2013 Forum Draft: Trades

[gabefergy]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1365805228' post='1432054']
I just think you could have kept Criner instead of doing what you did. You sort of went backwards there.

That's all. I'm not criticizing the move, as I think you got a good QB, but why even bother making the trade? Why not just keep your 4th & Criner?
[/quote]

He doesnt know at the time of the trade that Barkely will fall that far.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1365805448' post='1432059']
He doesnt know at the time of the trade that Barkely will fall that far.
[/quote]
Oh, I'm sure that was definitely his thought process behind it. I get it. It's just that QBs usually fall in these things from what I saw last year. I never participated in this before, so I went back and looked at the threads from the year prior to get an idea of how things would go and I saw that QBs & RBs were typically overlooked for flashier positions. So, I adjusted my draft strategy accordingly. I don't fault him for it, but I just feel like history could have shown this as being a distinct possibility.

I think he upgraded his QB position, though, with this move. I applaud him for the QB position being upgraded.

[Alexir]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1365805448' post='1432059']


He doesnt know at the time of the trade that Barkely will fall that far.
[/quote]

Exactly . Hindsight is pointless. I thought he'd be gone by 2nd

[Yatagarasu]

I like Barkley, but Tyrod Taylor fits my bootleg/Option Read System better.

Barkley seems better fit as a west coast QB built on short passes, since he struggles on the deep throws.

Chad Pennington is probably his ceiling, which is not bad, but does have a limit.

[Alexir]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1365805228' post='1432054']
I just think you could have kept Criner instead of doing what you did. You sort of went backwards there.

That's all. I'm not criticizing the move, as I think you got a good QB, but why even bother making the trade? Why not just keep your 4th & Criner?
[/quote]

Did I know Barkley was gonna fall? No I thought it was insane he dropped that much.

Height and Arm strength is what everyone is whining about with him but go back 12 years and that is what they told Drew Brees.

[Alexir]

[quote name='Corvus Amplus' timestamp='1365812138' post='1432140']
I like Barkley, but Tyrod Taylor fits my bootleg/Option Read System better.

Barkley seems better fit as a west coast QB built on short passes, since he struggles on the deep throws.

Chad Pennington is probably his ceiling, which is not bad, but does have a limit.
[/quote]

I disagree with the ceiling, like I just posted. Read Drew Brees' pre draft sheet. Height and arm strength were his weaknesses.

[Clutch Ravens]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1365814153' post='1432167']
I disagree with the ceiling, like I just posted. Read Drew Brees' pre draft sheet. Height and arm strength were his weaknesses.
[/quote]

It's also been the weakness of, quite possibly, hundreds of Quarterbacks that have never done anything in the NFL.

It's a good trade on your part given the value, but I'm not a fan of a guy that still struggled frequently with a receiver pairing of Woods & Lee.

[Alexir]

[quote name='Clutch Ravens' timestamp='1365815032' post='1432174']
It's also been the weakness of, quite possibly, hundreds of Quarterbacks that have never done anything in the NFL.

It's a good trade on your part given the value, but I'm not a fan of a guy that still struggled frequently with a receiver pairing of Woods & Lee.
[/quote]

And I think the fact teams gave him a first round grade last year says they liked what they saw. The offensive line took a hit, he wasn't his best in his senior year which is disappointing but he will be fine.

Guess the future will tell.

[Mt. Crushmore]

First post up to date.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1365814153' post='1432167']


I disagree with the ceiling, like I just posted. Read Drew Brees' pre draft sheet. Height and arm strength were his weaknesses.
[/quote]
Brees is far more athletic than Barkley though. That is a big difference. As for him having a first round grade last year, I don't know if anyone will know if that is true or not. He may go in the first this year, but he looks more like a third or fourth rounder to me. Still a good deal for you though, he has more going for him than Tyrod IMO.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1365814107' post='1432166']
Did I know Barkley was gonna fall? No I thought it was insane he dropped that much.

Height and Arm strength is what everyone is whining about with him but go back 12 years and that is what they told Drew Brees.
[/quote]
Huh? I'm not downing the acquisition of Barkley. I think it's a nice acquisition for you as I think he is significantly better than Taylor. I just think it was a bad trade to begin with and now you got Barkley & lost Criner. It just seems expensive. I'm not arguing with you or giving you grief or anything. I'm just saying that I think it was possible to predict Barkley falling so far. Yes, I do believe it is/was very possible to predict.

[Alexir]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1365818728' post='1432253']
Huh? I'm not downing the acquisition of Barkley. I think it's a nice acquisition for you as I think he is significantly better than Taylor. I just think it was a bad trade to begin with and now you got Barkley & lost Criner. It just seems expensive. I'm not arguing with you or giving you grief or anything. I'm just saying that I think it was possible to predict Barkley falling so far. Yes, I do believe it is/was very possible to predict.
[/quote]

I lost a 5th round receiver who was number 4-5 on my team for a QB that will go in first 64 picks.

I am fine with that.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1365819346' post='1432266']
I lost a 5th round receiver who was number 4-5 on my team for a QB that will go in first 64 picks.

I am fine with that.
[/quote]
Fair enough. He had a bad rookie year, but you can't say whether or not he sucks until at least his third year. WRs tend to take a little bit to develop. Still, I understand your reasoning even if I wouldn't have done the same.

[Guest nflfan123]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1365819503' post='1432275']
Fair enough. He had a bad rookie year, but you can't say whether or not he sucks until at least his third year. WRs tend to take a little bit to develop. Still, I understand your reasoning even if I wouldn't have done the same.
[/quote]
Criner didn't have a bad year and was a training camp standout. He has potential.

[Alexir]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1365819503' post='1432275']
Fair enough. He had a bad rookie year, but you can't say whether or not he sucks until at least his third year. WRs tend to take a little bit to develop. Still, I understand your reasoning even if I wouldn't have done the same.
[/quote]

Yeah, if I didn't have Moore, Amendola, Ford, Streater. I wouldn't of made the move. but what is a 4-5th receiver when it comes to a starting Qb...

Plus I have 2 capable tight ends in Fred Davis and Ryan Otten.

[Alexir]

[quote name='nflfan123' timestamp='1365819619' post='1432276']
Criner didn't have a bad year and was a training camp standout. He has potential.
[/quote]

Yeah he had a great camp and had some big plays.

Ask Corvus, I didn't want to give him up but I wanted Barkley.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='nflfan123' timestamp='1365819619' post='1432276']
Criner didn't have a bad year and was a training camp standout. He has potential.
[/quote]
Well, in terms of production, I mean. He didn't really put up a lot. Then again, Palmer was throwing him the ball.

I personally don't like the move myself. I think Criner has a lot of potential, as you said. He was a guy I really liked last year.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1365819664' post='1432277']
Yeah, if I didn't have Moore, Amendola, Ford, Streater. I wouldn't of made the move. but what is a 4-5th receiver when it comes to a starting Qb...

Plus I have 2 capable tight ends in Fred Davis and Ryan Otten.
[/quote]
Well, Amendola can't be relied on to remain healthy. That's one. Ford is a KR/PR guy, and he could go down with an injury at any team because those positions do have a higher rate of season-ending injuries, hence the whole moving the kick-off up more yards thing.

I like Otten a lot, but I just don't like the idea of ever counting on rookies. Criner was one year in the system, so there's a very good chance he has a good year this year. Otten, like most rookies, may take some time to really get it going.

[Guest nflfan123]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1365819755' post='1432281']
Well, Amendola can't be relied on to remain healthy. That's one. Ford is a KR/PR guy, and he could go down with an injury at any team because those positions do have a higher rate of season-ending injuries, hence the whole moving the kick-off up more yards thing.

I like Otten a lot, but I just don't like the idea of ever counting on rookies. Criner was one year in the system, so there's a very good chance he has a good year this year. Otten, like most rookies, may take some time to really get it going.
[/quote]
Ford has made some good plays catching the ball as well. He's very comparable to Jacoby Jones.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='nflfan123' timestamp='1365819885' post='1432282']
Ford has made some good plays catching the ball as well. He's very comparable to Jacoby Jones.
[/quote]
I'm not saying that. I'm saying that there's a possibility that he could be injured on a KR/PR. There's a high risk of injury on returns, at least that's what I've read. I'm just going off of what I remember seeing & reading. I remember a lot of season-ending injuries due to returns.

[Alexir]

[quote name='nflfan123' timestamp='1365819885' post='1432282']

Ford has made some good plays catching the ball as well. He's very comparable to Jacoby Jones.
[/quote]

Agreed

[Guest nflfan123]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1365820020' post='1432284']
I'm not saying that. I'm saying that there's a possibility that he could be injured on a KR/PR. There's a high risk of injury on returns, at least that's what I've read. I'm just going off of what I remember seeing & reading. I remember a lot of season-ending injuries due to returns.
[/quote]
That is true. Ironically last year he got injured when Palmer was passing it to him.

[Alexir]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1365819755' post='1432281']
Well, Amendola can't be relied on to remain healthy. That's one. Ford is a KR/PR guy, and he could go down with an injury at any team because those positions do have a higher rate of season-ending injuries, hence the whole moving the kick-off up more yards thing.

I like Otten a lot, but I just don't like the idea of ever counting on rookies. Criner was one year in the system, so there's a very good chance he has a good year this year. Otten, like most rookies, may take some time to really get it going.
[/quote]

Not worried about it...

My receivers will do just fine without Criner and already looking to replace him.

[Sizzlebshu]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1365820411' post='1432298']
Not worried about it...

My receivers will do just fine without Criner and already looking to replace him.
[/quote]
Guessing you gave up on that option offense then?

[Alexir]

[quote name='Sizzlebshu' timestamp='1365821319' post='1432322']

Guessing you gave up on that option offense then?
[/quote]

Yeah. Didn't think a good QB would be available. Obviously would have to see where Barkley is at during camp to see if he could run the offense, if not, pistol option it is with Dixon and Pryor

[Guest nflfan123]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1365822208' post='1432345']
Yeah. Didn't think a good QB would be available. Obviously would have to see where Barkley is at during camp to see if he could run the offense, if not, pistol option it is with Dixon and Pryor
[/quote]
Pryor and Barkely both have upside

[SecretAgentMan]

[quote name='nflfan123' timestamp='1365822745' post='1432372']

Pryor and Barkely both have upside
[/quote]
Pryor has upside. I never like Barkley much

[Guest nflfan123]

[quote name='Mr. Irrelevant' timestamp='1365822914' post='1432378']
Pryor has upside. I never like Barkley much
[/quote]
You know I don't either, but some people have him as the number one qb this year....

[JO_75]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][b]Official Trade:[/b]

Jacksonville - 7th Round Pick (213th Overall)

Tennessee - 7th Round Pick (221st Overall), G John Moffit[/font][/color]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Edit: Revised[/font][/color][list]

[/list]

[-Truth-]

This again? Seriously? I call for a veto. As a matter of fact, wasn't this already vetoed last year?