Awful offensive line

[BmoreBird22]

 

Exactly, I said earlier I prefer the eye test. It's also helpful to look at if the tackle had one really bad game or whether the sacks/hurries were spread out, and whether they came against someone like Jared Allen or not. Too many variables to go off just numbers.

To me, Monroe passes the eye test. Oher, not so much.

[The Raven]

 

 

To me, Monroe passes the eye test. Oher, not so much.

 

 

 

Completely agree. 

[Sami84]

ProFootballFocus has him giving up four sacks, not five. 



Part of it could have been that a man got around Monroe and Rice failed to pick up the block or Monroe gave ample time for Flacco to pass, but Flacco held the ball too long and was credited with the sack himself. 
One of those sacks came when he was with the Jaguars, so PFF has him giving up three sacks, 11 hurries, and only two hits with the Ravens. 


Again, it is important to remember two of those sacks came against Julius Peppers in the pouring down rain in 50 mph wind on a very torn up field.

yes...aside from the peppers game and at 1 sack on his debut he has been very good.

[BmoreBird22]

 

yes...aside from the peppers game and at 1 sack on his debut he has been very good.

One thing that has really stood out to me is that he does not get pushed back much. It's usually him pushing back his man and creating a very wide pocket and giving Joe room to move around or a lane to run through.

[flynismo]

Sacks aren't the only form of pressure, while they are obviously the most impactful, it's better to look at the whole. Monroe has allowed 4 sacks, 2 hits, and 11 hurries in 367 pass-blocking snaps. That is pretty dang good.

Compare that to Michael Oher, who has allowed 7 sacks, 5 hits, and 33 hurries in 538 pass-blocking snaps.

It's night and day. Monroe is among the league's best in pass-blocking, and it's not really debatable.

Okay, I got the stats sorted out here, because tthings were not adding up between what you said and what I said.

Monroe has given up five sacks on the season, four of them was with us.
He gave up one sack and 15 pressures in four games with JAX.

So he has given up five sacks and 26 pressures on the year, those numbers are very close to Oher's, and if we allow for extrapolating the stats to compensate for Oher playing one more game than Monroe, their numbers are nearly identical.

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2013-10-01/sports/bal-eugene-monroe-could-be-an-impressive-upgrade-for-ravens-offensive-line-20131001_1_bryant-mckinnie-bernard-pierce-ray-rice

[flynismo]

The thing you're failing to take into account is that Monroe plays on the left side and Oher plays on the right. Who gets the more talented edge rushers?

Generally, Monroe will get the more talented rushers.
But I am not comparing the two, I am simply saying that I don't feel that Monroe has played particularly well, and is not a guy I want to throw a ton of money at this off-season.

[gabefergy]

He's given up five sacks, not four, in nine games with us. It is very debatable to say he is among the best in the league in pass blocking this season.

How is it debatable? The facts are the facts and even if you insist he has given up 5 that is still a low number. 2 hits and only 11 hurries is ridiculously good for the number if snaps in pass-pro.

[gabefergy]

It's actually not night and day, if you do the math. It's very comparable.

Monroe averages 0.01 sacks, .005 hits, and .03 hurries a snap. If you extend those averages to Oher's snaps, Monroe would have allowed roughly 5.5 sacks, 2.5 hits, and 16 hurries. He would allow far fewer hurries, but his sacks and hits allowed would be comparable.

While better, definitely not night and day.

The problem with using these stats is that there is no one, reputable source for tracking these numbers.

11 hurries vs 33 isn't night and day?

Just look at the efficiency. Monroe at 96.3 vs 93.4 for Oher. That takes # of snaps into account and adjusts for sacks compared to hits/hurries.

Here is the context: Monroe's mark is 5th best in the league, Oher is 40th.

[gabefergy]

Okay, I got the stats sorted out here, because tthings were not adding up between what you said and what I said.

Monroe has given up five sacks on the season, four of them was with us.
He gave up one sack and 15 pressures in four games with JAX.

So he has given up five sacks and 26 pressures on the year, those numbers are very close to Oher's, and if we allow for extrapolating the stats to compensate for Oher playing one more game than Monroe, their numbers are nearly identical.

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2013-10-01/sports/bal-eugene-monroe-could-be-an-impressive-upgrade-for-ravens-offensive-line-20131001_1_bryant-mckinnie-bernard-pierce-ray-rice

I'm looking at his numbers in Baltimore, the ones that are relevant.

[T3hRaven]

How is it debatable? The facts are the facts and even if you insist he has given up 5 that is still a low number. 2 hits and only 11 hurries is ridiculously good for the number if snaps in pass-pro.

 

Even if you count the Jax numbers, he's right in line with the top guys in terms of total pressure allowed.  That's why he ranks so well in PBE because they normalize it over the amount of snaps played.

[BmoreBird22]

 

Generally, Monroe will get the more talented rushers.
But I am not comparing the two, I am simply saying that I don't feel that Monroe has played particularly well, and is not a guy I want to throw a ton of money at this off-season.

Well good thing that comment was not directed at anything you said. I never asked you to compare the two.

[The Raven]

11 hurries vs 33 isn't night and day?

Just look at the efficiency. Monroe at 96.3 vs 93.4 for Oher. That takes # of snaps into account and adjusts for sacks compared to hits/hurries.

Here is the context: Monroe's mark is 5th best in the league, Oher is 40th.

 

"He would allow far fewer hurries, but his sacks and hits allowed would be comparable." Thought that would imply that hurries were night and day, but overall, there is not a night and day difference. Should have clarified.

 

I think it's interesting that a mere difference of 3 in pass blocking efficiency is the difference between being ranked 5th and 40th. I am happy with Monroe, for the record

[BmoreBird22]

Okay, I got the stats sorted out here, because tthings were not adding up between what you said and what I said.

Monroe has given up five sacks on the season, four of them was with us.
He gave up one sack and 15 pressures in four games with JAX.

So he has given up five sacks and 26 pressures on the year, those numbers are very close to Oher's, and if we allow for extrapolating the stats to compensate for Oher playing one more game than Monroe, their numbers are nearly identical.

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2013-10-01/sports/bal-eugene-monroe-could-be-an-impressive-upgrade-for-ravens-offensive-line-20131001_1_bryant-mckinnie-bernard-pierce-ray-rice

Well, I guess I spoke too soon with my other comment. Oher is not getting players that are nearly as talented as Monroe, and I would venture to say that Monroe is often left without help more than Oher. That's not even to mention that Oher has the distinct advantage of playing next to Marshall Yanda and Monroe plays next to AQ Shipley. Which one of those two inspires confidence? Even a hobbled Yanda is way better than Shipley.
That's just going off stats, though. Monroe has shown to be a much more competent run blocker than Oher, something you cannot measure with stats. When looking at the tape, Monroe doesn't get pushed around or just handled at the point of attack. He usually pushes his man back and handles them.
If Monroe gets beat, he will get beat badly. He doesn't get beat often, though.

[gabefergy]

"He would allow far fewer hurries, but his sacks and hits allowed would be comparable." Thought that would imply that hurries were night and day, but overall, there is not a night and day difference. Should have clarified.

 

I think it's interesting that a mere difference of 3 in pass blocking efficiency is the difference between being ranked 5th and 40th. I am happy with Monroe, for the record

Well, it comes down to about 1.5 pressures a game which can be signficant. Over the course of a season that is like 25 more pressures so then you can start to see how big of an impact there is. 25 times Joe gets time to make a throw, as opposed to a lesser OT.