Dean Pees

[ravensdfan]

You didn't answer my question... There's a theme here, isn't there?

 

I'm a little tired of the Pees' apologists too.

 

We have talent. We gave them the last 6 high draft picks. 

 

Still, we have vanilla schemes and no QB pressure.

 

Pees is a problem. It's time to admit it.

[The Raven]

I'm a little tired of the Pees' apologists too.

 

We have talent. We gave them the last 6 high draft picks. 

 

Still, we have vanilla schemes and no QB pressure.

 

Pees is a problem. It's time to admit it.

 

Let me repeat the question so you have another chance to answer:

 

"How do coaches get blamed for pro bowlers not shedding blocks?"

 

By the way, four of those six draft picks played today, and they played quite well. You have to actually look at the positions we drafted before complaining about them. 

[ravensdfan]

Let me repeat the question so you have another chance to answer:

 

"How do coaches get blamed for pro bowlers not shedding blocks?"

 

By the way, four of those six draft picks played today, and they played quite well. You have to actually look at the positions we drafted before complaining about them. 

 

I answered. Coaches are the ones there every single day. If a player has a weakness, if they have issues with anything, exactly like shedding blocks, it is their job to 1. notice that issue 2. work on that issue 3. make sure it has been fixed.

 

It is their job to at the very least field a team that resembles an NFL squad. Which they did not today, for the most part, outside of 1. red zone play (where the field is much smaller) and 2. a few plays by a few players here and there.

[Militant X 1]

I'm a little tired of the Pees' apologists too.

 

We have talent. We gave them the last 6 high draft picks. 

 

Still, we have vanilla schemes and no QB pressure.

 

Pees is a problem. It's time to admit it.

 

Absolutely!!  Now, you know me ravensdfan; that I'm not sold on our offense whatsoever.  Especially, after what I saw from them last season and seen today...pathetic!  But that's me!  However, as a lover of defense I must totally agree with you here!  I like an aggressive D.C. that can dial up some serious heat for the opposing QB.  I saw very little to none of that today but that's on the players!

 

@Mili

[The Raven]

I answered. Coaches are the ones there every single day. If a player has a weakness, if they have issues with anything, exactly like shedding blocks, it is their job to 1. notice that issue 2. work on that issue 3. make sure it has been fixed.

 

It is their job to at the very least field a team that resembles an NFL squad. Which they did not today, for the most part, outside of 1. red zone play (where the field is much smaller) and 2. a few plays by a few players here and there.

 

So you blame Pees for Suggs, Dumervil, and Ngata being unable to shed blocks, even though they're all all pro bowlers who haven't had problems shedding blocks before? Cool.

 

They held the Bengals to five FGs and one TD, and you think they didn't resemble an NFL squad? WOW! It's like you aren't even trying here.

[ravensdfan]

Absolutely!!  Now, you know me ravensdfan; that I'm not sold on our offense whatsoever.  Especially, after what I saw from them last season and seen today...pathetic!  But that's me!  However, as a lover of defense I must totally agree with you here!  Pees is too soft!  He got to go!  I need an aggressive D.C. that can dial up some serious heat for the opposing QB.  I saw very little to none of that today!  Trash!  SMH!!

 

@Mili

 

I was not impressed with our offense today either. Anytime to have your QB throwing over 60 times a game though - it's an issue.

 

I'm still trying to figure out why every receiving target in the league that cannot catch winds up on our team!

 

But, on topic, Pees is just not the right fit.

[ravensdfan]

So you blame Pees for Suggs, Dumervil, and Ngata being unable to shed blocks, even though they're all all pro bowlers who haven't had problems shedding blocks before? Cool.

 

They held the Bengals to five FGs and one TD, and you think they didn't resemble an NFL squad? WOW! It's like you aren't even trying here.

 

I blame Pees for having no creative solutions when things fail. I blame Pees for not having any creative blitz packages. I blame Pees for obviously not knowing what a screen pass is nor how to defend against one.

[The Raven]

I blame Pees for having no creative solutions when things fail. I blame Pees for not having any creative blitz packages. I blame Pees for obviously not knowing what a screen pass is nor how to defend against one.

 

Look at the top five defenses last year and tell me how many of them NEEDED blitzes to get pressure. I'll wait.

[Militant X 1]

I was not impressed with our offense today either. Anytime to have your QB throwing over 60 times a game though - it's an issue.

 

I'm still trying to figure out why every receiving target in the league that cannot catch winds up on our team!

 

But, on topic, Pees is just not the right fit.

 

I was shocked by Smith, Sr.'s drops but Jacoby?  Never had the best of hands imo.

 

@Mili

[edthehead]

Let me repeat the question so you have another chance to answer:

 

"How do coaches get blamed for pro bowlers not shedding blocks?"

 

By the way, four of those six draft picks played today, and they played quite well. You have to actually look at the positions we drafted before complaining about them. 

the last 2/3 yrs our draft have had a huge emphasis on his scheme 'DANNY BOY' he was a part of the selection process,OL'DANNY BOY,do not have the correct schemes in place he do not play to his players strengths,,MR.RAVEN,,you have been here long enough to know,A coordinator is suppose to put his players in position to make plays,    DANNY BOY does not,I have always spoke out against him,he is a good DC but he is not for us, Huff and players got benched and cut if they did not do their job,suggs got an extension,why because he still have a little left in the tank,,,   

[52N19]

i don't know how you can blame pees. every one talks about chykie browns play against green at the end of the game. the bengals picked on brown ALL day. every pass was to browns side of the filed and went for a minimum of 8 yards.

 

#2 its not pees fault. i though dumerville and suggs were supposed to get to the quarterback. dalton had all day to throw. at some point your so called stars need to play like stars. it looks like elvis has left the building.

[The Raven]

the last 2/3 yrs our draft have had a huge emphasis on his scheme 'DANNY BOY' he was a part of the selection process,OL'DANNY BOY,do not have the correct schemes in place he do not play to his players strengths,,MR.RAVEN,,you have been here long enough to know,A coordinator is suppose to put his players in position to make plays,    DANNY BOY does not,I have always spoke out against him,he is a good DC but he is not for us, Huff and players got benched and cut if they did not do their job,suggs got an extension,why because he still have a little left in the tank,,,   

 

Tell me more about what Pees can do to make Suggs and Dumervil better when we haven't addressed those positions?

 

The thing you clearly can't comprehend is that we've addressed every position except OLB/DE. Yes, we spent six high picks on D. None were OLBs/DEs. They were safeties, tackles, and linebackers who played very well today, if they did play. 

[52N19]

I was shocked by Smith, Sr.'s drops but Jacoby?  Never had the best of hands imo.

 

@Mili

it was disappointing to to not see any passes to marlin brown or juice.

 

aiken made 3 catches and i think 2 were 3rd down conversions. that kid must be psyched despite the loss.

[ravensdfan]

Look at the top five defenses last year and tell me how many of them NEEDED blitzes to get pressure. I'll wait.

 

You're kind of missing the point aren't you? Here is a new term for you to google: in-game adjustments

 

If it isn't working - you find new ways. Pees never does that and sometimes, when something is working, he then switches it up to what doesn't work (last season).

 

As for that late TD, I don't even blame Brown for that, I blame Pees. Even with Safety help, Brown should NEVER have been in that position.

 

It is his job to know strengths and weaknesses, it is his job to scheme to put his players in a position to succeed. Not "oh I like this vanilla scheme and the players are just going to have to do it". He is the defensive version of Cam Cameron.

[The Raven]

i don't know how you can blame pees. every one talks about chykie browns play against green at the end of the game. the bengals picked on brown ALL day. every pass was to browns side of the filed and went for a minimum of 8 yards.

 

#2 its not pees fault. i though dumerville and suggs were supposed to get to the quarterback. dalton had all day to throw. at some point your so called stars need to play like stars. it looks like elvis has left the building.

 

You said it. Stars need to play like stars. That's exactly it. Suggs and Dumervil are credited as pass rushers. Why weren't they rushing the passer? Bingo.

[The Raven]

You're kind of missing the point aren't you? Here is a new term for you to google: in-game adjustments

 

If it isn't working - you find new ways. Pees never does that and sometimes, when something is working, he then switches it up to what doesn't work (last season).

 

As for that late TD, I don't even blame Brown for that, I blame Pees. Even with Safety help, Brown should NEVER have been in that position.

 

I do blame Pees for not putting Jimmy on Green in clutch time. That's silly.

 

Look, just tell me what you think would make a pass rush better. Is it just to blitz more? Because Pees blitzed plenty of times today from a lot of different looks and we still didn't get off blocks. Also, blitzing doesn't work against good QBs on good offenses. Every time we blitzed today Dalton carved us up. 

 

It's as simple as this: Good defenses can get pressure with four. Every defensive line coach in the league will tell you that. Until we do that, we aren't a good defense. 

[ravensdfan]

I do blame Pees for not putting Jimmy on Green in clutch time. That's silly.

 

Look, just tell me what you think would make a pass rush better. Is it just to blitz more? Because Pees blitzed plenty of times today from a lot of different looks and we still didn't get off blocks. Also, blitzing doesn't work against good QBs on good offenses. Every time we blitzed today Dalton carved us up. 

 

It's as simple as this: Good defenses can get pressure with four. Every defensive line coach in the league will tell you that. Until we do that, we aren't a good defense. 

 

 

Well until Mattison (omg) and Pees, we rarely ever rushed just four. Suddenly with one of the best defenses for a good long time in the this league, everyone else was doing it wrong. Okay.

[The Raven]

Well until Mattison (omg) and Pees, we rarely ever rushed just four. Suddenly with one of the best defenses for a good long time in the this league, everyone else was doing it wrong. Okay.

 

Actually, in 2000, we mostly got our pressure with four. I've seen games from back then and we didn't blitz any more than the average team. 

 

The top five defenses last year were Seattle, Carolina, Cincy, New Orleans, and San Fran. Seattle, Carolina, and Cincy especially rely on their front four alone for pressure. The league leader in sacks last year, the Panthers, don't blitz that much. They just have a dominant front four. The Patriots rarely rush more than four and they finished in 5th with 48 sacks.

 

Like I said. Good defenses can get pressure with four, and there's not a defensive coach in the league that'll tell you different. 

 

Also, to reiterate, blitzing gets you killed by teams with a good passing game. Not even debatable. 

[ravensdfan]

Actually, in 2000, we mostly got our pressure with four. I've seen games from back then and we didn't blitz any more than the average team. 

 

The top five defenses last year were Seattle, Carolina, Cincy, New Orleans, and San Fran. Seattle, Carolina, and Cincy especially rely on their front four alone for pressure. The league leader in sacks last year, the Panthers, don't blitz that much. They just have a dominant front four. The Patriots rarely rush more than four and they finished in 5th with 48 sacks.

 

Like I said. Good defenses can get pressure with four, and there's not a defensive coach in the league that'll tell you different. 

 

Also, to reiterate, blitzing gets you killed by teams with a good passing game. Not even debatable. 

 

You are mistaking a straight man four rush with a disguised four which we ran alot in 2000.

[The Raven]

You are mistaking a straight man four rush with a disguised four which we ran alot in 2000.

 

Dude, we ran a tampa 2 4-3 defense in 2000. That's a straight four man rush. It's basically the same defense Marvin Lewis still runs in Cincy.

[edthehead]

Tell me more about what Pees can do to make Suggs and Dumervil better when we haven't addressed those positions?

 

The thing you clearly can't comprehend is that we've addressed every position except OLB/DE. Yes, we spent six high picks on D. None were OLBs/DEs. They were safeties, tackles, and linebackers who played very well today, if they did play. 

those positions do not have to be addressed in a manner they requires replacement,but good depth in the event somebody goes down,courtney upshaw is good but dumervil came along and to me I saw a good opportunity,with good schemes those tackles and safeties along with linebackers should aidE in QB sack and hits and pressure,you know all that good stuff,,, forgive me for saying this but past DC would have worked miracles with what we have,(hate to compare past coaches),they made it work,again pees is good,but he is not good for the RAVENS,,     

[BSHU_Miami]

I also hated how we didn't adjust to the screen game at all

[1/28/01]

Pees is the least of this teams issues.

[GrimCoconut]

How do coaches get blamed for pro bowlers not shedding blocks?

 

Nobody's explained this to me and I'd really like a justification. 

I've said it many times, but my issue with Pees isn't even with Pees but the fact that I don't think he inspires the "guys" to play for him. The Ravens defenders, primarily the older ones, seem to feed off of the aggressive coordinators. It's my best guess why we don't look the same. Also, his schemes are good. They contain some great QBs, such as Brady and even Manning. Pees knows how to call a game against great QBs, and that's very important. I would call him a championship coach. He's the kind of guy who you can absolutely win a championship with--well, yeah, we did it already. What I mean by that is, that's when he is at his best. When he gets to scheme against the best. When his guys go against the other guys in the regular season, it just isn't the same. I feel that's because they don't buy into his system. Again, it's my best guess. 

 

Also, there comes a point where guys are constantly missing tackles that you need to start enforcing that, and so far it's still an issue and it's uncorrected. The onus falls on him as DC for that one, and now it falls on John for also not fixing it. 

[The Raven]

I've said it many times, but my issue with Pees isn't even with Pees but the fact that I don't think he inspires the "guys" to play for him. The Ravens defenders, primarily the older ones, seem to feed off of the aggressive coordinators. It's my best guess why we don't look the same. Also, his schemes are good. They contain some great QBs, such as Brady and even Manning. Pees knows how to call a game against great QBs, and that's very important. I would call him a championship coach. He's the kind of guy who you can absolutely win a championship with--well, yeah, we did it already. What I mean by that is, that's when he is at his best. When he gets to scheme against the best. When his guys go against the other guys in the regular season, it just isn't the same. I feel that's because they don't buy into his system. Again, it's my best guess. 

 

Also, there comes a point where guys are constantly missing tackles that you need to start enforcing that, and so far it's still an issue and it's uncorrected. The onus falls on him as DC for that one, and now it falls on John for also not fixing it. 

 

I just don't believe that he hasn't focused on the fundamentals like tackling and block shedding. Every time Pees talks he rants about how important it is to do the fundamentals right. Harbs and Pees put a huge emphasis on fundamentally sound defense. 

 

I agree with the players not playing for him. Don't see why they don't play for him, but we'll never know. 

[GrimCoconut]

I just don't believe that he hasn't focused on the fundamentals like tackling and block shedding. Every time Pees talks he rants about how important it is to do the fundamentals right. Harbs and Pees put a huge emphasis on fundamentally sound defense. 

 

I agree with the players not playing for him. Don't see why they don't play for him, but we'll never know. 

I've wondered myself. If I had to guess, my best guess is it has to do with Suggs, maybe. I can only imagine perhaps he misses the aggressive schemes of Pagano and Rex and laments the sort of "cerebral and disciplined" schemes Pees employs. He's a veteran and he isn't playing up to his performance he demonstrated with those guys. To top it off, Suggs looked poor when he was under Mattison as well, who admittedly does try to do similar schemes as Pees. 

 

That's my guess, anyway.

[The Raven]

I've wondered myself. If I had to guess, my best guess is it has to do with Suggs, maybe. I can only imagine perhaps he misses the aggressive schemes of Pagano and Rex and laments the sort of "cerebral and disciplined" schemes Pees employs. He's a veteran and he isn't playing up to his performance he demonstrated with those guys. To top it off, Suggs looked poor when he was under Mattison as well, who admittedly does try to do similar schemes as Pees. 

 

That's my guess, anyway.

 

Pees' scheme is focused on reading and reacting instead of attacking. That's probably it. I don't know why that's necessarily a bad thing, but the players don't like it. Read and react defenses typically play slower, but they give up fewer stupid mistakes. 

 

Maybe Pees is that stereotypical annoying coach who nagged you all day and night about fundamentals and hustle. Those guys are awful to play for. Lol

[GrimCoconut]

Pees' scheme is focused on reading and reacting instead of attacking. That's probably it. I don't know why that's necessarily a bad thing, but the players don't like it. Read and react defenses typically play slower, but they give up fewer stupid mistakes. 

 

Maybe Pees is that stereotypical annoying coach who nagged you all day and night about fundamentals and hustle. Those guys are awful to play for. Lol

Lol yeah that might be it. I think the players probably want to "attack attack attack!" and Pees is more "patience, watch"

[BmoreBird22]

I don't get all the people wanting to hate on Pees for not being aggressive. Just think about this-

The Ravens had Chykie Brown as their second starting corner and Darian Stewart, a newcomer, as their starting free safety. Would you really be blitz happy and take help away from a young and inexperienced secondary? Then think about the fact that Suggs, Doom, and Ngata are all a part of the front four. The Ravens have over $20 million locked up in those three, but you want to tell me it's acceptable for them to not generate pressure?

Also, what is Pees supposed to do when the defense won't tackle? I saw so many times where players were in a position to make the stop with three or four yards of cushion, but they got dragged all the way to the first down or lunged and missed the tackles. You can't put that on Pees if you're listening to him in his presses.

The new guys on defense really seem to buy into his scheme and do really well in it. Not sure why the older guys won't

[The Raven]

Lol yeah that might be it. I think the players probably want to "attack attack attack!" and Pees is more "patience, watch"

 

That's exactly it I think. 

 

Personally, I prefer the aggressive Tampa 2 style where you can blow up your gap, but you better hold it. When I watch our dline, I see them reading the blocks more than trying to blow up their blocks. I'd like to go back to the "blow up the gap" style that Pagano ran.