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ravensfan520

Joe Flacco and Gary Kubiak

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CBSSports.com's Doug Gottlieb not only thinks Flacco won't succeed with the bootleg, but he thinks the offense will be worse next season under Kubiak. "You need a really athletic quarterback because you're running a lot of bootlegs, and that's not really Joe Flacco," Gottlieb said in this video. "It's not that Joe Flacco isn't a good athlete, he's actually a really good athlete, but he's not somebody you want to roll out, plant his feet and throw the ball. He's a down-field thrower. "This to me strikes me as a guy who is a really good offensive coordinator with a really good quarterback with a really bad fit for each other. I don't see them getting better. I see them fighting over the play calling and the set up and the depth of the drops."

what is everyone thought about the comment.

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Flacco is a better athlete than Schaub, in near every way.

Schaub worked the bootleg fine.  Schaub was at his worst when in the pocket for long stretches.

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CBSSports.com's Doug Gottlieb not only thinks Flacco won't succeed with the bootleg, but he thinks the offense will be worse next season under Kubiak. "You need a really athletic quarterback because you're running a lot of bootlegs, and that's not really Joe Flacco," Gottlieb said in this video. "It's not that Joe Flacco isn't a good athlete, he's actually a really good athlete, but he's not somebody you want to roll out, plant his feet and throw the ball. He's a down-field thrower. "This to me strikes me as a guy who is a really good offensive coordinator with a really good quarterback with a really bad fit for each other. I don't see them getting better. I see them fighting over the play calling and the set up and the depth of the drops."

what is everyone thought about the comment.

What are YOUR thoughts on the comment?

 

I think Gottlieb is clueless and should stick to college basketball.

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Flacco is much more athletic then Schaub. Also if you take the time to actually watch Flacco he's a much better QB when he's allowed to move around, plus he throws really well on the run, so I don't see how rolling out, "planting" his feet and throwing would be a problem.

I didn't read the article but it strikes me as a guy who doesn't watch much of Flacco, he's just operating on the thoughs that Joe is a stationary guy who wants to just chuck the ball down field.

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It appears that Mr. Gottlieb is unaware that Flacco is a good athlete AND that Kubiak would adjust the scheme if need be. 

 

Kubiak is great for Joe, simple as that. 

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I Hope both of them find a way to get the offense better. "I don't like this, I don't like that". Thats BS. You do whatever to score points.

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Flacco and Kubiak... Kubiak and Flacco...

 

tumblr_m1iz9zJqvO1qb1hsso1_400.gif

 

haha sorry but it's the first thing that came to mind.

 

 

I don't think this article's assesment is too accurate.  Joe is as mobile (or moreso) than any of the other QBs Kubiak has had success with.  This guy is just going against the grain the get page hits.

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Guys let's keep this about how Flacco and Kubiak will work together in this system. It's not about Flacco's.....

Contract

Super Bowl win,

Pervious stats

Ranking compared to other QBs

Wins

Leadership

Personality

Let's stay on topic or this will be yet another Flacco thread shut down and that's getting old. No personal attacks, no hater vs support battles. Stay on topic and do not hijack this thread.

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I love how Kubiak attacks all three levels of the defense, and I love love love his use of crossing routes. I think we might see him call the offense similar to the Texans offense, but with maybe a bit more deep stuff, since we have Joe. I definitely don't want it turning into Cam 2.0, and I know it won't, but while Schaub is limited in the deep passing game, Flacco is strong in it. So, we'll see a bit more of it, but not too much more. We'll definitely build it up more with a lot of slants and crosses

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I wouldn't say Flacco is a better athlete than Schaub. Nothing really to compare them too but I will say if the Kubiak can establish a run game for the Ravens it will make Flacco better for the 2014 season. Kubiak is pretty good at making a team a run team to say.

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I love how Kubiak attacks all three levels of the defense, and I love love love his use of crossing routes. I think we might see him call the offense similar to the Texans offense, but with maybe a bit more deep stuff, since we have Joe. I definitely don't want it turning into Cam 2.0, and I know it won't, but while Schaub is limited in the deep passing game, Flacco is strong in it. So, we'll see a bit more of it, but not too much more. We'll definitely build it up more with a lot of slants and crosses

Couldn't agree more. Being able to attack all 3 levels will open things up so much. We've never really attacked all 3 levels together. We either focused on the low percenatge deep ball(11"-13") or the mid range game(10") or the short game/dumpoff("08-"09). We've never had a offense that attacked all levels, despite having a QB more then capable.

I can't wait to see that first PA stretch, throw back across the field to Pitta play.

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I always though Joe looked pretty good at running the bootleg stuff, rolling out to the right, etc. 2011-12 AFC Championship game comes to mind.

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He can run it and run it well. I would like for Joe to work on his play fake more though.  Maybe it's the view when watching, but it doesn't seem like he sells it well.  It's small things like that can help get a receiver some separation for a big play.  Will also make the throw easier on him if the defense actually bites.  Excited to see how the o line plays next year.  One thing I noticed about the Texans o line before this year was they really seemed to move as a single unit.  Don't see that often where the whole line seems in sync. 

 

 

I also think the bootleg has a lot to do with how the o line moves.  If they do their job, you don't need to be the most athletic because the defensive front will be following them.

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Well considering Shaub NEVER ran around at all when running Houston's offense whereas Joe takes off quite often when he has to, I don't see how moving outside the pocket for a bootleg is going to be an issue.  Joe does have issues setting his feet when throwing, but quite often when I've seen that it's when he's under duress and flushed from the pocket.  If it's a designed bootleg, Joe should have no problem with it.

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I wouldn't say Flacco is a better athlete than Schaub. Nothing really to compare them too but I will say if the Kubiak can establish a run game for the Ravens it will make Flacco better for the 2014 season. Kubiak is pretty good at making a team a run team to say.

 

You might not say Joe's a better athlete than Schaub but he clearly is. Beyond simply watching them play, the stats bear that out. Flacco has run for a higher clip than Schaub during his career, picked up more first downs and had bigger gains. 

 

As others have said, I'm looking forward to watching Joe work with Kubiak. 

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Ravens hire a pass happy OC "Flacco can't perform in this offense it's a terrible fit"

 

Ravens hire Kubiak for his zone stretch run offense "Flacco can't do it well enough, blah blah blah"

 

Is anyone here surprised? The stories never change, these pundits will never believe in Flacco and that's ok. Kubiak is the perfect fit here. He and Dennison ran a very productive offense (besides this season) with Shaub who doesn't compare to Joe. Flacco can do everything required of him within the confines of this offense. Still, most importantly, this scheme will be dependant on the run game resurrecting itself, the rest will follow suit. 

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I just hope he can teach joe how to read defenses !!! (maybe cut down on the romo's too)

This right here. Look, I'm a fan of Flacco. I root for him to do well. But, my biggest complaint about him is his awareness, both pocket and pre-snap. Seriously, when was the last time any of us saw a defender jump offsides and Flacco take his "free shot" downfield? I can't remember a single time. That kind of stuff drives me crazy about Flacco. How many times did we see Polamalu lining up in the defensive end position to blitz, and zero changes occur at the line? Then he gets sacked or stripped of the ball, with zero effort to move away from that side of the rush!! I know it sounds like I'm bashing on Flacco, but I'm just pointing out some examples of things I hope this new relationship will fix. After all, no one is perfect.

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I always though Joe looked pretty good at running the bootleg stuff, rolling out to the right, etc. 2011-12 AFC Championship game comes to mind.

yes my thoughts exactly
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None of it matters if Kubiak and off-season events do not fix the OL

 

It would mean his rollouts won't be by play-design lol

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I have two thoughts one Doug Gottlieb needs to stick to basketball and leave

football out of it I don't like his basketball rhetoric  either most times. Two Kubiak has already said he is going to work with Joe to find what best  suits him , not exact words but that sounds like his game plan will play to Flacco's strengths as it should be.

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This right here. Look, I'm a fan of Flacco. I root for him to do well. But, my biggest complaint about him is his awareness, both pocket and pre-snap. Seriously, when was the last time any of us saw a defender jump offsides and Flacco take his "free shot" downfield? I can't remember a single time.

A) There aren't many defensive offsides penalties against us, because our Oline is false starting so often.

B) He's thrown bombs in those situations several times.

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managing to do it worse then last season would be trully an amazing job.

dont think its possible lol.

 

also flacco is more athletic then alot of people think and he can throw the ball on the run better then most QBs.

 

that cannon arm of his makes up for being not set when throwing and probaly his best plays came when on the move.

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A worse offense than last year?  Really?  Does this guy realize that we had the worst and the 6th worst running backs of the last 10 seasons?  In one year, on one team, the WORST and the SIXTH WORST.  That's out of 339 qualifying running backs, ranked in terms of yards per attempt.

 

We had a bottom 20 running game in the Super Bowl era.

 

We were last in the league in Yards Per Play.

 

He really expects it to get even WORSE from that?  Really?

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This guy is unaware that Flacco can move around. In fact, his ability to move around in the pocket and escape has improved ten fold since last year.

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This guy is unaware that Flacco can move around. In fact, his ability to move around in the pocket and escape has improved ten fold since last year.

 

I agree with you there. That was sort of the one thing, that kept our offense alive last season, but then the Detroit game came and ... ugh.

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You might not say Joe's a better athlete than Schaub but he clearly is. Beyond simply watching them play, the stats bear that out. Flacco has run for a higher clip than Schaub during his career, picked up more first downs and had bigger gains. 

 

As others have said, I'm looking forward to watching Joe work with Kubiak. 

Agreed.  You know, over the last 4 seasons, Schaub's longest rush attempt was for 8 yards.  Flacco's longest in the span was 33 yards, and he has ran for 9+ yards (so, longer than Schaub's longest) 16 times.  Over their entire careers, Schaub has run for first downs of at least 2 yards (so this is purposefully exluding anything that would constitute a QB sneak, for instance) 21 times, while Flacco has 35 under his belt.  And Flacco has played in 32 fewer games.  (These stats are regular season only, by the way).  So I would say Flacco has demonstrated much more athleticism in making plays with his feet just going by the stats alone.

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that cannon arm of his makes up for being not set when throwing and probaly his best plays came when on the move.

Perhaps, but throwing downfield on the run is where 90% of his accuracy issues come into play. Very inconsistent on 15+ yard attempts on the run, according to the eyeball test

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Neither Flacco or Kubiak strike me has unreasonable personalities. Therefore, I think they will work well together. Flacco has been open to advise and help in the past and with the year he is coming off of I expect he will be again. Joe has shown that he is flexible (excluding those gimmick wildcard plays). And Kubiak says he will work with Joe on what he feels or his strengths and help him continue his growth. So, I see only good things coming from a Kubiak offense with Joe as its QB.

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based on past teams and QB's Gary's worked with, and proven track record with Qb's and bringing the best out of them at some point, im excited to see the progression and growth Flacco takes through the course of this season as well as the seasons to come. Time will tell for sure but just looking from the outside in, it appears to be a match that could bring balance to this offense once more AND establish a more "fine tuned, primed" Flacco, as compared to his previous years, leading to better production overall as a complete unit.

 

AND bring back a rushing attack that his a productive force in moving the chains and extending the play. A Respected Rushing attack back in Baltimore.

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He can run it and run it well. I would like for Joe to work on his play fake more though.  Maybe it's the view when watching, but it doesn't seem like he sells it well.  It's small things like that can help get a receiver some separation for a big play.  Will also make the throw easier on him if the defense actually bites.  Excited to see how the o line plays next year.  One thing I noticed about the Texans o line before this year was they really seemed to move as a single unit.  Don't see that often where the whole line seems in sync. 

 

 

I also think the bootleg has a lot to do with how the o line moves.  If they do their job, you don't need to be the most athletic because the defensive front will be following them.

I agree with the play fake of Joe, but I will also say that comes from coaching as well. Our offense never put a heavy emphasis on carrying out the play fake so Joe doesn't really do it. Despite not being under center much, his play fakes in college looked much better then now. So that leads me to believe he isn't asked to focus on that much.

I like this offense because it'll force Joe to have active feet. One of my biggest issues with Joe is that he gets lazy feet at time and just relies on arm strenght to win. Zorn started to clear that up, thanks Cam, but once we started focusing more on the vertical pass game those bad habits showed up again. This offense will force Joe to have active feet and he's really good when he has active feet. It'll definitely be interesting to see how Flacco handles a offense that actually suites him.

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This right here. Look, I'm a fan of Flacco. I root for him to do well. But, my biggest complaint about him is his awareness, both pocket and pre-snap. Seriously, when was the last time any of us saw a defender jump offsides and Flacco take his "free shot" downfield? I can't remember a single time. That kind of stuff drives me crazy about Flacco. How many times did we see Polamalu lining up in the defensive end position to blitz, and zero changes occur at the line? Then he gets sacked or stripped of the ball, with zero effort to move away from that side of the rush!! I know it sounds like I'm bashing on Flacco, but I'm just pointing out some examples of things I hope this new relationship will fix. After all, no one is perfect.

Yea the motion and overall design of the offense should help Flacco in these areas. We should have more blitz beaters now, aduibles that are actually designed to attack defenses not just flip the play side or kill the play. The offense Gary brings will help Jow a lot and of course Joe will have to do his part to master this offense and make it even better.

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watch the super bowl again if you have a problem with flacco throwing on the move, youll change ur mind. 

 

it boggles my mind to know that some of these people get paid hefty salaries to talk about sports and dont know the first thing about the most recent SBMVP

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I think one of Joes biggest upside is arm strength. One of his flaws is throwing a wr open. Call that not trusting his teammates or whatever. I am hoping that kubiak can fix that part of his game. Kubiaks game plan attacks in all parts of the field and I hope he can help Flacco to see that as well instead of waiting on one guy or area.

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I agree that he can move around in the pocket but that's because he is big and hard to bring down. We never featured a lot of Joe moving by design. Yes he has done it some and faired well with it... but he needs to work on the touch with his passes as well. He tends to rely on his strong arm and zip it in to much. One big thing I hope Kubaik can help with is the middle of the field that is where Flacco seems to have the most problems with. Reading safties or linebackers in coverage.

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I'm excited about this hire. It will help Joe get to the next level. For the first time since Jim Zorn left, Joe will have someone on the sidelines who understands what he is going through. Gary Kubiak will get the most out of Joe. Its up to Joe to get the most out of Gary Kubiak.  It will also be refreshing to have someone on the sidelines who understands how to run the offense. Its frustrating and embarrassing for a HC to watch a team who is not performing up to his expectations. It is probably even more frustrating for a HC who often looks clueless on the sidelines and whose game decisions often seemed to lack good judgment. I will temper my enthusiasm because we have just hired an OC who is coming off a 2-11 season as a HC after starting 2-0. That being said, this will give John Harbaugh the opportunity to become a great coach rather than just the good coach he is now. He will have more time to concentrate on the things that HCs should be doing. AND he could take a page out of President Reagan's book where the President said "you can accomplish a lot if you don't care who gets the credit." Its too early to post our predictions for next year's entry but we've already improved the team. Let's go, Ravens! 

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