Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

edthehead

Art Modell Excluded From HOF Again

36 posts in this topic

Well ,, we as ravens fans are use to the media in all their bias comments, we even tolerated them not letting MR.ART MODELL in the H.O.F within his initial 5 years,but all these years later to continue to despise him is wrong. Who are the people that vote and the commissioner does he have any say (I know he don't) The man is truly a pioneer in Football . What can we as fans do.      

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not a surprize. Too many sportswriters are always gonna drag him down just cuz he moved the Browns to Balt. One move trumps all the pioneeering. Smh.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He moved a loser Franchise and made it a winning won. I could understand if the Browns were like 5 time SB champs and all of that was wiped away but they had 0 SBs before the move and 0 after.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He moved a loser Franchise and made it a winning won. I could understand if the Browns were like 5 time SB champs and all of that was wiped away but they had 0 SBs before the move and 0 after.

Its because they were one of the original franchises... Dating back to the late 19th century, early 20th.

And they were from one of the birthplaces of professional football (Ohio). That's a whole lot of history to change.

But I don't mind. I love my Ravens.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As I put on someone's status who commented on this:

 

The city of Cleveland, the Browns' organization and fans continue to reap the karmic rewards of this vendetta. It really is this one sportswriter guy who makes a case before the voters not to include Modell.

 

I really don't want to hear the historic franchise crap - they are still the Cleveland Browns residing in the city of Cleveland with all their history intact within the franchise & city.

 

Davis moved the Raiders how many times?

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's getting beyond ridiculous, to be honest. Could you write the history of the NFL without talking about Art Modell? No! It's not his fault Cleveland would't help in building a new stadium, so he made the business decision he had to make to bring them here. End of. 

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He moved a loser Franchise and made it a winning won. I could understand if the Browns were like 5 time SB champs and all of that was wiped away but they had 0 SBs before the move and 0 after.

Actually, the Browns were one of the football's most successful teams for a while. During their four years in the AAFC, they won every single championship,  and were one of only three AAFC teams to be admitted to the original NFL, where they won an additional 4 championships in their first 15 years in the league.

 

You also neglect to mention that that "Loser Franchise" was one that he was responsible for maintaining, and one with which he had a very hands on approach. It isn't like he simply periodically checked up on the team and let the coaches do everything. In fact, the franchise didn't manage a winning record until Modell sold the majority share to Mr. Biscotti.

 

 

It's getting beyond ridiculous, to be honest. Could you write the history of the NFL without talking about Art Modell? No! It's not his fault Cleveland would't help in building a new stadium, so he made the business decision he had to make to bring them here. End of. 

 

Modell announced on November 6, 1995, that he had signed a deal to relocate the Browns to Baltimore in 1996—a move which would return the NFL to Baltimore for the first time since the Colts relocated to Indianapolis after the 1983 season. The very next day, on November 7, 1995, Cleveland voters overwhelmingly approved an issue that had been placed on the ballot at Modell's request, before he made his decision to move the franchise, which provided $175 million in tax dollars to refurbish the outmoded and declining Cleveland Municipal Stadium.

 

 

That's from Wikipedia. Where's your source for Clevelanders not wanting to build him a new stadium?

 

Honestly, I'm grateful he brought us the Baltimore Ravens, but the cult around Modell is simply baffling to me.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, the Browns were one of the football's most successful teams for a while. During their four years in the AAFC, they won every single championship, and were one of only three AAFC teams to be admitted to the original NFL, where they won an additional 4 championships in their first 15 years in the league.

You also neglect to mention that that "Loser Franchise" was one that he was responsible for maintaining, and one with which he had a very hands on approach. It isn't like he simply periodically checked up on the team and let the coaches do everything. In fact, the franchise didn't manage a winning record until Modell sold the majority share to Mr. Biscotti.

I'm not sure where your idea that Modell didn't manage a winning record until he sold the majority stake to Bisciotti:

During Modell's 35 seasons as team owner the Browns qualified for the postseason 17 times, winning 11 division titles and the NFL championship in 1964. The team's overall regular season record during Modell's tenure was 252–233–10, (winning percentage .519), and its post-season record was 7 wins against 14 losses (winning percentage .333).



That's from Wikipedia. Where's your source for Clevelanders not wanting to build him a new stadium?

Honestly, I'm grateful he brought us the Baltimore Ravens, but the cult around Modell is simply baffling to me.

That wiki quote indicates that the funding was for renovations, not a new stadium. Model had indicated for years that they needed a new stadium, but the city wouldn't budge. Instead , they built a new stadium for the Indians (which reduced his income even more), not to mention various other projects including the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame. It was too little too late. Remember Modell wasn't a multi-millionaire business man the owned the Browns, they were his only source of income.

Further, I don't see a cult around Modell, but for people like me who grew up with the Colts, we're extremely grateful to him for bringing football back to Baltimore. Most of us just don't understand how a guy like Al Davis can be in the Hall, but not Modell...other than Tony Grossi's personal vendetta.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, the Browns were one of the football's most successful teams for a while. During their four years in the AAFC, they won every single championship,  and were one of only three AAFC teams to be admitted to the original NFL, where they won an additional 4 championships in their first 15 years in the league.

 

You also neglect to mention that that "Loser Franchise" was one that he was responsible for maintaining, and one with which he had a very hands on approach. It isn't like he simply periodically checked up on the team and let the coaches do everything. In fact, the franchise didn't manage a winning record until Modell sold the majority share to Mr. Biscotti.

 

 

 

 

That's from Wikipedia. Where's your source for Clevelanders not wanting to build him a new stadium?

 

Honestly, I'm grateful he brought us the Baltimore Ravens, but the cult around Modell is simply baffling to me.

 

When the Browns moved their records stayed behind right? All those championships still exist for them that was not the case for the Colts here if I'm correct. Cleveland lost their team for a couple years. The Ravens do not have credits for their wins, championships and records.

 

Im just tired of the Model hating is all.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure where your idea that Modell didn't manage a winning record until he sold the majority stake to Bisciotti:

I meant after moving the team to Baltimore. The Browns were a very good team while in Cleveand prior to the year before the move, and were even favorites to win the 1995 Superbowl when the season started.

 

 

That wiki quote indicates that the funding was for renovations, not a new stadium. Model had indicated for years that they needed a new stadium, but the city wouldn't budge. Instead , they built a new stadium for the Indians (which reduced his income even more), not to mention various other projects including the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame. It was too little too late. Remember Modell wasn't a multi-millionaire business man the owned the Browns, they were his only source of income.

Further, I don't see a cult around Modell, but for people like me who grew up with the Colts, we're extremely grateful to him for bringing football back to Baltimore. Most of us just don't understand how a guy like Al Davis can be in the Hall, but not Modell...other than Tony Grossi's personal vendetta.

There are conflicting stories on whether or not Modell was offered a new stadium, but considering there is no evidence either way, I'm not going to get into an argument about it.

 

The Indians got a new stadium because Modell refused to share any revenue that he got from luxury suites that were used during Indians baseball games with them, and the owner of the Indians threatened to leave the city. If Modell wanted them to stay, he could have negotiated an agreement with the Indians that didn't shortchange them.

 

I can understand wanting a new stadium, but to convince lawmakers to give the people of Cleveland the opportunity to send you their tax money because your business isn't making enough, and then not only negotiate to move the team before finding out the outcome, but also announce the move the day before the vote was the kind of move I would expect from a cartoon villain, not a model of NFL ownership.

 

I don't think Al Davis deserves to be in the Hall, but neither do I think Modell deserves to get in either. Monday Night Football is certainly very important, and it's great that he was instrumental in bringing it about, but I simply don't think it outweighs his mistakes and the move from Cleveland.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When the Browns moved their records stayed behind right? All those championships still exist for them that was not the case for the Colts here if I'm correct. Cleveland lost their team for a couple years. The Ravens do not have credits for their wins, championships and records.

 

Im just tired of the Model hating is all.

 

 

I haven't  been a football fan for years and years  so I have a question. why was it ok for the Colts to leave in the dead of night and its was ok with the nfl but it wasn't ok for Modell to move the browns ? is it the same thing or have I missed something in translation?

 

 

the current brown's  stadium is horrible not to denigrate that club or its fans but big difference in ours and theres

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't  been a football fan for years and years  so I have a question. why was it ok for the Colts to leave in the dead of night and its was ok with the nfl but it wasn't ok for Modell to move the browns ? is it the same thing or have I missed something in translation?
 
 
the current brown's  stadium is horrible not to denigrate that club or its fans but big difference in ours and theres


Well that is the interesting question. We know how people feel about Modell, that said when it is time for consideration how well we feel about Irsay getting in ? I would personally hate out and despise home as a person and individual. I hate that Modell isn't in, but I know why the rest of the league hates it as well.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not a surprize. Too many sportswriters are always gonna drag him down just cuz he moved the Browns to Balt. One move trumps all the pioneeering. Smh.

And the Colts left Baltimore for Indianapolis is the dead of night!  What's the difference?  Art is the man and should be honored as such!

 

#Mili

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I meant after moving the team to Baltimore. The Browns were a very good team while in Cleveand prior to the year before the move, and were even favorites to win the 1995 Superbowl when the season started.

 

There are conflicting stories on whether or not Modell was offered a new stadium, but considering there is no evidence either way, I'm not going to get into an argument about it.

 

The Indians got a new stadium because Modell refused to share any revenue that he got from luxury suites that were used during Indians baseball games with them, and the owner of the Indians threatened to leave the city. If Modell wanted them to stay, he could have negotiated an agreement with the Indians that didn't shortchange them.

 

I can understand wanting a new stadium, but to convince lawmakers to give the people of Cleveland the opportunity to send you their tax money because your business isn't making enough, and then not only negotiate to move the team before finding out the outcome, but also announce the move the day before the vote was the kind of move I would expect from a cartoon villain, not a model of NFL ownership.

 

I don't think Al Davis deserves to be in the Hall, but neither do I think Modell deserves to get in either. Monday Night Football is certainly very important, and it's great that he was instrumental in bringing it about, but I simply don't think it outweighs his mistakes and the move from Cleveland.

Thank you for objective information. I don't ever expect to learn the whole story but this clears up a bit because I am continually being misinformed by other Baltimorean who would rather cover up Modell's faults. I feel sorry for the city of Cleveland and their franchise,especially given our success, but hey man we needed a team. I don't know what I would do without my Ravens but that doesn't mean I don't want to know the dirty truth of how they got here. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I understand the city is upset, But the man himself means so much to football and to continuously deny him even in the afterlife they will not let him in,,FLAT OUT WRONG, Is it anyway to possibly override their decision    

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't  been a football fan for years and years  so I have a question. why was it ok for the Colts to leave in the dead of night and its was ok with the nfl but it wasn't ok for Modell to move the browns ? is it the same thing or have I missed something in translation?

 

 

the current brown's  stadium is horrible not to denigrate that club or its fans but big difference in ours and theres

With the Browns, whether Modell was refused the stadium he wanted or refused an offer for is unknown, and who you choose to believe depends solely on who you think is more trustworthy. What is known is that at Modell's urging, the people of Cleveland were given the opportunity to vote to give him money to renovate his existing stadium and he left the city for Baltimore the day before the vote after giving no indication that he was planning a move. He uprooted a successful team with a rich history and deserted a devoted fanbase.

 

The Colts on the other hand, were in a much more complicated situation where they were victimized to a much greater extent by Baltimore and Maryland as a whole. The Colt's previous owner had wanted a new stadium as far back as 1969 and when the city decided it was going to increase the fees he paid for rent instead, he decided he wanted to leave. Luckily for Baltimore, Irsay was able to work out a deal with the guy so Irsay would get the Colts in Baltimore, and the original owner would get the Rams out in LA.

 

In order to get Irsay to buy the Colts, Baltimore promised they'd build a new stadium to accommodate all of Baltimore's sports teams. Of course, that stadium never actually happened because it was shot down by the Maryland legislature, and when it didn't happen the Orioles' owner was ready to leave and Irsay was in favor of putting his faith in the people of Baltimore. I'm sure he came to regret his optimism when the people of Baltimore passed an amendment to the city charter that stated that city funds would never be used to fund a stadium other than Memorial Stadium during elections later that year. Then Irsay asked for 25 million dollars to renovate Memorial Stadium and the Maryland legislature returned a counter offer that was 2 million dollars fewer and required both the Colts and Orioles so lease the stadium long term.

 

Despite such a blatant slap in the face, it was another five years (including a stretch of three straight playoff trips) with no indication that he would get a new stadium before Irsay started taking any real interest in shopping around for a new home city. In 1984, Baltimore Mayor finally announced that there wouldn't be a new stadium for the Colts unless Irsay was willing to foot the entire bill, and Irsay decided to go forward with plans to move to either Pheonix or Indianapolis. In response, the Maryland Senate passed a bill that would have seized the Colts from Irsay via eminent domain and the House of Delegates planned to consider it the following day. That convinced Phoenix to give up on the Colts, but Indianapolis had already built a football stadium, and the mayor was able to convince an Indianapolis based shipping company to get the Colts and all of their equipment and belongings out of Baltimore and into Indy the same day. It should be noted that the House of Delegates did in fact pass the bill the next day.

 

If you don't want to read the whole post, what it basically boils down to is that Irsay waited for a new stadium for the 25 years he was in Baltimore and never got it, couldn't even manage to get money for renovations from, and when he finally tried to move the team to somewhere that would build him a stadium, the city tried to steal his team from him, whereas Modell arguably had support for a stadium and had overwhelming support for renovation money.

 

That's why many in football media and in the NFL feel more strongly about Modell's move than about Irsay's.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With the Browns, whether Modell was refused the stadium he wanted or refused an offer for is unknown, and who you choose to believe depends solely on who you think is more trustworthy. What is known is that at Modell's urging, the people of Cleveland were given the opportunity to vote to give him money to renovate his existing stadium and he left the city for Baltimore the day before the vote after giving no indication that he was planning a move. He uprooted a successful team with a rich history and deserted a devoted fanbase.

 

The Colts on the other hand, were in a much more complicated situation where they were victimized to a much greater extent by Baltimore and Maryland as a whole. The Colt's previous owner had wanted a new stadium as far back as 1969 and when the city decided it was going to increase the fees he paid for rent instead, he decided he wanted to leave. Luckily for Baltimore, Irsay was able to work out a deal with the guy so Irsay would get the Colts in Baltimore, and the original owner would get the Rams out in LA.

 

In order to get Irsay to buy the Colts, Baltimore promised they'd build a new stadium to accommodate all of Baltimore's sports teams. Of course, that stadium never actually happened because it was shot down by the Maryland legislature, and when it didn't happen the Orioles' owner was ready to leave and Irsay was in favor of putting his faith in the people of Baltimore. I'm sure he came to regret his optimism when the people of Baltimore passed an amendment to the city charter that stated that city funds would never be used to fund a stadium other than Memorial Stadium during elections later that year. Then Irsay asked for 25 million dollars to renovate Memorial Stadium and the Maryland legislature returned a counter offer that was 2 million dollars fewer and required both the Colts and Orioles so lease the stadium long term.

 

Despite such a blatant slap in the face, it was another five years (including a stretch of three straight playoff trips) with no indication that he would get a new stadium before Irsay started taking any real interest in shopping around for a new home city. In 1984, Baltimore Mayor finally announced that there wouldn't be a new stadium for the Colts unless Irsay was willing to foot the entire bill, and Irsay decided to go forward with plans to move to either Pheonix or Indianapolis. In response, the Maryland Senate passed a bill that would have seized the Colts from Irsay via eminent domain and the House of Delegates planned to consider it the following day. That convinced Phoenix to give up on the Colts, but Indianapolis had already built a football stadium, and the mayor was able to convince an Indianapolis based shipping company to get the Colts and all of their equipment and belongings out of Baltimore and into Indy the same day. It should be noted that the House of Delegates did in fact pass the bill the next day.

 

If you don't want to read the whole post, what it basically boils down to is that Irsay waited for a new stadium for the 25 years he was in Baltimore and never got it, couldn't even manage to get money for renovations from, and when he finally tried to move the team to somewhere that would build him a stadium, the city tried to steal his team from him, whereas Modell arguably had support for a stadium and had overwhelming support for renovation money.

 

That's why many in football media and in the NFL feel more strongly about Modell's move than about Irsay's.

thanks for taking the time to explain it to me I knew there was more then what I knew of it  nothing is ever cut and dry.I read the entire post. I feel for both fanbases the browns and the colts . if the ravens leave it would rip my heart out and tear it into little pieces .my father remains a colt fan never waivered even after they left , his opinion was Baltimore ran them off . so I left it never asked .

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Saint Irsay?

If you'd like to present an alternate account that you think is appropriately demonizing, feel free to do so.

 

 

 

 

thanks for taking the time to explain it to me I knew there was more then what I knew of it  nothing is ever cut and dry.I read the entire post. I feel for both fanbases the browns and the colts . if the ravens leave it would rip my heart out and tear it into little pieces .my father remains a colt fan never waivered even after they left , his opinion was Baltimore ran them off . so I left it never asked .

It's interesting that he stayed a Colts fan. I heard a lot of people in Maryland shifted loyalty to the Redskins and Steelers. I think Baltimore and Maryland as a whole really screwed the pooch with the way they handled the Colts, but at the least, the backlash against the government resulted in a lot more protections being put in place for sports teams that the Ravens now benefit from.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If Modell's actions negate his accomplishments, then I don't want to hear about Belichick and Kraft being future HOF.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If Modell's actions negate his accomplishments, then I don't want to hear about Belichick and Kraft being future HOF

that's a really good point !

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you'd like to present an alternate account that you think is appropriately demonizing, feel free to do so.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

How bout Irsays lies and the way he handled people in general. The week before he moved he told the people of Balt in no way shape or form was he moving the team(there were rumors of him moving to Phoenix at the time). Then they up and moved out of Balt in the middle of the night in a downpour taking the colors and history of the Colts with him.It don't get lower than that. Elway wouldn't even come here after he was drafted and that started the avalanche. Irsay straight up was a jerk.

 

As for the Browns moving to Balt that all started when Paul Tagliaboo-boo did everything in his powers as commisioner to not give us an expansion team even tho we had the best package deal available for a team. The Browns wouldn't even have moved. At least not to Balt. All new stadiums were being built in Cleve at the time for baseball,basketball and the Rock N Roll HOF. Modell was told to take a backseat. No Modell might not have been a saint(he could have sold the team to local investors at the time and Modell not wanting to share revenue for skyboxes was true) and he knew the package Balt had laid out was too good to pass up. Bottomline is we should have gotten one of the expansion teams but only Modell gets the blame for the Browns move. The true culprit does not.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
As a personal note regarding the Colts move, I grew up a few houses down from their Head Trainer at the time. As I recall, he found out about the move with a late-night phone call that said "pack your bags, we're moving to Indy." Pure class, that Irsay.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The really big difference is the teams. The Browns remained in Cleveland. They have their history, their colors, their victories intact. The football HOF does not consider any of that to have anything to do with Baltimore. Not so for the Colts. All of their history, their victories, even their players have been usurped by Indy. The HOF has Johnny U as an Indianapolis Colt. There is some footnote about Baltimore but it is like Baltimore never had a team until the Ravens. Its a bitter pill to swallow for Baltimore football fans.

 

 

Besides all that the Hall of Fame should memorialize all of the history of the game. Villains are famous throughout history. So Art may have been arguably villainous for part of his career. He is also a major player in the history of football. Isn't that what fame is about?

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The really big difference is the teams. The Browns remained in Cleveland. They have their history, their colors, their victories intact. The football HOF does not consider any of that to have anything to do with Baltimore. Not so for the Colts. All of their history, their victories, even their players have been usurped by Indy. The HOF has Johnny U as an Indianapolis Colt. There is some footnote about Baltimore but it is like Baltimore never had a team until the Ravens. Its a bitter pill to swallow for Baltimore football fans.

 

 

Besides all that the Hall of Fame should memorialize all of the history of the game. Villains are famous throughout history. So Art may have been arguably villainous for part of his career. He is also a major player in the history of football. Isn't that what fame is about?

 

People always bring up how the Browns still have their history, but fail to include the caveat that Modell didn't leave it to them out of the goodness of his heart. They had to sue Modell to the point where the NFL and representatives of Cleveland and Baltimore had to get together to sort everything out.

 

I don't believe that the Hall of Fame should simply be for people who are well known. It exists to honor exceptional players, coaches, owners, etc for their contributions in improving the game of football. Modell's only significant contribution that I'm aware of was the introduction of Monday Night Football  and as great as that is, it isn't exactly a fundamental part of the way football works. If for some reason MNF was done away with, the only thing affected would be the schedule.

Do you think I don't realize how much losing their team sucked for Baltimore? (incidentally, a lot of the statements in the video apply equally to Modell)

 

It was a bad situation. But when you've got a city that literally alters its charter to say that it will never contribute any tax money for you to have a new stadium (note that this was a public referendum) after a publicly funded one was promised to you, and a state legislature that refuses to authorize any money for improvements to said stadium (10 years overdue for a replacement) with no repercussions from their constituents, you feel disrespected. Then he decides to start shopping around the team to see if there are any cities that might be a bit more grateful for a team, and he has to leave unannounced because the state literally tries to steal his team from him.

 

Maybe Irsay handled the situation without class, but would you have handled it with class? If I feel like someone is disrespecting me, they certainly aren't going to get respect from me, especially if that respect might cost me the most valuable thing I own.

 

 

How bout Irsays lies and the way he handled people in general. The week before he moved he told the people of Balt in no way shape or form was he moving the team(there were rumors of him moving to Phoenix at the time). Then they up and moved out of Balt in the middle of the night in a downpour taking the colors and history of the Colts with him.It don't get lower than that. Elway wouldn't even come here after he was drafted and that started the avalanche. Irsay straight up was a jerk.

 

As for the Browns moving to Balt that all started when Paul Tagliaboo-boo did everything in his powers as commisioner to not give us an expansion team even tho we had the best package deal available for a team. The Browns wouldn't even have moved. At least not to Balt. All new stadiums were being built in Cleve at the time for baseball,basketball and the Rock N Roll HOF. Modell was told to take a backseat. No Modell might not have been a saint(he could have sold the team to local investors at the time and Modell not wanting to share revenue for skyboxes was true) and he knew the package Balt had laid out was too good to pass up. Bottomline is we should have gotten one of the expansion teams but only Modell gets the blame for the Browns move. The true culprit does not.

I'm not saying Irsay should have lied to the people of Baltimore about whether or not he was planning to move the team, but I am saying he was justified in doing so because of the way he was treated. As for leaving in the middle of the night, he was forced into it because the state of Maryland was trying to steal his team from him.

 

As for Modell, it's "he said she said" at this point. Cleveland government officials have claimed Modell turned down an offer for a new stadium several years before the move, and Modell said he was the one who got refused. Regardless of whether or not Tagliabue unintentionally set up Baltimore as an attractive spot for Modell, Modell still strung Clevelanders along by asking them for money for renovations and then taking the team out of the city on the day before the vote.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People always bring up how the Browns still have their history, but fail to include the caveat that Modell didn't leave it to them out of the goodness of his heart. They had to sue Modell to the point where the NFL and representatives of Cleveland and Baltimore had to get together to sort everything out.

 

I don't believe that the Hall of Fame should simply be for people who are well known. It exists to honor exceptional players, coaches, owners, etc for their contributions in improving the game of football. Modell's only significant contribution that I'm aware of was the introduction of Monday Night Football  and as great as that is, it isn't exactly a fundamental part of the way football works. If for some reason MNF was done away with, the only thing affected would be the schedule.

Do you think I don't realize how much losing their team sucked for Baltimore? (incidentally, a lot of the statements in the video apply equally to Modell)

 

It was a bad situation. But when you've got a city that literally alters its charter to say that it will never contribute any tax money for you to have a new stadium (note that this was a public referendum) after a publicly funded one was promised to you, and a state legislature that refuses to authorize any money for improvements to said stadium (10 years overdue for a replacement) with no repercussions from their constituents, you feel disrespected. Then he decides to start shopping around the team to see if there are any cities that might be a bit more grateful for a team, and he has to leave unannounced because the state literally tries to steal his team from him.

 

Maybe Irsay handled the situation without class, but would you have handled it with class? If I feel like someone is disrespecting me, they certainly aren't going to get respect from me, especially if that respect might cost me the most valuable thing I own.

 

 

I'm not saying Irsay should have lied to the people of Baltimore about whether or not he was planning to move the team, but I am saying he was justified in doing so because of the way he was treated. As for leaving in the middle of the night, he was forced into it because the state of Maryland was trying to steal his team from him.

 

As for Modell, it's "he said she said" at this point. Cleveland government officials have claimed Modell turned down an offer for a new stadium several years before the move, and Modell said he was the one who got refused. Regardless of whether or not Tagliabue unintentionally set up Baltimore as an attractive spot for Modell, Modell still strung Clevelanders along by asking them for money for renovations and then taking the team out of the city on the day before the vote.

 

You're underestimating the importance of MNF. Football wasn't always a multi-billion dollar business. So, if they decided to do away with MNF tomorrow, would it make a big impact for the fans? Not necessarily, since the sport is so big now (it might also make some people's monday night's not as fun), but it would have an impact on NFL with tv revenue. Football also wasn't the biggest sport in the US as it is today, so back when MNF was put in place it most definitely helped expand the NFL brand. MNF isn't all he did either, and I find it strange that you did this research to objectively look at both moves but failed to look up any other contribution Art gave to the NFL. A quick search led me to this article, and here's a little quote from the beginning, it's a little synopsis of some of the things he did.

 

 During his 43 years as a team owner, Modell served as president of the league, helped create the first collective bargaining agreement with the players and was instrumental in creating a bond with television that propelled the NFL into prominence.

 

 

I also don't get why it seems like you're saying Cleveland had to pry the Brown's legacy from Modell, but Irsay did what he had to in order to keep his team? Were the Brown's not Modell's team? That's just the tone I get from reading this comment or am I just reading it wrong? I'm not being as objective as you, so I apologize if I am getting the wrong tone. Another thing, we were never going to be the Baltimore Browns anyway, the people of Baltimore were going to vote on a new team name regardless. I wasn't even originally going to comment on what you were saying about the moves but I just feel the need, it's late at night and the thoughts are flowing.

 

Back on topic:

I have no sympathy for Cleveland fans. I just don't, and, frankly, I don't think I ever could. Why? Because they only had to wait like 3 years for a new team. Houston only had to wait 4 years (Side note on Houston: Don't necessarily feel sympathy for them either, but at the same time there's a little understanding; our fan base can relate to theirs when they see Tennessee in Oilers uniforms for throwback days). While those 3 to 4 years must have been grueling, they just don't compare to 13 brutal years without a football team that Baltimore had to deal with. All the while being denied 2 expansion teams and being told to

"build a museum" by the commissioner at that time. We wouldn't even be discussing this issue like we are had we been given an expansion team. LA or some other city probably would be, though. So no, no tears for Cleveland. I will say that I do see the irony in how we got our team in a similar fashion as the way we lost it.

 

I think what really irks me about it all is that we're sort of told that we can't even complain about it. We're told to get over it, which I think doesn't help when trying to get over it. Sure, now it's water under the bridge because it's been over a decade since this all went down, but being told to get over what happened, while Cleveland fans are allowed to do the same (all the while getting obvious support from HoF voters). I mean, Modell's son had to ask the Brown's to not pay tribute to Art when he died because he knew, and everyone else knew, that the response would be horrible. That's pretty low of Brown fans. Also, this post has sort of become just an "in general" post, but here's another thing for you, Nave, if Modell didn't contribute that much to the NFL then why was there a tribute to him at every game that week (except Browns/Eagles, of course) when he died? That doesn't happen for just anyone.

 

All I'm trying to say is Modell deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.

 

Sorry this post is so long, but I did say that the thoughts were flowing. I hope nothing comes off as rude, I wasn't trying to be, but I know I got a bit defensive. Okay, I'm done. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People always bring up how the Browns still have their history, but fail to include the caveat that Modell didn't leave it to them out of the goodness of his heart. They had to sue Modell to the point where the NFL and representatives of Cleveland and Baltimore had to get together to sort everything out.

 

 

 

As for Modell, it's "he said she said" at this point. Cleveland government officials have claimed Modell turned down an offer for a new stadium several years before the move, and Modell said he was the one who got refused. Regardless of whether or not Tagliabue unintentionally set up Baltimore as an attractive spot for Modell, Modell still strung Clevelanders along by asking them for money for renovations and then taking the team out of the city on the day before the vote.

Balt fans didn't want the name"Browns'. So what if Clev was gonna sue. If Balt didn't win its lawsuit how was Clev?? That lawsuit had nothing to do with it

 

That new stadium was supposed to house the football and baseball teams. That would've been a financial blow to Modell. So when he turned that offer down they went and built the Indians a nice new stadium. What a slap in the face.  Pretty funny how Clev didn't refurbish the football stadium but completely rebuilt the stadium using NFL money after the move. Tags knew he goofed badly.

 

Look if the Browns didn't move we wouldn't have a team. We were always gonna be considered Redskin territory.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People always bring up how the Browns still have their history, but fail to include the caveat that Modell didn't leave it to them out of the goodness of his heart. They had to sue Modell to the point where the NFL and representatives of Cleveland and Baltimore had to get together to sort everything out.

 

I don't believe that the Hall of Fame should simply be for people who are well known. It exists to honor exceptional players, coaches, owners, etc for their contributions in improving the game of football. Modell's only significant contribution that I'm aware of was the introduction of Monday Night Football  and as great as that is, it isn't exactly a fundamental part of the way football works. If for some reason MNF was done away with, the only thing affected would be the schedule.

Do you think I don't realize how much losing their team sucked for Baltimore? (incidentally, a lot of the statements in the video apply equally to Modell)

 

It was a bad situation. But when you've got a city that literally alters its charter to say that it will never contribute any tax money for you to have a new stadium (note that this was a public referendum) after a publicly funded one was promised to you, and a state legislature that refuses to authorize any money for improvements to said stadium (10 years overdue for a replacement) with no repercussions from their constituents, you feel disrespected. Then he decides to start shopping around the team to see if there are any cities that might be a bit more grateful for a team, and he has to leave unannounced because the state literally tries to steal his team from him.

 

Maybe Irsay handled the situation without class, but would you have handled it with class? If I feel like someone is disrespecting me, they certainly aren't going to get respect from me, especially if that respect might cost me the most valuable thing I own.

 

 

I'm not saying Irsay should have lied to the people of Baltimore about whether or not he was planning to move the team, but I am saying he was justified in doing so because of the way he was treated. As for leaving in the middle of the night, he was forced into it because the state of Maryland was trying to steal his team from him.

 

As for Modell, it's "he said she said" at this point. Cleveland government officials have claimed Modell turned down an offer for a new stadium several years before the move, and Modell said he was the one who got refused. Regardless of whether or not Tagliabue unintentionally set up Baltimore as an attractive spot for Modell, Modell still strung Clevelanders along by asking them for money for renovations and then taking the team out of the city on the day before the vote.

 

How the Browns maintained their history is not relevant, at least not to me. I am certain that if Baltimore could get its history back by publicly embarrassing themselves they would happily do so to get back what is and should be theirs.I was not a Baltimorian during the Colt era so have no real direct knowledge of the situation, but I am reasonably certain that those old Colts fans would do anything to get back what is theirs.

 

 

And to answer your question, Yes. I would ALWAYS maintain my "class" and dignity regardless of the circumstances. Always have, always will. We are free to define ourselves as others would have us do so, or we may define ourselves through our own actions. I do not allow others actions to define me, or to define how I treat them. To do so, makes you less then they are. A servant of their ignorance. I try to take the higher road, to be the better man.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I looked into this subject and this journalist is making it sound like Modell voted for the Jacksonville and Carolina expansion teams instead of Baltimore. Its as if he was saving Baltimore in his back pocket all along. He makes it sound like that's the reason Art isn't in the hall of fame. Can anyone explain what really happened this guy clearly doesn't like Modell so I would like to hear an unbiased opinion.
http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2013-02-13/news/bs-ed-ravens-modell-20130213_1_ravens-owner-art-modell-nfl-owner


 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites