32 replies to this topic

[GrimCoconut]

I don't post topics often about prospects. I usually stick to generalized threads, but I can't believe nobody on this forum is talking about this kid. I decided recently I wanted to look at Joeckel because he's the top-rated consensus best LT out there. Well, this kid really gave Joeckel fits when they played against each other. I can't believe how impressed I was with him. I came away with this thinking "We got to get this kid"

He can be a DE or an OLB, hand in the dirt or standing up. He's flexible from what I saw, strong, great use of hands. I saw him really play exceptionally well against Joeckel but when I went to look for him in other games I realized that he doesn't play every snap. Seems like a rotation guy. That's fine for us! He needs some work. He looks like he can be beat with great technique. I also read he has some injury history. But man! I was very impressed with this kid!

[Sizzlebshu]

Physicals? Projected Round? He seems like an interesting prospect and definitely worth a later selection. Could be out next Mcphee

Edit: looked the guy up. He will probably raise his stock to a 3rd round grade after some exposure at the combine, but this guy looks like he could be our next Kruger/Mcphee/situational pass rusher.

[BloodRaven]

His burst is hot and cold but I think it's more of a lack of hustle than his motor. He's definitely not a power player but he's physical at the POA and has some potential, also I don't know if he's a true pass rusher on the next level but that inside punch move he does on both videos is nice.

5th.

Edited by BloodRaven, 20 February 2013 - 01:23 AM.

[GrimCoconut]

Physicals? Projected Round? He seems like an interesting prospect and definitely worth a later selection. Could be out next Mcphee

Edit: looked the guy up. He will probably raise his stock to a 3rd round grade after some exposure at the combine, but this guy looks like he could be our next Kruger/Mcphee/situational pass rusher.

I think he's worth a 3rd. He has great potential and just challenged the best LT prospect in the draft. I agree. His stock could already be up there. I hope he can be another McPhee/Kruger. I'd love this kid in the 4th if we can get him there.

[gabefergy]

I probably would not touch him before the 4th round based off that one cut-up. He looks like a below average athlete, but he does display solid technique/hand usage. He got leverage on Joeckel a couple times and beat him to the inside. I'm not overly impressed by his get off though. I would like to see more of him, especially how he can play in space.

Edited by gabefergy, 20 February 2013 - 01:21 AM.

[Sizzlebshu]

I think he's worth a 3rd. He has great potential and just challenged the best LT prospect in the draft. I agree. His stock could already be up there. I hope he can be another McPhee/Kruger. I'd love this kid in the 4th if we can get him there.

Maybe our third, but I dont see enough upside with him where he is worth more than a 4th. He seems like a purely situational guy. If he had starter upside maybe you could justify a third, but I dont see that from his physicals. He would need at least 10 lbs to play olb effectively on an nfl level.

[GrimCoconut]

I probably would not touch him before the 4th round based off that one cut-up. He looks like a below average athlete, but he does display solid technique/hand usage. He got leverage on Joeckel a couple times and beat him to the inside. I'm not overly impressed by his get off though. I would like to see more of him, especially how he can play in space.

Our 4th round pick or the 4th? I said 3rd because it's essentially a 4th due to how low it is. He needs work. I agree. But he's an exciting prospect I have not seen here before. I will watch more on him later. Only watched four games tonight.

[CalvinSmoke]

the guy looks good to me

[Dubs]

I think athletically he looks pretty talented. He has a nice way of setting up linemen with his speed on the edging making them take deeper kick steps so he has inside rush lanes. I agree technique wise, mainly hand usage, there is not much to talk about but he looks like a an interesting Hybrid player to say the least - good find

[Purple_ICE 81]

I don't post topics often about prospects. I usually stick to generalized threads, but I can't believe nobody on this forum is talking about this kid. I decided recently I wanted to look at Joeckel because he's the top-rated consensus best LT out there. Well, this kid really gave Joeckel fits when they played against each other. I can't believe how impressed I was with him. I came away with this thinking "We got to get this kid"

He can be a DE or an OLB, hand in the dirt or standing up. He's flexible from what I saw, strong, great use of hands. I saw him really play exceptionally well against Joeckel but when I went to look for him in other games I realized that he doesn't play every snap. Seems like a rotation guy. That's fine for us! He needs some work. He looks like he can be beat with great technique. I also read he has some injury history. But man! I was very impressed with this kid!

He is a project rush linebacker. He is very athletic and explosive but is still very raw. Wouldnt mind wasting a 4th rounder on him he is projected 4th-6th, but I feel like we have to continue on with the Upshaw project and get him going this year.

[gabefergy]

Our 4th round pick or the 4th? I said 3rd because it's essentially a 4th due to how low it is. He needs work. I agree. But he's an exciting prospect I have not seen here before. I will watch more on him later. Only watched four games tonight.

Too small of a sample size for me. I didnt see anyrhing that jumped out at me though. I might think about him in the 5th, but I think there are better mid to late round pass rush prospects.

[GrimCoconut]

Too small of a sample size for me. I didnt see anyrhing that jumped out at me though. I might think about him in the 5th, but I think there are better mid to late round pass rush prospects.

Watch some more games on him. As I said, he seems to be a rotational player, but he has a big upside. I would absolutely take him in the 6th. I think he has 3rd round talent but I agree he needs some work but his upside is big and if we use him to just rush the passer that would be a great pick IMO. He's a good player with a lot of upside.

[Sizzlebshu]

Watch some more games on him. As I said, he seems to be a rotational player, but he has a big upside. I would absolutely take him in the 6th. I think he has 3rd round talent but I agree he needs some work but his upside is big and if we use him to just rush the passer that would be a great pick IMO. He's a good player with a lot of upside.

This guy is a pretty good pass rusher. He can't be Suggs obv but he may be an effective starter down the line if he develops his overall game and puts on some weight. Its project, but I like what I see there. He isn't insanely raw, but he is raw enough which is good for us because he may fall to our 4th an let us snatch up a guy we can develop into a starting caliber olb.

Edited by Sizzlebshu, 20 February 2013 - 12:23 PM.

[GrimCoconut]

This guy is a pretty good pass rusher. He can't be Suggs obv but he may be an effective starter down the line if he develops his overall game and puts on some weight. Its project, but I like what I see there. He isn't insanely raw, but he is raw enough which is good for us because he may fall to our 4th an let us snatch up a guy we can develop into a starting caliber olb.

My thinking as well. He has that big upside and is widely undiscussed so it seems like a Ravens pick to me. I won't be surprised or upset if we get him. He can replace Krugs eventually IMO while he sits behind Upshaw and the rest. It at the very least builds us a stable of pass rushers.

[gabefergy]

Watched a couple more games of McCray and came away equally unimpressed. He does not possess the speed to win the edge and is very slow off the snap. Lacks bend. Average athlete with average measurables. Looks lost when asked to play in space (which isnt often). I saw him on the ground a lot, including a couple of pancakes. He is at his best when stunting inside as a pass-rusher. He holds up well against the run for the most part and could have a future in the NFL, but not as a pass-rusher. Just my opinion, but I dont see the explosiveness required to win at the next level.

[GrimCoconut]

Watched a couple more games of McCray and came away equally unimpressed. He does not possess the speed to win the edge and is very slow off the snap. Lacks bend. Average athlete with average measurables. Looks lost when asked to play in space (which isnt often). I saw him on the ground a lot, including a couple of pancakes. He is at his best when stunting inside as a pass-rusher. He holds up well against the run for the most part and could have a future in the NFL, but not as a pass-rusher. Just my opinion, but I dont see the explosiveness required to win at the next level.

I don't think he's slow off the snap. I'd say he's more inconsistent than anything. What games did you watch? Just curious. I see what you mean with the slow off the snap, but I've seen him bolt off the snap as well. As for him being an average athlete, I think he's a little above-average TBH but his attributes would be admittedly average. You're right about him stunting inside, but the explosiveness is really difficult to say. I suppose we'll see at the combine since he'll be a participant, and those combine measurements should help us see what kind of athlete he really is.

But I think he can be a capable pass-rusher.

[gabefergy]

I don't think he's slow off the snap. I'd say he's more inconsistent than anything. What games did you watch? Just curious. I see what you mean with the slow off the snap, but I've seen him bolt off the snap as well. As for him being an average athlete, I think he's a little above-average TBH but his attributes would be admittedly average. You're right about him stunting inside, but the explosiveness is really difficult to say. I suppose we'll see at the combine since he'll be a participant, and those combine measurements should help us see what kind of athlete he really is.

But I think he can be a capable pass-rusher.

I watched FSU and Georgia. The Georgia game he might have been hurt because he was off the field a lot, but I saw him on the ground a lot which is not a good thing. I might have seen 1 pressure the entire game.

He was a little better against FSU, picking up a sack/fumble when Manuel stepped up into him.

He has some power moves, but speed is not an asset. We saw how a guy without great speed is limited as a pass-rusher in Courtney Upshaw, and I dont think McCray is nearly the player Upshaw was in college.

[GrimCoconut]

I watched FSU and Georgia. The Georgia game he might have been hurt because he was off the field a lot, but I saw him on the ground a lot which is not a good thing. I might have seen 1 pressure the entire game.

He was a little better against FSU, picking up a sack/fumble when Manuel stepped up into him.

He has some power moves, but speed is not an asset. We saw how a guy without great speed is limited as a pass-rusher in Courtney Upshaw, and I dont think McCray is nearly the player Upshaw was in college.

I agree that Upshaw was a far superior prospect, but Upshaw was considered a top-15 or so pick, whereas he's probably going at the end of the third day unless he blows up this combine. His speed seems inconsistent to me. I think his speed is decent enough. He does seem a little like a "wind-up toy", where he takes a few steps to really get going but I think that once he builds up his speed he's pretty quick.

Edited by GrimCoconut, 20 February 2013 - 03:35 PM.

[gabefergy]

I agree that Upshaw was a far superior prospect. His speed seems inconsistent to me. I think his speed is decent enough. He does seem a little like a "wind-up toy", where he takes a few steps to really get going but I think that once he builds up his speed he's pretty quick.

I dont see how that translates to being a pass-rusher. He needs to get a running start to get by the OT? He doesnt seem to be a quick-twitch athlete. I think he will do very poorly in the cone and shuttle drills.

[GrimCoconut]

I dont see how that translates to being a pass-rusher. He needs to get a running start to get by the OT? He doesnt seem to be a quick-twitch athlete. I think he will do very poorly in the cone and shuttle drills.

This is all rather pointless since we haven't seen him in any drills. We'll see how he does at the combine and then talk. There's really nothing to go by now and it doesn't seem like this is going anywhere with you, so I'll shelve this discussion with you until we have something more concrete to go on here.

And for the record, I think he does a good job against OTs where he can beat them in terms of being physical and getting around the OT. I like his hand use and I think he has a strong punch. I like his potential.