PS4/Xbox One Discussion

[H8R]

yup, to be honest, being close to the ps4 specs would be a mid range pc

Blahhh. PC gaming is BLAHHHHHH. : P

[BohBalmerOsbohs]

Its not for everyone.

[Dudeman]

Color me skeptical here with the Ps4, and my reasons aren't really because of cost, hardware, social gaming, or any of the reasons listed above.

My biggest qualms stem from a lack of conviction in their ability to make a dynamic network/interface. If you watch the announcement show (2 hours of yaaawn) you come away feeling like you just watched a political advertisement. This isn't my first time at the rodeo, and a lot of what is being "promised" sounds unrealistic. Being able to stream the entire library of ps1,2, and 3 games is simply improbable. Why not bring that capability to the ps3? One of the things I hate about my ps3 is being unable to play (or even purchase on the PSstore) ps2 games. Furthermore, there seems to be no empathy to the consumer for having to purchase the same game multiple times across multiple platforms. I'd imagine the response to such a complaint would be to simply play the game on the older system. But I take issue with that, as I was raised being taught that the customer is always right. At my job, the customer is always right...

I'd have a little more "faith" in the ps4 network if the ps3 network wasn't so bad. The PS Store is a joke,the design is ugly, the layout is clunky, and its slow loading. It takes several screens to purchase a game, download the game and then install the game. On xbox live you download and install simultaneously. Some would point to the fact that you "get what you paid for" and that Ps network is free. But its not really free, the PS3 still costs more than the Xbox360, and it just sounds like a cop-out answer. Why make excuses for a terrible network?

Which leads me to have some prejudice on how the PS4 network is going to look, function, and fare. It needs to be totally over-hauled and yet retain your prior purchases. Until I see dramatic improvements across the board in this area I will not be purchasing a PS4. I am not saying this as a "fan" of one system or another either. Fact is I own 3 xbox360's, 2 ps3's, and my computer trumps them all put together. No, I recommend you all look up http://store.steampowered.com/, because I think they are the future of gaming. There is talk of a steam box, which would blow anything that microsoft or sony is cooking up straight out of the water. Actually you can bank on it that the sole reason that the ps4 was announced is because steam is going to be entering the fray and just watch out for when they do!

Edited February 27, 2013 by Dudeman

[Corvus]

Well here's a few things to think about Dudeman. For starters, the actual phrase the Sony bigwigs used in regards to being able to stream all Playstation games was "long-term goal." That tells me that they aren't going to have everything available day one, likely select titles that they will continually add to. The technology for this has been around since 2003, as evidenced by that being the year Valve launched Steam. So while EVERY playstation title throughout its history is unlikely to be streamable, they certainly have the software to stream PS1, PS2, and PS3 games. I would imagine the reason the software to do this was not on the PS3 was moreso because of financial and business decisions, not the simple inability to implement it. Also, you can't stream PS2 games on PS3, but they have been adding titles for purchase and download to the store (I bought GTA San Andreas just 3 weeks ago or so) so you can buy select titles to play on PS3. I do share in your lamenting on no backwards compatability on new PS3s and you'll notice in an earlier comment I said the lack of it for the PS4 is a large factor in why I likely won't pick one up until next year sometime. If I could use my PS3 library on my new console and access new features, I would be more inclined to get it ASAP and I am not the only consumer who thinks this way. As far as the actual PS store goes, I actually quite liked the old version and never had any problems with finding what I needed there. I definitely don't care for the new version, which I have had a few problems with. It seems though that Sony heard you as one of the tidbits I gleaned from the announcement was that downloading and installing will be much more streamlined than the PS3.

As far as Steam and Valve are concerned, I certainly believe their future is constantly brighter and an actual hardware console would give them a huge boost. That said, they have been doing this for almost a decade, and while they are picking "steam" (pardon the pun), if they were going to overtake Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo, I would think they would have already done so (I think decreased console sales for all 3 are due more to the prevalance of the mobile and tablet market which was almost nonexistent just 6 or 7 years ago and the fact that this current generation of consoles has stagnated longer than previous ones). Also consider that not everyone here in the U.S. even has a great interet connection, much less the world so there will always be a market for hard-copy disk based games that run on consoles for this simple fact, much less the rest of the world

Edited February 27, 2013 by Corvus

[H8R]

Its not for everyone.

Its not for most, IMO.

[Corvus]

Its not for most, IMO.

I will not knock a single person for preferring PC gaming (except the ones who think they are holier than thou for sinking $2000+ into their "rig") but your opinion is a common one that I share due to the ease of console use. With a new PC game, I need to do research before purchase as to whether my PC can even run said game. The three major consoles are plug and play if you will and for that reason alone, there will always be a market for them. Not all gamers are super tech savvy (while I more than comprehend most basic computer functions and how they work, I myself am not that savvy either) and it is simply easier to enjoy a game this way then to construct a dedicated gaming PC. And while I know costs for top of the line video cards, etc etc are getting more reasonable for PC gamers to construct their own gaming PC, the current gen of consoles are still much more affordable to many.

[Dudeman]

Well here's a few things to think about Dudeman. For starters, the actual phrase the Sony bigwigs used in regards to being able to stream all Playstation games was "long-term goal." That tells me that they aren't going to have everything available day one, likely select titles that they will continually add to. The technology for this has been around since 2003, as evidenced by that being the year Valve launched Steam. So while EVERY playstation title throughout its history is unlikely to be streamable, they certainly have the software to stream PS1, PS2, and PS3 games. I would imagine the reason the software to do this was not on the PS3 was moreso because of financial and business decisions, not the simple inability to implement it. Also, you can't stream PS2 games on PS3, but they have been adding titles for purchase and download to the store (I bought GTA San Andreas just 3 weeks ago or so) so you can buy select titles to play on PS3. I do share in your lamenting on no backwards compatability on new PS3s and you'll notice in an earlier comment I said the lack of it for the PS4 is a large factor in why I likely won't pick one up until next year sometime. If I could use my PS3 library on my new console and access new features, I would be more inclined to get it ASAP and I am not the only consumer who thinks this way. As far as the actual PS store goes, I actually quite liked the old version and never had any problems with finding what I needed there. I definitely don't care for the new version, which I have had a few problems with. It seems though that Sony heard you as one of the tidbits I gleaned from the announcement was that downloading and installing will be much more streamlined than the PS3.

As far as Steam and Valve are concerned, I certainly believe their future is constantly brighter and an actual hardware console would give them a huge boost. That said, they have been doing this for almost a decade, and while they are picking "steam" (pardon the pun), if they were going to overtake Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo, I would think they would have already done so (I think decreased console sales for all 3 are due more to the prevalance of the mobile and tablet market which was almost nonexistent just 6 or 7 years ago and the fact that this current generation of consoles has stagnated longer than previous ones). Also consider that not everyone here in the U.S. even has a great interet connection, much less the world so there will always be a market for hard-copy disk based games that run on consoles for this simple fact, much less the rest of the world

Hard copy discs are going the way of the dinosaur faster than any other outdated technology has turned over in the past. With the abilitiy to quite easily add terrabytes to a console HD then why in the world would I ever purchase a disc again? I've had my fill of losing discs whether they were destroyed, lost, borrowed, or straight up stolen. Furthermore, if you think about the main issue with a console it has always been disc reading errors since the days you had to slap and blow into NES cartridges. The simple wear and tear on a consoles disc drive is the number one factor in it's over-all durability. Even recently I've replaced 360's and Ps3 because they stopped reading discs.

[Corvus]

Hard copy discs are going the way of the dinosaur faster than any other outdated technology has turned over in the past. With the abilitiy to quite easily add terrabytes to a console HD then why in the world would I ever purchase a disc again? I've had my fill of losing discs whether they were destroyed, lost, borrowed, or straight up stolen. Furthermore, if you think about the main issue with a console it has always been disc reading errors since the days you had to slap and blow into NES cartridges. The simple wear and tear on a consoles disc drive is the number one factor in it's over-all durability. Even recently I've replaced 360's and Ps3 because they stopped reading discs.

I do agree that they will eventually be phased out, but it won't happen this generation with the PS4 and XBox720. While I would have problems with game discs on prior consoles, I attribute that largely to my youth at that time and not taking care of things I owned. The four games I purchased when I first bought a PS3 in spring '08 (Assassin's Creed, GTA IV, Uncharted: Drake's Fortune, and MotorStorm) still work perfectly fine on my console and have nary a mark on them. Not trying to say you don't take care of your equipment there Lebowski or anything of the nature, just pointing out that different people will have different experiences, sorry that you've had people borrowing, stealing, and destroying your games. No such problems here my man. I am on my second PS3 but that is only because at the time, it was drunkenly pissed upon at a kegger I hosted, no lie, haha.

Edited February 28, 2013 by Corvus

[darklight1216]

Hard copy discs are going the way of the dinosaur faster than any other outdated technology has turned over in the past. With the abilitiy to quite easily add terrabytes to a console HD then why in the world would I ever purchase a disc again? I've had my fill of losing discs whether they were destroyed, lost, borrowed, or straight up stolen. Furthermore, if you think about the main issue with a console it has always been disc reading errors since the days you had to slap and blow into NES cartridges. The simple wear and tear on a consoles disc drive is the number one factor in it's over-all durability. Even recently I've replaced 360's and Ps3 because they stopped reading discs.

Sorry about your issues, but I personally have never had any major hardware problems on any game console or handheld.* So my question would be, why fix what isn't broken?

*I have had minor problems, such as the occasional glitch that required the restart of my machine, but they were very few and far between. Actually I could say "are" because I can still play my older games as reliably as my newer ones.

Besides that, after reading about 1984 on Kindle, I've always had this nagging suspicion that I probably shouldn't spend big bucks on media that is purely digital. >.>

[Raven07]

[Dudeman]

I do agree that they will eventually be phased out, but it won't happen this generation with the PS4 and XBox720. While I would have problems with game discs on prior consoles, I attribute that largely to my youth at that time and not taking care of things I owned. The four games I purchased when I first bought a PS3 in spring '08 (Assassin's Creed, GTA IV, Uncharted: Drake's Fortune, and MotorStorm) still work perfectly fine on my console and have nary a mark on them. Not trying to say you don't take care of your equipment there Lebowski or anything of the nature, just pointing out that different people will have different experiences, sorry that you've had people borrowing, stealing, and destroying your games. No such problems here my man. I am on my second PS3 but that is only because at the time, it was drunkenly pissed upon at a kegger I hosted, no lie, haha.

LOL, yeah most of the issues I have with discs are not because I went out of my way to not take care of them. I actually I am quite proud of the collection I have that is in good condition. But yeah long story short I have been gaming a long time, and lately its my kids that destroy my games or are the reason my consoles are heavily used.

Now that I think about it I NEVER had an issue with a console dying until my 360 got red ringed maybe 5 years ago. THAT happens to be a disc reading issue, and it seems that I have run into a bit of bad luck related to that issue since. I have two Ps3's as well. The one had to be purchased shortly before christmas because the other stopped reading games or blue-rays and its one of the older models. Whats strange is my ps2 is an original model and while it is slow to load it still works just fine and has been rode hard and put away wet so to speak.

In summary I don't think new (and newish) consoles are built to last. I also don't think that constantly reading discs are good for the machines durability in general. On my PC I have stopped purchasing discs and between Blizzard and Steam I am pretty confident with how long those digitial licenses are going to last. It also takes up so much less space.

Lastly, I don't want to be a killjoy here on these new consoles. I am excited about the future of gaming and the direction things are going. I am just trying my best to temper those expectations and not jump right into something that will quickly be obsolete or take a long time to patch and make right.

[H8R]

I have NEVER had ANY issues with a disc. They're VERY durable. In fact, I did 1500 installs with ONE SCCM boot disc.

[Corvus]

LOL, yeah most of the issues I have with discs are not because I went out of my way to not take care of them. I actually I am quite proud of the collection I have that is in good condition. But yeah long story short I have been gaming a long time, and lately its my kids that destroy my games or are the reason my consoles are heavily used.

Now that I think about it I NEVER had an issue with a console dying until my 360 got red ringed maybe 5 years ago. THAT happens to be a disc reading issue, and it seems that I have run into a bit of bad luck related to that issue since. I have two Ps3's as well. The one had to be purchased shortly before christmas because the other stopped reading games or blue-rays and its one of the older models. Whats strange is my ps2 is an original model and while it is slow to load it still works just fine and has been rode hard and put away wet so to speak.

In summary I don't think new (and newish) consoles are built to last. I also don't think that constantly reading discs are good for the machines durability in general. On my PC I have stopped purchasing discs and between Blizzard and Steam I am pretty confident with how long those digitial licenses are going to last. It also takes up so much less space.

Lastly, I don't want to be a killjoy here on these new consoles. I am excited about the future of gaming and the direction things are going. I am just trying my best to temper those expectations and not jump right into something that will quickly be obsolete or take a long time to patch and make right.

Yup, children will definitely attribute to disc wear and tear, don't need to tell you that. I can't really disagree with everything you've said in this entire thread, I guess I just felt the need to put up some defense for the PS4 since you were being such a "killjoy" (haha, just kidding man). I think that disc do cause major wear and tear on their reading devices after a while, I guess I'm just sentimental about having hard copies of games, dating back to blowing on a Defender 2 cartridge for NES (as you alluded to earlier). I'll reserve any further judgement on the PS4 until more details are announced though...

[Marc2k6]

^{I have already started moving away from buying games from a store and downloading instead. All of the games I play right now except for Black Ops2 are downloaded games. I like that I can just quit a game and quickly move to another.}

[BohBalmerOsbohs]

Its not for most, IMO.

fair enough

[TheRavenouseD2008]

http://www.gamespot.com/news/sony-on-ps4-used-games-we-are-going-to-do-the-right-thing-6404470

 

 

 

I might move to ps4 after my 360 goes out

[T3hRaven]

Well Microsoft revealed the name of the new system, and it's worse than I thought it would be.  The presser is still going on, and as expected Microsoft is worried about the fluff and entertainment bits.  Their pressers are so cheesy too.

 

I wish these companies would focus on the games.  Surely we'll be seeing Halo 5 at some point in the near future.

[T3hRaven]

They announced a partnership between Microsoft and the NFL, and then went on to talk about some fantasy football monitoring nonsense.  I'm more interested in that partnership giving access to all the games on Sunday, since I'm not in the Ravens broadcast area.

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

That entire conference was laughable.

Forced Kinect, pointless TV features, and just an overall horribad reveal. To top it all off:

"Microsoft has confirmed that all Xbox One games will require mandatory installation onto the system's hard drive and, to install the same disc onto another user's drive, a fee must be paid."

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/407912/microsoft-confirms-pre-owned-fee-for-xbox-one/

Thank you for making my decision between the PS4 and the Xbox One much more simpler, Microsoft. The fact they placed so much emphasis on those TV features instead of the actual games, it shows where their intentions are. They'll probably go into depth on games at E3 but they literally should of just combined what they showed today with their E3 conference because this reveal was just bad. There were a couple aspects I didn't care for about Sony's PS4 conference either, but at least they placed an emphasis on games.

[berad]

Who gives a crap about TV or music? I have other devices for those. I wanted a great gaming console with backwards compatibility, less garbage online "content"/fees, and the focus to be placed on games rather than the fluff.

[Cville-Raven]

Looks like I'm building a gaming PC. They are going to implement a fee for used games. Btw is it just me or does COD: Ghost look incredibly inferior to Battlefield 4. I was actually laughing when they said that game was going to be their next gen title. 

[Free Agent]

A preowned fee is the dumbest thing Microsoft could've done. I've never bought a new video game in my life. 

[Free Agent]

So, so stupid. Microsoft, you quite likely now have "One" less customer.

 

 

http://www.gamespot.com/news/xbox-one-has-preowned-fee-6408671

 

Microsoft today confirmed with Wired that all Xbox One game discs must be installed to the HDD to play and that while installs to other hard drives are allowed, users will need to pay an unspecified fee to do so.

[Cville-Raven]

So, so stupid. Microsoft, you quite likely now have "One" less customer.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/xbox-one-has-preowned-fee-6408671

It's funny that they are going to make you install every game with a 500gb HD. Should have given it a 1TB HD, but they probably didn't do that just so they can get you to spend money later on a upgrade.

[sliceanddic3]

That entire conference was laughable.

Forced Kinect, pointless TV features, and just an overall horribad reveal. To top it all off:

"Microsoft has confirmed that all Xbox One games will require mandatory installation onto the system's hard drive and, to install the same disc onto another user's drive, a fee must be paid."

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/407912/microsoft-confirms-pre-owned-fee-for-xbox-one/

Thank you for making my decision between the PS4 and the Xbox One much more simpler, Microsoft. The fact they placed so much emphasis on those TV features instead of the actual games, it shows where their intentions are. They'll probably go into depth on games at E3 but they literally should of just combined what they showed today with their E3 conference because this reveal was just bad. There were a couple aspects I didn't care for about Sony's PS4 conference either, but at least they placed an emphasis on games.

Wow, that is awful. I wont be getting one, video game companies are so money hungry nowadays. Spend less time on making good games and more on widening their wallet. Nintendo is the only decent company in the industry left.

[darklight1216]

I can understand the enmity towards used games. I mean everyone wants more money, but come on that is just unrealistic. They charge an arm and a leg for a new game and then they want more?

 

I have never owned an Xbox and that is not going to change any time soon.

Wow, that is awful. I wont be getting one, video game companies are so money hungry nowadays. Spend less time on making good games and more on widening their wallet. Nintendo is the only decent company in the industry left.

I'm not as much of a gamer as I used to be, but isn't Nintendo still focusing on 8 year olds, 80 year olds, and pretty much no one else (except Zelda and a couple of other outliers)?

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

I can understand the enmity towards used games. I mean everyone wants more money, but come on that is just unrealistic. They charge an arm and a leg for a new game and then they want more?

 

I have never owned an Xbox and that is not going to change any time soon.

I'm not as much of a gamer as I used to be, but isn't Nintendo still focusing on 8 year olds, 80 year olds, and pretty much no one else (except Zelda and a couple of other outliers)?

Nintendo's 1st party titles still remain as some of the best in the industry. The Wii U isn't where it needs to be yet but the 3DS is a prime example of a system offering many quality games with tons more coming. It's not the 90s where you couldn't find mature titles on a Nintendo platform anymore.

Edited May 22, 2013 by EnVy_CaLiBeR

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

Also, the Xbox One will not function without the Kinect attached.

Forcing a pointless gimmick down consumers throats? Microsoft failed big time.

[T3hRaven]

A preowned fee is the dumbest thing Microsoft could've done. I've never bought a new video game in my life. 

 

As someone who has never bought a used video game, I couldn't care less about that.

[Guest nflfan123]

Horrible name lol

Can't wait for PS4!