The ceiling of the offense (Plus Needs)

[The Raven]

This offense has a very tall ceiling. It's capable of a lot, if it ever realizes its full potential. 

[callahan09]

Not sure what's up with our run game right now.  I think we all expected better.  We haven't been running the ball much, but that's partially because when we have run the ball it fails and sets up 3rd and long all too often.  Currently every team in the NFL except the Giants, the Steelers, and the 49ers have a #1 running back getting more yards per carry than Ray Rice (or Bernard Pierce for that matter).  It's really dismaying when so many people predicted this to be a year we relied heavily on the run game...

 

Through 2 games, this offense has had 155 actual offensive plays (not counting kneel downs, punts, field goal attempts), which is very, very high (averaging over 77 per game!).  The thing is, we've only handed the ball off to the running backs 53 times, versus Flacco keeping it 102 times.  That's about a 2:1 ratio of pass to rush.  2.8 yards per carry for the running backs just isn't getting the job done, which is why we have so many 3rd and longs.  We have had 31 plays on 3rd and at least 5 to go.  That's out of 38 total 3rd down plays.  So 82% of our 3rd down plays come with enough distance to go that an average running play can't be expected to convert.  Which is why we have only had one single rushing attempt on 3rd down this year.

[flynismo]

What is insane is that even with an UDFA rookie as our #2, with a TE who has the worst hands in the league, another TE who is 90 years old, the thing that is holding back our offense is our running game..
Once the running game gets going this offense is going to take off. And if we stop dropping the ball at such a crazy pace, this is going to be an elite offense.

[Kid87]

What is insane is that even with an UDFA rookie as our #2, with a TE who has the worst hands in the league, another TE who is 90 years old, the thing that is holding back our offense is our running game..
Once the running game gets going this offense is going to take off. And if we stop dropping the ball at such a crazy pace, this is going to be an elite offense.

I agree the run game has been so disappointing.  every now and then  i see little sparks but we still need to improve. Then are passing game will get better. 

[redlobster]

The Ravens o-line and running game needs work. The run blocking schemes are just awful. Seeing O-Linemen getting blown up off the LOS, disrupting the running lanes, is tough to watch, almost as tough watch as the play calling. Ozzie needs to draft an OL, (Priority one) Can't remember the last time, they converted a 3rd and inches. 

 

I would say the Ravens offense is a work in progress.They just need to get more balance for the win. 

 

I would imagine LT will be the to priority next year (along with WR and TE) but LG, C, RG, and RT if Oher remains are all relatively young and draft picks from the Ravens.

[Sami84]

gino is the weak link. im curious about this ryan jensen fella. he might before the seasons end be the C we ned. hes much bigger and stronger then gino.

[Purple_ICE 81]

What our offense needs is for the youngsters to make plays and be dependable. You look at the Patriots everyone thought Tom Brady would hold together the offense, but the damn Jets looked more fluid on offense than Tom Brady because the young receivers make too many mistakes. If you watched that game Tom Brady should have been off the stat sheet but his WRs dropped pretty much everything. The Ravens are in a similar boat We dont have a dependable receiver who you KNOW will be there to make the tough catches...not even Torrey is that guy. We cant have dropped passes miscommunications, or little mistakes like we have had the first 2 weeks. Plain and simple our receivers have gotta step up.

 

Our running game has not impressed at ALL through 2 weeks either. Not much room to work with from the o-line and the fact that we pretty much run a split back situation which SUCCCKs. Hopefully we can get it together, and I think we will with time.

[3-4ravdef509]

I think we need to improve the run game... Ray Rice is still the featured back, with Pierce the change of pace back, so I think it's important for our featured back numbers to improve.  Since Caldwell took over, Rice has 148 carries for 528 yards, 3 tds, 4 fumbles.

 

That's just 3.57 yards per carry, 49.3 carries between TDs, 37 carries between fumbles.  These are uncharacteristically bad numbers for Rice... is it something to do with the play calling or the run game design since Caldwell (or perhaps Juan Castillo... who knows) took over?

 

Very odd.

 

Pierce has been better, but as the change of pace back, I don't think you can say that's because Pierce is actually better than Rice.

 

 

Caldwell looked like he was using the 'Ask Madden' feature for a while in the first half but Ultimately figured it out. The reason we CAN and WILL lose games is abandoning the run. The second we went behind our play calling lost any source of logic and reason.

 

 

Also I don't remember any Play-Action. Play Action opens the deep pass, which is what Flacco does best. 

 

 

BUT, the WRs caught the balls today. We will find our rhythm, as long as the WRs can keep solid hands.

 

To both of you, we didn't abandon the run, it just wasn't working in the fist half. In the second half it didn't either, but Jim was stubbornly trying to force it by running on first and second down repeatedly. We need to pass first to set up the run, and we need to to more no huddle to wear out the defensive line and linebackers so we can run better. We jut don't have a good enough line to just keep trying to force it to work, because by the time it does against a good team we would be down a couple scores.

[3-4ravdef509]

The offense really played well in a lot of key areas, especially Flacco.

 

First drive Marlon and Dickson droped passes, Marlon's was a touchdown. We would have been up 7-0.

 

Second drive same thing almost, moved the ball well, Torrey I think either ran the route a little slow and off, or Flacco delivered the ball early and off a bit, but it was still catchable, and Torrey is our supposed number 1 receiver, he needs to make that play.

 

3rd drive starts with a good play to Billy, then a nice run by Benard. Then offensive line has a fit, Flacco has to roll to his right on consecutive plays, the first one he throws it in the area of Torrey, the second one was what I thought a catchable ball to Stokely. 

 

4th drive again the o-line takes a dump on 3rd down. Torrey was open but Joe had a guy in his face and couldn't deliver the ball. Kudos to Joe for protecting the ball well while trying to escape the sack.

 

5th drive- The first play was on Joe, idk why he dumped the ball to Rice, considering he had two open receivers. That was dumb. Then a screen that picked up like 6, Then a short pass to Smith who can't get the first down.

 

Last drive of the half starts with a good scramble by Joe, then a big pickup to Smith. Then a bobbled pass by Smith, that if he hadn't bobbled wold have been a touchdown. Should be at least 14-6 by now. More if the drives killed by drops and bad o-line plays would have produced points. IT was Drop, miscue, bad line, bad line, then a legitmate stop by the Browns defense, then another drop. We should have been up 14-6, could have been much higher. The second half was much better as far as scoring, but it was a lot of running for short gains on first and second down and then Joe being brilliant on third down. My only issue is why didn't we pass more on first and second, seeing as the run was being contained pretty well. I know running is important, but more important is moving the ball, getting first downs and scoring. We can't expect Joe to always convert 3 and 8+ yards. But the unit is moving in the right direction. Should have been a 28-6 final, could have been a bigger blow out. Joe is playing his tail off, Torrey is still coming along but he's on pace to do more than he or Boldin did last year, and Marlon has as many touchdowns as he has games played in his career, and he could have had one more. 

 

My conclusion is we need to do more no huddle, with passes and screens on first and second downs with runs mixed in especially on 2nd and hopefully 3rd and short situations. I point to last years Bengals game as a blue-print. 

[PolishRifle]

We need to pass first to set up the run

 

There have been six 400 yards passing games already this season. If we're a run first team, we're not a SB championship team.

[beanfigger]

There have been six 400 yards passing games already this season. If we're a run first team, we're not a SB championship team.

 

Are those QBs all undefeated?  Just because a lot of players are doing something doesn't mean it's the only way to do it.

[3-4ravdef509]

There have been six 400 yards passing games already this season. If we're a run first team, we're not aa SB championship team.

You're preaching to the choir brother

[callahan09]

Interesting stats I discovered while responding to edreedfromtheu in an unrelated topic... Thought I'd share them here where they fit a little better into this topic of discussion.

 

A pretty bright spot in our offense this year so far as been red zone efficiency.  We are pretty glaringly bad outside of the red zone, unfortunately.  Here's the comparison:

 

In the red zone, Bernard Pierce and Ray Rice combine for 26 yards on 7 attempts, with 2 touchdowns.

Outside of the red zone, they combine for 125 yards on 46 carries, with 0 touchdowns and a lost fumble.

 

That's 3.7 yards per carry in the red zone, and 2.7 yards per carry outside the red zone.

 

Meanwhile, Flacco is 6/11 for 41 yards and 3 touchdowns (0 interceptions, 0 fumbles, 0 sacks) in the red zone.  That's a 102.7 QB Rating in the red zone.

 

Outside the red zone he is 50/84 for 532 Yards, 0 TDs, 2 INTs, and 6 sacks for -41 yards (and a fumble, recovered by us).  That's a QB Rating of 68.2 outside the red zone.

 

So some totals in the red zone: 67 yards on 18 plays with 5 touchdowns and 0 turnovers; that's 3.7 yards per play.

And outside the red zone: 616 yards on 136 plays with 0 touchdowns and 3 turnovers; that's 4.5 yards per play.

 

Fewer yards per play on a short field would seem to make some sense (for instance, 4 of those plays came from within 5 yards of the end zone).  The numbers from outside the red zone are pretty terrible, honestly.

 

We kicked 2 field goals in the red zone.

 

All told, we have been to the red zone 7 times, and scored all 7 times, including 5 touchdowns.

 

All of our scoring has come from within the red zone.  We have missed 2 field goals from outside the red zone.  We haven't had any big play touchdowns from outside the red zone.  Also no defensive or special teams touchdowns.

[easternshore97]

I think we need to improve the run game... Ray Rice is still the featured back, with Pierce the change of pace back, so I think it's important for our featured back numbers to improve.  Since Caldwell took over, Rice has 148 carries for 528 yards, 3 tds, 4 fumbles.

 

That's just 3.57 yards per carry, 49.3 carries between TDs, 37 carries between fumbles.  These are uncharacteristically bad numbers for Rice... is it something to do with the play calling or the run game design since Caldwell (or perhaps Juan Castillo... who knows) took over?

 

Very odd.

 

Pierce has been better, but as the change of pace back, I don't think you can say that's because Pierce is actually better than Rice.

Well do you think it has anything to do with the fact that no one is afraid of TE1 or TE2, nor are they impressed with WR3.

 

Once Brown and Flacco start lighting people up, that will change

[PolishRifle]

Well do you think it has anything to do with the fact that no one is afraid of TE1 or TE2, nor are they impressed with WR3.

 

Once Brown and Flacco start lighting people up, that will change

 

Any idea when Aaron Mellette is coming back? Or is he out for the season?

[rmw10]

Any idea when Aaron Mellette is coming back? Or is he out for the season?

 

On IR, done for the year.

[PolishRifle]

On IR, done for the year.

Too bad. I really liked him this preseason. Could've been another Marlon Brown for us. :(

[The Raven]

There have been six 400 yards passing games already this season. If we're a run first team, we're not a SB championship team.

 

How you do you explain San Fran making the Superbowl last year? We won it. Good passing games do not win championships. Good running games don't win championships. Good, balanced offenses do. We will need a balanced attack. When the run isn't there, we'll lean on the pass. When the pass isn't there, we'll lean on the run. We will run and pass as needed. That's how good offenses operate. A good offense doesn't label itself as a "pass first" or a "run first" team.

[Militant X 1]

The Ravens had a terrible first half against the Browns, with no points and just one third-down conversion on their seven tries. They rushed for only 27 yards on their nine first-half attempts,

 

^^^^ that's.....

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~Mili

[Cawtious]

gino is the weak link. im curious about this ryan jensen fella. he might before the seasons end be the C we ned. hes much bigger and stronger then gino.

Gino looks fairly decent in pass pro.  He seems to lack good push in the running game.  Jensen was a mauler in College that excelled at downfield blocking and sticking to his man.  I have a feeling we don't see him until Miami, though.  It will be interesting to see what he brings.

[flipper14]

 

1. That 3rd Quarter TD drive was vintage Cam Cameron. RUN RUN - Pass on 3rd AND LONG.
2. Flacco and the WR corp finally started to click as they balled out that drive. As they were 3/3 for 44 yards 
3. Credit the running game - they stayed with it. 
4. Minus the drop from Dickson to start the game, and the 2 drop TD pass & 2 miss FGs. The offense still did good against a division rival. They just need to keep trying establish the running game regardless if they are only getting 2 yards a carry.

 

The run, run, pass deal is really a myth. I just went back and charted the first four games last year (I will do the rest later today) and Baltimore ran 94 first down plays. Of those 94, only 12 were run, run, pass, if you count running backs only. There were three wide receiver runs. I think one could argue that there weren't enough run, run, pass series instead of too many.

[jdynamite]

I was once pumped to see D.Thompson this season, I thought he'd really be a contributor but with this nagging foot injury , he hasn't practiced in over month, just beginning to do light running.

I guess my expectations for him now is just to see him play at all.... Would be nice if could play now with Jones out and having plenty of opportunities.

[JoeCool#5]

The run, run, pass deal is really a myth. I just went back and charted the first four games last year (I will do the rest later today) and Baltimore ran 94 first down plays. Of those 94, only 12 were run, run, pass, if you count running backs only. There were three wide receiver runs. I think one could argue that there weren't enough run, run, pass series instead of too many.

Run, Run, Pass a myth? Lol. 

 

Baltimore Ravens at 11:03

1. 1-10-BAL 20(11:03) 27-R.Rice left guard to BAL 34 for 14 yards (22-B.Skrine).
2. 1-10-BAL 34(10:32) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 27-R.Rice right guard to BAL 35 for 1 yard (97-J.Sheard; 53-C.Robertson).
3. 2-9-BAL 35(10:04) (No Huddle) 27-R.Rice right guard to BAL 38 for 3 yards (22-B.Skrine; 92-D.Bryant).
4. 3-6-BAL 38(9:35) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 5-J.Flacco pass deep middle to 82-T.Smith to CLE 39 for 23 yards (43-T.Ward).
5. 1-10-CLE 39(9:03) (No Huddle) 30-B.Pierce left guard to CLE 38 for 1 yard (90-B.Winn).
6. 2-9-CLE 38(8:36) (No Huddle) 30-B.Pierce right guard to CLE 36 for 2 yards (43-T.Ward; 90-B.Winn).
7. 3-7-CLE 36(8:07) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 5-J.Flacco pass short middle to 14-M.Brown to CLE 26 for 10 yards (39-T.Gipson; 97-J.Sheard).
8. 1-10-CLE 26(7:38) (No Huddle) 27-R.Rice right guard to CLE 24 for 2 yards (92-D.Bryant; 52-D.Jackson).
9. 2-8-CLE 24(7:06) (No Huddle) 27-R.Rice right end to CLE 24 for no gain (53-C.Robertson).
10. 3-8-CLE 24(6:29) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 5-J.Flacco pass short right to 80-B.Stokley to CLE 13 for 11 yards (22-B.Skrine).
11. 1-10-CLE 13(5:55) (No Huddle) 30-B.Pierce left guard to CLE 5 for 8 yards (23-J.Haden).
12. 2-2-CLE 5(5:18) 30-B.Pierce up the middle for 5 yards, TOUCHDOWN. The Replay Assistant challenged the runner broke the plane ruling, and the play was Upheld.

Any one got pictures of the Browns game? I believe you might have got some rare footage of mythical creature. I heard "Bigfoot" showed its ugly head (3 consecutive times) in the 3rd quarter.

[5aiah]

imo, the Ravens offensive personnel is not suited for a high flying, fast paced air assault style of offense like the Packers, Falcons, Saints or Patriots.  the Ravens just DON'T have those types of receivers that can constantly catch the ball and make plays!  and yet, they keep trying to force that style of play upon this team.  smh!  imo, we are built to run the ball (Rice, Pierce and Leach) and pass off of that play action.   there's no shame in being who you are!

 

~Mili

Exactly. It seems we(the Franchise,the Team and the Fans) want to become that high octane style but this year we just don't have the guys to run it. Flacco is at his best in our run based system as well but we will eventually give him the tools he needs to really give the air assault a shot. Juice and Furst are guys who in the future could be a part of that but right now we are looking to defend our title with stop gaps at receiver. That being said in terms of our running to passing ratio I'm pretty sure we try to keep our RBs fresh for the playoffs and try to win without overusing our strengths. This year the problem is we might not make it there if we don't. 

[PolishRifle]

Run, Run, Pass a myth? Lol. 

 

Baltimore Ravens at 11:03

1. 1-10-BAL 20(11:03) 27-R.Rice left guard to BAL 34 for 14 yards (22-B.Skrine).
2. 1-10-BAL 34(10:32) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 27-R.Rice right guard to BAL 35 for 1 yard (97-J.Sheard; 53-C.Robertson).
3. 2-9-BAL 35(10:04) (No Huddle) 27-R.Rice right guard to BAL 38 for 3 yards (22-B.Skrine; 92-D.Bryant).
4. 3-6-BAL 38(9:35) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 5-J.Flacco pass deep middle to 82-T.Smith to CLE 39 for 23 yards (43-T.Ward).
5. 1-10-CLE 39(9:03) (No Huddle) 30-B.Pierce left guard to CLE 38 for 1 yard (90-B.Winn).
6. 2-9-CLE 38(8:36) (No Huddle) 30-B.Pierce right guard to CLE 36 for 2 yards (43-T.Ward; 90-B.Winn).
7. 3-7-CLE 36(8:07) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 5-J.Flacco pass short middle to 14-M.Brown to CLE 26 for 10 yards (39-T.Gipson; 97-J.Sheard).
8. 1-10-CLE 26(7:38) (No Huddle) 27-R.Rice right guard to CLE 24 for 2 yards (92-D.Bryant; 52-D.Jackson).
9. 2-8-CLE 24(7:06) (No Huddle) 27-R.Rice right end to CLE 24 for no gain (53-C.Robertson).
10. 3-8-CLE 24(6:29) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 5-J.Flacco pass short right to 80-B.Stokley to CLE 13 for 11 yards (22-B.Skrine).
11. 1-10-CLE 13(5:55) (No Huddle) 30-B.Pierce left guard to CLE 5 for 8 yards (23-J.Haden).
12. 2-2-CLE 5(5:18) 30-B.Pierce up the middle for 5 yards, TOUCHDOWN. The Replay Assistant challenged the runner broke the plane ruling, and the play was Upheld.

Any one got pictures of the Browns game? I believe you might have got some rare footage of mythical creature. I heard "Bigfoot" showed its ugly head (3 consecutive times) in the 3rd quarter.

 

Joe and the passing offense were pretty clutch converting 3rd downs that day. Without them we probably wouldn't have been able to move the ball up the field at all.

[Brandon22]

I think we need to improve the run game... Ray Rice is still the featured back, with Pierce the change of pace back, so I think it's important for our featured back numbers to improve.  Since Caldwell took over, Rice has 148 carries for 528 yards, 3 tds, 4 fumbles.

 

That's just 3.57 yards per carry, 49.3 carries between TDs, 37 carries between fumbles.  These are uncharacteristically bad numbers for Rice... is it something to do with the play calling or the run game design since Caldwell (or perhaps Juan Castillo... who knows) took over?

 

Very odd.

 

Pierce has been better, but as the change of pace back, I don't think you can say that's because Pierce is actually better than Rice.

I don't think we can afford to pay a starter more than the backup when the backup is better than the starter we can ask Rice to renigotiate his contract or fall victim to the same thing Trent Richardson did today 

[beanfigger]

I don't think we can afford to pay a starter more than the backup when the backup is better than the starter we can ask Rice to renigotiate his contract or fall victim to the same thing Trent Richardson did today 

 

A trade wouldn't help us much because we'd still have to eat Rice's bonus money.  He's safe on this team through at least 2014 due to his contract.

[Brandon22]

A trade wouldn't help us much because we'd still have to eat Rice's bonus money.  He's safe on this team through at least 2014 due to his contract.

Remember when you trade someone away there whole contract plus guarenteed money goes with them

[beanfigger]

Remember when you trade someone away there whole contract plus guarenteed money goes with them

 

Yes, but the signing bonus that he already got from us doesn't.  We spread that cap hit over the life of the contract, so even though we don't have to give him more money, we have to take that cap hit.  He still has multiple years left on his contract, but if we get rid of him in any way, we have to combine all the hits from all the rest of the years he had left.  That means we would actually lose money (or cap room, really) if we trade him away because next year we would not only have to eat his signing bonus money earmarked for next year, but also the money set to hit our cap the following year all at once.

[Brandon22]

Not if we can get him to renigiotiate his contract