Disturbing Joe Flacco stats?

[wayne]

I am beginning to truly feel a small segment of this forum is almost angry that Flacco led the team to a Super Bowl last year, and that they are seething over the fact he was the MVP.  

What does that have to do with this past season though???? Really!!! I guess Eli Manning homers feel the same way and the realist are saying that's history,lol.

[wayne]

i'm stunned you said something positive about flacco ,,,am I dreaming ? j/k its nice to see

Funny thing is I have always said this and I say Flacco is a decent, good QB with potential to play great at times. I have said that a million times but the Flacco fan club will say he's a great QB that plays poor at times which is simply not true.Like Ray Lewis said, he always played like this.

[jimjim5]

[quote name="StingerNLG" post="1732291" timestamp="1388627946"]
I am beginning to truly feel a small segment of this forum is almost angry that Flacco led the team to a Super Bowl last year, and that they are seething over the fact he was the MVP.[/quote]
I think that it is more that the fans see the foreshadowing of MAJOR team problems that could have been completely avoided. It's disappointing.

For the record, Flacco's my guy, but I think he is turning out to be a bit thick-headed with regard to his development vs. the team's offensive philosophy.

[quote name="PerpetuallyBored74" post="1732299" timestamp="1388628425"]
Have you seen how inept our coaching has been on the offensive side of the ball during those 6 years?
Flacco hasn't even had the same QB coach for more than 2 years in a row if I'm not mistaken.
Bring in somebody who played QB and knows what it takes from first hand experience--if Zorn isn't welcome here anymore, than what's Marc Bulger doing right now?[/quote]
Also, having Tyrod as his backup was probably a very bad decision. You need a backup guy that can push you. One that is at least better than you in one area that is passing related. You need a peer to bounce stuff off of. All the SB did was validate Flacco's opinion of himself.

[jimjim5]

Yep! One has to wonder what the Wizard of Oz was thinking.

 

Here are some more disturbing Flacco stats:

 

John Unitas played from 1956 through 1973 and was sacked a total of 74 times.

Joe Flacco has been sacked 222 times in six years in the league, not to mention the number of times he's been hit!

Think about it! John Unitas was not a scrambler. He was a drop-back passer who stayed in the pocket most of the time.

For all the Einsteins who think Joe somehow can't elude the pass rush, think again. Johnny U had a great O-line who protected their franchise QB because that was their job. Today's O-lines do not compare to the great ones of the past. Just ask the Fearsome Foursome who had to play against them. For the benefit of those of you who are under fifty, they were Deacon Jones, Lamar Lundy, Merlin Olson and Rosie Greer. Come to think of it, Peyton Manning was only sacked 18 times this year. Automatically, some will explain the difference is that QBs like Manning and Unitas got rid of the ball quicker and they would be right. However, they were also throwing to HOF receivers and running backs too who were always finding ways to get open to help their QB. Joe was throwing to a future HOFer until the FO decided not to re-sign him after an MVP performance in the SB last year. Go figure! And, BTW, pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. After all, he's the great and powerful Wizard of Oz, right?

 

PS - Incidentally, kudos belong to Ray Rice for finally successfully throwing a block for Joe last Sunday in Cincy. It was about time, Little Ray.

 

Apples to oranges comparison. The athletes of today are head and shoulders better than the players of yesteryear. You've got beasts across the board on the defensive lines now.

 

BTW, Manning can thank Tom Moore for developing than offensive system for him.

[Militant X 1]

Also, having Tyrod as his backup was probably a very bad decision. You need a backup guy that can push you. One that is at least better than you in one area that is passing related. You need a peer to bounce stuff off of. All the SB did was validate Flacco's opinion of himself. 

That is definitely possible!

 

#Mili

[The Mom Gene]

once I was looking at contracts ryan makes more then Joe ....really?

Yup... his contract came after Joe's and was higher...  as was Romo's (more guaranteed),

[The Mom Gene]

Why would anyone care, unless you are one of those "fantasy" players. The only stat that matters is wins and rings. I believe Rivers, Romo and Ryan don't have any finger bling. Am I wrong?

Nope, you're right...  None of them have the bling.

[PerpetuallyBored74]

Also, having Tyrod as his backup was probably a very bad decision. You need a backup guy that can push you. One that is at least better than you in one area that is passing related. You need a peer to bounce stuff off of. All the SB did was validate Flacco's opinion of himself. 

 

And all this season did was humble him and bring him back to earth and remind him of how far he still needs to go.

I agree, it did seem like he let his immediate short-term playoff success go to his head some.

[flynismo]

"Don't mean a thing if it ain't got that bling"

[frozen joe flacco fan]

Apples to oranges comparison. The athletes of today are head and shoulders better than the players of yesteryear. You've got beasts across the board on the defensive lines now.

 

BTW, Manning can thank Tom Moore for developing than offensive system for him.

 

Once again, you have failed to back up your statements with logic. Name for me one defensive front four in the league like the Fearsome Foursome, The Steel Curtain or The Purple People Eaters. The only two that compare even remotely close to those great defensive front fours of the past are arguably the '85 Bears or our own Ravens wit Burnett, McClary, Adams and Siragusa.

 Who was the first 4,000 yard passer? It wasn't Peyton Manning, was it? And he only played 12 games a year, not 16. Have you bothered to watch any of the NFL's 100 Greatest Players. You must be kiddin or you were watching cartoons instead of football games when some of the best of all time played real men's football!

 

On one of your points, we can agree. It was not Jim Caldwell who is responsible for Peyton Manning's system in Indy. It was Tom Moore.  

[jimjim5]

Funny thing is I have always said this and I say Flacco is a decent, good QB with potential to play great at times. I have said that a million times but the Flacco fan club will say he's a great QB that plays poor at times which is simply not true.Like Ray Lewis said, he always played like this.

 

Flacco's got THE BEST tools in the shed compared to any QB in the NFL. Problem is that he can't build with them because he has no blueprint to work off of. Additionally, an objective Flacco fan knows that Flacco is lackadaisical in the first half of games. His form is ALWAYS off and as a result, his intermediate accuracy (and the team) suffers. Second, he doesn't sell play fakes or sell out/attempt his XYZH progressions enough. A part of that must be attributed to the Air Corydell system though. Because he's worked the Air Coryell and Spread Offense his whole adult life, the way he reads defenses and his timing falls back on those systems.

[frozen joe flacco fan]

That is definitely possible!

 

#Mili

 

Its not only possible, its true. The SB solidified Joe's opinion of himself that he is among the best in the business. He'll never be elite though like Manning, Brady, Brees and Rodgers until we get an O-line to protect him. Elite QBs (with the possible exception of Brett Favre) don't get sacked 48 times in a season.

[K-Dog]

. Elite QBs (with the possible exception of Brett Favre) don't get sacked 48 times in a season.

Every time I watch the Pats play I want to cry.

Princess Brady has SO MUCH time in the pocket.  I would swear she could put the ball down and read a book and THEN throw the ball.  If she does have to move, often its just a few steps and the ball is gone.

I have said it before and I will say it again, there is not a QB in this league who would turn stellar numbers behind our o-line.

Well there is one who could but I am not saying it...

[jimjim5]

Once again, you have failed to back up your statements with logic. Name for me one defensive front four in the league like the Fearsome Foursome, The Steel Curtain or The Purple People Eaters. The only two that compare even remotely close to those great defensive front fours of the past are arguably the '85 Bears or our own Ravens wit Burnett, McClary, Adams and Siragusa.

Keep dreaming your life away though. Who was the first 4,000 yard passer? It wasn't Peyton Manning, was it? And he only played 12 games a year, not 16. Have you bothered to watch any of the NFL's 100 Greatest Players. You must be kiddin or you were watching cartoons instead of football games when some of the best of all time played real men's football!

 

On one of your points, we can agree. It was not Jim Caldwell who is responsible for Peyton Manning's system in Indy. It was Tom Moore.  

 

When I say "across the board", I am referring to all of the NFL. Many teams now have awesome Defensive Ends, excellent tandems and/or pass rush specialists.  Dude, it's a different era. Stop analyzing stats as an attempt to apply logic in a highly variable environment. Observe the nuances of the game. It is a much more complex game today - Why do to think the Air Coryell is having problems and is all but abandoned in the NFL today??

[jimjim5]

Its not only possible, its true. The SB solidified Joe's opinion of himself that he is among the best in the business. He'll never be elite though like Manning, Brady, Brees and Rodgers until we get an O-line to protect him. Elite QBs (with the possible exception of Brett Favre) don't get sacked 48 times in a season.

 

This is true.

[StingerNLG]

I think that it is more that the fans see the foreshadowing of MAJOR team problems that could have been completely avoided. It's disappointing.

 

For the record, Flacco's my guy, but I think he is turning out to be a bit thick-headed with regard to his development vs. the team's offensive philosophy.

 

Oh really?  So now Joe Flacco is thick-headed?  And that is based upon what?  

 

And what MAJOR team problems would have been avoided by letting our Super Bowl MVP walk?    Enlighten us please.

[StingerNLG]

What does that have to do with this past season though???? Really!!! I guess Eli Manning homers feel the same way and the realist are saying that's history,lol.

 

It has everything to do with it.   And before we start throwing Eli Manning out there, I'd dare say Flacco in a shorter amount of time has been a lot more consistent than Eli.   And Eli has had a couple more seasons throwing 20+ picks than Flacco.

 

I think you may want to rethink that comparison.

[jimjim5]

Oh really?  So now Joe Flacco is thick-headed?  And that is based upon what?  

 

And what MAJOR team problems would have been avoided by letting our Super Bowl MVP walk?    Enlighten us please.

 

It's written in my previous posts. I'm not going to decipher it for you.

 

Re: major team problems - I am referring to roster and coaching moves, not Flacco directly. Pardon me if I was not clear. I am posting on multiple topics in several forums and posts at the same time.

[jaege]

Also, having Tyrod as his backup was probably a very bad decision. You need a backup guy that can push you. One that is at least better than you in one area that is passing related. You need a peer to bounce stuff off of. All the SB did was validate Flacco's opinion of himself. 

So you know Flacco personally then? At least well enough that you feel comfortable making such statements about the man. Implying that he is some sort of egoist. This is a guy that celebrated his vast new contract by going to McDonalds. Seems like a rather run of the mill guy to me. Not a guy with some over inflated opinion of himself.

[jimjim5]

It has everything to do with it.   And before we start throwing Eli Manning out there, I'd dare say Flacco in a shorter amount of time has been a lot more consistent than Eli.   And Eli has had a couple more seasons throwing 20+ picks than Flacco.

 

I think you may want to rethink that comparison.

 

Eli is a perfect comparison to Flacco. Flacco may be the better QB, but they are both wildly inconsistent QBs.

[jimjim5]

So you know Flacco personally then? At least well enough that you feel comfortable making foolish statements about the man. Implying that he is some sort of egoist. This is a guy that celebrated his vast new contract by going to McDonalds. Seems like a rather run of the mill guy to me. Not a guy with some over inflated opinion of himself, sort of like the guy quoted.

 

Hidden behind that "run of the mill" guy, I'm willing to bet, is a rather cocksure guy. You don't take the risk, you don't get to where he is at, and you don't make the throws that he makes without feeling that you are "that guy". I've worked in highly competitive environments. I've seen it many times. I've played with athletes that are in that strada. If you can't see the quiet fire that sometimes leaks out of him, I don't know what to tell you.

[frozen joe flacco fan]

When I say "across the board", I am referring to all of the NFL. Many teams now have awesome Defensive Ends, excellent tandems and/or pass rush specialists.  Dude, it's a different era. Stop analyzing stats as an attempt to apply logic in a highly variable environment. Observe the nuisances of the game. It is a much more complex game today - Why do to think the Air Coryell is having problems and is all but abandoned in the NFL today??

 

Dude, you're the one with no context for your comparisons. At least I do and of course its a different era. Just look up the facts.  Do you think Joe Namath passed for 4,000 yards in a 12 game season because of the inferior talent he played against? To say that it is a much more complex game today does not mean the players of today are better than they were before. If anything, the talent pool has been diluted due to the league's expansion to 32 teams. For example, there are fewer Navy Seals taken into the Navy each year than there are NFL Draft picks. It's an insult to many great players who are in the HOF not because of when they played but because of what they accomplished when QBs weren't protected and WRs weren't protected, et cetera.

 

Here's one you can take to the bank though. New offensive systems like the Pistol Offense will last just as long as the QB who runs them. RG3 didn't fare too well this year. Neither did Michael Vick. Those offenses have been around in college for years. They aren't innovative or evolutionary, Dude! As soon as Colin Kapernick gets older and slower, he'll have to adapt to the conventional style of play. Meanwhile, I hope he and Q go back to the SB and win one for The Gipper this time. 

[jimjim5]

Dude, you're the one with no context for your comparisons. At least I do and of course its a different era. Just look up the facts.  Do you think Joe Namath passed for 4,000 yards in a 12 game season because of the inferior talent he played against? To say that it is a much more complex game today does not mean the players of today are better than they were before. If anything, the talent pool has been diluted due to the league's expansion to 32 teams. For example, there are fewer Navy Seals taken into the Navy each year than there are NFL Draft picks. It's an insult to many great players who are in the HOF not because of when they played but because of what they accomplished when QBs weren't protected and WRs weren't protected, et cetera.

 

Here's one you can take to the bank though. New offensive systems like the Pistol Offense will last just as long as the QB who runs them. RG3 didn't fare too well this year. Neither did Michael Vick. Those offenses have been around in college for years. They aren't innovative or evolutionary, Dude! As soon as Colin Kapernick gets older and slower, he'll have to adapt to the conventional style of play. Meanwhile, I hope he and Q go back to the SB and win one for The Gipper this time. 

 

Inferior is the wrong word. My thinking is that the defensive talent was not exceptional enough to stop an excellent player and  leader of an offensive attack that teams were not prepared to stop.

 

His talent passing the ball was not negated by the talent or a defensive system on the opposing end. It's that simple. He was a catalyst that helped start the NFL passing attack.

[The Mom Gene]

Guys and Gals...  Can we try and not get to the point of attacking others based on their opinions?    We need to remember that an opinion is just that; an opinion.  It can't be right or wrong, because it is an opinion.  It is possible to state our views without attacking others or bashing our QB.  We can point out inadequacies and faults without "hating".

 

:)  I appreciate it

Thanks! 

[PolishRifle]

Matt Schaub had 3 4000+ yrds seasons AND his comp.% this season has been over 60. We should totally get him. He has been to the ProBowl twice, you know?

 

Eli is a perfect comparison to Flacco. Flacco may be the better QB, but they are both wildly inconsistent QBs.

 

Eli has two rings. If Flacco gets a second SB ring, he can keep the 120 million. I wouldn't care.

 

People actually complaining, that some value SBs over stats, are insane. No yard or TD is as important as the plays you need to make to win the game. Remember the Vikes game, when Flacco didn't look good for 3 quarters? He still pulled it off in the end.

 

Have fun with your calculators. I'd rather watch a SB victory parade. 

[wayne]

It has everything to do with it.   And before we start throwing Eli Manning out there, I'd dare say Flacco in a shorter amount of time has been a lot more consistent than Eli.   And Eli has had a couple more seasons throwing 20+ picks than Flacco.

 

I think you may want to rethink that comparison.

 

 

Eli is a perfect comparison to Flacco. Flacco may be the better QB, but they are both wildly inconsistent QBs.

Eli is a perfect comparison to Flacco and anyone that looks at football can see the comparisons,lol. Saying which one is more inconsistent than the other is irrelevant b/c just being inconsistent is a huge negative in it's self. That's like saying Ted Bundy killed a lot more people than Jeffery Dahmer. Hell, both will get the death penalty so what difference do it make that Bundy killed more people than Dahmer.

[HoldingCall]

Once again, you have failed to back up your statements with logic. Name for me one defensive front four in the league like the Fearsome Foursome, The Steel Curtain or The Purple People Eaters. The only two that compare even remotely close to those great defensive front fours of the past are arguably the '85 Bears or our own Ravens wit Burnett, McClary, Adams and Siragusa.

Keep dreaming your life away though. Who was the first 4,000 yard passer? It wasn't Peyton Manning, was it? And he only played 12 games a year, not 16. Have you bothered to watch any of the NFL's 100 Greatest Players. You must be kiddin or you were watching cartoons instead of football games when some of the best of all time played real men's football!

 

On one of your points, we can agree. It was not Jim Caldwell who is responsible for Peyton Manning's system in Indy. It was Tom Moore.  

 

I will add that the QBs of those days had to survive the hits without a break in the action caused by the benefit of a penalty. However, there are some good front fours but they are hardly able to stay together for more than a year or two.

[HomeoftheBRAVENS]

Phillip Rivers is a damn good QB so I won't even argue about who is better between him and Joe.

 

Romo = Witten,Bryant,that rookie who made big plays(I forget his name) and Austin

 

Ryan =Julio,White,Gonzales and Douglas

 

Flacco=Torrey Smith andddd..........

[flynismo]

Phillip Rivers is a damn good QB so I won't even argue about who is better between him and Joe.

Romo = Witten,Bryant,that rookie who made big plays(I forget his name) and Austin

Ryan =Julio,White,Gonzales and Douglas

Flacco=Torrey Smith andddd..........

Now if Marlon has the same success under Brady or Rodgers as he did with Flacco this year, we would all be hearing about how they "turned a nobody into a good player".

[HomeoftheBRAVENS]

I've seen way too many people over the last year saying "Forget (insert big time wr),we're stacked at wr.Lets see what these undrafted wrs,seventh round picks and Tandon Doss can do" for anyone to call Flacco out about his stats.We downgraded our wrs and o line and lost our te.What ravens fan was actually expecting Flacco to have career stats after that?

[quote name="flynismo" post="1732710" timestamp="1388674666"]
Now if Marlon has the same success under Brady or Rodgers as he did with Flacco this year, we would all be hearing about how they "turned a nobody into a good player".[/quote]
Exactly!That's another thing people overlook.