Jason LaCanfora: Ravens to let Williams, Kruger walk; attempt to Re-sign Flacco, Reed, Elerbe

[Gtown Purple]

With as much talent as this team has and a flat salary cap casualties are going to have to happen. Nobody wanted to see JJ or Grubbs go last year but it's about the money. There is only so much to go around and guys need to make what they can while they can. The thing I love about the ravens is how they develop talent from the draft and castoffs from other places. Name another team that gets more from their draft than us? Upshaw and KO are key starters while Pierce could start for other teams. If we draft this year as well as we did last year even we'll be primed for another playoff season. Kiper only gave us a B.

Kruger and Cary will get big money from lesser quality teams and that's fine. Other teams love to take advantage of our developmental process. Players usually have to decide between money and winning and most choose money for obvious reasons. You don't know how long you are going to be in the league so make the most of it. Very rarely do you get both unless you are a superstar. I agree with the majority that Flacco, Ellerbe, and Reed are the priorities but I'm looking forward more to the draft and the under the radar signings that we pull off. Who is going to be the Jacoby Jones or Graham this year?

[ArmyRavensFan]

They tried Kruger at DE a couple of years ago and it didnt work out. It was one of the reasons for his stunted growth.

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1360724755' post='1356183']
He has the size to play DE easily. 6'4, 265, and it's not like he is all that great in dropping into coverage. DE would allow him to do what he does best, get after the QB.
[/quote]

[arnie_uk]

[quote name='ArmyRavensFan' timestamp='1360759514' post='1356502']
They tried Kruger at DE a couple of years ago and it didnt work out. It was one of the reasons for his stunted growth.
[/quote]you don't seem to understand basic formations of other teams. All the teams he mentioned run a 43. We tried to make him a 34 de when he needs to be the guts of 300 pounds. A 43 de is a whole different ball game. It's what he, and most other 34 olbs are built for, in fact most 34 olbs start of as 43 ends in college and get moved when drafted by a 34 team.

If I took the time to look I'd be willing to bet Kruger played 43 de in college.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1360762502' post='1356519']
you don't seem to understand basic formations of other teams. All the teams he mentioned run a 43. We tried to make him a 34 de when he needs to be the guts of 300 pounds. A 43 de is a whole different ball game. It's what he, and most other 34 olbs are built for, in fact most 34 olbs start of as 43 ends in college and get moved when drafted by a 34 team.

If I took the time to look I'd be willing to bet Kruger played 43 de in college.
[/quote]
He did, DE at Utah.

[arnie_uk]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1360762664' post='1356521']

He did, DE at Utah.
[/quote]well there we go, back to his normal position.

[BMORElegacy]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1360723074' post='1356149']
Hate to say it, but Kruger walks and he's the next Bart Scott. Played well for us and will be NOTHING for whoever he plays for next.
[/quote]I said somewhere else that he'll follow in the footsteps of Adalius Thomas.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1360737272' post='1356411']


I read a article leading up to the Super Bowl about Ed Reed that really drives home why it's important to resign him. It talk about how Reed is just as great of a leader as Ray, but not as vocal. It talked about how Ed teaches other players on defense just how to break down film on opponents. It talks about how Ed Reed has more of a father figure/relationship with young guys then Ray did.

Ed Reed is a different type of guy from Ray, but he's just as valuable as Ray. I also like having Ed around for another few years to help guys like Thompson, O. Brown, C. Brown, Cook and Jackson develop more. In that article it talked about how it was Ed who held the team accountable after a poor practice following the open discussion the team had with Harbs.

I don't think the Ravens will miss Ray's leadership as much, if they re-sign Ed. Also the biggest reason for me in bringing Ed back, who you gonna find better? Ed while clearly losing a step, still has a dominate presence on the back end of the defense.
[/quote]
I agree with everything here, and have only one thing to add.

Byrd. He's probably the best safety in the NFL with Thomas.

[jdynamite]

[quote name='JO_75' timestamp='1360722700' post='1356141']
I was hoping we would be able to come to some fair deal to keep Kruger but I understand why we have to let him go. Though at this point, it would seem keeping Kruger, Ellerbe and Joe would be priority while letting Ed test the market and then offer him a fair deal to come back.
[/quote]

In my opinion keeping Kruger isn't more of a priority than ellerbe or reed because Kruger isn't a complete enough player yet to justify the money that will be thrown his way. Kruger is more of a typical high risk free agent, that has a career year on his contract year after playing below expectations the previous years of that contract.
Krugers value should be diminished by the fact that he isn't an every down player due to his lack-luster run defense and pass coverage abilities.

Ellerbe is higher priority because well he is the only ILB outside of a draft pick that we have, Mcclain had a down year this year and suffered an injury late in the year, haven't heard any injury updates for him, ellerbe was our best coverage LB and he became a weapon as a blitzing lb as well. And ILB typically have lower contract #s than OLB.

Ed Reed is still high priority, firsf because of the unknown behind him ( Omar Brown, C.Thompson are they ready to play not replace him because its impossible , or does the team risk CB depth and convert one of the CBs like J.Smith to FS? ) 2nd - Ed reed may not have made as many gamebreaking INTs, FFs, or FRs this year but even with injuries he forced opposing QBs to alter their gameplans with his play on the back-end in fact Reed began to gamble a little less which really limited teams ability to hit the deep throws. Also Ed reed helps to get the defenders in position Pre-snap with his communication because of excellent film study.

I felt all year that McPhee was being used wrong because the year before he was more of situational player and he had more burst, while injuries did affect McPhee I felt like him trying to focus on run defense while having Cody and Kemo onside of him getting driven down field 6 yards also limited his pass rush potential.

[RobFuseRaven]

[quote name='Gtown Purple' timestamp='1360758796' post='1356496']
With as much talent as this team has and a flat salary cap casualties are going to have to happen. Nobody wanted to see JJ or Grubbs go last year but it's about the money. There is only so much to go around and guys need to make what they can while they can. The thing I love about the ravens is how they develop talent from the draft and castoffs from other places. Name another team that gets more from their draft than us? [b]Upshaw and KO are key starters while Pierce could start for other teams. If we draft this year as well as we did last year even we'll be primed for another playoff season. Kiper only gave us a B.[/b]

Kruger and Cary will get big money from lesser quality teams and that's fine. Other teams love to take advantage of our developmental process. Players usually have to decide between money and winning and most choose money for obvious reasons. You don't know how long you are going to be in the league so make the most of it. Very rarely do you get both unless you are a superstar. I agree with the majority that Flacco, Ellerbe, and Reed are the priorities but I'm looking forward more to the draft and the under the radar signings that we pull off. Who is going to be the Jacoby Jones or Graham this year?
[/quote]

Not to mention Gino Gradkowski will be a starter soon after he showed his skill against the Bengals and DeAngelo Tyson was surprisingly good when he played.

[Gtown Purple]

The Ravens are the best at finding talent to develop in the lower rounds. We don't make news on draft but that's not when it counts.


[quote name='RobFuseRaven' timestamp='1360767303' post='1356549']
Not to mention Gino Gradkowski will be a starter soon after he showed his skill against the Bengals and DeAngelo Tyson was surprisingly good when he played.
[/quote]

[MARYLANDMIKE21224]

Kruger really didnt do anything untill suggs got back. I think he would be the last of the free agents I would worry about keeping

[beasy2487]

Kruger could definitely be a Jared Allen clone somewhere else. Will be sad to see him go but it has to happen.

[MARYLANDMIKE21224]

I am afraid the only Jared he will clone is from subway ...lol

[PuRock]

[quote name='beasy2487' timestamp='1360774150' post='1356628']
Kruger could definitely be a Jared Allen clone somewhere else. Will be sad to see him go but it has to happen.
[/quote]

Kruger needs to add a bunch of pass rush moves to his repoitorie to be even close to Allen. Allen throws a ton of different looks at the beginning of the game to see what works but usually falls back on his 'dip and rip' in critical situations.

Kruger doesn't have that vast array of moves.

[beasy2487]

[quote name='PuRock' timestamp='1360775022' post='1356640']
Kruger needs to add a bunch of pass rush moves to his repoitorie to be even close to Allen. Allen throws a ton of different looks at the beginning of the game to see what works but usually falls back on his 'dip and rip' in critical situations.

Kruger doesn't have that vast array of moves.
[/quote]

True, but I'm accounting for his progression. If he keeps the drive to improve that he had here he should be able to evolve, if not, then I agree he will be another Bart Scott, Ed Hartwell, Adalius Thomas type of guy.

[RobFuseRaven]

[quote name='MARYLANDMIKE21224' timestamp='1360774896' post='1356639']
I am afraid the only Jared he will clone is from subway ...lol
[/quote]

No.

[ravensfan2430]

I love this time a year when "reporters" say they are 90% sure this player will go here, or that player there.. Either way they are 100% right. I remember when Jamison Hensely was getting it wrong during the entire draft/ offseason last year. A weather man or sports reporter... the only jobs you never have to be right.

[Bazooka Joe]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1360728909' post='1356302']

You missed the big point! Ahhh! I was hoping you would say it, so I will!

And THIS ladies & gentlemen is EXACTLY why we need to use our young players MORE! So we can SEE what they can do before they are on their last year. Ozzie said this I think two years in a row now. He said he wants to get the young talent more involved so they are not seeing what it is until it's too late.

Part of our success is using vets and that helps us win games. Part of our failure is always using vets to a fault and thus our youth do not get reps nor game experience and thus don't develop as quickly.
[/quote]

I agree. But we have gotten to a place where we are seeing our young players contributing early. I allspice like how Harbaugh does the practices to get young guys those needed reps. We do have a lot of guys still on rookie deals.

That said, we must stop switching guys around too much. Kruger was a DE then asked to gain weight and then asked to lose weight. Oher gets switchedd from left to right to left. Same with KO.

[Corvus]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1360723074' post='1356149']
Hate to say it, but Kruger walks and he's the next Bart Scott. Played well for us and will be NOTHING for whoever he plays for next.
[/quote]

I disagree completely. Paul is by no means a great "athlete" but he has a motor that doesn't stop. Yes, Suggs returning did help his numbers out. But there are plenty of teams who could use a partner in crime to their best pass rushing LB/DE and he would fit it perfectly in that situation. Also, yes Kruger played in a 4-3 at Utah so he has experience there too. Keep in mind this guy had two wasted years for us when he couldn't get on the field his rookie year due to him not being a great special teams guy and his second season, he was completely misused as a 5 technique DE which he simply does not have the size nor strength and technique to play. I think Paul is only going to get better with more consistent playing time, its just too bad it likely won't be with us.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='Corvus' timestamp='1360783964' post='1356785']


I disagree completely. Paul is by no means a great "athlete" but he has a motor that doesn't stop. Yes, Suggs returning did help his numbers out. But there are plenty of teams who could use a partner in crime to their best pass rushing LB/DE and he would fit it perfectly in that situation. Also, yes Kruger played in a 4-3 at Utah so he has experience there too. Keep in mind this guy had two wasted years for us when he couldn't get on the field his rookie year due to him not being a great special teams guy and his second season, he was completely misused as a 5 technique DE which he simply does not have the size nor strength and technique to play. I think Paul is only going to get better with more consistent playing time, its just too bad it likely won't be with us.
[/quote]
Kruger will be a very good DE. I think it's his best position. I can see a team running the 4-3 targeting him. He would be perfect with a team like the Bills IMO. They could dump Anderson and get him and have Mario-Kruger, a combo to give offensive line nightmares with a very good interior DT.

[MARYLANDMIKE21224]

[quote name='Corvus' timestamp='1360783964' post='1356785']
I disagree completely. Paul is by no means a great "athlete" but he has a motor that doesn't stop. Yes, Suggs returning did help his numbers out. But there are plenty of teams who could use a partner in crime to their best pass rushing LB/DE and he would fit it perfectly in that situation. Also, yes Kruger played in a 4-3 at Utah so he has experience there too. Keep in mind this guy had two wasted years for us when he couldn't get on the field his rookie year due to him not being a great special teams guy and his second season, he was completely misused as a 5 technique DE which he simply does not have the size nor strength and technique to play. I think Paul is only going to get better with more consistent playing time, its just too bad it likely won't be with us.

I think you are way overrating kruger, and who would you want on the edge with suggs, kruger or upshaw ?, kruger is easily blocked most his numbers cam from lesser tackles, when the big boys block him you never hear his name, good riddens save the money and keep "Q" !!!!!!!
[/quote]

[Bazooka Joe]

Rumors on 105.7 has the Steelers and Eagles interested in Kruger

[Bravens292]

[quote name='Bazooka Joe' timestamp='1360785916' post='1356835']
Rumors on 105.7 has the Steelers and Eagles interested in Kruger
[/quote]

steelers don't make sense unless they lose a lot of players to get him, right? Browns were a team that popped up that could happen.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='Bazooka Joe' timestamp='1360785916' post='1356835']
Rumors on 105.7 has the Steelers and Eagles interested in Kruger
[/quote]
Did the Steelers magically create 20M+ in cap space? I can see Philly as they are potentially going 3-4.

[The Raven]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1360786406' post='1356847']
Did the Steelers magically create 20M+ in cap space? I can see Philly as they are potentially going 3-4.
[/quote]

Kruger would be a great fit in Philly's current system. He'd make a killing in the Wide-9.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1360786520' post='1356851']


Kruger would be a great fit in Philly's current system. He'd make a killing in the Wide-9.
[/quote]
They already have a lot of talent at DE though which is why is a surprise to me unless they are making a switch.

[Bravens292]

steelers have a bunch of problems of their own AND they rarely go after big time FA's. then again, it [i]IS [/i]105.7

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1360765814' post='1356543']

I agree with everything here, and have only one thing to add.

Byrd. He's probably the best safety in the NFL with Thomas.
[/quote]

Agreed. Those would be my top guys, but I'll keep the door open for Eric Berry. I don't think he was 100% last year after the 2011 injury. I strongly dislike how they label a guy as the next somebody coming out of the draft before they've done anything. Berry was the same, I didn't like it, but when I got the chance to see him in that playoff game in 2010, I was highly impressed. The guy was all over the field. If he can get back to 100%, I think his name will be firmly among the list for the best safeties in the game.

[dirtybird10]

[quote name='Bazooka Joe' timestamp='1360785916' post='1356835']
Rumors on 105.7 has the Steelers and Eagles interested in Kruger
[/quote]
I don't see how. Arent both of them worse off cap wise than we are? I am pretty sure the Steelers are well over the cap and I thought the Eagles were too.

[H8R]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1360723074' post='1356149']
Hate to say it, but Kruger walks and he's the next Bart Scott. Played well for us and will be NOTHING for whoever he plays for next.
[/quote]

I tend to agree, I wonder how good he would have been if they lined him up at OLB from day one instead of bouncing him around? I feel like he'll do some damage for another team if he's opposite another good rush LB . Suggs made him better, he's still suspect in run support.