Is Flacco FINALLY gaining respect from the media? This is weird

[Ravensfan23]

I think we're all just going in circles here.

 

seems to be common place for any Flacco thread

[PerpetuallyBored74]

I still think i have a valid point.  It's really your opinion against mine.   But to be paid that much and to have a performance like last year, whether it be from poor offense supporting cast kind of tells me Flacco isn't great.  

 

Put some pieces around him, and i think he will thrive.   Believe it or not, I have some (relatively positive) optimism for Flacco doing well this season.   Why?  B/C he has the pieces around him to do so.   You can argue Peyton having a great cast now, but how about Andrew Luck last year?  What about Brady last year? or Philip Rivers?  Those are 'great cast'?  Just sayin..

 

Football is really a team sports.  Teams that really understands how to work together eventually wins the big one.  I think if anything, Flacco is the first guy in the team to always realize that.  But there are very few exceptional QB that really stands out and be a 'great' one that puts a major weight on his shoulders.  Flacco just isn't that guy. 

 

The offensive coaching staff and offensive scheme are also part of a QB's "cast"

Why do you think we got rid of both the scheme and the coaches?

 

I've yet to see ANY QB overcome poor offensive talent AND poor coaching AND poor scheme.

Show me the HoF QB who did not have at least good coaching, good scheme and good offensive talent around him for at least a good part of his career?

 

The closest I can come up with is Elway, who finally got the talent and coaches near the end of his career and thus his only 2 SB rings.

[PolishRifle]

The offensive coaching staff and offensive scheme are also part of a QB's "cast"

Why do you think we got rid of both the scheme and the coaches?

 

Cam should've been fired after 2011. Joe posted his third 3600+ yrds ~20TD ~10INT season in a row. Right then Harbs should've noticed, that Joe maxed out Cameron's system. Not surprising since Drew Brees posted similar stats in San Diego with arguably superior personal surrounding him. Rather than "accepting", that this is where Joe's production plateaus, we should've looked for a new system altogether. 

 

I'm very excited for the next season. I always believed, that Joe was held back by a playbook, which he outgrew years ago. This is the year, when I'm going to be proved right. I just know it.

[Guest RBates]

Ok but you haven't answered my question. Because based on some of these other contracts I see QBs getting I could make a case that Flacco has more then played up to his contract. But what does a decent season consistent of? Is it 4,300yds 30tds 8ints and a playoff berth? Does he need to be a pro bowler? What is decent, because I could say that if he didn't has so many INTs last season his season would have been decent. So if he does the same numbers this year but cuts down on the ints, puts up another 3Tds and gets us into the playoffs with one more win, does that solidify his contract? I've never been good a science, rocket nor any other, so you're gonna have to help me out a little bit here lol. What exactly is you're definition of decent?

 

I do agree that I don't want to see average play from Flacco and thus far we've only gotten slightly above that. We will not win the SB the same way again, so if anyone thinks we can repeat the 2012 season in any way i'd caution them not to wait on it. Flacco has to be better and I see no reason to think he won't. Not for contract sake, but because the guy is way more talented then his numbers and overall play would suggest. Imo every great QB had a coach or overall system that brought out the absolute best in them, I think both the system and Kubes will do that for Flacco. But we'll see.

I have to agree with this point,  However i think it will be Owen Daniels and Kubiak that bring out the best in Flacco.  I agree that he was in a bad system with mediocre talent around him.  But now you have two outside guys, two guys that can work the middle of the field and a decent line and run game.

 

A decent year would be one were I could say that he led us to wins instead of causing us to lose. I'm getting tired of mentioning his name at critical points in games and being right about him giving the game away. 

[Gordo52]

Anyone else see that POC KC Joyner article on espn insider? It makes me wonder why I pay for it....

Contrary to popular belief, success for the Ravens has largely come when their offense has played well.

That doesn't bode well for the 2014 squad. The Ravens are coming off a season in which they finished 25th in the league in points scored and had horrible metrics in nearly every area. And they don't seem likely to get any better.

The addition of new offensive coordinator Gary Kubiak notwithstanding, the Ravens haven't done enough this offseason to improve their statistical outlook on offense. At this point, it's difficult to consider them a strong playoff contender.

...

The problems on offense aren't just on the ground. According to ESPN Stats & Information, the Ravens averaged a mere 8.7 yards per attempt (YPA) on vertical passes (aerials traveling 11 or more yards downfield). That was the lowest vertical YPA in the league and was four-tenths of a yard lower than the next-lowest-ranked team in this category (Carolina, 9.1).

This is a fundamental reason Baltimore also ranked tied for last in Total QBR on vertical throws (58.9). To put this performance into perspective, 11 teams had a higher Total QBR mark on short passes (those traveling 10 or fewer yards downfield). In other words, one-third of the league rated better on dink-and-dunk passes than the Ravens did on their downfield throws, despite Total QBR being heavily weighted in favor of longer throws.

...

• Daniels and Smith could continue to battle age and injury. The hype over Pitta stems from his breakout 2012 campaign. And yet that season, his 8.0 vertical YPA placed 37th among 43 qualifying tight ends. He might not be as impactful as is generally thought.

That last quote is hilarious. Who the hell cares about a TE's vertical ypa? Pitta's value comes mostly from 3rd downs and redzone opportunities... Like most TE's lol.

This guy is the worst pointless stats geek around. It's clear he doesn't believe in studying game tape. The comments are what made me post this article in this thread. He's basically disrespecting Joe and the entire offense if he believes the offense could be just as bad as last season. & Why is he pulling up weird created stats from last year to show what will happen this year?

http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?storyId=11169239

Just a boring time of the offseason. Figured this is something to post. lol

[Ravensfan23]

Anyone else see that POC KC Joyner article on espn insider? It makes me wonder why I pay for it....

That last quote is hilarious. Who the hell cares about a TE's vertical ypa? Pitta's value comes mostly from 3rd downs and redzone opportunities... Like most TE's lol.

This guy is the worst pointless stats geek around. It's clear he doesn't believe in studying game tape. The comments are what made me post this article in this thread. He's basically disrespecting Joe and the entire offense if he believes the offense could be just as bad as last season. & Why is he pulling up weird created stats from last year to show what will happen this year?

http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?storyId=11169239

Just a boring time of the offseason. Figured this is something to post. lol

 

who cares? I've gotten to the point where I don't pay attention to any of those guys nearly as much as I used to. I'd rather read a blog featuring people who post here rather then some of these so called experts who get paid to talk football. All they know is stats, I haven't found too many guys who actually take the time to breakdown why a team was either good or bad.

 

This guy clearly doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to the Ravens and he's just basing any opinion off what he saw last year. KO is a pro bowl caliber LG, A.Q Shipley probably won't even be on the roster this year, how is that not an upgrade? Zuttah isn't a stud by any means, but he's a solid Center where as Gino was ranked like 35th among Centers last year and there is only 32 teams. I'd say it shouldn't be hard to upgrade from that. Most of the Ravens issues last season came as a result of injury, with all those guys coming back you can view that as an upgrade over the backups we had playing last year. Imo the article would have made more sense if he spoke to the fact that chances of everyone coming back off injury and returning to pervious form shouldn't be viewed as high. Or if he would have said that a new system will take time to get accustom to, but he arguments just make him seem like a rival fan who hopes the Ravens have no shot.

[Gordo52]

who cares?

I agree, just bored!

[ravensdan]

According to the players. Nfl network top 100....

1-3 manning/Brady/Brees

4. Rodgers

5. Wilson

6. Newton

7. Luck

8. Roethlisberger

9. Rivers

10. Flacco

11. Foles

12. Romo

13. Kaepernick

14. Stafford

[BSHU_Miami]

According to the players. Nfl network top 100....

1-3 manning/Brady/Brees

4. Rodgers

5. Wilson

6. Newton

7. Luck

8. Roethlisberger

9. Rivers

10. Flacco

11. Foles

12. Romo

13. Kaepernick

14. Stafford

ahhh Matty butt nowhere to be found. Lovely

[RavensFan34950]

According to the players. Nfl network top 100....

1-3 manning/Brady/Brees

4. Rodgers

5. Wilson

6. Newton

7. Luck

8. Roethlisberger

9. Rivers

10. Flacco

11. Foles

12. Romo

13. Kaepernick

14. Stafford

HAHA and no Matt Ryan. That just made my day.

[flynismo]

Just goes to show how stupid these lists can be, even when it comes from guys who have more credibility.... there are NOT at least 14 better QBs than Ryan.

[TDubbs]

Just goes to show how stupid these lists can be, even when it comes from guys who have more credibility.... there are NOT at least 14 better QBs than Ryan.

 

Totally agree. Foles (as great as his season was) and Kaep (32 games played) .. are not better than Matt Ryan. Factor in the fact the guy didn't even make the top 100 in general (which is a dumb list to begin with), is ridiculous. 

[1/28/01]

11. Foles

12. Romo

13. Kaepernick

14. Stafford

Better that Ryan? Hahahahaha!

[flynismo]

Totally agree. Foles (as great as his season was) and Kaep (32 games played) .. are not better than Matt Ryan. Factor in the fact the guy didn't even make the top 100 in general (which is a dumb list to begin with), is ridiculous. 

 

It's crazy how fickle people are....Ryan used to annoy me simply because he was inducted into Canton the minute he declared for the draft. People crapped on Flacco non-stop. In the matter of one season, the tables seemingly are reversed....which is made even weirder by the fact that Flacco is coming off a horrible year. I think that anyone who does not have both Flacco and Ryan in their top 10 needs to put the crack pipe down. Or at least ease up on the crack smoking

[52520Andrew]

It's crazy how fickle people are....Ryan used to annoy me simply because he was inducted into Canton the minute he declared for the draft. People crapped on Flacco non-stop. In the matter of one season, the tables seemingly are reversed....which is made even weirder by the fact that Flacco is coming off a horrible year. I think that anyone who does not have both Flacco and Ryan in their top 10 needs to put the crack pipe down. Or at least ease up on the crack smoking

I agree, I have both ranked in my top 10. Ryan lost his top 2 targets and had an O-line almost as bad as ours. Can't really fault either QB for what they had around them this past year.

[ravensdan]

It's crazy how fickle people are....Ryan used to annoy me simply because he was inducted into Canton the minute he declared for the draft. People crapped on Flacco non-stop. In the matter of one season, the tables seemingly are reversed....which is made even weirder by the fact that Flacco is coming off a horrible year. I think that anyone who does not have both Flacco and Ryan in their top 10 needs to put the crack pipe down. Or at least ease up on the crack smoking

Ok, here's mine. I'm basing this on 2014. Not just what they've done already...I'm also basing it on individual talent. Not based around the rest of the team.

1. Rodgers

2. Brady

3. Brees

4. Manning

5. Luck

6. Flacco

7. Roethlisberger

8. Newton

9. Ryan

10. Rivers

11. Romo

12. Cutler

13. Eli manning

14. Kaepernick

15. Stafford

16. Foles

17 Wilson

18. Griffin 3

19. Dalton

20. Smith

21. Mccown

22. Bradford

23. Palmer

24. Tannehill

25. Locker

26. Bridgewater

27. Manuel

28. Geno smith

29. Schaub

30. Fitzpatrick

31. Henne

32. Hoyer

[Militant X 1]

Just goes to show how stupid these lists can be, even when it comes from guys who have more credibility.... there are NOT at least 14 better QBs than Ryan.

So, one minute when we (fans) criticize the coaches and players; it is said that we don't know about the business like them; and now, when the "players" themselves have chosen who should be placed where on the top 100 players in the NFL list or left off it all together; now you say the list is stupid even though it came from the players who are more credible than you and me?  You cats can't have it both ways brah!  lol!

 

#Mili

[flynismo]

So, one minute when we (fans) criticize the coaches and players; it is said that we don't know about the business like them; and now, when the "players" themselves have chosen who should be placed where on the top 100 players in the NFL list or left off it all together; now you say the list is stupid even though it came from the players who are more credible than you and me?  You cats can't have it both ways brah!  lol!

 

#Mili

It's not the same thing brah! smh!

 

Ranking players is purely opinion. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

There are tangible variables and considerations for us to evaluate when we talk about how "stupid" it was for us to release Boldin.

[52520Andrew]

So, one minute when we (fans) criticize the coaches and players; it is said that we don't know about the business like them; and now, when the "players" themselves have chosen who should be placed where on the top 100 players in the NFL list or left off it all together; now you say the list is stupid even though it came from the players who are more credible than you and me? You cats can't have it both ways brah! lol!

#Mili

I honestly don't take the rankings to heart with these lists. They are cool to see and it introduces me to a couple players a year that I hadn't heard of. With that said however, this is the same list that didn't have Jimmy Graham or Yanda on the list last year. Trust me when I say that their rankings are in no way perfect, just like any other ranking.

[ravensdfan]

So, one minute when we (fans) criticize the coaches and players; it is said that we don't know about the business like them; and now, when the "players" themselves have chosen who should be placed where on the top 100 players in the NFL list or left off it all together; now you say the list is stupid even though it came from the players who are more credible than you and me?  You cats can't have it both ways brah!  lol!

 

#Mili

 

So you think Peyton coming in on the list when he didn't play an entire season makes sense?

 

Fact is - the lists really aren't logical - all the players don't respond, a very small percentage do which absolutely is going to make the results decidedly less than accurate. Despite the fact the list is supposed to be based on expectations for the coming season and not reputation -we all know that isn't the case.

 

They mean nothing really. How can a guy in the NFCW for instance, that perhaps only played anyone in the AFCN once or never, supposed to give an accurate account of the players there? Reputation. Period.

 

Personally I don't care if anyone "fears" Flacco - as long as we win games, division titles, post season games and Lombardis.

[TDubbs]

So you think Peyton coming in on the list when he didn't play an entire season makes sense?

 

Fact is - the lists really aren't logical - all the players don't respond, a very small percentage do which absolutely is going to make the results decidedly less than accurate. Despite the fact the list is supposed to be based on expectations for the coming season and not reputation -we all know that isn't the case.

 

This is the truth right here. Also, why do they make the list based on expectations for the coming season? That makes it far too subjective and projection based. It is mainly reputation and how they performed in the previous season. Rankings aside, I do enjoy the player profiles, NFL Films does a great job on that. 

[ravensdfan]

This is the truth right here. Also, why do they make the list based on expectations for the coming season? That makes it far too subjective and projection based. It is mainly reputation and how they performed in the previous season. Rankings aside, I do enjoy the player profiles, NFL Films does a great job on that. 

 

Yes I like those profiles as well. It is perhaps the only saving grace of the list.

[ravensdan]

I heard it mentioned somewhere it would be a good idea to choose a specific panel of players. A cross section. A few coaches. A few front office or scouting people and a few analysts like Greg cossell. Now that would be a good list.

[jimjim5]

Flacco has had a good career, but if we had Newton, Wilson, or Kap in 2013 we probably would have won 1-2 more games. Neg me all you want but anybody

who says otherwise is drinking too much purple koolaid.

Those guys are not better than Flacco... Yet. Kapernick? That is funny. He can't hit the side of a barn door. And he doesn't progress through his

reads.

Flacco was a slave to the offensive system.... Y'all will see this year. We win with Flacco and a limp offensive system (before Kubiak). We win because of Flacco.

Plug ANY other QB into our old offensive system and see how many wins we would rack up.... Not many. (Remember Cam Cameron and Beck with the Miami Dolphins and 1 win?