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3-4ravdef509

I don't care if Flacco is "elite"

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I used to be so frusterated with Flacco's inconsistencies. I wanted him to throw over 30 touchdowns. I wanted him to throw over 4,000 yards, complete 65% of his passes...etc etc. I wanted him to garner national respect.

But end of the day, I don't think he'll ever be that. Instead, he's in my mind a great quarterback, and a proven winner. He might never be Brady or Brees elite as far as statistics...yet you see where their gaudy numbers got them this year.

Here's what people need to understand....next year, Flacco will come out and play one game and look unstoppable, and throw two picks the next one. He might never be consistent, but he's good enough to get you where you want to go, and he's clutch. End of the day, he might go down as the winningest quarterback in nfl history one day, and I'd much prefer that to gaudy statistics.
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The way Flacco and Caldwell are gelling, Flacco may very well have a consistently strong season next year.

But either way, you are right. Its the wins that count. Matt Ryan may put up better numbers, but he's won one playoff game in five seasons. Flacco has won playoff games in every single one of his five seasons. Id take Flacco over Ryan/wins over stats any day.
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Joe certainly gets the job done. Thank goodness that the defenses have dropped as many of his passes as they have though lol. That rocket arm comes in handy.
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I just wanted the team to W.I.N. yea we all want our guys to throw 3k,4k,5k yards and over 50 TD's yada yada yada......... how bout just being a winning quarterback, Flacco wins games, its been proven year after year since he came into the league, if he wasn't "good" enough to be a good.. no no..great QB..... the Ravens would not be in the position they are/have been. (5 straight seasons in playoffs, all with at least 1 win, 3 AFC Championship games, and now a Superbowl berth. this team has always been about the TEAM...the TEAM and oh yea.... the TEAM! ever since harbaugh came here, that's the mindset he instilled upon the players. For the team, its never about the Pro bowls and awards. those are for individuals. THIS right here... THIS is for the team.....AND Flacco has yet to be in the pro bowl. so individual stats are meaningless to me as far as im concerned.
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[quote name='Free Agent' timestamp='1359474268' post='1334001']
The way Flacco and Caldwell are gelling, Flacco may very well have a consistently strong season next year.

But either way, you are right. Its the wins that count. Matt Ryan may put up better numbers, but he's won one playoff game in five seasons. Flacco has won playoff games in every single one of his five seasons. Id take Flacco over Ryan/wins over stats any day.
[/quote]

Well Caldwell may be a head coaching candidate after the Super Bowl . I hope he's stays here .
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"Teamwork makes the dream work"

Who cares if he's not elite exactly, I don't see the elite quarterbacks all making the Superbowl anymore? Saints have a losing record this year. We beat the Patriots twice, knocked out Denver. Where is Green Bay? I don't mean any disrespect to the teams I've mentioned, but all these "elite" QBs, aren't they supposed to be in the Superbowl?

Teamwork is all you need, it's been a team effort throughout, and will continue to be a team effort. As long as we go on the field with this mindset and playing like this, who needs Flacco to be an elite QB?
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[quote name='Hjulmann' timestamp='1359479412' post='1334072']
"Teamwork makes the dream work"

Who cares if he's not elite exactly, I don't see the elite quarterbacks all making the Superbowl anymore? Saints have a losing record this year. We beat the Patriots twice, knocked out Denver. Where is Green Bay? I don't mean any disrespect to the teams I've mentioned, but all these "elite" QBs, aren't they supposed to be in the Superbowl?

Teamwork is all you need, it's been a team effort throughout, and will continue to be a team effort.[b] As long as we go on the field with this mindset and playing like this, who needs Flacco to be an elite QB?[/b]
[/quote]

So spot on! It may cost Flacco good standing with the stat nerds and general public, but I'm willing to bet that Peyton will rather have a SB ring than the MVP trophy that he is likely to get.

It's unfortunate that so many people would rather believe a stat sheet than what they see with their very own eyes.
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[quote name='jimmypowder' timestamp='1359478948' post='1334066']
Well Caldwell may be a head coaching candidate after the Super Bowl . I hope he's stays here .
[/quote]

Great news is that I believe Caldwell already is coming back as our OC next year.
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[quote name='3-4ravdef509' timestamp='1359473551' post='1333993']
I used to be so frusterated with Flacco's inconsistencies. I wanted him to throw over 30 touchdowns. I wanted him to throw over 4,000 yards, complete 65% of his passes...etc etc. I wanted him to garner national respect.

But end of the day, I don't think he'll ever be that. Instead, he's in my mind a great quarterback, and a proven winner. He might never be Brady or Brees elite as far as statistics...yet you see where their gaudy numbers got them this year.

Here's what people need to understand....next year, Flacco will come out and play one game and look unstoppable, and throw two picks the next one. He might never be consistent, but he's good enough to get you where you want to go, and he's clutch. End of the day, he might go down as the winningest quarterback in nfl history one day, and I'd much prefer that to gaudy statistics.
[/quote]

This is really dead on, and it goes to show that while perception drives reality it can still be misleading. I also agree that Flacco's upside is enormous, and it can cause one to salivate at his potential. So when he doesn't always live up to expectations its easy to get frustrated. But let's face the some of the facts here objectively.

Wikipedia="An [b]elite[/b] in [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_theory"]political[/url] and [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociology"]sociological theory[/url], is a small group of people who control a [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_inequality"]disproportionate amount of wealth[/url] or [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_power"]political power[/url]."

Does the word elite even apply to football players? It certainly does to the ownership, but to the players its a misnomer. We are experiencing an unprecedented age of football where the QB play today is totally superior to when we won the Super Bowl. Half of the QB's playing now would blow the competition out of the water 20 years ago, and thats no joke.

So who came up with the idea elite in the first place? I understand what they mean as far as the best of the best. So most pundits simply argue about Brady and Manning being interchangeable 1, and 2 depending on how critical championships are to the evaluator. But the biggest difference between Brady/Manning and the rest of the QB's in the league is age.

In 10 years where will Flacco be? Will he be in Baltimore, will he be a multi championship winner? At the current pace Joe is on he would blow both Manning/Brady out of the water. So its reasonable to assume that no human could keep such a pace, especially because the position by nature is so team oriented. But yes the caveat is that the pace Joe is on is both unprecedented, and would put him into the hall of fame at this rate.
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He's outplayed both Brady and Manning in the playoffs, so I'd call him elite at this point.
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[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1359479930' post='1334085']


Great news is that I believe Caldwell already is coming back as our OC next year.
[/quote]

Man I hope your right .There were comments on tv that a few teams wanted to interview him for a
head coaching position but cannot because we are in the Super Bowl and still playing .
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[quote name='jimmypowder' timestamp='1359484685' post='1334246']
Man I hope your right .
[/quote]

BAL doesn't really have a choice, at this juncture. You don't fire personnel that brought your team to the Super Bowl, unless you're Jerry Jones...
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[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1359479834' post='1334083']
So spot on! It may cost Flacco good standing with the stat nerds and general public, but I'm willing to bet that Peyton will rather have a SB ring than the MVP trophy that he is likely to get.

[b]It's unfortunate that so many people would rather believe a stat sheet than what they see with their very own eyes.[/b]
[/quote]
[img]http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/27249389.jpg[/img]
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Flacco this year tied himself with Tom Brady, Donovan McNabb, Brett Favre, Troy Aikman, and Ken Stabler as the only quarterbacks to win a play-off game in each of 5 consecutive seasons.

Nobody has ever won one in each of 6 consecutive seasons, so if Flacco wins another play-off game next year, he is truly into uncharted territory for a quarterback.

Out of all active quarterbacks, only Joe Flacco and Tom Brady have ever had a better streak than 3 consecutive seasons with a post-season win.

There have been 15 total occurrences among ALL active quarterbacks of winning a play-off game in back to back seasons. 5 of those occurrences belong to Tom Brady (2003-2007 represents 4 of them, and 2011-2012 represents the fifth), and Joe Flacco has 4 of them (2008-2012), so 60% of all cases are represented by Brady and Flacco.

The others are Matt Hasselbeck (2005-2007), who is the only other active player to have more than 1 occurrence of back-to-back seasons with a play-off win (2 times for him), and then one each for Mark Sanchez (2009-2010), Philip Rivers (2007-2008), Ben Roethlisberger (2004-2005, which is his rookie & second season, hasn't done it since), and Peyton Manning (2003-2004).

Drew Brees, Eli Manning, Aaron Rodgers, Matt Ryan, etc. have all never had back-to-back seasons with a post-season win.

Since Joe Flacco entered the league, it's happened only 6 times, 4 of which are Flacco, one is Brady, and one is Sanchez.
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Flaco definitely flips on the "Elite" switch come playoff time, every year for the past 5 years.
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To me, Flacco is the definition of an Elite quarterback. From where I'm sitting, an Elite quarterback is one who shows he can consistently win games at any level of competition. Flacco may not be consistent game-to-game, but when it comes to the competition this kid will elevate his play at the drop of a hat. It's crazy but it's really the only ability you need to be successful.
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[color=#333333][font=Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3]Flacco = 15 TDs 2 INTs in his last 7 playoff games (5-2) [/size][/font][/color]
[color=#333333][font=Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3]Brady = 15 TDs 10 INTs in his last 7 playoff games. (3-4) [/size][/font][/color]
[color=#333333][font=Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3]Peyton = 14 TDs 6 INTs in his last 7 playoff games. (2-5) [/size][/font][/color]
[color=#333333][font=Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3]Eli = 11 TDs 4 INTs in his last 7 playoff games. (6-1) [/size][/font][/color]
[color=#333333][font=Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3]Rodgers = 14 TDs 5 INTs in his last 7 playoff games. (5-2) [/size][/font][/color]
[color=#333333][font=Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3]Roethlisberger = 8 TDs 6 INTs in his last 7 playoff games. (5-2) [/size][/font][/color]
[color=#333333][font=Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3]Brees = 19 TDs 3 INTs in his last 7 playoff games (4-3)[/size][/font][/color]

[color=#333333][font=Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3]Hes definitely elite.He wouldve had 4000 yards this year if it wasnt for us sitting him in the last game of the year and pulling him in the 4th quarter vs the bengals and raiders.In my opinion,if he can prove once and for all that he can win a sb this weekend hell be the 5th best qb in the league right behind Rodgers,Brady,Peyton and Brees.[/size][/font][/color]
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[quote name='3-4ravdef509' timestamp='1359473551' post='1333993']
I used to be so frusterated with Flacco's inconsistencies. I wanted him to throw over 30 touchdowns. I wanted him to throw over 4,000 yards, complete 65% of his passes...etc etc. I wanted him to garner national respect.

But end of the day, I don't think he'll ever be that. Instead, he's in my mind a great quarterback, and a proven winner. He might never be Brady or Brees elite as far as statistics...yet you see where their gaudy numbers got them this year.

Here's what people need to understand....next year, Flacco will come out and play one game and look unstoppable, and throw two picks the next one. He might never be consistent, but he's good enough to get you where you want to go, and he's clutch. End of the day, he might go down as the winningest quarterback in nfl history one day, and I'd much prefer that to gaudy statistics.
[/quote]


I say with Cam gone Flacco comes out much more consistent next year and finally goes over 4000 yards and puts up at least 30 tds. I think the days of inconsistent play calling are now behind us. When a plan is working the team might actually stick to it. One of the reasons behind this will be Flacco is now going to be the "General" on offense. I see a top 10 offense and defense next year if healthy.
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For all the flack Flacco gets for not being a good road quarterback, it's interesting that he's won 27 games on the road in his 5 year career, which is the most in the NFL over the past 5 years. He's played in 50 road games, which means he actually does have a winning record on the road (27-23 for a .540 winning percentage).

Actually, if you look at every QB in NFL history, only 6 quarterbacks have ever had more than 27 road wins in a 5-year span. Looking at their bests:


Tom Brady (34)
Peyton Manning (32)
Eli Manning (31)
Joe Montana (29)
Troy Aikman (28)
Donovan McNabb (28)

And only one other quarterback matches Flacco's 27 in 5 years: Roger Staubach.

Pretty good company.

I can come up with lists and leader boards all day long where Flacco sits among a very select few quarterbacks on these all-time lists.

They are all a great sign. Only problem I see is that Donovan McNabb pops up on almost all of them as well... Since I don't think he'll ever make the Hall, it means Flacco will have to do more if he'll ever have a chance (as if that wasn't obvious) of being considered elite and maybe some day qualifying for the Hall.

The thing is, Flacco makes these lists in just his first 5 years. Most of these other players have 10 or more seasons over which they had opportunities to make their way to these lists. If Flacco can keep up the success he's had so far, he'll be in a league of his own.

The one I'm most interested in is if we can make the play-offs and win a game next year, he would be the only quarterback in NFL history to win a play-off game in 6 consecutive seasons.
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