LT Position Resolved ?

[Free Agent]

I'm eager to see how Wagner, Gaines, or Devey will perform at LT in camp, but I would be very much in favor of a trade for an LT.

[GrimCoconut]

I'm eager to see how Wagner, Gaines, or Devey will perform at LT in camp, but I would be very much in favor of a trade for an LT.

I'm a big fan of Devey. I like him a lot. He has a very good attitude as well. Blue collar guy.

[mgridda]

Haha no. I remember 2 years ago you trying to claim that Reid could improve his feet and play LT. Well that hasnt happened has it? 

 

Reid's footwork is fine, it's his pad level and getting bullrushed by short guys like Dumervil or James Harrison that's the problem. Also, his calf injury

[Sizzlebshu]

It all depends on the compensation. Sure. I doubt we would make the move if our medical staff didn't evaluate it further to assess the risk. All I am saying is it's possible--not probable. Peters carries a massive salary this year. 10M. I mean, we would do it, but I think we would obviously have to restructure that deal if we even did bring him here. 

 

There is a difference between Revis & Peters. Revis is widely considered by far the best at his position. Peters, while considered very good, is not considered the best. Furthermore, what you have failed to address is the fact that Jason Peters has had two consecutive injuries to the same Achilles. That is an entirely different scenario from Revis', who had one injury to his ACL--an injury many athletes are now recovering from very well. Meanwhile, due to these consecutive injuries, Peters' trade value is very low. The Eagles might not be willing to deal him. I never said they were. It's all hyperbole, as you said. Given the fact that at least one source of media made the story about possibly trading Peters before the acquisition of Johnson signifies some possibility. 

 

I'd take Monroe every day of the week over Peters. I thought this pretty clear. I just can't speculate too much on it because there's really not much evidence on the Jags even wanting to make the move. At least with the Eagles, there was something. 

 

I would hate trading for Albert. I really don't like OTs with back issues after the show "Greedy Gaither & the Bad Back Bang" starring the San Diego Chargers. 

I didnt fail to address it, I just addressed it a prior post. And while specifically it is different, the general point of not being able to get close to fair value for a franchise player is the point I was trying to make and is valid there. 

 

The evidence for the Jags wanting to make their move was obvious to me. I'll clarify it to you if you don't see it/notice it. Its in their actions. The jaguars had a myriad of needs everywhere yet they chose to take Luke Jockel, a premier LT, with their 2nd overall pick in the draft. While Jockel may have been the BPA, you don't tend to take a RT with the second overall pick knowing that he is gonna play RT. Even if Jax couldnt trade down, I would argue that Dion Jordan, Ziggy Ansah, Dee Millner, etc... would have helped out the team much more than taking a RT in Jockel at 2nd overall. The fact that they took Jockel knowing he can play LT suggests a cap friendly scenario coming along where they may be try to trade Monroe to strengthen their team overall since they know that Jockel is a LT. The reports that they wont even try to extend Monroe until 2014 seem to suggest they have considered it. 

[ellicottraven]

If there ever was something I felt very strongly about, it is bringing Big Mac back... it is critical to Flacco's continued success. First you clip his wings by trading Boldin away, then you try to cut his feet off by not bringing McKinnie back? Totally foolish and unacceptable!

[SecretAgentMan]

If anyone mentions Gaithersburg as an option you will get found

[GrimCoconut]

I didnt fail to address it, I just addressed it a prior post. And while specifically it is different, the general point of not being able to get close to fair value for a franchise player is the point I was trying to make and is valid there.

The evidence for the Jags wanting to make their move was obvious to me. I'll clarify it to you if you don't see it/notice it. Its in their actions. The jaguars had a myriad of needs everywhere yet they chose to take Luke Jockel, a premier LT, with their 2nd overall pick in the draft. While Jockel may have been the BPA, you don't tend to take a RT with the second overall pick knowing that he is gonna play RT. Even if Jax couldnt trade down, I would argue that Dion Jordan, Ziggy Ansah, Dee Millner, etc... would have helped out the team much more than taking a RT in Jockel at 2nd overall. The fact that they took Jockel knowing he can play LT suggests a cap friendly scenario coming along where they may be try to trade Monroe to strengthen their team overall since they know that Jockel is a LT. The reports that they wont even try to extend Monroe until 2014 seem to suggest they have considered it.

You won't get fair value for a franchise player if you consider him one if they are coming off of two consecutive injuries that are the same in nature. Revis' situation is different because ACL tears have shown more promise recently. Achilles injuries have not yet shown the same promise as ACLs despite Suggs.

[gabefergy]

Reid's footwork is fine, it's his pad level and getting bullrushed by short guys like Dumervil or James Harrison that's the problem. Also, his calf injury

The injuries have been a big issue for him, but he doesnt have LT feet. Never has and he never will. He could potentially be a very good RT, but the quickness and agility to play on the left side isnt there.

[The Raven]

Check my guy out

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfTIrb3AQjM

 

 

Really like him. Is there any more tape of him on youtube? He's an inconsistent run blocker from what I can tell from that video. He looks like he has slow, plodding feet, but he does have good footwork. 

 

How do you think he is as a run blocker and how is he against speed rushers?

[ravensdan]

Why not? If the compensation is little, what's the risk? Let's say we traded them Ed Dickson & a late round draft pick in 2014--a conditional one. Let's say a conditional 6th round pick that could become a 5th round pick. There's absolutely zero risk in that.

Why would they take that?

[GrimCoconut]

Why would they take that?

I just made something up. I really have no idea what kind of value they have for Peters. It was simply an example. I included Ed Dickson because he was an Oregon Duck & Kelly might like to have a TE with whom he is familiar.

[ravensdan]

I just made something up. I really have no idea what kind of value they have for Peters. It was simply an example. I included Ed Dickson because he was an Oregon Duck & Kelly might like to have a TE with whom he is familiar.

I thought we were talking about Monroe lol. I don't really want peters to be honest. Two straight years trying to come back from a major injury. Older than Monroe. I think we want younger more athletic linemen. I believe we will go a lot more hurry up and no huddle this year. Closer to Peyton manning offense

[GrimCoconut]

I thought we were talking about Monroe lol. I don't really want peters to be honest. Two straight years trying to come back from a major injury. Older than Monroe. I think we want younger more athletic linemen. I believe we will go a lot more hurry up and no huddle this year. Closer to Peyton manning offense

I would love Monroe, but I feel like that's a dream trade, lol. 

[The Raven]

If you guys want more insight into Wagner, here is more tape.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk7aLzbwBb8

[RavensAllTheWay]

I have no real opinion on what we should do, but I know what I don't want us to do.  I'm not a fan of moving KO to LT.  As someone said, he had his share of struggles at RT against speed rushers.  I get that he says he feels comfortable having played LT in college, but in the NFL, he seems much more suited to play guard.  He's a mauler more than anything.  I don't think he has quick enough feet to play LT in the NFL.

 

I hope we don't give him the Oher treatment and switch him back and forth, potentially slowing his development.  He looks like a star in the making at LG.

[GrimCoconut]

If you guys want more insight into Wagner, here is more tape.

 

I like Wagner a lot. I think he has LT potential. The issue is I just wonder if his feet are quick enough. That's a big question for me. I have no doubt he could play the position other than that. 

[SecretAgentMan]

Really like him. Is there any more tape of him on youtube? He's an inconsistent run blocker from what I can tell from that video. He looks like he has slow, plodding feet, but he does have good footwork. 

 

How do you think he is as a run blocker and how is he against speed rushers?

He's an ok run blocker..... I don't know about pass protection.... Honestly haven't watched enough tape of him.

Regardless I think Castillo is going to do wonders for the guy.

[SecretAgentMan]

*

I did not say I thought he was the future at LT. But I do think Wagner was a good pick! 

[The Raven]

I like Wagner a lot. I think he has LT potential. The issue is I just wonder if his feet are quick enough. That's a big question for me. I have no doubt he could play the position other than that. 

 

His feet aren't quick, but he takes smart steps if you know what I mean. He might be slow and methodical with his footwork, but his feet consistently put him in a good position. He's very good at staying in the way of the rusher.

He's an ok run blocker..... I don't know about pass protection.... Honestly haven't watched enough tape of him.

Regardless I think Castillo is going to do wonders for the guy.

I just watched him against Stanford, and I watched him in Montee Ball vs Ohio State. He's a solid run blocker.

 

I think he could be our LT of the future ,as bold as that is. He can do a lot of what we ask our olinemen to do.

[SecretAgentMan]

His feet aren't quick, but he takes smart steps if you know what I mean. He might be slow and methodical with his footwork, but his feet consistently put him in a good position. He's very good at staying in the way of the rusher.

I just watched him against Stanford, and I watched him in Montee Ball vs Ohio State. He's a solid run blocker.

Ok= Solid in my book...

 

I just haven't seen enough of his tape to determine how good he is in pass P.

[The Raven]

Ok= Solid in my book...

 

I just haven't seen enough of his tape to determine how good he is in pass P.

 

 

Same. I want to see him against a speed rusher. He can take on bull rushers easily. I need to see him against a speed rusher.

[GrimCoconut]

His feet aren't quick, but he takes smart steps if you know what I mean. He might be slow and methodical with his footwork, but his feet consistently put him in a good position. He's very good at staying in the way of the rusher.

I just watched him against Stanford, and I watched him in Montee Ball vs Ohio State. He's a solid run blocker.

 

I think he could be our LT of the future ,as bold as that is. He can do a lot of what we ask our olinemen to do.

Yeah, he definitely has the potential to play LT & I wouldn't be surprised if he did well there. He has what you want physically for the job. His feet are just slow, as you said. He's a smart kid, though, so perhaps he can do it. 

 

If not, check out this guy. I like him. His arms aren't as long as Wagner's, but I like him as well. He's Jordan Devey, OL, Memphis. He's #64.

[SecretAgentMan]

Same. I want to see him against a speed rusher. He can take on bull rushers easily. I need to see him against a speed rusher.

 

We've got plenty of those in our division. Kruger, Mingo, Woodley, Johnson, Dunlap, (would Jarvis be classified as a speed rusher? Never liked him much).

Not to mention he gets to go against Doom, and Sizzle in training camp.

 

I cannot wait for the season to start.

 

SOMEONE PLZ MAKE THE COUNTDOWN THREAD! 

[The Raven]

Yeah, he definitely has the potential to play LT & I wouldn't be surprised if he did well there. He has what you want physically for the job. His feet are just slow, as you said. He's a smart kid, though, so perhaps he can do it. 

 

If not, check out this guy. I like him. His arms aren't as long as Wagner's, but I like him as well. He's Jordan Devey, OL, Memphis. He's #64.

 

 

Checking him now

[Ravenseconbeast]

Here's a few things i've learned about Wagner:

He played as a starter since 2009(consistency), was formerly a TE(had the highest vertical jump which is a bit useless, but has a athlethic background), and his measureables are 6'6 - 310 pounds with 34' arm.

He has power and great technique and has plenty of experience. His slow on his feet so he is a run oriented than a pass oriented OT. He could possibly get quicker on his feet, but he hasnt shown that he can in 4 years being in badgers. He was projected to be minimum late 2nd rounder last year, but fell off the board this year with injuries on his senior year.

If Rick Wagner can get fully healthy( he was injured early in 2012 with minor injury) and get quicker on his feet, he can be a tremendous value to be groomed as a future LT.

[The Raven]

Here's a few things i've learned about Wagner:

He played as a starter since 2009(consistency), was formerly a TE(had the highest vertical jump which is a bit useless, but has a athlethic background), and his measureables are 6'6 - 310 pounds with 34' arm.

He has power and great technique and has plenty of experience. His slow on his feet so he is a run oriented than a pass oriented OT. He could possibly get quicker on his feet, but he hasnt shown that he can in 4 years being in badgers. He was projected to be minimum late 2nd rounder last year, but fell off the board this year with injuries on his senior year.

If Rick Wagner can get fully healthy( he was injured early in 2012 with minor injury) and get quicker on his feet, he can be a tremendous value to be groomed as a future LT.

 

 

Vertical leap isn't actually useless for linemen. It is used to measure explosion and power.

[Bltravens]

I like Wagner a lot. I think he has LT potential. The issue is I just wonder if his feet are quick enough. That's a big question for me. I have no doubt he could play the position other than that. 

Didn't the staff say Wagner was going to be an interior lineman?

[The Raven]

Didn't the staff say Wagner was going to be an interior lineman?

 

 

Hope not. Think they said that about the other OL guy we drafted.

[Bltravens]

Hope not. Think they said that about the other OL guy we drafted.

 

Thought I read the kid from Pueblo was moving to C and Wagner was moving to OG.  Maybe not though.

[GrimCoconut]

Checking him now

You mentioned something about Wagner against the speed rush. Well, I've been trying. 

http://www.battleredblog.com/2013/2/13/3985612/checking-out-all-the-extra-senior-bowl-tape-part-the-first

http://www.musiccitymiracles.com/2013/1/23/3907748/senior-bowl-2013-wednesday-practice-report

The second link is more pertinent. The first just depressed the Hell out of me. Sigh...I REALLY wanted Datone Jones. He's a monster, man. He's going to be something really special at the next level. I hate the Packers. 

 

Wisconsin OT Ricky Wagner went 1 and 1 vs the star DE Datone Jones and Texas DE Alex Okafor. Wagner lost to Okafor with the speed rush but controlled him with the bull rush.

Datone Jones was abusing everyone not named Eric Fisher

Alex Okafor got a rare win off Fisher with the bull rush when Fisher didn't anchor and got high. Fisher's only weakness from what I can tell, is that he plays too tall on occasion and allows defenders up in his grill to take advantage of his height.

Didn't the staff say Wagner was going to be an interior lineman?

From what I remember, yeah. The idea of him playing LT was brought up. That's why we're discussing it.