Average Joe

[sliceanddic3]

That's why Flacco is my favorite player. He's so humble and the exact opposite of flashy.

[StaticRaven]

12-15 million a year isn't financial security?

 

This is a really lame statement.

 

If Joe would have taken a 5m a year contract you could just as easily sit there and say "1-2 million a year isn't financial security?" and it'd be just as true.

 

I don't know what kind of job you work, but in my industry (and in most higher end skill position jobs) you go in and you negotiate a salary based on what you think you're worth, not what you need to survive. 

 

Do you go into your job salary negotiations negotiating to a number you need to stay out of poverty, or do you go in negotiating to get what you think you're worth?

[Tank 92]

12-15 million a year isn't financial security?

 

 

Well, obviously it is. I would think $6 - $8 million would be as well. But the market determines the worth and I don't think there are any players out there that would settle for less than their market value, especially with their first veteran deal.

[StaticRaven]

Well, obviously it is. I would think $6 - $8 million would be as well. But the market determines the worth and I don't think there are any players out there that would settle for less than their market value, especially with their first veteran deal.

 

That's the other thing - NFL Players only have a certain window to make the really "big" bucks. And this particular contract (and perhaps the next) are the contracts in which Joe's going to make most of his money. The next contract (perhaps) and any after that would be easier for someone to give a hometown discount on. It'd be stupid to give a discount on the most valuable contract of your career. It's almost a 99.9% guarantee that every contract after this is going to be for lower dollar values.

[GrimCoconut]

Flacco and Newsome must be best buds. No matter what either guy does they'll always be questioned lol

[flaccopoe]

Lmao at Sanchez's tween girl outfit!

[flaccopoe]

You don't here these people complaining about Ryan and Rodgers taking too much money.

 

I've heard a lot of people make fun of Ryan's contract.  Aaron Rodgers is uber-talented though, no one can knock his hustle.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

For a guy who apparently doesn't need much he wasn't willing to sign his first extension offer let alone accept a hometown discount. Lets call it like it is.

 

 

He doesn't need much as far as material things... that's what he meant.

 

Providing not only the immediate financial security for himself, his wife and family but also that of his children's children and so on is priceless.

 

Football is a game, his family is more than that... and you cant blame him for gambling on the extra millions - those millions are whats gonna put his grandchildren and great grandchildren through any college they chose so that they can invest the money and guarantee to futures of the next generations.

 

You CANNOT knock a guy for that... especially when so many in his shoes are irresponsible and broke by 40.

 

AND, on the flipside.... if he had a bad year last year would you expect the Ravens to give a few extra million than anyone else would for being a "team player" and stand up guy? Heck no. Our franchise makes those decisions every year and we praise them for it - its why theyre the best organization in the NFL.

 

So lets call it like it really is - Joe only did to the Ravens what the Ravens would have done to him if given the chance.

[BloodRaven]

This is a really lame statement.
 
If Joe would have taken a 5m a year contract you could just as easily sit there and say "1-2 million a year isn't financial security?" and it'd be just as true.
 
I don't know what kind of job you work, but in my industry (and in most higher end skill position jobs) you go in and you negotiate a salary based on what you think you're worth, not what you need to survive. 
 
Do you go into your job salary negotiations negotiating to a number you need to stay out of poverty, or do you go in negotiating to get what you think you're worth?

I'm not surprised that a bandwagon fan would miss the irony.

[StaticRaven]

I'm not surprised that a bandwagon fan would miss the irony.

 

I did miss the irony, go ahead and point it out to me then.

 

Bandwagon? I'm curious as to how you came to this conclusion. Perhaps new to this forum, but I've been lurking about 24x7 and the Scout site for over a decade.

 

It seems to me that your one-line response to my points that doesn't actually address any of them is a weak way of trying to come out on top of this discussion. But, whatever.

[BloodRaven]

I did miss the irony, go ahead and point it out to me then.
 
Bandwagon? I'm curious as to how you came to this conclusion. Perhaps new to this forum, but I've been lurking about 24x7 and the Scout site for over a decade.
 
It seems to me that your one-line response to my points that doesn't actually address any of them is a weak way of trying to come out on top of this discussion. But, whatever.

Call it what you want, I don't have the time or patience.

[StaticRaven]

Call it what you want, I don't have the time or patience.

 

Let me guess, you have to be at the gym in 26 minutes?

 

Just so I'm clear, you don't have the time and patience to respond intelligently to my post that you've responded to twice already.

 

Right.

 

Well, toodles.

 

I look forward to more of your witty and insightful comments in later matters. Hopefully that 10K post count you racked up is filled with thoughtful comments, just like the two you "didn't have the time or patience for" posted over the last hour. ^^

 

Well that's the end of my comment to you on the matter.

 

Otherwise I'm sticking with my original thought. People in skill positions negotiate based on their value, not based on what they need to be comfortable (past a certain income threshold, of course).

 

But, IMO, Flacco's in a class of athletes that now has a 20m/year price tag attached to it. So I see no reason to begrudge him for it.

[BloodRaven]

He doesn't need much as far as material things... that's what he meant.
 
Providing not only the immediate financial security for himself, his wife and family but also that of his children's children and so on is priceless.
 
Football is a game, his family is more than that... and you cant blame him for gambling on the extra millions - those millions are whats gonna put his grandchildren and great grandchildren through any college they chose so that they can invest the money and guarantee to futures of the next generations.
 
You CANNOT knock a guy for that... especially when so many in his shoes are irresponsible and broke by 40.
 
AND, on the flipside.... if he had a bad year last year would you expect the Ravens to give a few extra million than anyone else would for being a "team player" and stand up guy? Heck no. Our franchise makes those decisions every year and we praise them for it - its why theyre the best organization in the NFL.
 
So lets call it like it really is - Joe only did to the Ravens what the Ravens would have done to him if given the chance.

C'mon man, if Joe was so concerned about financial security like you say he wouldn't have rolled the dice on his contract extension, what if the season hadn't gone his way?

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

C'mon man, if Joe was so concerned about financial security like you say he wouldn't have rolled the dice on his contract extension, what if the season hadn't gone his way?

Unless he was confident he'd win. Winners don't make bets on what they don't know or can't control. His potential loss wasn't much, he was still this teams franchise QB. But he stood to gain a lot by doing what he did.

You're basing your argument on what ifs that DIDN'T HAPPEN. He banked on himself bc of confidence and guess what he was right. You can't question it bc it's what happened.

The richest people in the world don't sell when they get a good deal, they wait and get the best deal bc they know they can. That's all Joe did which only supports the value he has in financial security, not opposes it.

PS - it's not "rolling the dice" when you know you can't lose, and have the possibility to win huge. That's just a smart, calculated wager.

[BloodRaven]

Unless he was confident he'd win. Winners don't make bets on what they don't know or can't control. His potential loss wasn't much, he was still this teams franchise QB. But he stood to gain a lot by doing what he did.
You're basing your argument on what ifs that DIDN'T HAPPEN. He banked on himself bc of confidence and guess what he was right. You can't question it bc it's what happened.
The richest people in the world don't sell when they get a good deal, they wait and get the best deal bc they know they can. That's all Joe did which only supports the value he has in financial security, not opposes it.
PS - it's not "rolling the dice" when you know you can't lose, and have the possibility to win huge. That's just a smart, calculated wager.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say, you contradict yourself a few times there. It's kind of a mess.

[Grapple Raven]

Joe has said on more than one occasion since he signed his contract, twice on this website, that he gambled on himself because it was a matter of respect, not so much the money. Personally, I am happy for him. I can't remember another QB from recent history that has been as misaligned by the press as Joe has. If for nothing else, he earned that contract for putting up with Cam all those years, lol.

[PolishRifle]

Lmao at Sanchez's tween girl outfit!

As bad as that is, I still think Kaep TD celebration is still the worst. Seriously, Alex Smith could've gotten this ridiculously loaded team to the playoffs. What did he even achieve, that would merit it's own celebration routine?

How about you carry yourself like you have been in the endzone, like the game is about the team and team effort, instead showing of how much you like yourself. -_- UGH, that's so irritating.

It's like Tebow tebowing and then saying he is paying tribute to Christ, while it's just a transparent attempt to get everyone's attention. :( Unfortunetly, just like with tebowing, Kaep's "flexing" actually worked and the masses just eat it up.

Things like that make you lose faith in humanity. :eyes:

[beanfigger]

I'm not sure what you're trying to say, you contradict yourself a few times there. It's kind of a mess.

I completely understood it. He makes a lot of sense and has a valid argument.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

I'm not sure what you're trying to say, you contradict yourself a few times there. It's kind of a mess.

 

uhmmm mind pointing out the contradictions?

[hawkprey]

It's ridiculous that of all the new QB salaries out there (Rodgers, Ryan, Romo, Stafford), Flacco is the only one who has to "back up his contract". The guy that just won the Super Bowl is the one who "Hey, you got it, now go earn it." The other QBs who failed in the playoffs or missed it altogether, those are the guys who are "just getting their market value". 

[flaccopoe]

It's ridiculous that of all the new QB salaries out there (Rodgers, Ryan, Romo, Stafford), Flacco is the only one who has to "back up his contract". The guy that just won the Super Bowl is the one who "Hey, you got it, now go earn it." The other QBs who failed in the playoffs or missed it altogether, those are the guys who are "just getting their market value". 

 

Um, why is Super Bowl MVP Aaron Rodgers on that list?  He's in a different stratosphere from the other QBs you mentioned.

[hawkprey]

Um, why is Super Bowl MVP Aaron Rodgers on that list?  He's in a different stratosphere from the other QBs you mentioned.

Because no one talks about Rodgers as needing to prove himself. Even though Joe eclipses him in playoff and total wins since 2008. Rodgers gets money and no one talks about the Packers being weaker with him taking up more salary cap. No one talks about him needing to maintain the success he's had that got him that contract. No one talks about him needing to make the playoffs or get somewhere in order for that contract to be seen as "worth it". 

[flaccopoe]

Because no one talks about Rodgers as needing to prove himself. Even though Joe eclipses him in playoff and total wins since 2008. Rodgers gets money and no one talks about the Packers being weaker with him taking up more salary cap. No one talks about him needing to maintain the success he's had that got him that contract. No one talks about him needing to make the playoffs or get somewhere in order for that contract to be seen as "worth it". 

 

Rodgers actually deserves his 9-figure contract, unlike Romo, Stafford and Ryan.

[hawkprey]

Rodgers actually deserves his 9-figure contract, unlike Romo, Stafford and Ryan.

But the point was to say Flacco's contract is seen by too many people as something he now has to earn, rather than something he's already earned.

[flaccopoe]

But the point was to say Flacco's contract is seen by too many people as something he now has to earn, rather than something he's already earned.

 

Understood.  However, I wouldn't mention Rodgers in the same sentence as the other QBs you listed.  If Rodgers had a decent RB corps, defense and O-line, he would no doubt be on Brady's level in terms of playoff wins.

[5aiah]

Because no one talks about Rodgers as needing to prove himself. Even though Joe eclipses him in playoff and total wins since 2008. Rodgers gets money and no one talks about the Packers being weaker with him taking up more salary cap. No one talks about him needing to maintain the success he's had that got him that contract. No one talks about him needing to make the playoffs or get somewhere in order for that contract to be seen as "worth it". 

Rodgers is just so much better and ahead of the rest of the QBs(including Flacco). No one who knows football would question him taking up cap because he can make the guys around him better than anyone else in the league aside from Peyton and Brady and they are near their end(and his arm is better overall then both of theirs). We know he is already worth it because the has a top 5 power arm,accurate arm,and reading ability and timing. The Packers aren't even that weaker because of his contract yet. They have young guys on the come up who cost little.

[hawkprey]

Rodgers is just so much better and ahead of the rest of the QBs(including Flacco). No one who knows football would question him taking up cap because he can make the guys around him better than anyone else in the league aside from Peyton and Brady and they are near their end(and his arm is better overall then both of theirs). We know he is already worth it because the has a top 5 power arm,accurate arm,and reading ability and timing. The Packers aren't even that weaker because of his contract yet. They have young guys on the come up who cost little.

Flacco rocks and Rodgers sucks!

 

Is that all you got out of what I said? I believe I explained myself clearly.

[H8R]

C'mon man, if Joe was so concerned about financial security like you say he wouldn't have rolled the dice on his contract extension, what if the season hadn't gone his way?

Your avatar is a joke, just like your posts

[5aiah]

Flacco rocks and Rodgers sucks!

 

Is that all you got out of what I said? I believe I explained myself clearly.

you said

 

But the point was to say Flacco's contract is seen by too many people as something he now has to earn, rather than something he's already earned.

Duh dude. There is a big difference between Arod ruling the QB elite for years and Flacco going on a great playoff run, in terms of how their contracts are looked at, but it is rightfully so. Its not some bias. I think Flacco will play up to his potential and earn his contract but no matter how great the run was it does not automatically validate his contract by itself. The Ravens had no choice but to pay him that amount. What he makes this year isn't all that much but the years after when it rises to Elite QB level of course he will have to grow into his contract. Both of these guys are getting different attention for a reason.

[hawkprey]

you said

 

Duh dude. There is a big difference between Arod ruling the QB elite for years and Flacco going on a great playoff run, in terms of how their contracts are looked at, but it is rightfully so. Its not some bias. I think Flacco will play up to his potential and earn his contract but no matter how great the run was it does not automatically validate his contract by itself. The Ravens had no choice but to pay him that amount. What he makes this year isn't all that much but the years after when it rises to Elite QB level of course he will have to grow into his contract. Both of these guys are getting different attention for a reason.

The Ravens had no choice? Interesting, I wasn't aware that the Packers had a choice to pay Rodgers less. How nice of them to give him more money than they had to. I'm sure Rodgers' agent told them "Just pay my client whatever you feel like".