Haloti Ngata, where ARE you?

[baltravensrj55]

I decided to dedicate watching most of the Broncos game to watching Ngata. Did anyone else notice he is looking really lethargic out there? He is standing straight up and isn't ALWAYS getting double teamed despite what many of you think. I saw multiple time he was getting single blocked and that one person was pushing him back. I think Ngata is a good player but I do think we overpayed him. What do you guys think?

Did we overpay Ngata and has he performed up to his contract? Please leave the negativity at home this is supposed to be some constructive criticism. I know he isn't reading this but I want to know what you Ravens think about his big deal?

Ps. This isn't a thread saying Ngata sucks, because he doesn't. I just don't think he is playing like he is being paid.

[cursona pirate]

Maybe he is injured like reported

[rlh445]

Eh Ngata's been having some problems lately. It stems from his injury but I think it's a little mental too. Did you see that article where it's claimed he's been talking perhaps an early retirement because of all the bumps and bruises (putting it lightly)? I think if we win a Lombardi this year and he heals up, he'll be back to his old self next year. Even if we don't, an off-season will work wonders for him. He just got banged up early and hasn't fully recovered but he's still out there pushing it so I can't be too hard on him.

[TDubbs]

I remember a year ago we had him lose weight, and this year had him put it back on (please correct me if Im wrong). That was a huge mistake. Whatever Ngata has weighed, he's always moved around fine. With his body type the goal should always be maintaing and gaining muscle (I believe). This is where the injury problems started .. Especially last year when he had that brutal thigh contusion.

I will say, maybe his cap hit is too high. But the alternative of not signing him wouldn't of been any better. As well as, Im sure any Ravens fan knows, his value can't always be measured in stats. Constantly demanding double teams because of who he is has a ripple effect on the Defense as a whole. Because of the huge splash plays we've seen him make, when you don't see him make them, there is always something left to be desired from #92

[raybaby]

I definitely miss 2010 Ngata but what are you gonna do. He seems to have nagging injuries so..

[bauer77]

I think it has a little to do with his weight, but it has more to do with injury. I still don't think he's 100% out there, and hasn't been all season.

[jaege]

I figure we see him every time that Kruger or Suggs or Mcphee or Ellerbee make a sack or a tackle. With him taking those double teams it lets others get penetration. Besides he does have a bunch of sacks and tackles himself. He has something like 50 or so tackles and 5 or 6 sacks. Not too bad for the walking wounded.

[izvoodoo]

Yeah he's been playing with a bad knee all year. Watcha gonna do?

[1/28/01]

Where? On the field battling it out while hurt. Taking on two blockers and more than likely allowing Jones, McPhee and Kruger to do what they've been doing!

Yeah, 5 sacks also!

[Tank 92]

[quote name='baltravensrj55' timestamp='1358196229' post='1312059']
I decided to dedicate watching most of the Broncos game to watching Ngata. Did anyone else notice he is looking really lethargic out there? He is standing straight up and isn't ALWAYS getting double teamed despite what many of you think. I saw multiple time he was getting single blocked and that one person was pushing him back. I think Ngata is a good player but I do think we overpayed him. What do you guys think?

Did we overpay Ngata and has he performed up to his contract? Please leave the negativity at home this is supposed to be some constructive criticism. I know he isn't reading this but I want to know what you Ravens think about his big deal?

Ps. This isn't a thread saying Ngata sucks, because he doesn't. I just don't think he is playing like he is being paid.
[/quote]


You should leave my man alone. He's been playing injured forever and never complains.

[Malkavian Raven]

[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]He put on weight during the off-season...[/i][/font]
[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]Has a lingering injury...[/i][/font]
[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]Was playing at an oxygen deprived high altitude...[/i][/font]
[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]Against a QB that was playing at an up-tempo and dominating TOP...[/i][/font]

[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]...so, I can see how he might be a little lethargic.[/i][/font]

[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]Did we overpay him? When he's healthy, I'd say he's worth every penny. Right now, he may not be getting any real penetration behind the line, but he's still causing mismatch problems and which helps get the LBs back there.[/i][/font]

[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]Give him a full off-season to rest, he should be good as new.[/i][/font]

[dacoats]

did you see him on the 3rd and 1?

he crushed that gap........

[gabefergy]

This again? Ngata is playing hurt. We all know that, and he is still effective! The Broncos never got their run game going largely because Ngata and the Dline doing work. He really dominated Kuper all game.

[H8R]

Please see the" Ngata take the money "thread that I started. He's actually been playing better. Still at times gets pushed around by single blockers, but not as often. He seems to be getting healthier... but we need MORE

[H8R]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1358203426' post='1312256']
This again? Ngata is playing hurt. We all know that, and he is still effective! The Broncos never got their run game going largely because Ngata and the Dline doing work. He really dominated Kuper all game.
[/quote]

They never got the run game going because Moreno left the game. Hillman still had some good runs. The Dline wore down their Oline though, I will say that.

[D_UP]

"Did we overpay" you cutting checks? Some people are never satisfied. If he was standing on sideline and not playing instead playing through injuries folks would still be crying foul.

[GrimCoconut]

No, we didn't overpay. He is a top DE when healthy. I think he is better than JJ Watt, personally. Probably get some people disagreeing with me there. But anyway, he is an athletic DE who can play any position on the DL in a 4-3 or 3-4. He can even play other positions as well. He has been injured and possibly has taken plays off due to injury but what do you want from a man who is hurt? I think he is more good than not and he is compensating for Cody. I think there is a correlation between 2010 Ngata being dominant with Gregg at NT and 2011/2012 being not so dominant.

We need a new NT or a new DE. Ngata needs some help.

[gnostic]

[quote][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I think he is better than JJ Watt, personally.[/font][/color][/quote]

You can think that, but you'd be wrong. JJ Watt had one of the greatest seasons ever for a defensive player this year. Ngata was an elite defensive lineman for sure, but what JJ Watt has done is historic.

[izvoodoo]

[quote name='gnostic' timestamp='1358212105' post='1312398']
You can think that, but you'd be wrong. JJ Watt had one of the greatest seasons ever for a defensive player this year. Ngata was an elite defensive lineman for sure, but what JJ Watt has done is historic.
[/quote]
If Watt and Ngata were on the same line though...

[izvoodoo]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1358209809' post='1312363']
No, we didn't overpay. He is a top DE when healthy. I think he is better than JJ Watt, personally. Probably get some people disagreeing with me there. But anyway, he is an athletic DE who can play any position on the DL in a 4-3 or 3-4. He can even play other positions as well. He has been injured and possibly has taken plays off due to injury but what do you want from a man who is hurt? I think he is more good than not and he is compensating for Cody. I think there is a correlation between 2010 Ngata being dominant with Gregg at NT and 2011/2012 being not so dominant.

We need a new NT or a new DE. Ngata needs some help.
[/quote]
I think Art Jones is a starting DE. I think our focus should be NT or DE/OLB. Depending on if you mean the 5 technique or like Suggs DE

[The Raven]

[quote name='gnostic' timestamp='1358212105' post='1312398']
You can think that, but you'd be wrong. JJ Watt had one of the greatest seasons ever for a defensive player this year. Ngata was an elite defensive lineman for sure, but what JJ Watt has done is historic.
[/quote]

Disagree. Would JJ Watt be able to do what he does in our scheme? I doubt it. Watt plays in a scheme that gives him fewer responsibilities than Ngata. His job is easier than Ngata's.

[H8R]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1358213074' post='1312410']


Disagree. Would JJ Watt be able to do what he does in our scheme? I doubt it. Watt plays in a scheme that gives him fewer responsibilities than Ngata. His job is easier than Ngata's.
[/quote]

Apples and Oranges. Watt was a monster , don't discredit his season.Watt has been more disruptive , as he should be... Totally different players. Id like to see Suggs and Watt on the same line . : D

[The Raven]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1358213420' post='1312414']
Apples and Oranges. Watt was a monster , don't discredit his season.Watt has been more disruptive , as he should be... Totally different players. Id like to see Suggs and Watt on the same line . : D
[/quote]

Definitely not discrediting him. Dude is a complete monster. Just saying that his scheme is more conducive to him having individual success. Our scheme asks Ngata to occupy two gaps. Watt is only responsible for one.

Watt and Suggs on the same line would be apocalyptic.

[izvoodoo]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1358213420' post='1312414']
Apples and Oranges. Watt was a monster , don't discredit his season.Watt has been more disruptive , as he should be... Totally different players. Id like to see Suggs and Watt on the same line . : D
[/quote]
Ngata Wilfork Watt. Just no where to hide.

[H8R]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1358213658' post='1312418']


Definitely not discrediting him. Dude is a complete monster. Just saying that his scheme is more conducive to him having individual success. Our scheme asks Ngata to occupy two gaps. Watt is only responsible for one.

Watt and Suggs on the same line would be apocalyptic.
[/quote]

They're not asked to do the same thing because they don't do the same things well. We play to Ngatas strength and the Texans play to Watts. We're not asking Ngata to get 20 sacks.. and he never will. Watt can do almost everything that Ngata can.. Ngata can't do the same. If Watt were in our defense, he'd WRECK things. no question.

[H8R]

[quote name='izvoodoo' timestamp='1358213841' post='1312422']

Ngata Wilfork Watt. Just no where to hide.
[/quote]

Watt Ngata Wilfork Suggs . forget about it.

[izvoodoo]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1358214001' post='1312426']
Watt Ngata Wilfork Suggs . forget about it.
[/quote]
Little off topic, but if you could pick the 4 LBs behind it who would it be. In my mind it would be:
Ngata Wilfork Watt

[izvoodoo]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1358214001' post='1312426']
Watt Ngata Wilfork Suggs . forget about it.
[/quote]
Little off topic, but if you could pick the 4 LBs behind it who would it be. In my mind it would be:
Ngata Wilfork Watt
Clay Matthews, Patrick Willis, Brian Cushing and Suggs

[Guest Moderator 6]

What does "where you at" mean?

[gabefergy]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1358207141' post='1312324']
They never got the run game going because Moreno left the game. Hillman still had some good runs. The Dline wore down their Oline though, I will say that.
[/quote]

They averaged 3.0 YPC so I would say the Dline, starting with Ngata, was very effective. Hillman was actually better than Moreno but still only averaged 3.8 YPC.