only cited his senior year, when in his junior year he did play FS exclusively.

 

Pitta, KO, Peirce... recently

 

You can't count KO yet. Hopefully you're correct - and I hope you are - but we've not seen that yet.

Pitta was a 4th round pick - I was specifically talking about early picks we've spent on offense though I wasn't clear on that.

Pierce was a 3rd round pick - while there is a lot of potential there - not sure we can say he's a roaring success yet.

 

To be clear - not even talking talent with these picks - I am talking about the defense taking all the early round draft picks once again.

 

Most in here touting how great this draft is will be the first ones screaming if the offense underperforms again. When they're reminded that we give the offense no help - they'll call it "excuses" and cite bringing in a TE & a WR (big fan of Smith's btw) at the end of their careers "help".

Edited by ravensdfan
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yanda - I knew I was forgetting someone still playing on the team.

Holmes was an undrafted FA. Lewis was 14 years ago.

Grubbs - 7 years ago. Heap - 13 years ago.

Maybe it is time to focus on offense in the earlier rounds.

I think our FO tried. Easily could've been Zack martin&Jordan matthews. Just the guy we want were gone. We just moved onto who was next on board. Edited by Ravenseconbeast
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All may be true but we have so much depth on the D line - we're ignoring offense yet again and we have serious needs on that side of the ball.

 

All we ever give the offense are the scrub picks. It's getting beyond old now especially after we were told how now we were going to build our offense like we did defense for so many years.

 

 

Kubiak, Monroe, Zuttah, Smith, Owens............. not sure how you can say we have ignored the O.

 

Smart move to draft BPA.  The O will be fine.

5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kubiak, Monroe, Zuttah, Smith, Owens............. not sure how you can say we have ignored the O.

Smart move to draft BPA. The O will be fine.

We can even throw Pitta and JJ on that list as well since they were technically free agents.

Losing Art was a big deal so replacing him early in the draft makes total and complete sense. I like this Jernigan cat a lot, especially when Sizzle puts his hand in the dirt and we show more of that 4-3 look.

Defense wins championships.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tell ya this, though, this is a terrible draft pick unless we do go 4-3. I don't see this guy as a NT or a 3-4 DE in the NFL. From what I've seen and heard, he's the prototype 4-3 3 tech.

After our first pick I assumed we would see more 4-3 sets. The 2nd pick solidified what I was thinking. It makes sense to get our guys on the field and utilize the guys we have. McPhee is a better 4-3 DE than OLB. Suggs has played DE and so has Doom. Canty was a DT and I think Williams will be a beast whether 3-4 or 4-3 but he can be a FORCE in a 4-3 lineup.

Everyone should calm down. In Ozzie we trust right?

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kubiak, Monroe, Zuttah, Smith, Owens............. not sure how you can say we have ignored the O.

Smart move to draft BPA. The O will be fine.

no real young top talent though. Short term fixes brought in from the outside.

I suppose you could still class monroe as a great improvement because he is still a recent transaction.

In a perfect world you would ad equally to both sides of the ball though. And comparing out additions to d and o the past two years it's extremely one sided.

Our defense needs to be off the charts to justify the heavy additions on its side og the ball. They have no excuse this year.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I did say "from what I've read" so obviously I was talking scouting reports. Isn't that what they do though? Watch the guy play and pick strengths & weaknesses?

 

And that was my original complaint was that he was still learning the position.

 

 

"After spending two years in a reserve role, he started all 14 games at free safety in '12 and had 51-4-2 with one tackle for loss and one forced fumble. Started 13 games for the '13 national champions (five at free safety, eight at strong safety), "

 

I stand corrected - the original source only cited his senior year, when in his junior year he did play FS exclusively.

 

 

You can't count KO yet. Hopefully you're correct - and I hope you are - but we've not seen that yet.

Pitta was a 4th round pick - I was specifically talking about early picks we've spent on offense though I wasn't clear on that.

Pierce was a 3rd round pick - while there is a lot of potential there - not sure we can say he's a roaring success yet.

 

To be clear - not even talking talent with these picks - I am talking about the defense taking all the early round draft picks once again.

 

Most in here touting how great this draft is will be the first ones screaming if the offense underperforms again. When they're reminded that we give the offense no help - they'll call it "excuses" and cite bringing in a TE & a WR (big fan of Smith's btw) at the end of their careers "help".

 

 

I understand you got it from an article.  I watch more FSU football then any scout out there.  Mark stoops played a very weird system in 2012 where he called his centerfield safety a strong safety and the box safety and free safety.  That caused confusion on brooks

 

In 2013, brooks played almost exclusively in centerfield.  He started the last 10 games next to the same guy so he didnt play both safety positions.  He was the centerfielder as FSU.  You can call it a strong or free safety but he played as a Raven free safety and compliments elam perfectly.

 

 

I wanted us to grab more offense.  The draft didnt drop that way.  I wanted Martin in rd 1.  I was hoping Lee fell in rd 2.  I was hoping Lattimer dropped to us in rd 3.  Ozzie did not have enough ammunition to move up and we didnt have guys drop to us that compare to these players.  Not sure why people want us to force picks for inferior players who wont start on offense anyway because we will play 2 TE and 2 WR and those spots are locked.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no real young top talent though. Short term fixes brought in from the outside.

I suppose you could still class monroe as a great improvement because he is still a recent transaction.

In a perfect world you would ad equally to both sides of the ball though. And comparing out additions to d and o the past two years it's extremely one sided.

Our defense needs to be off the charts to justify the heavy additions on its side og the ball. They have no excuse this year.

 

Absolutely. They need to be a defense capable of carrying an inept offense to the SB if necessary. Period. We have not done anything near as much for the offense except throw them hand me down vets and developmental scrub picks. Time for the defense to show that wasn't a mistake.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Absolutely. They need to be a defense capable of carrying an inept offense to the SB if necessary. Period. We have not done anything near as much for the offense except throw them hand me down vets and developmental scrub picks. Time for the defense to show that wasn't a mistake.

Injuries played a huge role in a historically bad offense though.  We already  have young Wrs on the team Smith, Brown, Mellette yet to play.  On the line Monroe, Yanda, and KO healthy is big.  We're only getting better.  Rb is the only spot I wish we would've addressed earlier through the draft but I feel like West going before our second 3rd is why we went Gilmore.  At the end of the day our offense is going as far as Flacco takes it.  He had a down year, and people can blame that on the line. But if Flacco is playing well with the pieces we have now we will have a solid offense.  

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I did say "from what I've read" so obviously I was talking scouting reports. Isn't that what they do though? Watch the guy play and pick strengths & weaknesses?

 

And that was my original complaint was that he was still learning the position

Yes that's what they do but like anything else some are better at it then others. My point is just be careful about basing such astrong opinion on someone else's view. Some of those guys watch hundreds of hours on one player, but most times they are only taking 3-4 games on a player and base their overall opinion on that small sample.

Yes he's still learning but not to the point that he can't become an immediate contributor. I think some times we just want the guy labeled as a stud in the draft, but it's the guys like Webb who you see showing up around the NFL as guys who weren't viewed as studs, but the become among the best.

I get what you are saying, I just feel the he's only a ST guy was highly inaccurate.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no real young top talent though. Short term fixes brought in from the outside.

I suppose you could still class monroe as a great improvement because he is still a recent transaction.

In a perfect world you would ad equally to both sides of the ball though. And comparing out additions to d and o the past two years it's extremely one sided.

Our defense needs to be off the charts to justify the heavy additions on its side og the ball. They have no excuse this year.

That logic sounds good, but you can only add what's available. Could we have added a WR early? Of course, but you have to ask yourself two questions imo. Is that position of need better then the player you have ranked highest on your board. Also is that player of need better then what you currently have? I think CJ was a no brainer at 17, so now you look at who was available with the picks of Timmy and Terrence and if those prospects are better then what you feel you have in Marlon Brown, Mellette, Wanger and Jensen.

If you don't feel those prospects are better then what to you have this upgrading you, why go offense just to say you're focused on adding to both sides of the ball. Why not continue to add quality talent to your defense in3 key positions where you either have an immediate need or have aging player?

Building a team through the draft is like building a business. While having immediate production is great, it'll ultimately be what you build directed towards longevity that'll put you on the greatest position.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now