LB Courtney Upshaw

[SecretAgentMan]

He's not a great pass rusher but he's a good run defender.

Not a bust but a major disappointment.

That being said, I do think he's good enough to start if Suggs were to be cut. He won't be a great pass rusher like Suggs was, but will probably be better in that department than JJ.

What we could use is a Situational Pass Rusher(Simon maybe?). But Upshaw, while being over drafted(I hated the pick initially), has a place in the defense.

[BmoreBird22]

 

He was out there more than you think, over 300 in 2012 and 200 in 2013. The problem is he was incredibly ineffective.

I'd be very interested to see the position distribution for those numbers. He played DT in sub packages at times on third down, so it's not as if he was always going after the quarterback. He also drops into coverage at times.

[BmoreBird22]

I think people forget why we brought him in. We didn't bring him in to be the next great pass rusher (Suggs tore his achilles after the draft and we had Kruger). We had just lost Jarrett Johnson and we had a void at an edge setting linebacker.

Courtney was brought in to be a linebacker that could set the edge, do the dirty work, and then keep the pass rushers fresh. The people who are expecting him to be a great pass rusher, or who did, are off base, and that's why you think he's a bust. 

He does his job extremely well. He sets the edge and can play a variety of positions, including either linebacker position, inside linebacker, defensive end, and even DT in sub packages. He's not going to get the recognition he deserves, but he balls.

In his rookie year, he was already a top three edge setting outside linebacker. 

He's not a disappointment or bust if you consider what he was brought in for.

[BloodRaven]

I've been meaning to make an Upshaw thread based on his production and potential.

 

Here are the given facts:

 

A He can't pass rush.

 

B He has elite strength at the POA.

 

C He walks around at 300lb in the offseason, he's not built to be 260lb.

 

So why not move him to defensive line? he already plays snaps on the line, just make him a part of the rotation. Let him play to his strengths at his natural weight.

 

Edit: If we're worried about losing a 2 down power player to set the edge we already have a more athletic version in John Simon.

[arnie_uk]

I think people forget why we brought him in. We didn't bring him in to be the next great pass rusher (Suggs tore his achilles after the draft and we had Kruger). We had just lost Jarrett Johnson and we had a void at an edge setting linebacker.

Courtney was brought in to be a linebacker that could set the edge, do the dirty work, and then keep the pass rushers fresh. The people who are expecting him to be a great pass rusher, or who did, are off base, and that's why you think he's a bust.

He does his job extremely well. He sets the edge and can play a variety of positions, including either linebacker position, inside linebacker, defensive end, and even DT in sub packages. He's not going to get the recognition he deserves, but he balls.

In his rookie year, he was already a top three edge setting outside linebacker.

He's not a disappointment or bust if you consider what he was brought in for.

completely incorrect. You don't draft that player in the second round. That type of player can be had on the late rounds.

[Tru11]

he is being used to set the edge which he is pretty good in.

not many people appreciated JJ at first but it will come in due time.

 

for some guys to shine others have to do the dirty work.

something  alot of people arent willing to accept.

 

no team will have 11 playmakers on defense.

 

also dude had a FF in the SB that we won.

[arnie_uk]

he is being used to set the edge which he is pretty good in.

not many people appreciated JJ at first but it will come in due time.

for some guys to shine others have to do the dirty work.

something alot of people arent willing to accept.

no team will have 11 playmakers on defense.

also dude had a FF in the SB that we won.

again u don't draft a 34 olb at the top of round 2 unless you think he can pass rush. Hes a bust based on that. But hes exactly what I said he'd be.

[JEEPercreepermd]

So quick to throw that B word around people. I swear its as if some of you don't even watch the games...just read the stat lines and start complaining. Grrrrrr

[FastEddie]

So quick to throw that B word around people. I swear its as if some of you don't even watch the games...just read the stat lines and start complaining. Grrrrrr

 

Courtney was drafted in 2012, come on people. JImmy Smith had a similiar start in the league and is developing into exactly what we thought he would be.

 

I'll wait till at least year three to do that.....

[LEGEN-wait for it-DARY]

I agree...he was drafted to pretty much replace Jarrett Johnson to sure up run D.

 

So far, he hasn't been in the same lvl as JJ.  

 

Much like upshaw, a lot of our early picks has been role players (red chip players).  They've been good team players so far, but few of those guy needs to step up.

 

JJ wasn't elite at setting the edge as soon as he came to Baltimore either, it took him about five years. It's pretty crazy how similar JJ's 05 and 06 (his first two years as a DE/OLB after being a DT) and Upshaw's first two years are. He's going to be fine and we're lucky we got him, otherwise who knows how 2012 would've turned out.

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

I think people forget why we brought him in. We didn't bring him in to be the next great pass rusher (Suggs tore his achilles after the draft and we had Kruger). We had just lost Jarrett Johnson and we had a void at an edge setting linebacker.

Courtney was brought in to be a linebacker that could set the edge, do the dirty work, and then keep the pass rushers fresh. The people who are expecting him to be a great pass rusher, or who did, are off base, and that's why you think he's a bust. 

He does his job extremely well. He sets the edge and can play a variety of positions, including either linebacker position, inside linebacker, defensive end, and even DT in sub packages. He's not going to get the recognition he deserves, but he balls.

In his rookie year, he was already a top three edge setting outside linebacker. 

He's not a disappointment or bust if you consider what he was brought in for.

Sorry, but you don't draft a OLB just so he can be another JJ. We drafted Upshaw because there was a belief he could be a complete OLB that could rush the passer and stuff the run. He's delivered on half of that, but he's been a major disappointment when it comes to getting to the quarterback. As others have said, we wouldn't be worried about what's going to happen as far as Suggs if that wasn't the case.

[BmoreBird22]

completely incorrect. You don't draft that player in the second round. That type of player can be had on the late rounds.

Maybe you don't, but apparently the Ravens did

. I saw multiple scouting reports that had him as a run defender, not pass rusher, at the next level. I'm sure the Ravens saw that, but it's good to know you were there in the Ravens draft room.

[BmoreBird22]

Sorry, but you don't draft a OLB just so he can be another JJ. We drafted Upshaw because there was a belief he could be a complete OLB that could rush the passer and stuff the run. He's delivered on half of that, but he's been a major disappointment when it comes to getting to the quarterback. As others have said, we wouldn't be worried about what's going to happen as far as Suggs if that wasn't the case.

Coming out of college he wasn't going to be a great pass rusher right away. Maybe the Ravens are hoping he could develop into that, but right away, he was a run stuffer.

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

Coming out of college he wasn't going to be a great pass rusher right away. Maybe the Ravens are hoping he could develop into that, but right away, he was a run stuffer.

Coming out of college, Upshaw was known to be a damn good pass rusher for Alabama that could also defend the run well. Early in the draft process that year, there was talk that he could of been a top 15 pick due to the fact that he has potential to be a complete LB. He fell due to his height, weight, and explosiveness concerns.

Once again, if you believe that the Ravens drafted Upshaw that high to be another Jarrett Johnson, then I'm afraid I believe you're mistaken. One of the criticisms of JJ was that he didn't deliver on the pass rushing aspect part of his game. Upshaw was drafted to eventually develop into a complimentary pass rusher opposite Suggs and be a complete LB since we hadn't got that from Kruger yet at the time Obviously he hasn't delivered on that yet, but expectations were high for him.

[izvoodoo]

Coming out of college, Upshaw was known to be a damn good pass rusher for Alabama that could also defend the run well. Early in the draft process that year, there was talk that he could of been a top 15 pick due to the fact that he has potential to be a complete LB. He fell due to his height, weight, and explosiveness concerns.

Once again, if you believe that the Ravens drafted Upshaw that high to be another Jarrett Johnson, then I'm afraid I believe you're mistaken. One of the criticisms of JJ was that he didn't deliver on the pass rushing aspect part of his game. Upshaw was drafted to eventually develop into a complimentary pass rusher opposite Suggs and be a complete LB since we hadn't got that from Kruger yet at the time Obviously he hasn't delivered on that yet, but expectations were high for him.

A lot of scouts, and people beyond internet forums, knew upshaw wasn't going to be that productive as a pass rusher.  Everyone said (he's like Jarett Johnson).  Even though his pass rush never developed, they weren't thinking they were getting Llamar Woodley, because Upshaw isn't that quality of an athlete.  Upshaw was a safe pick with a high floor.  And his rookie year he was one of the best run defenders in all of football.

[Tru11]

again u don't draft a 34 olb at the top of round 2 unless you think he can pass rush. Hes a bust based on that. But hes exactly what I said he'd be.

 

who made this rule?

i never heard of this before.

 

i always figured we take the best player availeble.

 

he was considerd a top 15 talent.

i think it was common knowledge he was viewed as a good football player not really a stud pass rusher.

i think pretty much everyone knew he would have to take some time to learn pass rushing techningues since all he did was use raw power to beat tackles in college lol.

 

expectations was to sit him behind kruger and suggs and learn.

suggs got injured and upshaw was put in the role of the edge setting olb while kruger became the pass rusher.

because kruger sucked in setting the edge , upshaw stayed on as the starter (impressive) and was relieved on pass down by kruger when suggs came back.

he had the 5th most tackles in the regular season and was had the 3rd most as a lber behind mcclain and ellerbe....

 

This season he was going to take on a bigger role with kruger leaving but then we signed dumervil and he stayed on as the edge setter while dumervil could focus more on pass rushing.

 

kruger was a 2nd round pick who did nothing and came into his own in his 3rd season as a pass rusher.

 

upshaw saw limited duty as a pass rusher in his rookie season and tnx to dumervil and suggs his 2nd season wasent much better.

 

i think people are a lil bit harsh bringing up his pass rushing when he wasent asked to do it much and he also spend time behind studs in that department....

 

did you really expect a rookie to beat out suggs and kruger as a pass rusher and then suggs and dumervil in his 2nd season??

 

talk about setting unrealistic goals lol.

 

ah well you have your opinion and i have mine and when a player does what he is being asked to and he does it well he aint a bust in my book.

[BmoreBird22]

Coming out of college, Upshaw was known to be a damn good pass rusher for Alabama that could also defend the run well. Early in the draft process that year, there was talk that he could of been a top 15 pick due to the fact that he has potential to be a complete LB. He fell due to his height, weight, and explosiveness concerns.

Once again, if you believe that the Ravens drafted Upshaw that high to be another Jarrett Johnson, then I'm afraid I believe you're mistaken. One of the criticisms of JJ was that he didn't deliver on the pass rushing aspect part of his game. Upshaw was drafted to eventually develop into a complimentary pass rusher opposite Suggs and be a complete LB since we hadn't got that from Kruger yet at the time Obviously he hasn't delivered on that yet, but expectations were high for him.

He was good at Alabama, but that had to do with the fact that he was strong enough to just destroy opposing tackles. He was never a dynamic pass rusher, like a Terrell Suggs.

No, I'm not saying they drafted him solely to be a JJ, but that's what they drafted him to be first. We already had pass rushers, but we lacked that gritty run defender. He filled that immediately. With a plethora of pass rushers, it allowed Upshaw to refine his pass rush. He wasn't going to be a dynamite pass rusher right away. I think two years under Suggs and Dumervil will do him good. He's technically sound and plays very hard to the whistle. If he shed weight, I'm sure he could develop into a pass rusher now.

I envision him being a complete player, but people should know we weren't getting that right away, especially not with Kruger and Suggs then Dumervil and Suggs. I'm sure when his time comes he can deliver

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

A lot of scouts, and people beyond internet forums, knew upshaw wasn't going to be that productive as a pass rusher.  Everyone said (he's like Jarett Johnson).  Even though his pass rush never developed, they weren't thinking they were getting Llamar Woodley, because Upshaw isn't that quality of an athlete.  Upshaw was a safe pick with a high floor.  And his rookie year he was one of the best run defenders in all of football.

While I'm sure you could point to articles that stated he could have trouble rushing the passer (again, his lack of explosiveness was one of the reasons he dropped) but I am also sure I could point to a number of articles stating that he had potential to be a complimentary pass rusher and a complete LB.

In this very video of when he was drafted, it was stated that he could be a three down LB in the NFL that could rush the passer AND fill JJ's role.

[BmoreBird22]

While I'm sure you could point to articles that stated he could have trouble rushing the passer (again, his lack of explosiveness was one of the reasons he dropped) but I am also sure I could point to a number of articles stating that he had potential to be a complimentary pass rusher and a complete LB.

In this very video of when he was drafted, it was stated that he could be a three down LB in the NFL that could rush the passer AND fill JJ's role.

The key word is CAN. Can he? I'm sure he COULD be if given the chance, but he hasn't. That video doesn't mean he could do it day one. It means he could do it one day, and I'm sure will when given the chance.

Terrell Suggs was once a pass rusher only, and now he is one of the best run defenders in the league

[Purple_ICE 81]

Courtney Upshaw's official NFL combine  scouting report:

 

" Upshaw sets the edge as good as any prospect in recent years. He uses his lower strength and girth to stall blockers and read plays off them to get to the ball in the run game. He understands how to use his hands to stack a block, hold the player up, then shed him and react to the play. He also uses his heavy hands well when covering a tight end at the line of scrimmage. Physical strength, explosion, and the ability to overpower offensive lineman to get to the ball carrier is what gives Upshaw so much value. Upshaw uses brute strength to rush the passer, can leverage tackles at the point of attack and literally force them into the backfield to create disruption. He also possesses the flexibility and knee bend to dip around tackles when given a step. Overall, due to his size, strength, and play against the run, Upshaw has late first-round talent. Look for him to pair with a pass-rush specialist opposite of him at outside backer in a 3-4 scheme where he can set the edge, work against tight ends and be a heavy run defender".

 

The run defense part was for the most part accurate but he doesnt seem to have a lot of "Explosion" or "ability to overpower o-linemen" as much as he was scouted for in the pass rush department. 

 

Overall we spent an early round draft pick on him to eventually develop into a 3 down OLB opposite Suggs who can rush the passer and stuff the run. So far he has proven that he is pretty good against the run but has not taken too many steps forward in the pass rushing department.

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

The key word is CAN. Can he? I'm sure he COULD be if given the chance, but he hasn't. That video doesn't mean he could do it day one. It means he could do it one day, and I'm sure will when given the chance.

Terrell Suggs was once a pass rusher only, and now he is one of the best run defenders in the league

 

What I'm trying to dispel is this notion that Upshaw was brought in to do what he has done up until this point. As arnie stated, you don't draft a OLB that high unless you believe he can make in impact in all phases of his game. JJ had left and the only person we had on our roster was Kruger and before his contract year, Kruger was a situational pass rusher that had not been effective outside of his last two years here, which was one of the reasons why we took Upshaw. 

 

 

He was good at Alabama, but that had to do with the fact that he was strong enough to just destroy opposing tackles. He was never a dynamic pass rusher, like a Terrell Suggs.

No, I'm not saying they drafted him solely to be a JJ, but that's what they drafted him to be first. We already had pass rushers, but we lacked that gritty run defender. He filled that immediately. With a plethora of pass rushers, it allowed Upshaw to refine his pass rush. He wasn't going to be a dynamite pass rusher right away. I think two years under Suggs and Dumervil will do him good. He's technically sound and plays very hard to the whistle. If he shed weight, I'm sure he could develop into a pass rusher now.

I envision him being a complete player, but people should know we weren't getting that right away, especially not with Kruger and Suggs then Dumervil and Suggs. I'm sure when his time comes he can deliver

 

Nobody knew we weren't getting that right away until it actually happened. Stop. Expectations were high for Upshaw because he was effective in all phases of his game when he was in college, which is why he was drafted so high. It hasn't happened yet in the NFL, but this notion that he drafted solely to be the run stopper for our "abundance" of pass rushers is false. He was drafted to be the complete package and I'm sure the Ravens wouldn't have mind if it was sooner rather than later. Also, Kruger's position at LB was no where near solidified before Upshaw was drafted. Kruger's inconsistency was one of the reasons why we did take Upshaw so I doubt that played a role as to why Upshaw didn't get his "time". 

[Tru11]

Courtney Upshaw's official NFL combine  scouting report:

 

" Upshaw sets the edge as good as any prospect in recent years. He uses his lower strength and girth to stall blockers and read plays off them to get to the ball in the run game. He understands how to use his hands to stack a block, hold the player up, then shed him and react to the play. He also uses his heavy hands well when covering a tight end at the line of scrimmage. Physical strength, explosion, and the ability to overpower offensive lineman to get to the ball carrier is what gives Upshaw so much value. Upshaw uses brute strength to rush the passer, can leverage tackles at the point of attack and literally force them into the backfield to create disruption. He also possesses the flexibility and knee bend to dip around tackles when given a step. Overall, due to his size, strength, and play against the run, Upshaw has late first-round talent. Look for him to pair with a pass-rush specialist opposite of him at outside backer in a 3-4 scheme where he can set the edge, work against tight ends and be a heavy run defender".

 

The run defense part was for the most part accurate but he doesnt seem to have a lot of "Explosion" or "ability to overpower o-linemen" as much as he was scouted for in the pass rush department. 

 

Overall we spent an early round draft pick on him to eventually develop into a 3 down OLB opposite Suggs who can rush the passer and stuff the run. So far he has proven that he is pretty good against the run but has not taken too many steps forward in the pass rushing department.

 

good post

 

also in upshaw defense he was stuck behind suggs and dumervil all season for pass rush snaps and mcphee was also primarly a pass rusher.

 

its really hard to proof something on limited oppurtunities.

 

his rookies year he was setting the edge with kruger being the pass rush guy.

especially when suggs came back and kruger only played passing downs while upshaw only played rushing downs.

 

its hard to judge a guy who only been in the league for 2 seasons on something the coaches did not ask him to do.

[PurpleCityLights]

Any word on Arthur Brown?

[Purple_ICE 81]

Any word on Arthur Brown?

Id say we resign Daryl Smith and have Arthur Brown start alongside.

[BmoreBird22]

What I'm trying to dispel is this notion that Upshaw was brought in to do what he has done up until this point. As arnie stated, you don't draft a OLB that high unless you believe he can make in impact in all phases of his game. JJ had left and the only person we had on our roster was Kruger and before his contract year, Kruger was a situational pass rusher that had not been effective outside of his last two years here, which was one of the reasons why we took Upshaw.

Nobody knew we weren't getting that right away until it actually happened. Stop. Expectations were high for Upshaw because he was effective in all phases of his game when he was in college, which is why he was drafted so high. It hasn't happened yet in the NFL, but this notion that he drafted solely to be the run stopper for our "abundance" of pass rushers is false. He was drafted to be the complete package and I'm sure the Ravens wouldn't have mind if it was sooner rather than later. Also, Kruger's position at LB was no where near solidified before Upshaw was drafted. Kruger's inconsistency was one of the reasons why we did take Upshaw so I doubt that played a role as to why Upshaw didn't get his "time".

Read the above scouting report about Upshaw. I knew he would be a run defender first. Arnie said he knew. I'm sorry if you didn't, but it wasn't a shocker to see him not be a great pass rusher right away. Again, lack of explosiveness and a limited array of moves and you didn't see that coming?

Kruger was inconsistent, but remember how everyone was hyped up because he started putting things together in 2011? He started taking over the passing downs and was getting to the quarterback. He started to develop into a pass rusher. That meant Upshaw didn't have to be a great pass rusher right away, something he wasn't.

Judging by this threat I'm sure no one would mind if he became the complete player next season, and I have faith he can be. The NFL is a big transition, especially from playing at Alabama where players are used to dominating everyone. Now everyone is on the same level or higher and it's a big transition.

I'm anticipating a much bigger role this season, so we'll see what happens.

By the way, as for the "you don't draft an outside linebacker that high" realize there were 7 (or six because I'm not sure what role Shea McClellan plays) drafted ahead of Upshaw, so it's not like the Ravens had their pick of the litter on pass rushers. The Ravens took the best player available at that point and it was Upshaw.

[arnie_uk]

good post

 

also in upshaw defense he was stuck behind suggs and dumervil all season for pass rush snaps and mcphee was also primarly a pass rusher.

 

its really hard to proof something on limited oppurtunities.

 

his rookies year he was setting the edge with kruger being the pass rush guy.

especially when suggs came back and kruger only played passing downs while upshaw only played rushing downs.

 

its hard to judge a guy who only been in the league for 2 seasons on something the coaches did not ask him to do.

if you can't tell he has no burst explosion, is constantly overweight and won't be a good pass rusher at least until he slides inside or loses weight well then I duno what to tell you.

There was 73 34 olbs that rushed the passer last year, upshaw is 62 in pressures, with 208 pass rushesa and only 16 pressures, 16! McPhee and 24 in 189 pass rush attempts and it was his first time in his life playing olb in a 34.

Last year he had 21 in 304 pass rushes, Kruger had 55 in 359 last year. He is not a pass rusher, pure and simple.

[arnie_uk]

Read the above scouting report about Upshaw. I knew he would be a run defender first. Arnie said he knew. I'm sorry if you didn't, but it wasn't a shocker to see him not be a great pass rusher right away. Again, lack of explosiveness and a limited array of moves and you didn't see that coming?

Kruger was inconsistent, but remember how everyone was hyped up because he started putting things together in 2011? He started taking over the passing downs and was getting to the quarterback. He started to develop into a pass rusher. That meant Upshaw didn't have to be a great pass rusher right away, something he wasn't.

Judging by this threat I'm sure no one would mind if he became the complete player next season, and I have faith he can be. The NFL is a big transition, especially from playing at Alabama where players are used to dominating everyone. Now everyone is on the same level or higher and it's a big transition.

I'm anticipating a much bigger role this season, so we'll see what happens.

By the way, as for the "you don't draft an outside linebacker that high" realize there were 7 (or six because I'm not sure what role Shea McClellan plays) drafted ahead of Upshaw, so it's not like the Ravens had their pick of the litter on pass rushers. The Ravens took the best player available at that point and it was Upshaw.

upshaw wasn't the best player, and I'm still adamant we could have got him In the third, and was only drafted because he went to Bama. To players easily better than him were Alshon Jeffrey and Cordy Glenn.

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

Read the above scouting report about Upshaw. I knew he would be a run defender first. Arnie said he knew. I'm sorry if you didn't, but it wasn't a shocker to see him not be a great pass rusher right away. Again, lack of explosiveness and a limited array of moves and you didn't see that coming?

Kruger was inconsistent, but remember how everyone was hyped up because he started putting things together in 2011? He started taking over the passing downs and was getting to the quarterback. He started to develop into a pass rusher. That meant Upshaw didn't have to be a great pass rusher right away, something he wasn't.

Judging by this threat I'm sure no one would mind if he became the complete player next season, and I have faith he can be. The NFL is a big transition, especially from playing at Alabama where players are used to dominating everyone. Now everyone is on the same level or higher and it's a big transition.

I'm anticipating a much bigger role this season, so we'll see what happens.

By the way, as for the "you don't draft an outside linebacker that high" realize there were 7 (or six because I'm not sure what role Shea McClellan plays) drafted ahead of Upshaw, so it's not like the Ravens had their pick of the litter on pass rushers. The Ravens took the best player available at that point and it was Upshaw.

As I stated before, I was sure that someone could point out scouting reports stating he would be run stopper. I've seen most of them. However, I can also point out ones stating he would be a complete player that is able to stuff the run and rush the passer. I stated that you don't take a player that high UNLESS you believe they can make an impact in all phases of the game. The opinions may have varied as to who believed Upshaw could be that but the belief was without a doubt there because I used to read it everywhere leading up to that draft. It was one of the reasons why around that time he was thought to have been a top 15 player in that draft but fell due to weight, explosiveness, and height concerns.

Even though some were excited about Kruger, his position was still never set in stone. Upshaw was brought in to compete with Kruger and potentially take over that spot across from Suggs. That didn't happen but nobody knew that it wouldn't before he played a down for the Ravens.

[Tru11]

if you can't tell he has no burst explosion, is constantly overweight and won't be a good pass rusher at least until he slides inside or loses weight well then I duno what to tell you.

There was 73 34 olbs that rushed the passer last year, upshaw is 62 in pressures, with 208 pass rushesa and only 16 pressures, 16! McPhee and 24 in 189 pass rush attempts and it was his first time in his life playing olb in a 34.

Last year he had 21 in 304 pass rushes, Kruger had 55 in 359 last year. He is not a pass rusher, pure and simple.

 

why you keep bringing up this pass rush crap?

 

i knew from the start he would be a good edge setter and an avg pass rusher needing to learn to get better at it,

 

he does a very good job in doing what he should do.

why would i worry about him being a pass rusher when we had suggs and kruger at first and now dumervil and suggs.

 

ill worry about his pass rushing when he becomes one of the top 2 guys to get the pass rush snaps.....

 

ill judge him on his pass rushing when he actually gets to rush the passer on a regular basis........

[BmoreBird22]

if you can't tell he has no burst explosion, is constantly overweight and won't be a good pass rusher at least until he slides inside or loses weight well then I duno what to tell you.

There was 73 34 olbs that rushed the passer last year, upshaw is 62 in pressures, with 208 pass rushesa and only 16 pressures, 16! McPhee and 24 in 189 pass rush attempts and it was his first time in his life playing olb in a 34.

Last year he had 21 in 304 pass rushes, Kruger had 55 in 359 last year. He is not a pass rusher, pure and simple.

I don't think anyone is arguing that he is a good pass rusher at this point, at least, they shouldn't be. I think people are arguing the potential is there if he slims down. He's a very high effort player and hustles harder than anyone, but he's just too heavy right now.