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Gary Kubiak's system impact on Ravens personnel?


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#1 cushrinada1986

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 12:23 PM

Given what Kubiak had in Texas, could Kubiaks scheme really help not just our star players but our backup players as well like Pierce's  and  help his production get to a potential probowl level? The run scheme Kubiak had in Texas helped Foster really explode in the running game/Playaction and with the fact that guys like Pierce/pitta are somewhat similar/better to guys he had in Houston like  Foster/Graham, do you think we could have a potential situation with our backups as well as our starters that we had with priest holmes and Jamal Lewis over a decade ago(as an example)?


Edited by cushrinada1986, 30 January 2014 - 03:36 PM.

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#2 Ravens1991

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 12:24 PM

Perhaps because I feel Rice is done and you couldn't make a better offensive system for Pierce. But he needs to stay healthy. He seems always hurt
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#3 The Raven

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 12:50 PM

I think we see Pierce take the starting role this season, and he's going to run with it. 


Edited by The Raven, 29 January 2014 - 12:50 PM.

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#4 Bltravens

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 12:56 PM

All depends on health.  He can thrive in any scheme, but the zone stretch is what he was made for.


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#5 jazz1988

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:00 PM

I think we see Pierce take the starting role this season, and he's going to run with it. 

 

I doubt it especially with a  healthy/ more in shape Ray Rice  but I do believe he will have a good season , I can see Rice and Pierce having the same type of season Foster and Tate had in 2011.


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#6 The Raven

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:13 PM

I doubt it especially with a  healthy/ more in shape Ray Rice  but I do believe he will have a good season , I can see Rice and Pierce having the same type of season Foster and Tate had in 2011.

 

Pierce just has better vision than Rice, and this system is dependent on good vision.

 

We need backs that make one cut and go instead of the five million and two cuts Rice makes before falling into the hole. Pierce is just a better fit schematically. 


Edited by The Raven, 29 January 2014 - 01:14 PM.

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#7 AsianRice

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:19 PM

Pierce just has better vision than Rice, and this system is dependent on good vision.

 

We need backs that make one cut and go instead of the five million and two cuts Rice makes before falling into the hole. Pierce is just a better fit schematically. 

They are probably the best duo backs in the league and Gary will prove that hypothesis.  Rice gaining weight lost his elusiveness which was his trademark back in 08.  If Rice can get back to his considered weight and Pierce staying healthy, we are looking at the best ground attack that we all have envisioned awhile ago...


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#8 jazz1988

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:22 PM

Pierce just has better vision than Rice, and this system is dependent on good vision.

 

We need backs that make one cut and go instead of the five million and two cuts Rice makes before falling into the hole. Pierce is just a better fit schematically. 

 

I always thought Rice had better vision but we shall see.


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#9 jkm5bmore

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:25 PM

Given what Kubiak had in Texas, could Kubiaks scheme really help Pierce's production get to a potential probowl level? The run scheme Kubiak had in Texas helped Foster really explode in the running game and with the fact that Pierce and Foster are the same size and same type runner, and with Bernard being the faster back, do you think we could have a potential situation with Bernard that we had with priest holmes and Jamal Lewis over a decade ago?

I think by adding Kubiak all aspects of the Ravens' offense should see great improvements and a healthy Pierce will elevate his performance as a result. However, what made Foster so dynamic in Kubiak's system was that he was equally skilled as a receiver. When on the field, there was always a threat of run or pass. That made the scheme so unpredictable and made Foster a Pro Bowl back as a result. Rice will probably see more growth in Kubiak's scheme because of this, but Pierce will elevate his play as well if he works on the passing game's protection reads, hot routes and his hands. I think he will. He has to if he will be used more often..


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#10 A Fish Called Yanda

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:30 PM

Pierce just has better vision than Rice, and this system is dependent on good vision.

 

We need backs that make one cut and go instead of the five million and two cuts Rice makes before falling into the hole. Pierce is just a better fit schematically. 

 

I don't think this is necessarily true.  I think Pierce has more power to break through bad blocking that Rice, and that's why he was a marginally better running back this year.  But lets not kid ourselves, both running backs performed terribly this year (though it really wasn't their fault).

 

Rice needs good primary blocks to get off the line, and then uses his elusiveness to force missed tackles up the field for big gains.  Pierce is more of a power rusher and has the ability to get yards even when the blocking scheme completely breaks down (which it did on a vast majority of running plays this year).

 

I hate all of the talk that Rice is done (not saying you said this The Raven).  Yes, he had a bad year, but Pierce had a bad year as well.  I think next year, with a large improvement in our ZBS, our running game will be back on track.


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#11 Ravensfan23

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:31 PM

I agree Peirce clearly has better vision then Rice from what I see. I think this system fits him perfectly and it'll be huge for his career. The heath concern is a issue because of his running style, but I expect to see a lot more production from BP. He's the future of this backfield and this offense fits his skills to a T. Rice will still be productive though.

I'll tell yo someone else who probably benefits greatly from this system and the hire of Kubiak probably saved his career....Gino G. Kubiak and Dennison turned a 6'4 285lbs Center into a all pro in this sytem. Now yes, Chris Myers is worlds better then Gino right now, but if Gino can take to this system and learn to play with more Leverage, he can certianly thrive in this system.
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#12 tech1080

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:32 PM

Ray will be back next year mark my words.


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#13 BmoreBird22

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:39 PM

I agree Peirce clearly has better vision then Rice from what I see. I think this system fits him perfectly and it'll be huge for his career. The heath concern is a issue because of his running style, but I expect to see a lot more production from BP. He's the future of this backfield and this offense fits his skills to a T. Rice will still be productive though.
I'll tell yo someone else who probably benefits greatly from this system and the hire of Kubiak probably saved his career....Gino G. Kubiak and Dennison turned a 6'4 285lbs Center into a all pro in this sytem. Now yes, Chris Myers is worlds better then Gino right now, but if Gino can take to this system and learn to play with more Leverage, he can certianly thrive in this system.

He was beginning to hold up better with blocks toward the end of the year, so I don't doubt he can learn to play with proper technique and hold his own, but what concerns me is that lack of knowledge we have from Gino. He's just routinely out of place and lost in his blocks because he cannot make the right call. Defenses knew they could run stunts, delays, crosses, or anything remotely close to get a sack.
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#14 kassaiscool

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:42 PM

It seems like Pierce is hurting after every play. Injury is always a concern with him, but if hes healthy he is hard to stop.


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#15 Stephenjr

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 02:06 PM

Given what Kubiak had in Texas, could Kubiaks scheme really help Pierce's production get to a potential probowl level? The run scheme Kubiak had in Texas helped Foster really explode in the running game and with the fact that Pierce and Foster are the same size and same type runner, and with Bernard being the faster back, do you think we could have a potential situation with Bernard that we had with priest holmes and Jamal Lewis over a decade ago?

It's all about the O-line. Also, Pierce needs to become more durable. We can be #1 in rushing if the O-line blocks correctly.


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#16 Stephenjr

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 02:08 PM

I agree Peirce clearly has better vision then Rice from what I see. I think this system fits him perfectly and it'll be huge for his career. The heath concern is a issue because of his running style, but I expect to see a lot more production from BP. He's the future of this backfield and this offense fits his skills to a T. Rice will still be productive though.

I'll tell yo someone else who probably benefits greatly from this system and the hire of Kubiak probably saved his career....Gino G. Kubiak and Dennison turned a 6'4 285lbs Center into a all pro in this sytem. Now yes, Chris Myers is worlds better then Gino right now, but if Gino can take to this system and learn to play with more Leverage, he can certianly thrive in this system.

Gino is at best a back up in this league IMO. His pass blocking got better as the season went on, but his run blocking was pure putrid!!


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#17 Ravensfan23

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 02:11 PM

He was beginning to hold up better with blocks toward the end of the year, so I don't doubt he can learn to play with proper technique and hold his own, but what concerns me is that lack of knowledge we have from Gino. He's just routinely out of place and lost in his blocks because he cannot make the right call. Defenses knew they could run stunts, delays, crosses, or anything remotely close to get a sack.


Yea I think some of that is the fault of the system and some the fault of Gino. McKinnie said when he left that Castillo's offense required a lot of thinking. It's tough to ask a young player to think more. You usually want young players to think less and just play. But Gino was asked to not only think for himself but also think for the entire oline as well. I think he'll be much better under Castillo in Kubes system and maybe some pointers from Dennison. Everyone should be on the same page so even if he's hearing more then one voice, it's the same message.
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#18 Ravensfan23

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 02:17 PM

Gino is at best a back up in this league IMO. His pass blocking got better as the season went on, but his run blocking was pure putrid!!


As was Yanda's and he's an all pro player. The oline as a unit struggled last year and I for one think it's unfair to judge what Gino can or can't be off one season where everything about him was poor or below standards as well.

Also think about this. Wade Smith was a career journeyman before he got into Kubes system 4 years, so I wouldn't be so quick to write off Gino. Just wait and see what he can improve upon first.
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#19 Robbo15

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 02:27 PM

He will he is perfect for this system rice might be past his prime and he dances too much in the holes
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#20 jkm5bmore

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 02:29 PM

Yea I think some of that is the fault of the system and some the fault of Gino. McKinnie said when he left that Castillo's offense required a lot of thinking. It's tough to ask a young player to think more. You usually want young players to think less and just play. But Gino was asked to not only think for himself but also think for the entire oline as well. I think he'll be much better under Castillo in Kubes system and maybe some pointers from Dennison. Everyone should be on the same page so even if he's hearing more then one voice, it's the same message.

Agreed. McKinnie didn't express a need to think alot on and off the field at times and in hind sight, this really could limit him even more as his career goes on. It's good to see that Gino is willing to take-on the challenge of mastering this blocking scheme. I only wish him the best and I hope that attitude resonates with all of our players.


Edited by jkm5bmore, 29 January 2014 - 02:38 PM.

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