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Who is the "Leader" and Who is the "Pulse" of the Ravens?

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Watching an old clip of Eric Davis on the NFL Network speaking about the Ravens prior to this past season beginning.  He said that the leader of a team may not necessarily be the pulse of the team.  As a former 49er, he made a very interesting statement validating his point.  He said;

 

"Joe Montana was the leader but Ronnie Lott was the pulse of the 49ers!"

 

That got me thinking about the Ravens.  For me; Ray Lewis has been both the "leader" and the "pulse" of the Ravens organization the past 17 years.  Who would you say are those things now?

 

#Mili

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I feel like this will be a common answer but I'd have to go with Joe and Suggs as being the "leader" and "pulse" of their respective sides of the ball. It's funny because from the outside looking in, their personalities are quite opposite. I think they're both very honest in their pressers and if they're both on then the whole team usually is (if only one is on then that side of the ball usually is). If I had to say for the team, as a whole, then it would be Joe as the leader and Suggs as the pulse. Which is interesting because the qb was the leader and the disruptive defender was the pulse in ED's mind. I think that may be the same for the majority of teams though. 

 

I am aware that Suggs might not be a Raven next year, I'm just looking at the team as is. 

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Without being in the locker room and simply taking quotes from players like Torrey Smith and Ray Rice, it seems to me they look at Flacco as their leader, but if I had to guess, the pulse would be Suggs.

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No Leader & No Pulse. Suggs is on his way out the door, people need to understand this is a new era for us.

 

Agreed. I've seen this team just straight quit at various stages in the season.

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I don't know. I honestly don't know. I would honestly say Tucker was probably the Pulse of the team. Leader wise, I don't think we really had one.

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I'd go with Flacco and Suggs as the leaders of the O & D. I'm not exactly sure what ED meant by the pulse of the team.  Is the pulse of the team the person who gives the team an identity? Is it the player(s) who is (are) the heart of the team and makes the team tick? If that's what he meant, I would say the pulse of the team are Flacco, Suggs, Rice, Jones and Tucker. Joe is a quiet leader and actions speak louder than words. Suggs is always out there sticking up for this team and his QB. The most demonstrative of the bunch is also the most diminutive of the bunch --- Ray Rice.

 

I would rather answer this question with another question.  Would it be a good idea for management to get rid of the leader or the "pulse" of the team or is it absolutely imperative that we keep that player or players? I would argue that Anquan Boldin would have been the "pulse" of the team this year if he was still a Raven.

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I'd go with Flacco and Suggs as the leaders of the O & D. I'm not exactly sure what ED meant by the pulse of the team.  Is the pulse of the team the person who gives the team an identity? Is it the player(s) who is (are) the heart of the team and makes the team tick? If that's what he meant, I would say the pulse of the team are Flacco, Suggs, Rice, Jones and Tucker. Joe is a quiet leader and actions speak louder than words. Suggs is always out there sticking up for this team and his QB. The most demonstrative of the bunch is also the most diminutive of the bunch --- Ray Rice.

 

I would rather answer this question with another question.  Would it be a good idea for management to get rid of the leader or the "pulse" of the team or is it absolutely imperative that we keep that player or players? I would argue that Anquan Boldin would have been the "pulse" of the team this year if he was still a Raven.

 

Rice is the leader, who tried fighting his Fullback on the sidelines and didn't take responsiblity for his bad play all year? Interesting.

 

Suggs who was told by the front office they expect him to step up to be a leader still remains a clown and only caring about him and his numbers. Getting in spats with Dumervil because they switched positions and Dumervil started getting the weak side blitzes.

 

Joe who mentioned that the reason the offense was so bad was timing issues with the receivers? You don't say that to the media, you work with your guys on the sideline especially young guys like Marlon Brown. You go over the film with them on the sideline and explain what he does better instead of sitting there with an empty gatorade cup in your mouth day dreaming.

 

This team lost it's "swag" and it's leadership. I called Ray Lewis out in the beginning of the year when he spoke out about our leadership because i felt it was self serving and disloyal. But he was right. This team does lack leadership.

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I'd argue that Flacco was the pulse because he was the only thing that kept us in games, even on bad days. He was the one getting first downs and trying to keep drives going. When he failed, the team failed. Likewise, when your pulse stops, you die. The team lived and died with Joe's performance.

 

Leadership, I don't even know. It was supposed to be Suggs but the only thing he seemed to lead was the line at the team cafeteria. 

Edited by The Raven
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We have neither right now. Just b/c you the franchise QB, that don't necessarily make you the leader. A leader isn't something you can anoint someone to be, it's something that should come natural and it's some they ought to want to be.A lot of people dismiss Ray and the impact he had on this team but it was major and to be a leader, that's a major feat right there. Men have to believe in you and be ready to follow and listen to you when times get rough. Suggs is more a rah rah guy and Joe...... he just doesn't appear to be that guy but hey, who knows.

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Rice is the leader, who tried fighting his Fullback on the sidelines and didn't take responsiblity for his bad play all year? Interesting.

 

Suggs who was told by the front office they expect him to step up to be a leader still remains a clown and only caring about him and his numbers. Getting in spats with Dumervil because they switched positions and Dumervil started getting the weak side blitzes.

 

Joe who mentioned that the reason the offense was so bad was timing issues with the receivers? You don't say that to the media, you work with your guys on the sideline especially young guys like Marlon Brown. You go over the film with them on the sideline and explain what he does better instead of sitting there with an empty gatorade cup in your mouth day dreaming.

 

This team lost it's "swag" and it's leadership. I called Ray Lewis out in the beginning of the year when he spoke out about our leadership because i felt it was self serving and disloyal. But he was right. This team does lack leadership.

 

At least we know how you really feel about three of the team's stalwart superstars even though you avoided answering Mili's question. I was impressed how much leadership Suggs showed by rehabbing to overcome an Achilles tendon injury and fighting through a partially torn bicep. I was not as impressed this year by Elvis Dumerville's performance or his leadership on the team even though I had high expectations for him. Sometimes you're hurt and sometimes you're injured. Late in the season when we needed him the most was he hurt or injured? There's no question about it though. We did lose a lot of leadership which is hard to replace in one season, especially when two of the leaders are living legends of the NFL. We sorely missed Matt Birk's steadying influence in the huddle too. As I've said before, the team met my expectations for an 8 - 8 season. I would have been surprised if we had made the playoffs. Thanks to the guys I mentioned earlier in my post and some others like Dennis Pitta who all showed a lot of heart, the Ravens nearly did make the playoffs in spite of losing so many of our starters from last year's team. So, I respectfully disagree with your assessment that the team lacks leadership. We just lost several leaders all at once but we have several more leaders who are works in progress. Just because a team goes 2 - 14 like the Houston Texans did does not mean they lacked leadership.

 

There are plenty teams out there who would jump at the chance to grab some of the players on our team that you don't like or see them as "leaders." Wait until free agency begins and you will see. This team is still in transition from our great SB team. Unfortunately, the transformation is not completely finished. In order for us to improve, we need to find a way to keep the core of leaders we have and add to it a C, WR, TE, OL & FS through the draft and free agent market. Another off-season like the one we just went through will further diminish the team's talent pool. I hope the WR is Anquan Boldin but that will depend on how he does in the post-season.

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At least we know how you really feel about three of the team's stalwart superstars even though you avoided answering Mili's question. I was impressed how much leadership Suggs showed by rehabbing to overcome an Achilles tendon injury and fighting through a partially torn bicep. I was not as impressed this year by Elvis Dumerville's performance or his leadership on the team even though I had high expectations for him. Sometimes you're hurt and sometimes you're injured. Late in the season when we needed him the most was he hurt or injured? There's no question about it though. We did lose a lot of leadership which is hard to replace in one season, especially when two of the leaders are living legends of the NFL. We sorely missed Matt Birk's steadying influence in the huddle too. As I've said before, the team met my expectations for an 8 - 8 season. I would have been surprised if we had made the playoffs. Thanks to the guys I mentioned earlier in my post and some others like Dennis Pitta who all showed a lot of heart, the Ravens nearly did make the playoffs in spite of losing so many of our starters from last year's team. So, I respectfully disagree with your assessment that the team lacks leadership. We just lost several leaders all at once but we have several more leaders who are works in progress. Just because a team goes 2 - 14 like the Houston Texans did does not mean they lacked leadership.

 

There are plenty teams out there who would jump at the chance to grab some of the players on our team that you don't like or see them as "leaders." Wait until free agency begins and you will see. This team is still in transition from our great SB team. Unfortunately, the transformation is not completely finished. In order for us to improve, we need to find a way to keep the core of leaders we have and add to it a C, WR, TE, OL & FS through the draft and free agent market. Another off-season like the one we just went through will further diminish the team's talent pool. I hope the WR is Anquan Boldin but that will depend on how he does in the post-season.

I don't know if being injured and playing injured and rehabbing from a injury has anything to do with leadership?

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At least we know how you really feel about three of the team's stalwart superstars even though you avoided answering Mili's question. I was impressed how much leadership Suggs showed by rehabbing to overcome an Achilles tendon injury and fighting through a partially torn bicep. I was not as impressed this year by Elvis Dumerville's performance or his leadership on the team even though I had high expectations for him. Sometimes you're hurt and sometimes you're injured. Late in the season when we needed him the most was he hurt or injured? There's no question about it though. We did lose a lot of leadership which is hard to replace in one season, especially when two of the leaders are living legends of the NFL. We sorely missed Matt Birk's steadying influence in the huddle too. As I've said before, the team met my expectations for an 8 - 8 season. I would have been surprised if we had made the playoffs. Thanks to the guys I mentioned earlier in my post and some others like Dennis Pitta who all showed a lot of heart, the Ravens nearly did make the playoffs in spite of losing so many of our starters from last year's team. So, I respectfully disagree with your assessment that the team lacks leadership. We just lost several leaders all at once but we have several more leaders who are works in progress. Just because a team goes 2 - 14 like the Houston Texans did does not mean they lacked leadership.

 

There are plenty teams out there who would jump at the chance to grab some of the players on our team that you don't like or see them as "leaders." Wait until free agency begins and you will see. This team is still in transition from our great SB team. Unfortunately, the transformation is not completely finished. In order for us to improve, we need to find a way to keep the core of leaders we have and add to it a C, WR, TE, OL & FS through the draft and free agent market. Another off-season like the one we just went through will further diminish the team's talent pool. I hope the WR is Anquan Boldin but that will depend on how he does in the post-season.

 

I did answer his quesiton earlier. I have no idea. I don't see a leader on this team. The Pulse was probably Jacoby and Tucker. They gave the team life.

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Lol at multiple people (not just in this thread) saying Suggs is still a clown cause of fights he got into with Dumervil. People have said it didn't happen guys. I've seen multiple people on twitter saying that is false. And by people I mean WNST, people who write for the Baltimore Sun, Russell Street Report, and others. If this was a big deal, you would see more people writing about it. Don't believe everything you read on the internet. 

 

And for the record, I think its a little wrong that we could call anyone "not a leader". We don't know what goes on in that locker room. Just for example, was listening to the radio last night, and the guy was saying one of the best leaders on the team was Canty. Just because you don't see them yelling at people on the sidelines or anything like that, doesn't mean they aren't a leader in the locker room. 

 

Imo though, leader- Flacco/Suggs. Pulse- probably Tucker/Jacoby/Torrey

Edited by bauer77
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Rice is the leader, who tried fighting his Fullback on the sidelines and didn't take responsiblity for his bad play all year? Interesting.

 

Suggs who was told by the front office they expect him to step up to be a leader still remains a clown and only caring about him and his numbers. Getting in spats with Dumervil because they switched positions and Dumervil started getting the weak side blitzes.

 

Joe who mentioned that the reason the offense was so bad was timing issues with the receivers? You don't say that to the media, you work with your guys on the sideline especially young guys like Marlon Brown. You go over the film with them on the sideline and explain what he does better instead of sitting there with an empty gatorade cup in your mouth day dreaming.

 

This team lost it's "swag" and it's leadership. I called Ray Lewis out in the beginning of the year when he spoke out about our leadership because i felt it was self serving and disloyal. But he was right. This team does lack leadership.

Thought that was a rumour perpetuated by some random dude on a baseless website...

 

Edit: and if this were true Suggs wouldn't have come back the week after Webb and Lewis were lost for the rest of the regular season.  It was quite clear Suggs was nowhere near game shape/readiness after his injury, yet he came back to try to hold the fort.

Edited by Bltravens
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Thought that was a rumour perpetuated by some random dude on a baseless website...

 

It was. People here still believe it for some reason though. lol

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I honestly would say....as of right now....we have neither.

I hate to agree,,,,,

 

I mean I understand saying Flacco, and those who say Flacco to a large degree are right.  Flacco is with out a doubt a leader, but not in a " God father " sort of way, like Ray was.   You never wanted to disappoint Ray for many different reasons.  I dont see Flacco having that level or respect. 

 

Ray set the bar super high for leadership in this organization.

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Flacco is a leader... just not your rah rah kind of leader.... He's not that guy and trying to compare him to Ray is unfair at best. Most of those pump up huddles aren't led by QB's.  You don't see Manning or Brady in those huddles...  Brees, yes, but not Luck or Kaepernick either...  For San Fran you see Patrick Willis... Most of those pump up huddles are led by defensive players...  Those guys are your tough guy, smack talking, leaders...  We have Suggs... Canty did a good job this year too... There are leaders, you guys just don't see them out there doing it in public.

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Lol at multiple people (not just in this thread) saying Suggs is still a clown cause of fights he got into with Dumervil. People have said it didn't happen guys. I've seen multiple people on twitter saying that is false. And by people I mean WNST, people who write for the Baltimore Sun, Russell Street Report, and others. If this was a big deal, you would see more people writing about it. Don't believe everything you read on the internet. 

 

And for the record, I think its a little stupid that we could call anyone "not a leader". We don't know what goes on in that locker room. Just for example, was listening to the radio last night, and the guy was saying one of the best leaders on the team was Canty. Just because you don't see them yelling at people on the sidelines or anything like that, doesn't mean they aren't a leader in the locker room. 

 

Imo though, leader- Flacco/Suggs. Pulse- probably Tucker/Jacoby/Torrey

You do know most things that's posted in any forum is opinionated? That's part of any forum to give one opinion on a subject b/c if everything that was posted was all facts, wouldn't be too many things to post about.

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You don't need a ra ra leader in sports.  Its one of the most perplexing myths about team sports in my eyes.  What you need in a leader is integrity combined with a professionalism in their work ethic.

Im fairly certain Manning doesn't lead pre-game speeches, nor does Brady.  But both of them will let you know when you're not up to snuff.  Steve Yzerman was the same way with the Red Wings for decades, he in my eyes is an idealized version of a team leader.  A guy who completely changed the way he played hockey, going from scoring upwards of 130+ points every year, to becoming one of, if not the best, two way centres in the entirety of NHL history.  Yzerman was not a ra ra leader.

I can't say for certain, but what needs to happen is Flacco needs to play better next year and then start demanding the same production and work ethic from teammates.

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I don't honestly know. I saw flashes of leadership and pulse this season, but I believe that we won't probably see that 'true' emergence of a team leader until 2014.

It was great to see so many Ravens take leadership roles in game and practice situations throughout the year. Although very little mentioned in most conversations, players like Ngata, Jacoby, Tucker, both Smiths, Canty, Doom, Elam, M Brown and others sparked the team to play more inspired at times. To me it will most likely come down to big play moments on the field, unyielding loyalty to your teammates on and off the field, a relentless work ethic, humanity and commitment to excellence to earn the title of leader or pulse. Without a doubt, we have leaders on our team and one or two will surely emerge as 'the' leaders.

 

It will take at least next season to see who those true leaders will be. Only through the harsh, blinding dust of adversity will leaders emerge followed by their brothers in arms ready to fight whatever army that stands in the clearing. (couldn't resist)

 

When this happens, none of those leaders will be Ray Lewis or any past leader. They will be 'clearly' self-defined, unique leaders of men and inspirations to all.

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I do see Joe more on the sidelines with his receivers going over pictures or talking and making hand signals I assume talking routes. I think Joe  will  be more vocal he's getting there . One thing I noticed at the start of the season spears and canty would be talking to players esp the young guys who messed up blew an assignment or got or almost got a penalty .Suggs you see flashes of it. I miss Reed and Lewis whether  the team is I don't know for sure  but I bet to some extent the players are you can't replace what those two brought to the table even if you looked a lifetime.

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You don't need a ra ra leader in sports.  Its one of the most perplexing myths about team sports in my eyes.  What you need in a leader is integrity combined with a professionalism in their work ethic.

Im fairly certain Manning doesn't lead pre-game speeches, nor does Brady.  But both of them will let you know when you're not up to snuff.  Steve Yzerman was the same way with the Red Wings for decades, he in my eyes is an idealized version of a team leader.  A guy who completely changed the way he played hockey, going from scoring upwards of 130+ points every year, to becoming one of, if not the best, two way centres in the entirety of NHL history.  Yzerman was not a ra ra leader.

I can't say for certain, but what needs to happen is Flacco needs to play better next year and then start demanding the same production and work ethic from teammates.

 

Agreed!  And to me...Ray Lewis was way more than being a "ra-ra" type of leader although cats try to limit his leadership to that.  To me, Ray led with passion, integrity and a great deal of love and respect for the game of football.  And through that passion for the game....speeches poured forth from him!  But those speeches were more than just "ra-raing" the team.  They were about life and how blessed those men were to play that "game".  He took his craft seriously and wanted to bring out the best in the players around him.  To answer my own question; I don't see anyone on the roster like that now!  And that's sad!

 

#Mili

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NOONE! Despite All our other problems and deficiencies, This was the biggest problem with this team. The leader and pulse of this team left after the Super Bowl. When #52 retired we lost All leadership and pulse. There was just noone on this team that could step up and fill those voids. I'm not saying nobody tried. I don't know because I wasn't in the locker room. But the product on the field showed that nobody Succeeded.

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