Continuing issue: The run game

[callahan09]

Relax guys. Once Yanda comes back from that injury, everything will be fine. Talk about a guy who can elevate a unit.

Hasn't Yanda been back?  Didn't he start both games?

[flynismo]

I didn't realize that. I gotta watch a replay if he was that bad.

If you need to rewatch the game, I don't think you paid much attention the first time lol...hate to say so, but overall Leach was pretty bad. Again.

[NaveSenrag]

Hasn't Yanda been back?  Didn't he start both games?

Yes. I was having a laugh at the O-line's expense.

[The Raven]

ZBS is dependent on the five guys working as a unit to make holes, like we established earlier. Another thing, which is where I'm seeing the problem, is that the ZBS is also dependent on the backside linemen sealing off their targets and/or getting to the second level. That is where I'm starting to see issues. Gino has been phenomenal getting to the second level, but he hasn't been too good at sealing off linemen on the backside. KO hasn't done either. He has not looked good getting to the second level, and he's inconsistent at sealing the backside. McKinnie has been only adequate. Yanda has been solid. Oher looked better than last week, but still rough at times. He has got to improve his reach block or this scheme will never work. Our tackles have to stop those DEs and OLBs from stringing out the play. When the DE string out the play so far and contains the run, and the backside isn't sealed, the play is busted. That's the problem.

 

So basically, Oher can't reach block and everyone to the left of Yanda can't seal the backside. So, the zone stretch will never work because everything just gets clustered and busted.

[gabefergy]

I place a large portion of the blame firmly on KO. What a disappointment thus far.

[arnie_uk]

I place a large portion of the blame firmly on KO. What a disappointment thus far.

can you elaborate, oline wouldn't be my strength! Is he just missing one on one blocks?

[gabefergy]

can you elaborate, oline wouldn't be my strength! Is he just missing one on one blocks?

More-so in the ZBS, to me he looks like he isnt sure what he is doing. When he has a clear assignment I think he does better, but he still struggles with basic stuff. Like when he is trying to get to the second level he is slow off the snap and often misses his initial block. I really think it is 100% mental, almost as if he isn't sure what he is supposed to be doing. I think he was a little better in week 2 but I am concerned.

[CalvinSmoke]

Still an issue. What do you guys think?

[callahan09]

Still an issue. What do you guys think?

Yep, still an issue.  Silver lining is that we have faced against the #1, #2, and #5 teams in terms of average yards per attempt allowed.  Hopefully we rank 2nd to last in YPA because of that.  Bills are #22 in that defensive category, so I'm hoping we can get close to 4 YPA, but I'll be at least relieved if we can at least break 3.

[flynismo]

For all our concern over the receivers/TE, looks like the OL is priority 1a this off-season.
I see us getting two new OT.

But to be fair, the ZBS is not a good fit for the guys we have. Maybe we go back to our roots of good old fashioned power football.

[flynismo]

Yep, still an issue. Silver lining is that we have faced against the #1, #2, and #5 teams in terms of average yards per attempt allowed. Hopefully we rank 2nd to last in YPA because of that. Bills are #22 in that defensive category, so I'm hoping we can get close to 4 YPA, but I'll be at least relieved if we can at least break 3.

I know what you mean, but I don't really see it as a silver lining. We need to be able to produce against the best, because that's what we'll be up against come January

[Gordo52]

For all our concern over the receivers/TE, looks like the OL is priority 1a this off-season.
I see us getting two new OT.

But to be fair, the ZBS is not a good fit for the guys we have. Maybe we go back to our roots of good old fashioned power football.

I wish....Something has to change, it's not working.

[CalvinSmoke]

Yep, still an issue.  Silver lining is that we have faced against the #1, #2, and #5 teams in terms of average yards per attempt allowed.  Hopefully we rank 2nd to last in YPA because of that.  Bills are #22 in that defensive category, so I'm hoping we can get close to 4 YPA, but I'll be at least relieved if we can at least break 3.

I hear you, but if we want to be labeled as a good running team, we need to be able to run against good running defenses. Houston didn't gash us but they were able to run the ball with good effectiveness overall 

[Militant X 1]

For all our concern over the receivers/TE, looks like the OL is priority 1a this off-season.
I see us getting two new OT.

But to be fair, the ZBS is not a good fit for the guys we have. Maybe we go back to our roots of good old fashioned power football.

I agree and have been saying this!  imo, the Ravens "identity" based upon their personnel...is tailor-made for a power running scheme, mixing in play action off of that while also utilizing ins and out routes along with curl routes.  throw in some screens, slants, sweeps, tosses and pitches and we have one hell of an offense.  INSTEAD...the Ravens coaches keep trying to force the offense into this "air-assault" creature that is ineffective and one that they are not built for.  smh!  get back to smash-mouth, ground and pounding the rock with the "3-headed" monster (Rice, Pierce and Leach) attack.  of course, take a few shots here and there down the field to keep the defense honest and we're in business!

 

~Mili

[FerrariFan87]

At some point, don't Moeller and Castillo have to take some of the blame? If we can ax our O-coordinator late in the season, don't think Harbs won't make a change at O-line coach/Run game coordinator should we continue to struggle.

[jdynamite]

Yep, still an issue. Silver lining is that we have faced against the #1, #2, and #5 teams in terms of average yards per attempt allowed. Hopefully we rank 2nd to last in YPA because of that. Bills are #22 in that defensive category, so I'm hoping we can get close to 4 YPA, but I'll be at least relieved if we can at least break 3.

Here's the but....

Yes those teams ranks are that against the run, but part of the reason they rank that high is because of our inability to produce... Until we get more of a sample size maybe 2 more games we won't know if those defenses were that good against run or if we are just that pathetic.

Regardless the online has allowed too much penetration into the backfield.

[flynismo]

Here's the but....

Yes those teams ranks are that against the run, but part of the reason they rank that high is because of our inability to produce... Until we get more of a sample size maybe 2 more games we won't know if those defenses were that good against run or if we are just that pathetic.

Regardless the online has allowed too much penetration into the backfield.

That is a good point. However, imo it is also somewhat irrelevant, because we need to do much better, especially against a good run defense. We can't worry ourselves about how good x-team is at stuffing the run. We need to be the team that our opponents worry about how they are going to limit the damage that Rice and Pierce do, and everything else will fall into place.

[The Raven]

Yeah, the ZBS sucks. It only works against undisciplined and bad dlines, which is why Houston got it to work against AFC South teams for so long. 

[callahan09]

Currently our median rush attempt is 2 yards.  That means that half of our attempts have been 2 or more yards, and half have been 2 or fewer yards.  Really when you look at it that way, you should expect the most likely outcome to be a 2 yard gain on any given rush attempt.

[jdynamite]

That is a good point. However, imo it is also somewhat irrelevant, because we need to do much better, especially against a good run defense. We can't worry ourselves about how good x-team is at stuffing the run. We need to be the team that our opponents worry about how they are going to limit the damage that Rice and Pierce do, and everything else will fall into place.

I agree with that .. I thought we would be that team you speak of already. I certainly didn't expect the run game to be non-existent. My expectations were that our 2 man punch would rank us amongst the top rushing teams and then the passing game would come along slowly and develop some great play action off the run.

[omar586]

we're running out of RBs

[Ravenseconbeast]

@ aug i told you all that juan castillo was a bad hire.   but where are the people that hyped him up as a 'stud o-line' coach at?  

 

like i said before time and time again....you do not hire your 'friends' to work.   harbaugh has a problem bringing people in just solely based on his relationship w/ people and not football.

 

what is spags doing?   probably collecting NFL pay check just b/c harbaugh hooked him up.   juan in the other hand is making our stud o-lines into a complete mess

[jimjim5]

@ aug i told you all that juan castillo was a bad hire.   but where are the people that hyped him up as a 'stud o-line' coach at?  

 

like i said before time and time again....you do not hire your 'friends' to work.   harbaugh has a problem bringing people in just solely based on his relationship w/ people and not football.

 

what is spags doing?   probably collecting NFL pay check just b/c harbaugh hooked him up.   juan in the other hand is making our stud o-lines into a complete mess

 

Yep with Castillo.  However Spags can make an argument regarding his impact.

[BMORElegacy]

@ aug i told you all that juan castillo was a bad hire.   but where are the people that hyped him up as a 'stud o-line' coach at?  

 

like i said before time and time again....you do not hire your 'friends' to work.   harbaugh has a problem bringing people in just solely based on his relationship w/ people and not football.

 

what is spags doing?   probably collecting NFL pay check just b/c harbaugh hooked him up.   juan in the other hand is making our stud o-lines into a complete mess

The o-line is a mess but Spags has been beneficial to the development of our defensive line and 4-3 base packages. 

[CalvinSmoke]

can't really touch Spag. the front 7 is nasty.

[ravens_4life]

castillo has to go. his scheme isnt working here. if there had been a little improvement over the last few weeks then i would say play it out. for god's sake were ranked 31st in running the ball. only the friggin' jags are worst. thats not raven football guys. we are built to run the ball north and south. i bet you ray rice is thinking the same thing.

[ravens_4life]

_{i have always liked spags. the defense is nasty becuase of spags not pees. i am not a pees fan. but pees is going to get the credit. spags probably sat his butt down and said this is whats going to work with this defense. spags said this defense reminds him of that nasty giants defense back in 2007 when they won the superbowl.}

[ravens_4life]

if pees doesnt start waking up and smelling the coffee i see his butt getting axed half way through the season like cam was last year. pees is a horrible. i was so happy when spags signed here, if he hadnt the defense wouldnt be what it is right now. believe that.

[beanfigger]

if pees doesnt start waking up and smelling the coffee i see his butt getting axed half way through the season like cam was last year. pees is a horrible. i was so happy when spags signed here, if he hadnt the defense wouldnt be what it is right now. believe that.

 

Does giving up zero touchdowns in two weeks not count as waking up?

[gabefergy]

if pees doesnt start waking up and smelling the coffee i see his butt getting axed half way through the season like cam was last year. pees is a horrible. i was so happy when spags signed here, if he hadnt the defense wouldnt be what it is right now. believe that.

I believe that you have no clue what you are talking about. Pees has been great. Besides this is a thread about the running game...