Brandon Browner

[Bullrush]

Not interested. We're set with Jimmy as our shadow corner and Webb on the other side.

[cushrinada1986]

If he's cheap and wants to be with a contender and there's contract stipulations then Hell yeah. 

I agree on that, we could have potentially had josh gordon if not scared off by his outside troubles. If we would have taken a chance on him(just like we should have taken a chance on Vontaze), WR would not have been a top need in this years draft, allowing us to go for potentially more picks to go towards a slot guy, TE to help with Pitta, a starting Center potentially, FS, the list goes on.

[Militant X 1]

The more one analyzes Oz's moves the last two years the more one has to realize Bisciotti is on the verge of a breakdown.

 

lol!

 

#Mili

[BloodRaven]

 

 

I'm not discussing Pollard any further, theres no point. This topic is about Browner. 

 

I'd be interested in seeing if Browner can play safety.

[BloodRaven]

Not interested. We're set with Jimmy as our shadow corner and Webb on the other side.

 

Teams don't have two wide receivers, we still need a capable third corner.

[rmw10]

I'm not discussing Pollard any further, theres no point. This topic is about Browner. 

 

I'd be interested in seeing if Browner can play safety.

 

Browner is not a safety.  Guys that are 6'4, 220+, and not very mobile cannot play safety.  He's strictly an outside CB.  He's good because he's big and physical.  That doesn't play well in space.

[Bullrush]

Teams don't have two wide receivers, we still need a capable third corner.

 

The odds of him taking a job that not only pays him like a backup corner but also gives him the role of a backup corner are about zero. Graham is a decent #3, we have way bigger needs than CB.

[BloodRaven]

Browner is not a safety.  Guys that are 6'4, 220+, and not very mobile cannot play safety.  He's strictly an outside CB.  He's good because he's big and physical.  That doesn't play well in space.

 

 

A lot of corners move to safety when they get older because they get slower.

 

The odds of him taking a job that not only pays him like a backup corner but also gives him the role of a backup corner are about zero. Graham is a decent #3, we have way bigger needs than CB.

 

It doesn't have to be Browner and Graham is a free agent, if we can retain him it's at market value.

[rmw10]

A lot of corners move to safety when they get older because they get slower.

 

 

It doesn't have to be Browner and Graham is a free agent, if we can retain him it's at market value.

 

6'4, 220+.  Again, he's not and won't be a safety.  There's a difference in speed and mobility.

[BloodRaven]

6'4, 220+.  Again, he's not and won't be a safety.  There's a difference in speed and mobility.

 

 

Safeties are bigger and slower than corners.

[52520Andrew]

I wouldn't mind Browner for the right price. He could be a great #2 and could cover the TE. That would allow Jimmy Smith to do his thing outside and Webb to do his thing with the slot guy. Maybe if we got him for a short term deal so he could prove himself worth a big raise and then get us a comp pick down the road. This is wishful thinking however most likely and unless he takes a one year deal, I don't think we will be able to afford him. And if we could afford him, Seattle would probably scoop him up anyways. 

[BmoreBird22]

 

Safeties are bigger and slower than corners.

No, not always true. Troy Polamalu is 4 inches shorter than Jimmy Smith, but a good bit faster. 

 

Safeties are considered big when they're hitting 6'0", 6'1" and most are around 5'11" or so. Think Troy, Reed, Earl Thomas, Eric Weddle, Donta Whitner, Devin McCourty, etc. They're all under 6'0" tall.

 

You realize that the bigger you are, the harder it is to change direction, right? Safeties aren't really big because it limits hip fluidity and change of direction, something very important to safeties. They have to be able to flip their hips and get going in a different direction quickly, and that would be limited if they were larger.

 

With a greater emphasis being placed on press coverage (think Seattle cornerbacks), it's okay for cornerbacks to be larger. Larger cornerbacks won't play much off or zone (think Seattle) for the above listed reasons. 

[Purple_ICE 81]

Thoughts on signing him if the price Is low enough.

Pros

Big cb

Fits press man

Physical

Cons

Potential suspension ( mitigated by terms of deal)

Love him a s CB however considering his ongoing off the field issues and especially because he will miss atleast the first 2 games of 2014...he  won't be a Raven.

[BloodRaven]

 

 

No, not always true. Troy Polamalu is 4 inches shorter than Jimmy Smith, but a good bit faster. 

 

Safeties are considered big when they're hitting 6'0", 6'1" and most are around 5'11" or so. Think Troy, Reed, Earl Thomas, Eric Weddle, Donta Whitner, Devin McCourty, etc. They're all under 6'0" tall.

 

You realize that the bigger you are, the harder it is to change direction, right? Safeties aren't really big because it limits hip fluidity and change of direction, something very important to safeties. They have to be able to flip their hips and get going in a different direction quickly, and that would be limited if they were larger.

 

With a greater emphasis being placed on press coverage (think Seattle cornerbacks), it's okay for cornerbacks to be larger. Larger cornerbacks won't play much off or zone (think Seattle) for the above listed reasons. 

 

 

Those are called exceptions. For example there are linebackers who happen to be shorter than or weigh less than cornerback Patrick Peterson, that doesn't change the fact linebackers are bigger than corners.

 

Ihedigbo is 214lb and the SS before him was 230lb but I guess we're just ignoring that, and we're pretending like Browner stands there like a statue after the press and doesn't mirror his receiver.

[Cville-Raven]

LOL why am I seeing Pollard being discussed in this thread?

[BmoreBird22]

 

Those are called exceptions. For example there are linebackers who happen to be shorter than or weigh less than cornerback Patrick Peterson, that doesn't change the fact linebackers are bigger than corners.

 

Ihedigbo is 214lb and the SS before him was 230lb but I guess we're just ignoring that, and we're pretending like Browner stands there like a statue after the press and doesn't mirror his receiver.

List me several safeties over 6'1". That's starting to become about the norm for cornerbacks. I don't want ones that are 6'1", like Ihedigbo and Pollard (even though neither are special). I want them to be at least 6'2" or above because you said safeties are usually bigger.

Do you know why I picked those particular names? Because they're considered to be the better safeties in the league right now. Hell, even Ronnie Lott was only 6'0" tall and he's considered to be the best safety ever. Am I saying that a safety has to be short to be good? No, but that's more often than not the case.

 

I'm glad you mention both Pollard and Ihedigbo. How often are they in center field or deep coverage? Rarely because they both suck at it. They can't move well in space and aren't quick enough to make the cuts and changes of direction needed to be a deep safety. They play well in the box and make plays at the line of scrimmage, but get burned deep.

 

Do you know why big cornerbacks play press coverage? I won't tell you, but please explain to me the differences in press man, off man, and zone coverage as it pertains to change of direction and playing in space.

[BloodRaven]

 

 

List me several safeties over 6'1". That's starting to become about the norm for cornerbacks. I don't want ones that are 6'1", like Ihedigbo and Pollard (even though neither are special). I want them to be at least 6'2" or above because you said safeties are usually bigger.

Do you know why I picked those particular names? Because they're considered to be the better safeties in the league right now. Hell, even Ronnie Lott was only 6'0" tall and he's considered to be the best safety ever. Am I saying that a safety has to be short to be good? No, but that's more often than not the case.

 

I'm glad you mention both Pollard and Ihedigbo. How often are they in center field or deep coverage? Rarely because they both suck at it. They can't move well in space and aren't quick enough to make the cuts and changes of direction needed to be a deep safety. They play well in the box and make plays at the line of scrimmage, but get burned deep.

 

Do you know why big cornerbacks play press coverage? I won't tell you, but please explain to me the differences in press man, off man, and zone coverage as it pertains to change of direction and playing in space.

 

 

The problem with your theory about short safeties is that for every one that you listed there are dozens who get cut and go work for Target, theres no pattern there just like theres no pattern for 220lb being too heavy to play safety, Eric Reid, Kam Chancellor, Laron Landry, William Moore are recent Pro Bowl selections... but wait, aren't they too big???

[BmoreBird22]

 

The problem with your theory about short safeties is that for every one that you listed there are dozens who get cut and go work for Target, theres no pattern there just like theres no pattern for 220lb being too heavy to play safety, Eric Reid, Kam Chancellor, Laron Landry, William Moore are recent Pro Bowl selections... but wait, aren't they too big???

Laron Landry is not over 6'1" (6'0"). Eric Reid is not over 6'1" (6'1"). William Moore is not over 6'1" (6'1").  Only Kam Chancellor is. Three of the four you listed are strong safeties who are not used as coverage safeties.

 

You also dodged my question about coverages.

 

I also said  "Am I saying that a safety has to be short to be good? No, but that's more often than not the case.", but good try.

[BloodRaven]

 

 

Laron Landry is not over 6'1" (6'0"). Eric Reid is not over 6'1" (6'1"). William Moore is not over 6'1" (6'1").  Only Kam Chancellor is. Three of the four you listed are strong safeties who are not used as coverage safeties.

 

You also dodged my question about coverages.

 

I also said  "Am I saying that a safety has to be short to be good? No, but that's more often than not the case.", but good try.

 

 

When did this become only about height? I said safeties are bigger than corners. Marlon Brown is taller than Brandon Williams, but is he bigger? no he isn't. If your entire argument is that it's "more often than not the case" then you're not really saying anything about Browner other than (presumably) there aren't many safeties who are 6'4".

[rmw10]

Let's just end the Browner at S talk.  It's not going to happen, and even if it did, he wouldn't fit here as he'd be relegated strictly to SS.

[Cville-Raven]

Let's just end the Browner at S talk. It's not going to happen, and even if it did, he wouldn't fit here as he'd be relegated strictly to SS.

Yeah, and in all honesty he'd probably be terrible.

[BmoreBird22]

 

When did this become only about height? I said safeties are bigger than corners. Marlon Brown is taller than Brandon Williams, but is he bigger? no he isn't. If your entire argument is that it's "more often than not the case" then you're not really saying anything about Browner other than (presumably) there aren't many safeties who are 6'4".

Okay, fine we'll talk about weight. The average safety is about 190-200 pounds, and any more than that and they're likely not in coverage. They're going to be in the box. You're average cornerback is about 200-205, with some being as much as 220, like Brandon Browner.

 

By the way, it's clear that you don't understand the differences in coverage, and that's okay, but realize that Browner at safety wouldn't happen or work.

[BloodRaven]

 

 

Okay, fine we'll talk about weight. The average safety is about 190-200 pounds, and any more than that and they're likely not in coverage. They're going to be in the box. You're average cornerback is about 200-205, with some being as much as 220, like Brandon Browner.

 

By the way, it's clear that you don't understand the differences in coverage, and that's okay, but realize that Browner at safety wouldn't happen or work.

 

 

You're applying averages again? tell me how average a 6'4" 220 pro bowl cornerback is. I also understand coverages so you'll forgive me if I ignore condescending 101 questions. What I do understand is that cornerbacks who are too small, too old, too slow, or didn't play much zone still make successful transitions to safety, so could Browner? nobody really knows for sure.

[BmoreBird22]

 

You're applying averages again? tell me how average a 6'4" 220 pro bowl cornerback is. I also understand coverages so you'll forgive me if I ignore condescending 101 questions. What I do understand is that cornerbacks who are too small, too old, too slow, or didn't play much zone still make successful transitions to safety, so could Browner? nobody really knows for sure.

It's not a 101 question. It's a question you don't understand.

 

It's bigger than average (I've already established that), but he was a replacement, not an outright Pro Bowler. But, you do realize the Pro Bowl is a game for the fans, so the fans voted him in and wanted to see him? Using the Pro Bowl is a terrible example.

[BloodRaven]

 

 

It's not a 101 question. It's a question you don't understand

 

 

I get it, I just dont care enough to answer.

[Purple_ICE 81]

 

 

List me several safeties over 6'1". 

Harrison Smith

Mark Barron

Dashon Goldson

Thomas Decoud

Kerry Rhodes

Reshad Jones

Adrian Wilson

Ryan Mundy

Barry Church

Jeromy Miles

[BmoreBird22]

 

I get it, I just dont care enough to answer.

The answer of those who don't understand.

 

Also, I replied to your comment about the Pro Bowl.

[BmoreBird22]

Harrison Smith

Mark Barron

Dashon Goldson

Thomas Decoud

Kerry Rhodes

Reshad Jones

Adrian Wilson

Ryan Mundy

Barry Church

Jeromy Miles

Pretty decent, but no long term success yet.

Not over 6'1"

Highly inconsistent and more of a product of the 49ers pass rush

Not over 6'1"

One of the rare guys who is better in coverage than run support despite his size and position

Not over 6'1"

One of my favorite strong safeties to ever play. Great player

Not over 6'1" and a backup

Weren't we all shocked when the Cowboys traded back and didn't draft Eric Reid?

Career backup and special teamer.

[The Raven]

I think Browner is fast enough to play on the outside but not mobile and agile enough to play safety. It's simple as that. 

[Purple_ICE 81]

Pretty decent, but no long term success yet.

Not over 6'1"

Highly inconsistent and more of a product of the 49ers pass rush

Not over 6'1"

One of the rare guys who is better in coverage than run support despite his size and position

Not over 6'1"

One of my favorite strong safeties to ever play. Great player

Not over 6'1" and a backup

Weren't we all shocked when the Cowboys traded back and didn't draft Eric Reid?

Career backup and special teamer.

The only guys on here who are not 6'1" are Ryan Mundy and Reshad Jones and both are close to 6'2" I just thought they were bigger off the top of my head.

 

Barron and Decoud are 6'2"