CB Jimmy Smith

[Tank 92]

You never know what the NFL's League Instructed Referees are going to do on a penalty call. They will call a penalty on one play and not call a penalty for the very same conduct on a different play. That said, Jimmy Smith's goal line play in the Superbowl was tops and a flag could have dropped against Crabtree. No Call was the only way to go in that circumstance on those contacts.

 

 

To be frank, it looked like adrenaline induced panic. Not saying it wasn't a good play. And I do think if there was a flag, it should have been thrown on Crabs.

[izvoodoo]

This is a great post, and very good analysis. The first catch he let up I believe we were in cover 3, meaning he had the deep third of the field. Jones drove him backwards and made a quick move inside that should be open against that coverage. That's really not defensible by Jimmy given his responsibility in the zone.

 

The second play I agree, he just got beat by Jones. He wasnt that far off though and stuck with him making the tackle right after the catch. 

 

The TD catch, Huff really was at fault. He bit on the underneath route leaving Jimmy out to dry. He was playing outside leverage expecting help inside that wasnt there.

 

Even the fade wasnt that bad IMO. He had tight coverage, and turned to try to make a play on the ball but it was just perfectly placed. It was just a great throw beating good coverage.

he broke to the ball and played with good technique.

 

His really bad play is when he lost assignment.

[mgridda]

So, after a night's rest and a clear mind free of being in the moment, I re-watched the game and payed attention to Jimmy. He really didn't play that bad. He played well the first two drives, covering Jones well enough on one play to make Ryan look for White instead. The 3rd drive wasn't good but when you really go back and look only the one pass, the second one, can you really put on Jimmy. On that play, Jones simply outplayed Jimmy to get open.

 

However, the first and third catches, the latter for the TD, were the same route by Jones. Both times Huff went up to give the LB help with the TE instead of staying back to help Jimmy, also leaving Elam alone back there. Now, I don't claim to know what Huff's responsibility was on those plays, but I would think we'd rather want him back to help cover Jones than have him cover a TE and leave Jimmy by himself against one of the best. Why people aren't considering possible miscommunication in the secondary is beyond me. There was clearly some of that in the Tampa game too.

 

As for the other two catches made against him, the fade was pretty bad. He seemed to stop running or at least slow down when he looked for the ball, allowing the receiver to get behind him and make the catch. The last catch that came against him is a play that happens a lot and can happen to the best of them. He went to cover Douglas, I believe it was Douglas, and left the flat open. He'll learn from it, that's what the preseason is for.

 

So, is he not living up to the first round pick status? Sure, that's fair to say. I still think he'll do well this year. Just remember that we will be getting Webb back which will bolster the secondary. I'll take Jimmy against #2 WRs.

Great analysis.

 

As for Michael Huff, I'll add that during the pre-season the safeties play differently than they do in the regular season and leave cornerbacks on an Island more sort of as a high risk proving ground (but the risk isn't that high since it's the preseason). So yes, in a regular season scenario those plays wouldn't have happened, but Jimmy Smith was brought in to be a shutdown, island type of cornerback.

 

 

I still feel like we should have drafted Muhammad Wilkerson. And I'm not just saying this now, I've said it before the draft, after, a year later, etc. I don't think Jimmy Smith is having a bad game as people said he did. Your analysis is spot on. Good job.

[beanfigger]

As I said when I bumped this thread up, I'm not so worried about his play. He has all the physical tools to be a great CB. I agree he didn't show terrible technique or get blown away too often in the game. I was concerned that he seemed mentally defeated. He had to be spoken to and calmed down by Harbaugh after the TD followed immediately by Webb because he was still upset. Teams pick up on that. Why do you think they immediately threw a fade route to Kevin Cone on the next drive? I'm betting it's because Jimmy was on him and they felt they had his number. Even with good coverage, he tightened up a bit and wasn't able to turn and play the ball. It was a great pass, but I would like to think Smith should get the better of a no-name receiver like that.

As for Huff, he did struggle at times, which led to even more frustration from Smith. I do think Huff will play better in the regular season, and someone has already stated that the responsibilities change during the real season. If it was Cover 3, as someone suggested, then that was simply a receiver and QB being given time to find the soft spot in the zone. Only one safety would have deep responsibility, so if Elam was back there that means Huff was supposed to help underneath. Anyway, I feel Huff has earned the benefit of the doubt by virtue of his play thus far in his career. I hope to see the secondary mesh nicely these next couple weeks.

[izvoodoo]

As I said when I bumped this thread up, I'm not so worried about his play. He has all the physical tools to be a great CB. I agree he didn't show terrible technique or get blown away too often in the game. I was concerned that he seemed mentally defeated. He had to be spoken to and calmed down by Harbaugh after the TD followed immediately by Webb because he was still upset. Teams pick up on that. Why do you think they immediately threw a fade route to Kevin Cone on the next drive? I'm betting it's because Jimmy was on him and they felt they had his number. Even with good coverage, he tightened up a bit and wasn't able to turn and play the ball. It was a great pass, but I would like to think Smith should get the better of a no-name receiver like that.

As for Huff, he did struggle at times, which led to even more frustration from Smith. I do think Huff will play better in the regular season, and someone has already stated that the responsibilities change during the real season. If it was Cover 3, as someone suggested, then that was simply a receiver and QB being given time to find the soft spot in the zone. Only one safety would have deep responsibility, so if Elam was back there that means Huff was supposed to help underneath. Anyway, I feel Huff has earned the benefit of the doubt by virtue of his play thus far in his career. I hope to see the secondary mesh nicely these next couple weeks.

I'm pretty sure they wanted to see how Elam handled single high responsibility.  Smith is a competitor, but if you're going to cheat off you have to anticipate the break in.

 

Also remember preseason isn't about winning, it's about seeing what you can do.

[beanfigger]

I'm pretty sure they wanted to see how Elam handled single high responsibility. Smith is a competitor, but if you're going to cheat off you have to anticipate the break.

I agree. It's all trial by fire right now with our new secondary. I just hope Jimmy realized this and doesn't lose any more confidence.

[izvoodoo]

I agree. It's all trial by fire right now with our new secondary. I just hope Jimmy realized this and doesn't lose any more confidence.

He actually had a lot of good play, but he didn't see a ball.

 

My big thing with jimmy is I want him to play the ball.

[beanfigger]

He actually had a lot of good play, but he didn't see a ball.

My big thing with jimmy is I want him to play the ball.

One way to do that is relax and play instinctually.

[izvoodoo]

One way to do that is relax and play instinctually.

yeah, I think Jimmy will round into form as the season goes.

 

It's like he just started taking his career seriously.

[big hits and ball hawks]

This is a great post, and very good analysis. The first catch he let up I believe we were in cover 3, meaning he had the deep third of the field. Jones drove him backwards and made a quick move inside that should be open against that coverage. That's really not defensible by Jimmy given his responsibility in the zone.

 

The second play I agree, he just got beat by Jones. He wasnt that far off though and stuck with him making the tackle right after the catch. 

 

The TD catch, Huff really was at fault. He bit on the underneath route leaving Jimmy out to dry. He was playing outside leverage expecting help inside that wasnt there.

 

Even the fade wasnt that bad IMO. He had tight coverage, and turned to try to make a play on the ball but it was just perfectly placed. It was just a great throw beating good coverage.

 

 

Great analysis.

 

As for Michael Huff, I'll add that during the pre-season the safeties play differently than they do in the regular season and leave cornerbacks on an Island more sort of as a high risk proving ground (but the risk isn't that high since it's the preseason). So yes, in a regular season scenario those plays wouldn't have happened, but Jimmy Smith was brought in to be a shutdown, island type of cornerback.

 

 

I still feel like we should have drafted Muhammad Wilkerson. And I'm not just saying this now, I've said it before the draft, after, a year later, etc. I don't think Jimmy Smith is having a bad game as people said he did. Your analysis is spot on. Good job.

 

 

Thanks, guys. I rarely go back and really look at specific players like that, but I felt people were being too harsh on Jimmy. I didn't even think about how safeties play different in preseason games. That's just one more thing to consider.

 

Mgridda, I have no issue with you wanting us to have drafted Wilkerson; and I have no problem with people being upset that he hasn't really lived up to his first round status or become that shutdown corner yet. I still think there's a chance he can be that guy or pretty close to it. 

[beasy2487]

This is a great post, and very good analysis. The first catch he let up I believe we were in cover 3, meaning he had the deep third of the field. Jones drove him backwards and made a quick move inside that should be open against that coverage. That's really not defensible by Jimmy given his responsibility in the zone.

 

The second play I agree, he just got beat by Jones. He wasnt that far off though and stuck with him making the tackle right after the catch. 

 

The TD catch, Huff really was at fault. He bit on the underneath route leaving Jimmy out to dry. He was playing outside leverage expecting help inside that wasnt there.

 

Even the fade wasnt that bad IMO. He had tight coverage, and turned to try to make a play on the ball but it was just perfectly placed. It was just a great throw beating good coverage.

 

I agree with your analysis. On the flip side though, to me it's a question of greatness. What you have described are the highly difficult-to-overcome situations. Degree of difficulty is a valid excuse, but an excuse nonetheless. Great corners make those plays. If not all, then at least one. Jimmy made none. It's preseason, he was on an island, and we were testing him--all of that makes sense. But on some level, if Jimmy is the corner we drafted him to be then he has to make those uncommon plays where he beats great offense. I want to see that from him. At some point it's not about the coaching or the scheme, he's just got to out there and make plays. I have faith, but it's got to translate on the field. Preseason is a double-edged sword. They're not game-planning for us either. Julio went into the huddle, told Ryan that Smith couldn't cover him, and schooled him one-on-one. If Jimmy Smith is the corner we think he is he will learn from it and get better...I hope.

[Sami84]

jimmy smith doesnt have it. i knew this from the get go. hes not a football player. hes an athlete. webb is  football player. boldin is a football player.

[gabefergy]

I agree with your analysis. On the flip side though, to me it's a question of greatness. What you have described are the highly difficult-to-overcome situations. Degree of difficulty is a valid excuse, but an excuse nonetheless. Great corners make those plays. If not all, then at least one. Jimmy made none. It's preseason, he was on an island, and we were testing him--all of that makes sense. But on some level, if Jimmy is the corner we drafted him to be then he has to make those uncommon plays where he beats great offense. I want to see that from him. At some point it's not about the coaching or the scheme, he's just got to out there and make plays. I have faith, but it's got to translate on the field. Preseason is a double-edged sword. They're not game-planning for us either. Julio went into the huddle, told Ryan that Smith couldn't cover him, and schooled him one-on-one. If Jimmy Smith is the corner we think he is he will learn from it and get better...I hope.

There is some truth to this, but I tend to disagree that 1 player can just overcome. Each player on the field has a responsibility, especially in the zone coverages we employ frequently. If Jimmy takes it on himself to try to make a play he is letting his teammates down, similar to how he was let down on that TD. If he's in man coverage, then yes, he can just stick with his guy. I'd like to see him make a couple plays there and he did get beat. There is no denying that.

[display name]

Point is: He is testing the patience of all of us as far as development and improvement, because he hasn't done either.

[beasy2487]

Point is: He is testing the patience of all of us as far as development and improvement, because he hasn't done either.

That's a bit drastic. He is far from his potential but he's definitely improved from the days of the shellacking we got the Chargers a couple years ago.

[izvoodoo]

That's a bit drastic. He is far from his potential but he's definitely improved from the days of the shellacking we got the Chargers a couple years ago.

I don't think anyone takes him with that pick though, looking back.

[gabefergy]

I don't think anyone takes him with that pick though, looking back.

Nope. I'm taking Wilkerson. I still havent given up on Jimmy though, I just want to see him stay healthy.

[izvoodoo]

Nope. I'm taking Wilkerson. I still havent given up on Jimmy though, I just want to see him stay healthy.

I want to see him make plays.

[5aiah]

I want to see him make plays.

I just want to see him lock down his man. I don't care if he never ever gets another interception in his career. I just want pass deflections and lock down D(including bullying elite WRs at the line). I was expecting him to be our poor man's Nnamdi. That being said playing corner is much harder as each year goes by and he has dealt with injuries. He needs to stay healthy for a whole season and show he can lock guys down.

[izvoodoo]

I just want to see him lock down his man. I don't care if he never ever gets another interception in his career. I just want pass deflections and lock down D(including bullying elite WRs at the line). I was expecting him to be our poor man's Nnamdi. That being said playing corner is much harder as each year goes by and he has dealt with injuries. He needs to stay healthy for a whole season and show he can lock guys down.

Well pass deflections would be plays.  But he did lock down Julio pretty well in man.  He shredded us in zone.  I think they wanted to see if Elam could handle single high looks.

[5aiah]

Well pass deflections would be plays.  But he did lock down Julio pretty well in man.  He shredded us in zone.  I think they wanted to see if Elam could handle single high looks.

Oh yeah I was mainly agreeing with you.

[izvoodoo]

Oh yeah I was mainly agreeing with you.

Understood.

 

You know these boards... not exactly the clearest of intentions.

[5aiah]

Understood.

 

You know these boards... not exactly the clearest of intentions.

I'm figuring it all out.

[izvoodoo]

I'm figuring it all out.

You'll like it here.

 

Nothing but rational informed football talk >.>

[Radinho84]

I think one thing that comes to my mind when I think about Jimmy is expectations.

 

He was regarded as one of the top college cornerbacks at that time.

 

As his college colleagues were able to make a name for themselves Jimmy mostly wash´t that spectacular in his first years.

 

Number one reason for me is that he wash´t a starter from day one and wash´t on the field that much just because we had much better players on our defense than most other teams. Those other guys took their fair share of mistakes as well but those came up in their first years and were a result of a lot of playing time.

 

Jimmy is still in a situation where he has to prove himself as a NFL player. I think he has all the potential in the world but he really needs to see the field a lot as a starter to be able to be judged fairly.

 

Let´s see what he will do this year as he had great moments during the playoffs. Maybe he can carry that momentum over to the next season...

[Bullrush]

I have full confidence in Jimmy, he has all the tools to become a shutdown corner, he just needs playing time and find his zone. He's started only 5 games in his career, you don't become a great corner with no playing time, no matter how talented you are. Webb struggled BIGTIME his first 2 years, in his 3rd season where he became a starter the lights went on. Now he's one of the better corners in the league.

 

I like to compare Jimmy to Amukamara from the Giants. They have the same skill set, both went in the 1st round in the same year and they both struggled at first, whether it's on the field (being raw, elite athletes that don't understand the game) or off (injured). Amukamara wasn't that good his first 2 seasons, barely played. The Giants allowed him to get a season under his belt as a starter and now he's by far their best corner and from what I'm reading might be Pro Bowl bound this year. Jimmy needs to start a full season, he's not gonna learn a whole lot as a 3rd corner. I know all the corners will play a lot but being on the field on every down, in 2 WR sets like every good starting corner is so much different from getting on the field only when the offense lines up with 3 or more receivers. He needs to start for us full time this year. Corey should be the #3. He had a few good games last season no doubt about it, but he's not the future and he's not a franchise type corner, I want Jimmy to be that guy because he has all the tools to be great and he's still very young. Corey can be a great backup or a stopgap guy at CB once Webb/Smith go down.

[poescrows]

I have mixed thoughts on Jimmy. Just when I start being his fan, he stumbles. And when he stumbles, its usualy in a big way. Hope he gets more consistent.

[Poes Crows]

Jimmy Smith has a ton of potential. That Championship Game Goal Line Stand is evidence of that. However he's not. A Finished "Product". (The Front Office will love the use of that term). Everyone knew that. How well and how soon Ladarius Webb is back to form is an unpredictable variable. Michael Huff demonstrated vs the Falcons that, "Once a Raider, always a Raider". Matt Elam looked like "Mr. Smith" in the television episodes of "Lost in Space". Coach Locker Room Obedience is likely already pining for Cary Williams and this is way before the "storm"arrives that's building over the horizon.

Ok, let's assume the Champs were a little flat, a little rusty and were working with some new personnel. (Now that's the understatement of the year!!!!) They are gonna have a new center. It's Shipley or Gradkowski. The only non-starter was Jah Reid and that line was not good. Why is Pierce getting more yards behind those guys?

Gonna have us some fun!

[GrimCoconut]

Jimmy Smith has a ton of potential. That Championship Game Goal Line Stand is evidence of that. However he's not. A Finished "Product". (The Front Office will love the use of that term). Everyone knew that. How well and how soon Ladarius Webb is back to form is an unpredictable variable. Michael Huff demonstrated vs the Falcons that, "Once a Raider, always a Raider". Matt Elam looked like "Mr. Smith" in the television episodes of "Lost in Space". Coach Locker Room Obedience is likely already pining for Cary Williams and this is way before the "storm"arrives that's building over the horizon.

Ok, let's assume the Champs were a little flat, a little rusty and were working with some new personnel. (Now that's the understatement of the year!!!!) They are gonna have a new center. It's Shipley or Gradkowski. The only non-starter was Jah Reid and that line was not good. Why is Pierce getting more yards behind those guys?

Gonna have us some fun!

Do you like this football team?

[Bullrush]

He's obviously tired of people blaming him or saying he had a poor game, when it was probably somebody else in the secondary that messed up. Elam would be my guess but I didn't watch the tape yet, will do so tonight.

 

 "There's a lot to learn as a whole defense. Nobody on the outside knows what happens on the inside. There were some holes that need to be fixed, and we worked on them this week in practice. I'm way too honest. I don't want to say the wrong thing, but nothing is ever as simple as people think it is."