Any OC Candidates from Black Monday Fallout?

[dhstandard]

[quote name='PurpleCorsair' timestamp='1356986461' post='1285117']
Zorn, anyone?
[/quote]

Didn't Zorn get stripped of his playcalling duties after a 4-0 start and losing pretty much every last game? The guy isn't a good OC.

[AsianRice]

[quote name='redrum52' timestamp='1357002053' post='1285376']
What offensive line, qb or running backs did he have to work with? If Flacco is as great as you all claim with Whisenhutt we should have a potent offense. [b]And how many points did Payton hang on us when he was with the Giants in that Super Bowl? I'll wait...[/b]
[/quote]
huh??2000 defense are going down to best defense in the history......good comparison *rolled eyes*

[dhstandard]

[quote name='flaccopoe' timestamp='1356987197' post='1285143']
I know Schwartz started off as a DC, but he's led one of the most electrifying passing attacks in the league! A far better offensive mind than defensive. And Kevin Gilbride might very well be available come Monday, given the Giants' gigantic regression after winning the Super Bowl just a year ago. Even Manning got way worse.
[/quote]

An electric passing game with a strong armed qb and the best receiver to come into the league since Jerry Rice. Honestly, Megatron is bigger, can jump higher, and run faster than the majority of receivers in the league. I wouldn't give much credit to the HC.

[dhstandard]

[quote name='K-Dog' timestamp='1356994225' post='1285276']
I REALLY dont get the Norv obsession.

I see nothing in the past twenty years that warrent such hype.
[/quote]

His offenses have been the best in the league when he was OC. The guy managed to become a head coach after being fired so many times because of how good he was as an OC. That says something.

[redrum52]

[quote name='AsianRice' timestamp='1357002361' post='1285383']

huh??2000 defense are going down to best defense in the history......good comparison *rolled eyes*
[/quote]


So you will take into account what Payton had to work against but not the fact that Arizona was offensively inept due to personnel?

[dhstandard]

[quote name='redrum52' timestamp='1357004846' post='1285442']
So you will take into account what Payton had to work against but not the fact that Arizona was offensively inept due to personnel?
[/quote]

Payton and the Giants actually had a good season though. That's one game compared to 16. In the past few years Arizona has been awful and despite all the reasons for it, a great OC will make something out of nothing. The cardinals are nothing even with a very strong defense.

Sean Payton turned the Saints into a Super Bowl team and look what happened to them with out him. That's a head coach.

[stan]

[quote name='GrimCoconut' timestamp='1356989822' post='1285208']
Just because he did not do well in Arizona does not mean he is a poor coordinator. He was a HC, and it is proven than some coordinators do not transition well to HC. Pagano's defense isn't exactly the best.

Having a bad OL and poor QBs don't translate well for any OC.
[/quote]
You're talking about Ken Wisenhunt. Ever since he made it to the Superbowl with Denny Green's Players his team has been going down hill. He took a silk purse and made it into a sow's ear.

[stan]

No I don't see any OC candidates from Black Monday fallout because I think Hugh Jackson Is the best offensive coordinator in the NFL. It's a crime this man is an obscure position coach. Everywhere he's gone and had any say in the offensive play the offense has flourished. Start in Cincinnati as a receivers coach. Jackson was given much imput into the offense and they went 15-1. In Atlanta he took over as interim coach and lit-it-up the last few games of the season with, of all QBs, Chris Remond at the helm. Then in Baltimore as a quarterbacks coach he helped Flacco and our offense for 2 years before he was appropriately hired as head coach in Oakland. Our offense hasn't been the same since. All he did in Oakland was turn a rag tag buch of underachievers into a very good offense. Darren Mcfadden and Darius Heyward Bey became players to have on your fantisy team.
Hugh Jackson is the best offensive coordinator since Ted Marchabroda. Ted made all Pros out of every quarterback he ever worked with. Hugh might even be better. His run blocking scemes and play calling are brilliant.
In my opinion Hugh Jackson is a legitimate offensive genius. He was my pick when people called for Cam's dismisal a few years back.

[jazz1988]

I like pat shurmur and hue jackson so far they are the only two whom i think can be great additions as oc or maybe even wide receiver coaches

[Grendelwulf21]

[quote name='Bravens292' timestamp='1356986839' post='1285129']
i like what caldwell is doing. remember the majority of the plays are still cam's plays so i'd like to see what he can do with his own scheme and playbook. No need to be discussing OC's right now.
[/quote]

I agree completely, I'd love to see what he can come up with in the off-season, Yes, he's been a QB coach, but doesn't mean he can't learn or already has a great mind to be an OC, it's a gamble I'd take, if the players really like him, and if they'd be willing to fight for him on the field, so that also means something too, emotions are involved too, they're not robots (even though they get payed A LOT to play 110% hahahaha)

[GrimCoconut]

For me personally, my #1 pick for OC is Hugh Jackson if we are going to move Caldwell back to QB coach. I like the fact that he plays his players to their strengths rather than make them work in his system. I like Jackson better than Ken.

[ravens_4life]

caldell isnt going anywhere. even if we get blown out hes not going anywhere. he will be our o.c next year. he hasnt proved hmself yet. 3 games isnt even close. we gave the humanoid cam cameron 5 friggin years. caldwell is here to stay. why would you want norv friggin turner as o.c that guy has done nothing in san diego.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='ravens_4life' timestamp='1357019695' post='1285578']
caldell isnt going anywhere. even if we get blown out hes not going anywhere. he will be our o.c next year. he hasnt proved hmself yet. 3 games isnt even close. we gave the humanoid cam cameron 5 friggin years. caldwell is here to stay. why would you want norv friggin turner as o.c that guy has done nothing in san diego.
[/quote]
While I am not calling for Norv or saying we should get rid of Caldwell, it does make some sense to keep Caldwell as QB coach and get a guy who is a proven NCAA or NFL OC. First of all, it helps Flacco due to the QB coach. Second, you still don't know what Caldwell can do. It is too early to say. That is a good thing and a bad thing.

If the right coach came along, I am 100% for putting Caldwell back at QB coach. Personally, I like Jackson the best. Joe has familiarity with him and I think he can be an effective coordinator.

[ellicottraven]

None other than Norv Turner imo.... it is rumored that he is looking for a quiet place with a good QB, where all he would like to do is call plays and help win ball games. I think he has both those options here in Baltimore and if he interviews with the Ravens, I think he will take the job if offered it.

Keep in mind, the reputation of the Ravens management across the league is stellar. So, I would think Baltimore should be on the top of any potential coach's radar...

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

[quote name='ravens_4life' timestamp='1357019695' post='1285578']
caldell isnt going anywhere. even if we get blown out hes not going anywhere. he will be our o.c next year. he hasnt proved hmself yet. 3 games isnt even close. we gave the humanoid cam cameron 5 friggin years. caldwell is here to stay. why would you want norv friggin turner as o.c that guy has done nothing in san diego.
[/quote]
Caldwell has never been the OC in his career prior to the past two games. He's far from set in stone.

And I would love Norv Turner as OC. Cam isn't even in his league as a play-caller.

[bauer77]

[quote name='stan' timestamp='1357007316' post='1285493']
No I don't see any OC candidates from Black Monday fallout because I think Hugh Jackson Is the best offensive coordinator in the NFL. It's a crime this man is an obscure position coach. Everywhere he's gone and had any say in the offensive play the offense has flourished. [b]Start in Cincinnati as a receivers coach. Jackson was given much imput into the offense and they went 15-1.[/b] In Atlanta he took over as interim coach and lit-it-up the last few games of the season with, of all QBs, Chris Remond at the helm. Then in Baltimore as a quarterbacks coach he helped Flacco and our offense for 2 years before he was appropriately hired as head coach in Oakland. Our offense hasn't been the same since. All he did in Oakland was turn a rag tag buch of underachievers into a very good offense. Darren Mcfadden and Darius Heyward Bey became players to have on your fantisy team.
Hugh Jackson is the best offensive coordinator since Ted Marchabroda. Ted made all Pros out of every quarterback he ever worked with. Hugh might even be better. His run blocking scemes and play calling are brilliant.
In my opinion Hugh Jackson is a legitimate offensive genius. He was my pick when people called for Cam's dismisal a few years back.
[/quote]


First, its HUE Jackson. Second, Cincinnati never went 15-1 when he was there, where exactly did you get that from? lol. And when Hue went to the Falcons, Chris Redman didn't start till week 12 (off-topic, but he did well in 4 of the 5 games he started). They actually had Joey Harrington starting till then.

[tctony]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1356992111' post='1285240']
As OC, maybe not, but I wouldn't mind sticking with Caldwell as OC and hiring Zorn to be Joe's QB coach. Caldwell would design the schemes, but Zorn really had Joe thinking about footwork and pocket presence in 2010, and had him moving around in the pocket more than any time except his rookie season. And I don't believe either Zorn or Caldwell would have a problem working with the other.
[/quote]

Jim Zorn really got the short end of the stick. If he would come back I bet Joe would respond really well. Cam was too much of a control freak.

[stan]

[quote name='bauer77' timestamp='1357029947' post='1285619']
First, its HUE Jackson. Second, Cincinnati never went 15-1 when he was there, where exactly did you get that from? lol. And when Hue went to the Falcons, Chris Redman didn't start till week 12 (off-topic, but he did well in 4 of the 5 games he started). They actually had Joey Harrington starting till then.
[/quote]
Correct. My mistake. They went 11-5 in 2005. I was looking at the wrong stats and got confused. You're right. His name is spelled Hue ... but he did crank up Atlanta's offense as interum head coach the last few games of the season, as I said and did the same in Oakland. His run blocking scemes and play calling are brilliant. Our offense hasn't been the same since he left.
Looks like Pat Shurmer has the lead though.

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='flaccopoe' timestamp='1356994915' post='1285287']
Hue Jackson?! He drove the Raiders into the ground! Even Tom Cable would be better, at least he understands offensive lines!
[/quote]

HC does not equal OC. There are plenty of position coaches and coordinators in this league who were terrible head coaches - best current example might be Wade Philips - absolutely clueless as a head coach, 0-5 in the post-season, yet he goes to Houston, a team that finished, in terms of PPG allowed, 24th in 2007, 27th in 2008, 17th in 2009, 29th in 2010. Wade has been there 2 seasons, and in those two years, 2011 and 2012, they've finished 4th and 9th in PPG allowed. Hue Jackson A) has a close relationship with Joe Flacco and Ray Rice, B. oversaw the development of Carson Palmer at both USC and Cinci, C) did great things with Ochocinco and TJ in Cinci, and D) helped tutor Flacco in his early years. Then Hue went to Oakland and in 2010 they finished 6th in the nfl in scoring after finishing 31st in 2009. Hue took Jason Campbell off the scrapheap and made him a serviceable quarterback for the Raiders. Now I have heard that he has some issues with arrogance and a know-it-all attitude, but I can't deny that he's done good things with our franchise quarterback and running back, and he runs a west-coast style system that emphasizes spreading the ball out, which I think ideally suits the skill set of the receivers we have here. I think he would be a solid fit here as offensive coordinator.

[Ravenslifer]

Please NO Norv Turner - I want a philosophy change from the Air Coryell system.

[Kwothdaraven]

No norv turner please. Im so sick of the air coryell and we dont even have the personell for it.

I say keep caldwell. I like what he has done with cams horrible plays

[Desert]

[quote name='Kwothdaraven' timestamp='1357059814' post='1285775']
No norv turner please. Im so sick of the air coryell and we dont even have the personell for it.

I say keep caldwell. I like what he has done with cams horrible plays
[/quote]

X2

[T3hRaven]

It looks like Whisenhunt might get another HC job, so Caldwell is my first choice. I hope he plans on installing a different system from the Fail Coryell, but we really don't know what he's going to do if he's given the reins in terms of scheme.

[The Raven]

This thread is chock full of lolz. I don't even know where to begin!

[poedacrow]

I was kinda hopin' we'd be able to hold on to Caldwell for another year or so. (Sidenote; stiller friend of mine is hoping they ditch Todd Haley and pick up Cam Cameron.)

[PolishRifle]

[quote name='poedacrow' timestamp='1357117460' post='1286488']
I was kinda hopin' we'd be able to hold on to Caldwell for another year or so. (Sidenote; stiller friend of mine is hoping they ditch Todd Haley and pick up Cam Cameron.)
[/quote]

The contract talks with Flacco will probably influence this. If Caldwell does well with Joe in the playoffs, he might stay, but if Joe doesn't perform great he still would be too good to simply let go without giving him at least one season more under an experienced OC who isn't Cam Cameron.
Wouldn't surprise me, if the Ravens put a tag on Joe and hire some accomplished OC, just to figure out how much or how little the FO needs to pay him. Let's not forget QBs are the biggest investment you can make in the NFL, so Ozzie and CO. need to be clever about this.
In a way, it is the Ravens own fault. They really should've fired Cam after season 4 and given Joe a new OC, just so they can properly evaluate Flacco.
Too bad, Jason Garrett didn't get fired. He was my #1 candidate. Still, the game against the Giants gives me hope. Let's see, if the game against the Colts can renew that.

[poedacrow]

[quote name='PolishRifle' timestamp='1357120754' post='1286493']
The contract talks with Flacco will probably influence this. If Caldwell does well with Joe in the playoffs, he might stay, but if Joe doesn't perform great he still would be too good to simply let go without giving him at least one season more under an experienced OC who isn't Cam Cameron.
Wouldn't surprise me, if the Ravens put a tag on Joe and hire some accomplished OC, just to figure out how much or how little the FO needs to pay him. Let's not forget QBs are the biggest investment you can make in the NFL, so Ozzie and CO. need to be clever about this.
In a way, it is the Ravens own fault. They really should've fired Cam after season 4 and given Joe a new OC, just so they can properly evaluate Flacco.
Too bad, Jason Garrett didn't get fired. He was my #1 candidate. Still, the game against the Giants gives me hope. Let's see, if the game against the Colts can renew that.
[/quote]

[poedacrow]

[quote name='PolishRifle' timestamp='1357120754' post='1286493']
The contract talks with Flacco will probably influence this. If Caldwell does well with Joe in the playoffs, he might stay, but if Joe doesn't perform great he still would be too good to simply let go without giving him at least one season more under an experienced OC who isn't Cam Cameron.
Wouldn't surprise me, if the Ravens put a tag on Joe and hire some accomplished OC, just to figure out how much or how little the FO needs to pay him. Let's not forget QBs are the biggest investment you can make in the NFL, so Ozzie and CO. need to be clever about this.
In a way, it is the Ravens own fault. They really should've fired Cam after season 4 and given Joe a new OC, just so they can properly evaluate Flacco.
Too bad, Jason Garrett didn't get fired. He was my #1 candidate. Still, the game against the Giants gives me hope. Let's see, if the game against the Colts can renew that.
[/quote]
Yep, bit of a sticky wicket. Firing cam with three games left in the season puts undue pressure on Flacco and Caldwell, I think. I'd like to see him (Caldwell) hang around for continuity's sake and to see if they develop any chemistry. The results of the Colts game (and hopefully beyond) will most likely determine that. I like Garret but he doesn't seem to like to run the ball much and there's no telling what "Jerrah" has planned for the offseason. Crazy business this football stuff.

[PolishRifle]

[quote name='poedacrow' timestamp='1357122484' post='1286496']
Yep, bit of a sticky wicket. Firing cam with three games left in the season puts undue pressure on Flacco and Caldwell, I think. I'd like to see him (Caldwell) hang around for continuity's sake and to see if they develop any chemistry. The results of the Colts game (and hopefully beyond) will most likely determine that. I like Garret but he doesn't seem to like to run the ball much and there's no telling what "Jerrah" has planned for the offseason. Crazy business this football stuff.
[/quote]

I think a more diverse route tree is more important, then the run-to-pass-ratio. I don't recall us ever trying to set up the big plays with short easy ones under Cameron.
If you demand from your QB to just attack the other team deep down the field and your best receiver is more known for being strong rather then being quick and gaining separation, then you shouldn't wonder why your QB "holds to the ball too long". I believe, that to be the reason why press coverage has been such an issue for the Ravens in this season as well.
Having Boldin on your team and not working the middle of the field borders on the comical, yet we have done so for the majority of the season.
Admittedly Caldwell, seems to do just that, which I believe will be key on overcoming Joe's tendency to be streaky.
I still remember Phil Simms during the AFCCG talking how you need short high percentage throws aka "drive starters" to sometimes get QBs into a game. How our OC couldn't catch something, that one of the worst commentators in the NFL could is beyond me.
I personally don't want us to hire a guy, who is known to use the Air Coryell system like Norv Turner. I much rather see us switch that system entirely to a more West Coast Offense.

[Guest Mr. Nobody]

I want to see Caldwell have a go at it with a full off-season to prepare... but I would really like to have Zorn back at Joe's coach too... these two combined would give us a very interesting Mr Flacco for next season