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Could Ravens look to trade a veteran?


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#1 Purple_ICE 81

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 08:26 PM

With no cap space as per usual and a lot of needs this offseason, could the Ravens try and deal one of our more expensive vets?

 

Such as a Terrell Suggs trade or a Haloti Ngata trade? These are both areas where the Ravens have some stability without either of them in the equation. We have Elvis Doomervil locked up for the next couple seasons and he was neck and neck with Suggs this year as far as sacks. And we have some young talent on the d-line like Brandon Williams and Pernell McPhee and could add to that in the draft as well.

 

We could get a pretty sexy draft pick maybe a 2nd or 3rd rounder and make some much needed cap space.


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#2 SecretAgentMan

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 08:29 PM

I'd so trade Ray Rice if we could find a team stupid enough to do it. That would clear some much needed room. And if we fix the line, we can get a late round back and he could do well if there's a good oline. 

 

I'd keep Suggs(would restructure him) and Ngata. It's harder to find great defensive talent. And even if they are getting older, they are both still good pieces to have.


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#3 akacrow

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 08:32 PM

We would lose 5.5 million in cap space to trade Ray Rice, Ngata would give us 1 million, and Suggs 7.8 Million.  With the 7.8 million we save on Suggs we lose a team leader, an elite pass rusher and gain???


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#4 Purple_ICE 81

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 08:45 PM

We would lose 5.5 million in cap space to trade Ray Rice, Ngata would give us 1 million, and Suggs 7.8 Million.  With the 7.8 million we save on Suggs we lose a team leader, an elite pass rusher and gain???

 

Haloti Ngata isn't going anywhere... until the 2015 off-season, since the Ravens can only save $1 million, this off-season.

 

Now, I think Suggs is gone, regardless if it's through a trade or simply by cutting him. I've discussed my displeasure with him, these last eight-or-nine weeks, all over this forum. He started off really strong (up until the Miami game), only to be M.I.A. the second-half of the season. Today's game showed that something is not "right" (or just "off) with the guy.

 

However, a trade should be entertained, at least. If some NFC team, like Arizona or something, is willing to consider a deal; then, I think Ozzie Newsome should definitely think about it. Although, if the Ravens only got a 6th-rounder for Anquan Boldin, don't expect a deal for Suggs to yielded much in return, either. Yet, something is better than nothing.

 

 

Ray Rice is stuck with the Ravens for next 2 years. All that money is tied to Baltimore. However, I've got a feeling Rice wants to return to form, next season, once the o-line gets fixed.

 

 

Elite pass-rusher? Yeah, if the year was 2011...

Leader? Ray Lewis yawns at the thought of hearing T-Sizzle being a "leader"...

 

I'm sorry; but, I rather have the Ravens use that money towards Arthur Jones than a significantly declining Suggs. 

You hit on a lot of good points...especially the fact that the Ravens couldnt trade Rice if they wanted too...he has too much money left on his contract...they said he would get like 25M over the coarse of his first 2 or 3 seasons. BUT Rice had a down year Im very much open to giving him a chance to bounce back next year, I think he will be as hungry as ever.

 

I definitely feel like Suggs is on the chop block...this is the NFL and big names have to get let go all the time. He hasnt been the same since he got absolutely nuked by injuries last year (Torn Achilles + Torn Bicep). He looks to have lost a step and has a lot of money on his contract. If we could get a 2nd or 3rd rounder out of him that could be a new WR or O-lineman and we could help keep Dennis Pitta and our FAs and we could make a few moves via free agent scraps like we always do.


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#5 K-Dog

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 08:47 PM

I don't WANT to loose Sizzle.
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#6 Purple_ICE 81

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 08:55 PM

I don't WANT to loose Sizzle.

I dont think anyone does...no one wanted to lose Ray Lewis, or Ed Reed Anquan Boldin or Paul Kruger last year but you find yourself having to cut, trade and move on from big name players in the NFL. Suggs is on the decline...still a good player and leader but injury plagues and getting older...I feel like the Ravens are going to have to cut him or trade him this offseason in order to make the moves we so desperately need to make. We never have any cap and he is one of our highest paid players


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Welcome WR Steve Smith 5 time pro bowler

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#7 GrimCoconut

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 09:10 PM

Haloti Ngata isn't going anywhere... until the 2015 off-season, since the Ravens can only save $1 million, this off-season.

 

Now, I think Suggs is gone, regardless if it's through a trade or simply by cutting him. I've discussed my displeasure with him, these last eight-or-nine weeks, all over this forum. He started off really strong (up until the Miami game), only to be M.I.A. the second-half of the season. Today's game showed that something is not "right" (or just "off) with the guy.

 

However, a trade should be entertained, at least. If some NFC team, like Arizona or something, is willing to consider a deal; then, I think Ozzie Newsome should definitely think about it. Although, if the Ravens only got a 6th-rounder for Anquan Boldin, don't expect a deal for Suggs to yielded much in return, either. Yet, something is better than nothing.

 

Ray Rice is stuck with the Ravens for next 2 years. All that money is tied to Baltimore. However, I've got a feeling Rice wants to return to form, next season, once the o-line gets fixed.

 

Elite pass-rusher? Yeah, if the year was 2011...

Leader? Ray Lewis yawns at the thought of hearing T-Sizzle being a "leader"...

 

I'm sorry; but, I rather have the Ravens use that money towards Arthur Jones than a significantly declining Suggs. 

Eh, I'm not sure I'm buying what you're selling here. Granted, I missed all the games after the Bengals game until the Patriots game, so I know I've missed quite a bit but Suggs is potentially still a good player. I heard he was injured or something. Not sure how true that is but I don't think we're going to get rid of Suggs unless we honestly believe we can replace him with what we have. I'm not sure we can. Suggs is typically very good at setting the edge and in coverage. He's a very complete LB so it might be presumptuous to say he's lost a step right now. I'll trust the team here on this one. Whatever they do, I'll trust them. Just saying, you sound a little too convicted when you say Suggs is gone. I'm not so sure I buy into that. 


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#8 SecretAgentMan

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 09:12 PM

Eh, I'm not sure I'm buying what you're selling here. Granted, I missed all the games after the Bengals game until the Patriots game, so I know I've missed quite a bit but Suggs is potentially still a good player. I heard he was injured or something. Not sure how true that is but I don't think we're going to get rid of Suggs unless we honestly believe we can replace him with what we have. I'm not sure we can. Suggs is typically very good at setting the edge and in coverage. He's a very complete LB so it might be presumptuous to say he's lost a step right now. I'll trust the team here on this one. Whatever they do, I'll trust them. Just saying, you sound a little too convicted when you say Suggs is gone. I'm not so sure I buy into that.

Idk. He's going to decline bc of age soon.

Id restructure Suggs over cut
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#9 GrimCoconut

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 09:14 PM

Idk. He's going to decline bc of age soon.

Id restructure Suggs over cut

It's hard to predict when age catches up with you. Abraham has played well into his age. Age doesn't necessarily indicate poor play. I think we'll let Suggs play out this year and evaluate next offseason. That's how I personally see it. 


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#10 SecretAgentMan

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 09:18 PM

It's hard to predict when age catches up with you. Abraham has played well into his age. Age doesn't necessarily indicate poor play. I think we'll let Suggs play out this year and evaluate next offseason. That's how I personally see it.

This is what will probably happen.

And if you want to clear cap room, McClain and Leach clears up $8 million..
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#11 Dfence4champs2052

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 09:18 PM

"Free agent scraps" are half the problem now though.
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#12 GrimCoconut

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 09:33 PM

Well, he suffered a neck injury in the practice right before the game in Chicago game. While Suggs played through the injury, there is no proof his play was limited due to the injury.

 

The problem is, ironically, since the first Bengals game, Suggs and Dumervil had a combined 2 sacks during the last 7 games of the season. Yeah, the duo we thought was going to wreak havoc only managed to get a sack each when the team made the push towards the playoffs. Now, stats hardly tell the story; but, both of them have been SO invisible these past 7 games. And, if their name was called, it was because of getting beat on an assignment. For example, the option play Andy Dalton scored on, today, and during the Lions game, when Suggs didn't set the edge and Reggie Bush blew by him a 14-yard TD run.

 

Now, it's true: There is NO player on the team that can replace Terrell Suggs. This is why it's going to be a hard decision for Ozzie Newsome and company to make. That $7.8 million the team can save can go a long way to keeping guys like Monroe, Pitta and Art Jones. If Suggs is gone, it will be up to young players like Upshaw, Simon and McPhee to step-up and earn thier playing time.

 

I mean, just because they could cut Terrell Suggs doesn't mean they while, nor does it mean they could even bring him back at a lower price. Either way, something IS happening to his contract in the off-season. How can a guy like Suggs (with Dumervil on the other side) fail to even generate pressure, let alone making sacks, in these past 7-to-8 games? Something is iffy...

There are a few explanations for Suggs' lack of production. One could be injury and another could be a weak DL as well as being double teamed. Those aren't excuses but are mere possibilities as I haven't personally seen any of those games from Chicago on until I watched the Patriots game. 

 

How has the DL played during that stretch? Have they improved? I love Arthur Jones like the next guy but I'm not sure I'd be comfortable jettisoning Suggs for him. I'd prefer Ngata if it was between the two because it's the same position (to an extent) but even then I'm not sure I'd go through with it. I agree something is up here because we should have had ridiculous pressure. 


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#13 Ravenseconbeast

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:06 PM

Can the guy woth the worst stat by his position in nfl. That would be Gino Dudkowski and Joe Flacco.
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#14 GrimCoconut

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:07 PM

Well, I stand corrected; get this: During the last 7 games, the Ravens defense only managed a grand total of... sacks...

 

Was the pass-rush that bad to closeout the season? Geez; no wonder why opposing offenses could kill so much time moving-the-chains, while QBs were able to have success against Jimmy Smith and Lardarius Webb. Daryl Smith had 2.5 sacks, Suggs had a sack, Dumervil had a sack, Graham had a sack, McPhee had a sack, Tyson had a sack and Upshaw had half-of a sack.

 

So, maybe it wasn't just Suggs? I don't want to say Dean Pees is a problem; but, the guy has no aggression in his gameplan.

 

Anyways, I would just hate to see Art Jones have success on another team. In the past, we've seen ex-Raven defensive players not have success, elsewhere. But, to me, I think A.J. is going to be a stud. As long if guys like Lewis-Moore and Tyson develop, I guess I can deal with Jones leaving.

 

That said, Suggs' contract will be evaluated by the front office: For one, the team needs to recoup some money for this off-season and, more importantly, if he wants to retire a Raven, they need work on a deal that will keep in Baltimore. Hopefully, Newsome doesn't overpay to keep him, here. 

Yeah, I'm not sure what the deal is with the defense. Again, I didn't see a lot of games so I can't really comment there. I only comment on what I see. I will say that a problem I've noticed is we seem to struggle to get pressure with a 3-man rush, which is what we want to do. I think perhaps we would be better suited for the 4-3, but regardless we need to find a way to get pressure and be creative about it. We've disguised schemes but perhaps we haven't sold it too well. Suggs doesn't seem to be as explosive as he was early in the season. I know I remember Suggs looking great early in the season. He looked awesome. I can't imagine that's gone. I think he hit a slump or something. It doesn't make sense. 

 

Your guess as to why our pass rush has struggled is as good as mine. I wouldn't mind an upgrade at DC, though. 


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#15 Ravenseconbeast

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:21 PM

Yeah, I'm not sure what the deal is with the defense. Again, I didn't see a lot of games so I can't really comment there. I only comment on what I see. I will say that a problem I've noticed is we seem to struggle to get pressure with a 3-man rush, which is what we want to do. I think perhaps we would be better suited for the 4-3, but regardless we need to find a way to get pressure and be creative about it. We've disguised schemes but perhaps we haven't sold it too well. Suggs doesn't seem to be as explosive as he was early in the season. I know I remember Suggs looking great early in the season. He looked awesome. I can't imagine that's gone. I think he hit a slump or something. It doesn't make sense. 
 
Your guess as to why our pass rush has struggled is as good as mine. I wouldn't mind an upgrade at DC, though.


Suggs had a neck injury @week9 and then had a undisclosed injury @week14 when he sat out at workout. Doom also being hurt @ later 2nd half of the season. When they were both healthy you saw what they've done in 1st half of the season.
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#16 NaveSenrag

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:26 PM

Can the guy woth the worst stat by his position in nfl. That would be Gino Dudkowski and Joe Flacco.

lol. You're nuts if you think Flacco is the worst QB in the NFL.


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#17 SecretAgentMan

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:34 PM

lol. You're nuts if you think Flacco is the worst QB in the NFL.

Espn says so. So he is

*roll eyes*
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#18 Ravenseconbeast

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:36 PM

lol. You're nuts if you think Flacco is the worst QB in the NFL.

Pretty close to it. But thats not what i said. Learn to read.

Espn says so. So he is
*roll eyes*

Almost every venue that evaluate his performances has him on bottom of the barrel. But im not the expert. Just do your research.
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#19 baltimorefan328

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:39 PM

I think one of the problems with the defense could be our linebackers...I mean I understand guys like bynes and mcclain and mclellan are decent players, but when you continually put out undrafted free agents eventually it will catch up with you. This year Arthur brown was a rookie, suggs and dumervil seemed to be dealing with injuries every week since like week 6, then bynes and mcclain are undrafted. I think we need to invest more picks into guys like Arthur brown because, while the difference between he and an undrafted guy might not be the immediate impact, you have to believe a second round pick like arthur brown has a much higher ceiling then an undrafted guy. Thats why there are "undrafted surprises" and "high-round pick busts." A perfect example is a guy like vontaze burfict. Obviously every team passed on him but Ozzie is supposed to be a wiz...How do you draft a guy like marc anthony in the 7th round and not take a chance on a guy like that...Thats obviously just one example but I think the Ravens need to start investing some higher round picks to solidify the middle of our defense rather than relying on guys who might turn out to be a nice surprise 


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#20 SecretAgentMan

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:42 PM

Almost every venue that evaluate his performances has him on bottom of the barrel. But im not the expert. Just do your research.

Statistics aren't everything. Why I'm gonna quit playing FF altogether.

Believe me, the fact we got 8 wins makes me happy. And we only got these 8 because of Joe.

Our defense implodes in the fourth
We have crap line
Bad weapons.

Flacco is a lot better than his statistics indicate....

And several of his INTs aren't on him(some are.. I'll blame him for when he deserves it), but it was clearly an off year
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