Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

DMH_in_WA

Matt Ryan is still going to be the better QB

88 posts in this topic

I kind of always knew this was coming. Forget that Matty Melt failed .. forget 1-4 .. forget all the interceptions ... I knew that once the dust settled, we'd be back to the unending comparison of Flacco to Ryan and that somehow, even being Superbowl MVP and on fire in the playoffs, Ryan would be deemed to be the better QB. Peel back the excuses for Ryan ... peel back his failures ... and you get that while Flacco may have won the SB, Matt Ryan has the higher trajectory and is/will be the better QB from the 2008 draft ... so there.

Whatever. I'll take the guy who elevates in big time games over the guy who seems to melt under the pressure. For the love of all things big and small, it took the incredible decisions of the Seahawks to not kick the ball out the back of the end-zone and then to go into a prevent D when the Falcons only needed 30-yards for a FG in order for him not to go 0-4 in the playoffs.

Why do I torture myself by reading these things?

[url="http://aol.sportingnews.com/nfl/story/2013-02-13/matt-ryan-atlanta-falcons-vs-joe-flacco-baltimore-ravens-2008-qbs"][b]http://aol.sportingnews.com/nfl/story/2013-02-13/matt-ryan-atlanta-falcons-vs-joe-flacco-baltimore-ravens-2008-qbs[/b][/url]
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'll take flacco he consistently gets it done and this year exceptional.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
They can say whatever they want.

Ryan supporters like to point to the fact that Ryan has marginally better individual stats than Flacco. When confronted with the knowledge that Romo has better stats than Ryan they point to Matt Ryan's wins. Funny, huh?

I've seen the phrase [i]'winningest QB in the NFC'[/i] on those forums... guess who's the winningest QB in the league...
8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
As much as I love our receivers, I am still envious of how loaded the Falcons are in this area.
I feel bad for Tony Gonzales though. There's a guy, that really deserves that ring in his career. Let's see what Matt Ryan can do without the greatest TE to ever play the game as his security blanket.
4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I honestly don't think Matt Ryan is that much better than Joe, even in terms of stats. He had ten more TDs this year and more yards, but his team has no good RB, and his version of Cam Cameron got fired before the season. We'll get a fair comparison next year when Joe gets to work with Caldwell for an entire year.

And of course you can't beat the clutch factor. Some players have it, some don't, and some need a little while to develop it. Flacco has had it since day one, but we're still waiting for Ryan.
2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Meh. The comparison doesn't even bother me anymore. The fact is that Flacco has as many rings as Ryan has playoff wins. That's all I need to know.
6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Before Flacco won the ship the way he did all this was understandable. Now it is just plain stupidity.

Just count the trophies baby....

Flacco- 1
Ryan- 0 HASNT EVEN BEEN TO The SUPERBOWL

Enough said
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='berad' timestamp='1360796950' post='1357055']Ryan supporters like to point to the fact that Ryan has marginally better individual stats than Flacco. When confronted with the knowledge that Romo has better stats than Ryan they point to Matt Ryan's wins. Funny, huh?[/quote]I point this out all the time. To this day I have no idea why Matty 2 Points is considered "Ice" while Romo is called a choker. They're basically the same guy, except that Romo actually has better stats, worse coaching, and an inferior team around him. As I mentioned before, the media chooses their "guys" and sticks with them no matter what.
6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'll preface this by saying Ryan is a good QB, but he would not survive in the AFC North and it irks me to no end how no sports writer/ journalist, whatever you want to call them, ever mentions the fact that Ryan plays in the NFC South home of some of the softest defenses in the entire league and 2 domed fields. N.O.? Just wow, even when Greg Williams was there the defense still gave up a ton of yardage and significant points, TB hasn't had a good defense since Monte Kiffin was there and the Panthers (while having good young pieces in the front 7) are still giving up 23 ppg.
3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I stopped caring when Flacco got his ring, and even before I didn't care that much.

Let them cling to their stats. It's all they have.
5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'll take a SB MVP over a melted pot of ice any day...

Oh, and the melted pot has a greater arsenal of weapons at his disposal. Prob the best in the NFL

White, who is just a great all around WR

and Jones, who is a Calvin Johnson esq athlete
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1360798427' post='1357088']
I stopped caring when Flacco got his ring, and even before I didn't care that much.

Let them cling to their stats. It's all they have.
[/quote]

true that
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Some QBs have talents that make the players around them better. You can give them any type of WR and they'll shine. Some guys have limitations that you need to have great well rounded guys surrounding them.

Matt Ryan is a guy that needs great talent around him. The offense he is in is perfect for him, because it hides his weaknesses. Ryan has a above average arm, isn't a QB who can stretch the field wide and deep consistently and he struggles to read defenses.

These are all of the concerns i had about Ryan coming out of BC when I wanted the Ravens to draft him. Now none of those weaknesses makes Ryan a bad QB, just mot as good as everyone makes him out to be. Having guys like Jones, White and Tony G inside of a timing offense plays to Ryan's strength.

Although it's tough to do, the comparison to me breaks down to this. If Flacco was in ATL, would that offense be the same worse or better? At the very least the same, but imo Flacco would really elevate that offense into the type of offense Roddy White cliams they are gonna be every offseason.

Now if you put Ryan into this Ravens offense and didn't change a thing, I don't think Ryan would be able to maintain this offense, let along elevate it. Especially under Cam. He doesn't have the arm strength to consistently attack outisde the numbers, he doesn't have the deep ball accuracy to consistently take advantage of the speed in this offense. He also doesn't have the same drive on his throws to be able to deliver the ball into tight windows with these WRs not creating much separation.

Also with all his comeback victories and a name like Ice, he gets flustered far more then people say, at least from what I see. I'm not sure how he would handle the physical nature of the Steelers and playing at Hienz field every year. I'm not sure he'd be able to overcome Bill Belicheks defensive schemes seemingly every year.

I like Matt Ryan, but I think with the young QBs coming up and himing losing Tony G and maybe White over the next few years, Ryan could quickly become like Philp Rivers. People will just get tried of waiting on him.
2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
All you have to do is look at Ryan's numbers when he plays top competition - for instance, 2011 vs. GB, CHI, HOU - 2 TDs, 5 picks, and we all know what he did in the playoffs. This year - 5 picks against Arizona, the only top passing defense he played all season, the 2 picks against Seattle in the playoffs, and then the second half pick against San Francisco that helped seal the deal. You can even go back to 2010 and see how poorly he fared against the Rothelisberger-less Steelers.
3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I feel pretty confident in saying that if Matt Ryan was our QB during this playoff run, we wouldn't be SB champ. Ofcourse this is only my personal gut feeling and I like Ryan.
4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Flacco is a better QB than Ryan at this point, and I see no reason why that will change. I have seen way too many Matt Ryan collapses in critical moments even though Ryan has arguably the best receiving weapons in the entire NFL. Ryan also plays the majority of his games in a dome or warm weather against the weak defenses of the NFC South.

People will continue to make excuses for him and it's true that he is a very good QB, but Flacco is a tier above him. He has the hardware to prove it, and no one can take that from him. Ryan doesnt have Joe's arm and he doesnt have the calm demeanor under pressure. He also isn't as athletic as Joe which shows itself when the pocket gets muddied.
2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Here's to the day we see matt Ryan on Nfln top 10 qbs to never win the Super Bowl
3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Tiz' timestamp='1360803839' post='1357153']
Here's to the day we see matt Ryan on Nfln top 10 qbs to never win the Super Bowl
[/quote]

Exactly lol.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
there's no comparison between Flacco and Ryan, Flacco is da man. the Falcons are even lucky to win vs sea-hawks if it wasn't for coach carroll calling Time out when kicker missed FG and gave them another chance to kick it.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I can see why people do this.Flaccos not really a likable guy(unless youre a ravens fan).People want Ryan to be the next best thing because they all loved him so much in college.But the one thing you cant deny if you want to be taken seriously by someone who knows football is Jones/White >>> Smith/Boldin.Those two would make any qb look good.If Matt Ryan was as good as they say he is,he wouldve been able to score atleast 3 points in the playoffs last year and wouldve been able to score atleast 3 in the second half vs the niners AT HOME in a dome.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The future HOF can be the better QB all he wants. As long as our inferior QB who has thrown 18 td and 2 int in his last three postseasons keeps racking up super bowl MVP awards, I could care less about this psuedo-debate
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1360804710' post='1357170']
The future HOF can be the better QB all he wants. As long as our inferior QB who has thrown 18 td and 2 int in his last three postseasons keeps racking up super bowl MVP awards, I could care less about this psuedo-debate
[/quote]
Flacco is one of the greatest young QBs ever........... The fact that the sports media is comparing a guy who has gotten the most playoff wins in his first five season potentially the greatest postseason for a QB in the last ten years, a Super Bowl MVP to a guy who may post amazing stats in the regular season, but is lucky to have one playoff win is just

<Insert Stephen A Smith Photo here>
Just so Disrespectful

If anything (especially if Flacco wins another SB)

FLACCO is the future HOF QB. With all that sucess in the postseason, another ring would get him a spot in the Hall. Three rings would get him to be an all time great.....
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
We've got a Manning v. Brady situation on our hands. Based on early career success (a la Brady) Flacco will probably be the better winner. From a cerebral perspective, Matt Ryan will always appear to be the more "sophisticated" Quarterback. At the end of the day, I'll take the multiple championships that Flacco is going to bring us over the stats that Ryan will put up.
2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'd rather have flacco. Outside of the Hall of Fame guys (Brady, Rodgers, Brees and Peyton he's my guy).

But matt ryan is a fine quarterback and atlanta should be excited to watch him.

Edit: They're just saying not to write off Matt Ryan. Which I agree.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
we'll see who is better next year in stats with caldwell in charge. joe will explode and ryan supporters will have nothing else to point to especially when Tony leaves and they'll be wondering what happened.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If you like this, you might like...

[quote][b]Falcons take Matt Ryan at No. 3.[/b][color=#292929][font=Mercury SSm A', 'Mercury SSm B', Georgia, Georgia, serif][size=4] So instead of getting Dorsey for defensive-minded coach Mike Smith, Atlanta goes with someone that will help it forget that Michael Vick kid as quickly as possible. Ryan is the traditional dropback quarterback, and those kind of passers have been found leading the most recent Super Bowl winners. I love Ryan's size, arm and competitiveness. And oh yeah, he has the all-important great character.[/size][/font][/color][/quote]
[quote][b]Ravens trade up to take Joe Flacco at No. 18.[/b][color=#292929][font=Mercury SSm A', 'Mercury SSm B', Georgia, Georgia, serif][size=4] The Texans make a great move, getting a third- and sixth-rounder just for sliding down eight spots. Baltimore, meanwhile, reaches for the project quarterback from Delaware. There is no doubt Flacco has the arm and overall skills to be a starter, but the Ravens will need to be very patient. An offensive lineman [b]or cornerback[/b] would have been a better choice.[/size][/font][/color][/quote]
[url="http://www.sbnation.com/2008/4/26/1640259/nfl-draft-round-1-analysis"]http://www.sbnation....ound-1-analysis[/url]

Dude, we coulda had Aquib Talib!!!
3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='DMH_in_WA' timestamp='1360795808' post='1357034']
I kind of always knew this was coming. Forget that Matty Melt failed .. forget 1-4 .. forget all the interceptions ... I knew that once the dust settled, we'd be back to the unending comparison of Flacco to Ryan and that somehow, even being Superbowl MVP and on fire in the playoffs, Ryan would be deemed to be the better QB. Peel back the excuses for Ryan ... peel back his failures ... and you get that while Flacco may have won the SB, Matt Ryan has the higher trajectory and is/will be the better QB from the 2008 draft ... so there.

Whatever. I'll take the guy who elevates in big time games over the guy who seems to melt under the pressure. For the love of all things big and small, it took the incredible decisions of the Seahawks to not kick the ball out the back of the end-zone and then to go into a prevent D when the Falcons only needed 30-yards for a FG in order for him not to go 0-4 in the playoffs.

Why do I torture myself by reading these things?

[url="http://aol.sportingnews.com/nfl/story/2013-02-13/matt-ryan-atlanta-falcons-vs-joe-flacco-baltimore-ravens-2008-qbs"][b]http://aol.sportingnews.com/nfl/story/2013-02-13/matt-ryan-atlanta-falcons-vs-joe-flacco-baltimore-ravens-2008-qbs[/b][/url]
[/quote]exactly why I learned a long time ago, to just have faith in my team and let it play out as its going to, reading this and that, just makes me mad, especially when they STILL are putting us down in some form or another, so, I just don't read anything into it.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='hawkprey' timestamp='1360807408' post='1357206']
If you like this, you might like...



[url="http://www.sbnation.com/2008/4/26/1640259/nfl-draft-round-1-analysis"]http://www.sbnation....ound-1-analysis[/url]

Dude, we coulda had Aquib Talib!!!
[/quote]

Hold up, the author of that was Vinnie Iyer - the same guy who wrote the OP article...

Sounds like someone is still trying to cover his tracks.
2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
That article should be flipped. I think Matt Ryan came into the league as the better QB. But Flacco has not only caught up, but has surpassed him. It's not as close as these guys try to make it seem.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Mr. Irrelevant' timestamp='1360805280' post='1357176']
<Insert Stephen A Smith Photo here>
Just so Disrespectful
[/quote]

Smith responds to this article

"That is blasphemous. That is Blasssssphemous.. how dare you.. *high pitch* how dare you say such a thing"
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='berad' timestamp='1360807599' post='1357209']
Hold up, the author of that was Vinnie Iyer - the same guy who wrote the OP article...

Sounds like someone is still trying to cover his tracks.
[/quote] Yeah I forgot to specify that (it's why I posted it, good catch). Funny how he calls Joe a project quarterback; five years later Matt Ryan has "almost caught up". And Joe has apparently reached his ceiling.

Some people just can't admit they were wrong.

EDIT: Oh and if anyone wants another chuckle...
[quote][b]Packers take Brian Brohm at No. 56.[/b][color=#292929][font='Mercury SSm A', 'Mercury SSm B', Georgia, Georgia, serif][size=4] Again, another pick for which the Pack will get criticized, but another one I like. Great value here for a quarterback who might end up being the best one in this class. This should light a fire under Aaron Rodgers and also gives Green Bay someone to develop if Rodgers can't quite be the successor to Brett Favre.[/size][/font][/color][/quote] ~same author.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='PuRock' timestamp='1360803273' post='1357151']
I feel pretty confident in saying that if Matt Ryan was our QB during this playoff run, we wouldn't [s]be SB champ [/s]have won a playoff game. Ofcourse this is only my personal gut feeling and I like Ryan.
[/quote]
Fixed
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'll continue to bring this up as long as articles like this come out. Phil Simms said it best, so called experts just can't admit they are wrong about Flacco.

I'll just take the same approach as Mr. B. I don't know how many championships the Ravens can win before we lose that chip on your shoulders, but I hope it never happens.

I hope the Ravens and none of our players ever become media darlings. I want them to continue to have that same disrespectful tone when talking about Flacco. I'm glad Suggs went on first take and showed no respect for Skip. I want them to talk about how this team can survive without Ray. Whatever it takes to keep that chip on the shoulder.


What will they say when Flacco wins the MVP and becomes the first QB in 7 years to actually win a playoff game the year after winning the Super Bowl. Guess that won't be impressive enough either. They'll probably say Ryan has more pro bowls lol.

Does anyone remember when Josh Freeman, Philp Rivers, Tony Romo and Mike Vick were so much better then Flacco? Well Flacco quited all those talks. Ryan, Eli and Ben are next. After next season there will be no question Flacco is better then guys and battling Rogers for best QB in the NFL.
3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1360809931' post='1357271']
I'll continue to bring this up as long as articles like this come out. Phil Simms said it best, so called experts just can't admit they are wrong about Flacco.

I'll just take the same approach as Mr. B. I don't know how many championships the Ravens can win before we lose that chip on your shoulders, but I hope it never happens.

I hope the Ravens and none of our players ever become media darlings. I want them to continue to have that same disrespectful tone when talking about Flacco. I'm glad Suggs went on first take and showed no respect for Skip. I want them to talk about how this team can survive without Ray. Whatever it takes to keep that chip on the shoulder.


What will they say when Flacco wins the MVP and becomes the first QB in 7 years to actually win a playoff game the year after winning the Super Bowl. Guess that won't be impressive enough either. They'll probably say Ryan has more pro bowls lol.

Does anyone remember when Josh Freeman, Philp Rivers, Tony Romo and Mike Vick were so much better then Flacco? Well Flacco quited all those talks. Ryan, Eli and Ben are next. After next season there will be no question Flacco is better then guys and battling Rogers for best QB in the NFL.
[/quote]

He is already better than Ben and Ryan....

Eli is a wildcard.... He has been succesful in the posteason. If he is hot, he is top 5, if not, top 15

Flacco at the moment is...

1. Rodgers
2. Manning
3. Brees
4. Brady
5. Flacco.
2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Actually Flacco has two trophies. AFC Champion and Super Bowl Champion. Oh and Super Bowl MVP. Ryan's a choke artist. If you can't get it done with Julio Jones, Roddy White and Tony Gonzalez, something's wrong. By the way I know the Super Bowl is the only trophy that matters, but I wanted to rub it in his face even more.
3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='ghost1986' timestamp='1360810365' post='1357280']
Actually Flacco has two trophies. AFC Champion and Super Bowl Champion. Oh and Super Bowl MVP. Ryan's a choke artist. If you can't get it done with Julio Jones, Roddy White and Tony Gonzalez, something's wrong. By the way I know the Super Bowl is the only trophy that matters, but I wanted to rub it in his face even more.
[/quote]
It is also wise to mention that he had the best postseason for any QB in the last ten years.....

Oh... He also got a sexy car ;)
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Mr. Irrelevant' timestamp='1360810128' post='1357275']


He is already better than Ben and Ryan....

Eli is a wildcard.... He has been succesful in the posteason. If he is hot, he is top 5, if not, top 15

Flacco at the moment is...

1. Rodgers
2. Manning
3. Brees
4. Brady
5. Flacco.
[/quote]

He's better then Ben, Eli and Ryan. I'm talking about from a public perception standpoint. Right now someone could have a fair argument that Ryan, Eli and Ben are comparable if not better then Flacco. However if anyone publicly stated that Freeman, Romo, Vick or Rivers are better then Flacco, i drug test my soon follow from their bosses.

There is still a perception that Flacco doesn't or can't carry this team. I heard Steve Whyce after the SB say he'd still pick Ryan because the Falcons ask him to do more. People still think Flacco just throws the ball up and his WRs bails him out. That because he hasn't thrown for 4,000yds and 30+TDs, he's not a top QB. Well all that will end after next season.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='beasy2487' timestamp='1360807086' post='1357195']
We've got a Manning v. Brady situation on our hands. Based on early career success (a la Brady) Flacco will probably be the better winner. From a cerebral perspective, Matt Ryan will always appear to be the more "sophisticated" Quarterback. At the end of the day, I'll take the multiple championships that Flacco is going to bring us over the stats that Ryan will put up.
[/quote]

Okay. I see Flacco as either Manning or Brady (more like Brady because he will have multiple rings) but I don't see who Ryan is supposed to be. The water boy? Ryan wishes he could have the respect and adoration of a Manning or Brady. Not in this life. He is and always will be a 2nd tier QB, with good stats. Book it.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Mr. Irrelevant' timestamp='1360810467' post='1357284']
It is also wise to mention that he had the best postseason for any QB in the last ten years.....

Oh... He also got a sexy car ;)
[/quote]
And he tied Montana for the most TD's in a post-season without throwing a pick. Enjoy it, Matty Melt.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Flacco could win 6 superbowls, save 50 kids and their dogs from a burning building, and 3 SB MVPs and Ryan will still be the better QB. SMH
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Moderator 2' timestamp='1360812890' post='1357324']
Flacco could win 6 superbowls, save 50 kids and their dogs from a burning building, and 3 SB MVPs and Ryan will still be the better QB. SMH
[/quote]
Probably... I was just taking with my dad. He said
"I don't think he is elite, but he sure as hell played like it" If he wins another ring, he's a hall of famer. If he wins two more rings, he's an all time great... The public on the other hand? Who cares what they think? There is no better comeback than Scoreboard"
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Mr. Irrelevant' timestamp='1360813255' post='1357329']
Probably... I was just taking with my dad. He said
"I don't think he is elite, but he sure as hell played like it" If he wins another ring, he's a hall of famer. If he wins two more rings, he's an all time great... The public on the other hand? Who cares what they think? There is no better comeback than Scoreboard"
[/quote]
I don't think hes elite. My elite QBs are basically hall of fame ballot guys.
Rodgers, Brady, Brees and Peyton. I don't throw the word around, but at the end of the day he can just outplay people.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Matt Ryan should send a Thank You card to Pete Carroll for taking that timeout at the end of the playoff game to allow Bryant a 2nd chance at redemption.

If Pete doesn't call a timeout. Natty Ice is still winless in the playoffs.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='JoeCool#5' timestamp='1360815564' post='1357366']
Matt Ryan should send a Thank You card to Pete Carroll for taking that timeout at the end of the playoff game to allow Bryant a 2nd chance at redemption.

If Pete doesn't call a timeout. Matt still winless in the playoffs.
[/quote]
Why do you think I still call him Playoff McNoWins?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites