Ron Jaworski's top 32 QB's 2013

[beasy2487]

That's a great article. Good find. Him being ranked 18th all time in passer rating over the first 5 years has to be a result of the great defense he gets to play with, right?

 

That article showed exactly why the Ravens won't get complacent after winning the Super Bowl. Because Flacco is the leader and no way is that guy getting complacent. I have often wondered this why Flacco wasn't seen on TV more this offseason, now I know. It's because that guy is too cool for commercials lol. Gotta love Flacco.

Haha I don't know about all that regarding the commercials. I work in advertising and we stay away from him because he can't act lol. However, you're going to be seeing a spot from a major brand with him in it very soon ;). I've only read the script but if they pulled it off it should be pretty funny too.

[Gordo52]

Jaws is on 105.7 the fan right now talking about Flacco. It's half way over though so if you'd like to hear it I'm sure they'll put it up on their website later today.

[Ravensfan23]

Jaws is on 105.7 the fan right now talking about Flacco. It's half way over though so if you'd like to hear it I'm sure they'll put it up on their website later today.

 

Wish I could have heard. I'm sure he justified his reasons for Flacco being #4, what did he say

[Gordo52]

Wish I could have heard. I'm sure he justified his reasons for Flacco being #4, what did he say

Hard for me to paraphrase right now because I'm at work but mostly his reasoning with ranking Flacco at 4. How he doesn't think the loss of Boldin will be significant or Lewis's leadership for next year. How it's teuely Flacco's offense now. He said it takes about 6 weeks for him to study only 1 QB, and he broke down all the different ways he does so. Also he think the Bengals are the team to beat in the North this year and the Steelers offense has him concerned. He also said Weeden did very well last year and that he could be that QB you have to build the offense around. He also loves Matt Ryan and thinks he could win a Superbowl sometime in the near future. Also praised Ozzie for all the bold moves he made this offseason.

[ellicottraven]

While I appreciate the fact that Ron Jaworski put Flacco up at #4 on his list, I still disagree with him. I really believe he should be the #2 ranked QB in the league behind Rodgers (for now). At the very least don't rank Brady higher than him when he beat him convincingly 2 out of 3 times in Foxborough and the one he lost, he really should have won and beat him here at M&T! Just my opinion and also doesn't take too much reasoning on Jaws part either right??

[Ravensfan23]

Hard for me to paraphrase right now because I'm at work but mostly his reasoning with ranking Flacco at 4. How he doesn't think the loss of Boldin will be significant or Lewis's leadership for next year. How it's teuely Flacco's offense now. He said it takes about 6 weeks for him to study only 1 QB, and he broke down all the different ways he does so. Also he think the Bengals are the team to beat in the North this year and the Steelers offense has him concerned. He also said Weeden did very well last year and that he could be that QB you have to build the offense around. He also loves Matt Ryan and thinks he could win a Superbowl sometime in the near future. Also praised Ozzie for all the bold moves he made this offseason.

 

Thanks, i'll try to pull it up online later. But these are the 2 points I would love to hear Jaws breakdown. I've always been a fan of Jaws ever since he was on MNF, i thought he brought so much to that booth. He's one of the few guys that you can actually tell is breaking down film and not just looking at film and taking someone else's opinion.

 

I'm so excited about this "finally" being Flacco's offense and Caldwell being the guy who is willing to step back and let it happen. I'd love to hear him talk about just what will be different with Cam out of the way and see if my views match up. I also would love to hear how he feels the lost of Boldin won't be a factor. I think it's all about scheme and the younger more explosive WRs being about to work in space.

[Ravensfan23]

While I appreciate the fact that Ron Jaworski put Flacco up at #4 on his list, I still disagree with him. I really believe he should be the #2 ranked QB in the league behind Rodgers (for now). At the very least don't rank Brady higher than him when he beat him convincingly 2 out of 3 times in Foxborough and the one he lost, he really should have won and beat him here at M&T! Just my opinion and also doesn't take too much reasoning on Jaws part either right??

 

I just posted in another thread about Brady. How long does the statue of limitations last on winning 3 Super Bowl. 10 years ago should be considered history. lol. But i think it's hard for people to just get past the raw numbers of Brady. He still produces great regular season numbers and for the most part shows up in big time regular season games.

 

But since that choke job in the SB in 07'. Brady has 3 playoff wins. 1 against Tebow, 1 against a reeling Texans team and 1 at the hands of Evans and Cundiff. He's been 1 and done twice. Outplayed by Eli twice, outplayed by Flacco twice and even outplayed by Sanchez.

 

As far as the Flacco vs Brady head to head matchups. I don't think it's even close. In the 6 games played since 09' Flacco has passed for either more yards and TDs then Brady 5 out of 6 times. The one time he didn't was 09' playoffs and you can hardly say Brady played well in that game.

[funky141]

Jaws did pretty well with this year's rankings.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

I mean you have made comments that suggest you didn't watch the teams(I can understand since they aren't as fun as the ravens) in regular season or playoffs and you don't understand how Flacco was able to stick to his strengths to beat these highly ranked pass defenses. I watched the two teams in question a bit. Pats not in the conversation since they had a troubled secondary to begin with and once they lost Talib some Pats fans gave up right then and there. Colts secondary was nothing to be scared of so that leaves two teams. The highly ranked pass defenses of Niners and Broncos. Now let me start out by saying these defenses were as good as the rankings say but pass wise when it came to the deep ball they were highly overrated and flawed. The Broncos defensive scheme relied on Champ shutting down his man one on one(an island) while the other DBs shut the rest of the field down and Von and Co. rushes the QB. This worked extremely well in the regular season but the championship isn't won there. The broncos got the bye and came up against the one team in the AFC that could take their biggest flaw(their defensive system) and beat them over the head with it again and again and again. The Baltimore Ravens. I'm not saying Flacco was not good, I am saying that the defensive backs coach and the defensive coordinator left their fatal flaw out in the open for Flacco to have a field day with. Why, I do not know, but they did and paid for it dearly. Aside from Chris Harris that secondary was not prepared for Flacco at all. They underestimated his power and in one of the biggest plays in NFL playoff history,underestimated his love of the deep ball and ignored what everyone else in the NFL knows and ended up losing because of it. Now for the Niners this takes much less since it was pretty much the line play that stopped the Niners from doing what they do best which is stuffing the run and getting to the QB. This didn't happen and Flacco capitalized, picking them apart quite easily. He beat them everywhere on the field because their secondary falls apart quickly with no pass rush. Their CBs aren't as good as ours and that's saying something because our best one isn't on the field. Then their safeties who are normally good in coverage but had been exposed the game before, didn't exactly play up to their hype when tested. Yes they are hard hitters but can they do their job as cover safeties like the stats say they can(when their front 7 isn't running the QB off the field every play), NO they could not. To end this debate since it is fraught with strawmen and uninformed opinions, Flacco had the most impressively efficient playoff run in NFL history without truly addressing his flaws as a QB. Imagine what he will do when they cease to be.    

 

Edit: I stand corrected. The Niners secondary had been exposed in the intermediary and deep passing game long before the previous playoff game as i thought. Proves my point even more.

 https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/01/29/setting-the-edge-super-bowl-xlvii-part-1/

 

I love how you downplay stats when fly says the niners and broncos had highly ranked passing defenses, and then use stats to promote your point when you find some that support you.

 

Either stats are important or they aren't. Just like post-season and superbowl play is the defining characteristic of being great or its not.

[scrock]

havent been able to find the espn video of jaws qb countdown for flacco...are they just trying to bury it? i think skip bayless almost died when he found out

[5aiah]

I love how you downplay stats when fly says the niners and broncos had highly ranked passing defenses, and then use stats to promote your point when you find some that support you.

 

Either stats are important or they aren't. Just like post-season and superbowl play is the defining characteristic of being great or its not.

I thought this conversation was over. I use different stats then you which is indicative of our differences period. You are using what i referred to as "primitive" stats because they don't tell the whole story and at the same time you didn't watch those teams enough to know what their weaknesses were. You probably don't even know how those defenses performed in pass coverage or what their strengths are,I listed what I thought from watching them, you have not yet. I used advanced stats to back up what i witnessed via the all-22 coach cam on game rewind as well as just debating with fans(rational non homers) of those teams. I am not downplaying stats, just ignoring your use of the stats that blind casual fans such as yourself. I made my argument and you have yet to actually refute or address it properly. I won't respond any longer because this has become more about you being right and attacking me than you actually attacking my argument. Good day sir.    

[EdReedFTW]

Is there any footage of Jaws' countdown?

[Militant X 1]

Just to play devil's advocate here - we're all loving Jaws right now for ranking Joe high, but do keep in mind that he and Joe are personal friends.

 

We always hate media bias in here, except in cases like this when that bias is pro-Ravens. Jaws and Flacco are buddies so of course he's gonna rank him high. We will say deservedly so - Jaws is just being accurate, but others will definitely say Jaws is looking out for his boy and putting him much higher than he deserves.

boom! 

 

to be honest i was very surprised that Joe was number 4 on that list.  sure, Joe won the Superbowl, was the MVP and had an incredible playoff run of 11 TDs and no interceptions!  BUT where is that type of QB gameplay from Joe throughout the regular season?  imo, that's  what our golden boy has been missing!  the 2013 regular season is showtime Joe!

 

~Mili

[CARavensFan]

Is there any footage of Jaws' countdown?

 

I've been wanting to know the same thing

[hawkprey]

boom! 

 

to be honest i was very surprised that Joe was number 4 on that list.  sure, Joe won the Superbowl, was the MVP and had an incredible playoff run of 11 TDs and no interceptions!  BUT where is that type of QB gameplay from Joe throughout the regular season?  imo, that's  what our golden boy has been missing!  the 2013 regular season is showtime Joe!

 

~Mili

I don't think people remember that for most of the regular season he was exceptional. He just had a few really bad games, and some of that has to do with protection. Remember Oher and Bobbie Williams on the left side? Yikes. That's one of the worst blind sides in all of football.

[5aiah]

I don't think people remember that for most of the regular season he was exceptional. He just had a few really bad games, and some of that has to do with protection. Remember Oher and Bobbie Williams on the left side? Yikes. That's one of the worst blind sides in all of football.

You thought he was exceptional? He had a lot of bad games and his best games came against lesser defenses like the Raiders. I agree that his line was crap but it wasn't as bad as Rodgers or Lucks. I am expecting Joe to take the next step this season and blow the critics out of the water with a consistently efficient season close to what he did in the playoffs. I know it won't be exactly like it with the TDs and yards but the cutback on turnovers is what I am looking at. He also has to play better on the road like he did during the run. That was another knock on his game. Basically it is all about whether or not the SB run Flacco is permanent. Since I think it is, I am expecting quite a lot from him even without Boldin.

[Militant X 1]

I don't think people remember that for most of the regular season he was exceptional. He just had a few really bad games, and some of that has to do with protection. Remember Oher and Bobbie Williams on the left side? Yikes. That's one of the worst blind sides in all of football.

i agree with the lack of protection piece Hawk.  however, for an example; if i'm not mistaken, Aaron Rodgers protection is horrible in Green Bay and yet he still seems to perform at a pretty high level more consistently in the regular season than Joe.

 

~Mili

[hawkprey]

i agree with the lack of protection piece Hawk.  however, for an example; if i'm not mistaken, Aaron Rodgers protection is horrible in Green Bay and yet he still seems to perform at a pretty high level more consistently in the regular season than Joe.

 

~Mili

You might be mistaken. A lot of people seem to think Rodgers holds onto the ball too long. If he throws away 15 passes instead of taking 15 of those 51 sacks, suddenly the O-line looks a lot more competent, but his completion percentage dips 2-3% and it stops looking like he produces at as high a level. Rodgers has sometimes trusted his ability to scramble to a fault.

[PolishRifle]

havent been able to find the espn video of jaws qb countdown for flacco...are they just trying to bury it? i think skip bayless almost died when he found out

It gave him another opportunity to get hung up on two games and call Flacco pathetic. Naturally he loved doing that. -_-

 

Jaws listed his top 32 qbs of 2013. 2013 as in: "this is a projection of how good QBs might be next season". Flacco just had the greatest post season of any QB EVER. The only QB that even compares is Montana (arguably the greatest QB of all time). What was Jaws left to do?

If Joe continues to perform that way (not saying he will), he easily will be a top 5 QB and it's not like you can trip into this playoff run (miraculous according to Skip) by sheer luck and have the best passer rating of any QB in the playoffs 4 times in a row. Neither is it coincidence, that it happened just as the Ravens changed OCs (who stayed on our roster for atleast this upcoming season) and as we managed to improve our Oline, which suddenly started to play well (btw, McKinnie being resigned outweights the loss of Boldin tenfold, imho).

 

Will Joe continue his brilliant performance from the last playoff season? I think it's unlikely, but I also don't see him regressing a ton and getting much worse (has he ever gotten much worse from season to season?). I certainly can't understand how someone could get hung up on the Broncos game for example, which was the first game, Caldwell even called offensive plays on the NFL level for and the first time Jim and John had to work together in an actual game (if I remember correctly, they seemed to have a decent second half in that game, btw).

 

It's a projection. And I have to give Jaws the benefit of a doubt here. Jaws was the one, who put Joe in his top 10 last year, ahead of Tony Romo, something he got criticized for. Where are those doubter now? How many people would want to put Romo over Flacco in 2013?

 

And btw, Skip putting Robert Griffen "the hurt", who is still limping around on one leg, at 4 instead of Joe is a joke.

[Ravensfan23]

There is no doubt that Joe needs to play more consistently in the regular season, not just to be labeled as a Elite QB, but more importantly to keep this team in a great position to win games every week like he has down each year thus far. I think with the offensive change this will definitely happen.

 

I caution people from thinking that Flacco just went on a "run" or hit a hot streak in the playoffs. This guy has played the same way in the playoffs the last 3 seasons, when given the opportunity. I personally don't think Flacco can be responsible for Cam playing conservative when facing better defenses instead of putting the game in Flacco's hands. Joe has played well in the Playoffs the last 3 seasons, to the tune of 18TDs 2Ints. He's thrown for at least 2TDs in 7 of his last 8 playoffs games and a Boldin drop prevents it from being 8.

 

I have no doubt that Flacco will carry over his playoff success to the regular season because I have no doubt that Caldwell will allow him to play to his comfort level. #5 definitely has to become more consistent in the regular season, but i'm betting that without Cam he will.

[scrock]

i feel like the past few years when Joe has excelled the coaches threw up their hands and said F it...we're not going to win playing cautiously on offense, Rice hasn't been the same player in the playoffs for whatever reason so if we are going to make some noise we need to unleash the offense and unleash Joe Flacco and thats when Joe goes to work and outplays Manning, Brady, etc...

 

..we need to take that mentality into the regular season, i may be wrong but sometimes when Flacco has those bad games that just make no sense for him to have its almost like he gets bored, its like Joe says look I've never missed the playoffs, thats when the games matter and regular season stats and games dont really carry that weight they should because he's been so successful....i know im totally wrong on this but its my theory for why he can lose focus and not be as consistent....cause fantasy football and regular season stats be damned, its about the playoffs

[5aiah]

You might be mistaken. A lot of people seem to think Rodgers holds onto the ball too long. If he throws away 15 passes instead of taking 15 of those 51 sacks, suddenly the O-line looks a lot more competent, but his completion percentage dips 2-3% and it stops looking like he produces at as high a level. Rodgers has sometimes trusted his ability to scramble to a fault.

Meh. Its not about the sacks bro its about the time he has to throw given his WRs have to run and get open. Yes could Rodgers throw some of these away instead of taking the sack,yes, could he not try and run but instead throw it away,yes, is his line bad and forcing him into these situations,yes. Thats a misconception based on people thinking sacks is the best indicator of whether a line is good or not. It isn't. His line is mediocre yet even with pressure he is still one of the best at handling it. 

 

Edit: Would also add that the run blocking is where they are weakest at not pass blocking.