Joe Flacco and Gary Kubiak

[frozen joe flacco fan]

When an athlete develops an attitude that he or she has nothing more to learn from a new coach, the athlete's development will stop progressing and the athlete will never get any better. I suspect that this will not happen with Joe because he has a great attitude. He has just not had the right OC. Now he has the right mentor --- Gary Kubiak. Ray Rice will be used more like Darren Sproules in a Kubiak offense and will not be expected to carry the ball as much. That will benefit Rice and Flacco. Joe will continue to be a pocket passer who will use play action, screen passes and roll out plays more than he has in the past. Its that simple! In an ideal world, it would be nice to have a veteran QB who is familiar with Kubiak's offense as a backup. A veteran QB could also give Joe some much needed competition.

 

The biggest downside of the relationship between Kubiak and Flacco is that this will be our 3rd OC in 13 months. They will have to work very closely with each other to develop a good rapport. Hopefully, Gary Kubiak will decide to coach from the sidelines and not from a booth. A different sportscaster has labeled the Dallas Cowboys as the most dysfunctional team in the NFL due to hiring their third OC in 3 years. Bottom line: All the King's horses and all the King's men will not be able to fix our offense without revamping the O-line and mastering the zone blocking system we have already begun to implement.    

 

The article by the sportswriter is in a word --- awful.

[arnie_uk]

There is absolutely no need to take it so personally dude. Take a long break and a lot of deep breaths. It isn't like what I said isn't true. If Flacco did that we would have a chance was my point. No, I don't hate Flacco but I have come to realize he isn't the best QB in the league either. I believe Flacco is who he is. It is time you own up to that without getting your garment in a bunch!

As for my football knowledge don't be judgmental and foolish. Your anger at someone questioning your man darling Flacco has sullied your mood and clouded your thinking. Like I said, just relax. I don't hate Flacco at all. It is just that I don't have a fetish for him like you seem to have.

fetish? Haha. No. I just hate when people spout baseless nonsense like that. If your going to criticise someone come with factual data to base your argument on, not benchmarks and markers he's already hit in his career.... Clearly showing your lack of knowledge

[Ravenslifer]

There is absolutely no need to take it so personally dude. Take a long break and a lot of deep breaths. It isn't like what I said isn't true. If Flacco did that we would have a chance was my point. No, I don't hate Flacco but I have come to realize he isn't the best QB in the league either. I believe Flacco is who he is. It is time you own up to that without getting your garment in a bunch!

As for my football knowledge don't be judgmental and foolish. Your anger at someone questioning your man darling Flacco has sullied your mood and clouded your thinking. Like I said, just relax. I don't hate Flacco at all. It is just that I don't have a fetish for him like you seem to have.

 

That isn't the problem - the problem is it seems like numbers are all that define a quarterback to some people.  The difference between 3900 and 4000 yards is really so great that it makes some guys top quarterbacks while Flacco "is who he is"?  If Kubiak can get Flacco to cut down on turnovers, be a very efficient quarterback, and help the Ravens win games, but he falls short of 4000 yards, in your estimation it's a failed job then?  Because I'm really trying hard to understand this need to have your quarterback throw for 4000 yards - most Superbowl winning quarterbacks throw for comparatively fewer yards than their contemporaries that season, because they usually have more of a balanced offense.  For instance, neither of the QBs in the NFC Championship game this year threw for even 3500 yards, so does that make them not worthy of being there?

[jazz1988]

That isn't the problem - the problem is it seems like numbers are all that define a quarterback to some people.  The difference between 3900 and 4000 yards is really so great that it makes some guys top quarterbacks while Flacco "is who he is"?  If Kubiak can get Flacco to cut down on turnovers, be a very efficient quarterback, and help the Ravens win games, but he falls short of 4000 yards, in your estimation it's a failed job then?  Because I'm really trying hard to understand this need to have your quarterback throw for 4000 yards - most Superbowl winning quarterbacks throw for comparatively fewer yards than their contemporaries that season, because they usually have more of a balanced offense.  For instance, neither of the QBs in the NFC Championship game this year threw for even 3500 yards, so does that make them not worthy of being there?

 

Quarterback stats isn't everything but it does matter. I honestly want to see Joe Flacco reach 4,000 + passing yards with more than 25 td and that is possible with Gary Kubiak being his offensive coordinator. I'm happy that Flacco will now have a real offensive coordinator to work with him and also help elevate his game .

[Ravenslifer]

Quarterback stats isn't everything but it does matter. I honestly want to see Joe Flacco reach 4,000 + passing yards with more than 25 td and that is possible with Gary Kubiak being his offensive coordinator. 

 

It would be nice, but as I've pointed out, he came within 200 yards of hitting it the last 2 seasons while sitting out parts of several games in both of those seasons.  So I could make the argument that had he played every snap, he would have reached 4000 yards.  But because he "hasn't", it seems like that proves he's not good enough to do so or will never do so, or something like that.  

 

Or to put it another way, I've seen Matthew Stafford throw for 5000 garbage yards like twice now.  But that doesn't make me think he's better than Aaron Rodgers, who's career high is around 4500 yards, or even better than Russell Wilson.  I think those two guys are better because of the command they seem to have of their offense and their ability to make plays to win games.  In the same vein, I happen to think Joe is better than a guy like Andy Dalton, but apparently because Dalton threw for 4000 yards this year, he's automatically a better quarterback than anybody who hasn't, is what it seems like some people are trying to say.  I mean, if Joe puts up 2010 numbers - 3500 yards, 25 TDs, 10 picks, 63 percent completion, is that a bad year?

[Militant X 1]

CBSSports.com's Doug Gottlieb not only thinks Flacco won't succeed with the bootleg, but he thinks the offense will be worse next season under Kubiak. "You need a really athletic quarterback because you're running a lot of bootlegs, and that's not really Joe Flacco," Gottlieb said in this video. "It's not that Joe Flacco isn't a good athlete, he's actually a really good athlete, but he's not somebody you want to roll out, plant his feet and throw the ball. He's a down-field thrower. "This to me strikes me as a guy who is a really good offensive coordinator with a really good quarterback with a really bad fit for each other. I don't see them getting better. I see them fighting over the play calling and the set up and the depth of the drops."

what is everyone thought about the comment.

 

Well, I guess not; IF all Flacco is asked to do is throw 9 routes down the field an entire season.  C'mon!  Who is this Gottlieb dweeb?  Wow!  Smh!  While I am not a Joe Flacco fan boy; dude can run a solid bootleg if that is what the play requires. Give the man a break!  Damn!

 

#Mili

[BmoreBird22]

I believe kubiak is going to fix Joe Flacco's game. He won't make him a Brady or a Manning or even a Rodgers, but he will make him a fairly decent QB like he did Schaub. I think Joe is more gifted than Shcaub is but Schaub was able to diagnose and dissect defenses better than Joe has been. So, Kubiak is going to help Joe throw a few more TDs than INTs this year. That will be awesome if Joe can get about 24-25 TDs this year with less than 15 INTs! I think he may also cross the 60% mark and just get over the 4000 yd hump too! It is his 7th year in the league too. If not now, then when? If not now, then it is pretty close to never!

Maybe, just maybe, he'll bring in a Marvin Harrison, or a Randy Moss, or even a Jordy Nelson. Wouldn't that be nice?

The thing about all of those quarterbacks is they have elite weapons, too.

Now, I think Kubiak's system will help elevate the level of the receivers, and as a result, you'll get your stats. Joe is going to have one hell of a year.

[ellicottraven]

That isn't the problem - the problem is it seems like numbers are all that define a quarterback to some people.  The difference between 3900 and 4000 yards is really so great that it makes some guys top quarterbacks while Flacco "is who he is"?  If Kubiak can get Flacco to cut down on turnovers, be a very efficient quarterback, and help the Ravens win games, but he falls short of 4000 yards, in your estimation it's a failed job then?  Because I'm really trying hard to understand this need to have your quarterback throw for 4000 yards - most Superbowl winning quarterbacks throw for comparatively fewer yards than their contemporaries that season, because they usually have more of a balanced offense.  For instance, neither of the QBs in the NFC Championship game this year threw for even 3500 yards, so does that make them not worthy of being there?

Here why argue and belabor this point over and over again. Let me say this outright. With Kubiak as offensive coordinator and till such time he is our coordinator, Joe Flacco will consistently throw over 4000 yards and over 25 TDs. Kubiak has made QB nobodies somebodies. And Joe is the best QB he will have coached short of Elway.

 

However, after last season, and the impossible inconsistency Joe shows game after game is shocking! In fact make that quarter to quarter inconsistency. He has never had a good coordinator guide him in all his years in the NFL is perhaps why. Do I hate Flacco? Absolutely not - in fact I used to be one of his biggest apologists and supporters. However, after last season I was pissed and rightfully so... he claimed to be the best in the league before and he may have said it with no malintent, but he needed to show that despite how poorly he was protected, he could still make quick but sensible decisions. 

 

I don't know about you, the one thing that changed with Flacco last year was he just held on to the ball too long and made poor decisions he never made before last year. Before last year, he was good at not taking sacks and throwing the ball way. This year he changed. He took way too many chances with throwing into triple coverage at WRs who were not known for great hands. Why? My belief is his confidence got the better of him and also that he had no specific QB coach talking to him and coaching him game to game and within a game. He needed that last year and didn't have it.

 

While that was happening, he didn't acknowledge it at any time. He was too proud to acknowledge it in an open forum perhaps, but he needed to be told that and I don't think Harbaugh did a good enough job at it either. Also, the thing that peeves me about him is his general 'cool' attitude about everything even during a game. I love that about him, don't get me wrong, but sometimes he needs to be agitated even if it isn't his style so he can get his teammates going... in any case I'll end my rant about why I said the things I said about him. 

 

Now, with Kubiak coming on, I am very hopeful he'll buy into the new system, put in the requisite time to learn new verbage that Kubiak puts together with him and makes sure everybody on offense gets it too. That takes time and effort and I want Joe to invest his soul into it. If he does and it is very likely he will, then not only will he put up yards and TDs, he will finally play to his ability which has always been elite!

[Ravenslifer]

Here why argue and belabor this point over and over again. Let me say this outright. With Kubiak as offensive coordinator and till such time he is our coordinator, Joe Flacco will consistently throw over 4000 yards and over 25 TDs. Kubiak has made QB nobodies somebodies. And Joe is the best QB he will have coached short of Elway.

 

However, after last season, and the impossible inconsistency Joe shows game after game is shocking! In fact make that quarter to quarter inconsistency. He has never had a good coordinator guide him in all his years in the NFL is perhaps why. Do I hate Flacco? Absolutely not - in fact I used to be one of his biggest apologists and supporters. However, after last season I was pissed and rightfully so... he claimed to be the best in the league before and he may have said it with no malintent, but he needed to show that despite how poorly he was protected, he could still make quick but sensible decisions. 

 

I don't know about you, the one thing that changed with Flacco last year was he just held on to the ball too long and made poor decisions he never made before last year. Before last year, he was good at not taking sacks and throwing the ball way. This year he changed. He took way too many chances with throwing into triple coverage at WRs who were not known for great hands. Why? My belief is his confidence got the better of him and also that he had no specific QB coach talking to him and coaching him game to game and within a game. He needed that last year and didn't have it.

 

While that was happening, he didn't acknowledge it at any time. He was too proud to acknowledge it in an open forum perhaps, but he needed to be told that and I don't think Harbaugh did a good enough job at it either. Also, the thing that peeves me about him is his general 'cool' attitude about everything even during a game. I love that about him, don't get me wrong, but sometimes he needs to be agitated even if it isn't his style so he can get his teammates going... in any case I'll end my rant about why I said the things I said about him. 

 

Now, with Kubiak coming on, I am very hopeful he'll buy into the new system, put in the requisite time to learn new verbage that Kubiak puts together with him and makes sure everybody on offense gets it too. That takes time and effort and I want Joe to invest his soul into it. If he does and it is very likely he will, then not only will he put up yards and TDs, he will finally play to his ability which has always been elite!

 

What I'm trying to get at, is, I think it's more important for Flacco to be efficient instead of prolific.  If he can get up to the mid-60s in completion percentage, cut down on the turnovers, play smart football, and make plays, I think that goes much further into winning a Superbowl than throwing for a bunch of yards and TDs.  I think this team is at its best when the run and pass games are close to 50/50, and that means that Flacco might never throw for 4000 yards, but is that necessarily a bad thing? If Kubiak gets him to be a better decision maker, a more efficient player, and we're able to move the football, score points, limit turnovers, and win enough games to make the playoffs every year (basically what Alex Smith has done the last few years, only with a bit more of an ability to make plays), isn't that better than being the Falcons this year, where Matt Ryan threw for over 4500 yards and they still went 4-12?

[PolishRifle]

What I'm trying to get at, is, I think it's more important for Flacco to be efficient instead of prolific.  If he can get up to the mid-60s in completion percentage, cut down on the turnovers, play smart football, and make plays, I think that goes much further into winning a Superbowl than throwing for a bunch of yards and TDs.  I think this team is at its best when the run and pass games are close to 50/50, and that means that Flacco might never throw for 4000 yards, but is that necessarily a bad thing? If Kubiak gets him to be a better decision maker, a more efficient player, and we're able to move the football, score points, limit turnovers, and win enough games to make the playoffs every year (basically what Alex Smith has done the last few years, only with a bit more of an ability to make plays), isn't that better than being the Falcons this year, where Matt Ryan threw for over 4500 yards and they still went 4-12?

 

What made Schaub a failure in Houston, was that he lacked confidence, after it was beated out of him.

Flacco threw a carreer high number of INTs last season, played with one of the leagues worst OLs, one of the leagues worst running games and had receivers, who caused about 1/4th of his total INTs. YET, none of this had any effect of Flacco's attitude, demeanor or willingness to pull the trigger and take chances.

 

Statistically Schaub (in his "prime") deserved his playoff invitations and he did blow Flacco out of the water. But he never showed the ability to make the "plays" necessary to win. At no point of Schaub's carreer did he have a game like the one Flacco had against the Vikings or the Dolphins. Not pretty games, not games that were consistent even from quarter to quarter, but games where Joe proved that he can be counted on.

 

Confidence is what makes QBs great and some have it naturally no matter what, while other need their team around them to have it at all.

 

Flacco is the most talented QB, Kubiak has worked with, since Elway. In the end I believe he might improve slightly on Schaub's performance under Kubiak, because the Ravens lack a Foster or a Andre Johnson. But unlike Schaub Flacco can be trusted with a ball in crucial situation and Kubiak didn't have that in a while.

[Ravenslifer]

What made Schaub a failure in Houston, was that he lacked confidence, after it was beated out of him.

Flacco threw a carreer high number of INTs last season, played with one of the leagues worst OLs, one of the leagues worst running games and had receivers, who caused about 1/4th of his total INTs. YET, none of this had any effect of Flacco's attitude, demeanor or willingness to pull the trigger and take chances.

 

Statistically Schaub (in his "prime") deserved his playoff invitations and he did blow Flacco out of the water. But he never showed the ability to make the "plays" necessary to win. At no point of Schaub's carreer did he have a game like the one Flacco had against the Vikings or the Dolphins. Not pretty games, not games that were consistent even from quarter to quarter, but games where Joe proved that he can be counted on.

 

Confidence is what makes QBs great and some have it naturally no matter what, while other need their team around them to have it at all.

 

Flacco is the most talented QB, Kubiak has worked with, since Elway. In the end I believe he might improve slightly on Schaub's performance under Kubiak, because the Ravens lack a Foster or a Andre Johnson. But unlike Schaub Flacco can be trusted with a ball in crucial situation and Kubiak didn't have that in a while.

 

I agree Flacco is the more talented guy, I'm just saying I don't believe in numbers being indicative of who's the better quarterback, otherwise you'd have to consider Matthew Stafford a top 5 guy.  What I hope to see is a more efficient Flacco, and I don't think he necessarily has to hit 4000 yards for me to consider him having a successful year.

[PolishRifle]

I agree Flacco is the more talented guy, I'm just saying I don't believe in numbers being indicative of who's the better quarterback, otherwise you'd have to consider Matthew Stafford a top 5 guy.  What I hope to see is a more efficient Flacco, and I don't think he necessarily has to hit 4000 yards for me to consider him having a successful year.

 

Yes, that's what I have pointed out in my post also. In my opinion the difference between a great QB and a good one is confidence, which is why I agree that Joe needs to be more efficient, but also hope, that Kubiak doesn't try to rein in Joe completely.

I don't want to see Joe being determined to keep his INTs under 10 and still would like to see him continue to force the ball into tight coverage once in a while, when it makes sense.

 

Flacco's confidence and ability to make game changing plays is what makes him a great QB (and ultimately why he got his contract), not his stats. That's why I talked about the game against the Vikes. Not impressive statistically and not the prettiest game from Flacco in the first 3 quarters, but man that 4th quarter...wow.

[jazz1988]

It would be nice, but as I've pointed out, he came within 200 yards of hitting it the last 2 seasons while sitting out parts of several games in both of those seasons.  So I could make the argument that had he played every snap, he would have reached 4000 yards.  But because he "hasn't", it seems like that proves he's not good enough to do so or will never do so, or something like that.  

 

Or to put it another way, I've seen Matthew Stafford throw for 5000 garbage yards like twice now.  But that doesn't make me think he's better than Aaron Rodgers, who's career high is around 4500 yards, or even better than Russell Wilson.  I think those two guys are better because of the command they seem to have of their offense and their ability to make plays to win games.  In the same vein, I happen to think Joe is better than a guy like Andy Dalton, but apparently because Dalton threw for 4000 yards this year, he's automatically a better quarterback than anybody who hasn't, is what it seems like some people are trying to say.  I mean, if Joe puts up 2010 numbers - 3500 yards, 25 TDs, 10 picks, 63 percent completion, is that a bad year?

 

It's not a bad year at all and I wouldn't be mad  if he does have such stats next season but I would be a little disappointed.  The reason why I say that is because I expect more and I expect a better Flacco with Gary Kubiak as the offensive coordinator.  Dalton had a better season than Flacco but I wouldn't call him the  better quarterback also  the bengels have done a good job with surround Dalton with offensive weapons. Dalton has one of the best receivers in the nfl to throw to in green, two  good tightends whom were first round picks, other solid receivers, solid offensive line and he had a offensive coordinator that knew how to cater to this quarterback strength . 

 

 If the Ravens can do the same for Flacco then I expect him to have more than 3,500 passing yards and we finally have the right offensive coordinator to help get him there.