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[News] Late For Work 12/20: Shooting Down A 'Pipe Dream'

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Ravens flirting with fine? McKinnie thinks he could make a difference. Peyton advises Eli.

[url=http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/article-1/Late-For-Work-1220-Shooting-Down-A-Pipe-Dream/04008310-cd16-44e2-84dd-2ad0984a2081]View the full article[/url]
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IMHO, I would like to see McKinnie back at Left Tackle. Not that he is our future, just that we were better last year with him in the lineup.
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Turner is indeed a great OC, but the odds of us landing him are probably small. We can only wish. I have my doubts about Caldwell long term. Guess we'll see.....
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Put McKinnie in or Oher is going to get Joe hurt. Oher stinks at LT he needs to be moved back to the right.
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I would love to see mckinnie come back i would love to know why he can't play anymore a couple million to warm the bench makes no sense to me . I always feel good about my ravens i don't need a sports pundit to give me any reason to . sorry eli you can call the football gods your losing this week time for our boys to stop playing around and handle there business.
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"Hensley didn't give a reason behind his opinion."

Of course he didn't. Why should a "journalist" need to provide evidence to support their stance? Ridiculous.
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@balfan23......I agree. An opinion is just that and worth what we paid for it. Zip. His opinion is just like all of our opinions. Sometimes I wonder how they manage to get paid for what they do. Wonder if they're hiring.....hmmmm...
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Having been one of Joe Flacco's strongest critics for most of his career, I would like to think I've been objective about it but that is not for me to judge. All that being said, I believe Flacco bounces back the rest of the games this season (however many that will be). The reason is that in the past few days Joe has done something he seldom, almost never, did in his career-- he owned the struggles of the offense. Any well meaning Ravens fan should be encouraged by this, and pull for the guy to succeed.

As much as Joe looked aloof on the sidelines or in games, he never seemed to put any pressure on himself-- much like the quarterback he faces on Sunday, Eli Manning, but the difference was that Eli almost always took the brunt of the criticism for the Giants' struggles and accepted it. With that came an innate desire to improve that much more (fingers held about two inches apart, cue Jim Caldwell). I believe Flacco made a major change over this past week, and the impact is yet to play out; but I hope it materializes immediately. The man who always referred to his play as "the offense's play" took total responsibility for the struggles of the Ravens on offense.

Such statements don't only have a propensity to improve Flacco's individual play, they often force the other players around him to face the guilt associated with someone else taking the bad rap for their own combined inadequacies. The receivers are forced to internally face their drops and lazy routes, the linemen may internalize their poor blocking and footwork, the backs may think twice about their subpar line reads and cuts. I think this makes the offense better overall, but it starts with the quarterback and rightfully so.

Regardless of what happens the next few games, I believe the Ravens will sign Joe Flacco to a long term deal. I earnestly hope Flacco and his representatives are sensible enough to understand that the man's health is as important as the contents of his wallet-- if not more important. If they go for the jugular; asking for the maximum contract Flacco can get because they know the Ravens are in somewhat of a bind, then they impede the team's ability to sign better linemen to protect Flacco while he plays out his monster contract. In the end he may turn out like Mike Vick; $100M contract with no linemen to block for you and then injury after injury the team is faced with no choice but to cut you after the guaranteed part of that "fools gold" deal is up and you are damaged goods. Flacco should do what Ray Rice did (and Ray is a better player, pound for pound), take a respectable deal that puts you in good range for your ability and production and leave something on the table to sign better players to put around you to keep you healthy and productive.
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I think Norv would be a better play caller than Caldwell, but there has to be someone better than that out there....
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Honestly, I'd love to see Norv Turner come to Baltimore as our OC. Turner is a great offensive mind, knows how to scheme and knows how to use his weapons. He's not a very good HC, but when it comes to offense, he is one of the best. I've always liked Andy Reid, but I think his coaching career is done. He hasn't been the same the last few years, and after the passing of his son, he just doesn't seem to be all in the game, not that I could really blame him.
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Norv says he'd be willing to be a coordinator, wouldn't like to take a year off from coaching and would like to go to a winner ... How does that eliminate him from OC conversation JH?
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I really think that only only way to end the losing streak is to shake things up. Pull Hamilton up from the practice squad and rest Suggs for the playoffs. Give Williams a few reps at wideout. Let Allen run for at least 6 to 8 carries but please don't throw him any passes. Shuffle the offensive line again. Let McKinnie earn his paycheck for the next 2 games. I was totally against Oher at LT and boy was I right. Let's not take any chances on the Giants ending Flacco's season.
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Wow. Mckinnie you must have really ticked someone off!
We've heard he's lazy but that can't be the whole story. He must have told someone to stick it where the sun don't shine :-)
Say you're sorry Bryant and get out there and help this team!
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Remember where you heard it first. Caldwell will become a head coach in the NFL before Turner or Reid get hired in B-mo. Harbaugh never wanted to dump Cam but the "statue" in the pocket Cameron offensive scheme is dated just like blaming Joe for a young O-line and a 24th ranked aging injured defense. Two of the last three games our Ravens had leads that the defense gave up to long drives and if you go back to the STEALers game a guy the same age as Ray Lewis baffled our Dean Pees tweaked "D". The offense & the defense as a team are very average. You root for the team as a whole you have on the field not the team you wish you had on the field.I'll be rooting for the Steelers at home on Sunday that will be once in my life I rooted for "them". Where's Sergio Kindle? Why can't he make this roster?
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Add my name to the "Bring Norv to Baltimore" list!

Interesting, eh, that there are no articles, not one that says "Cam's available"! Just one last kick of a dead horse! S'cuse me!
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Norv Turner runs the same offense as Cam, slow developing, predictable. Why would anyone want to continue down the path of mediocrity?
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[quote name='jravens13' timestamp='1356016806' post='1271566']
I think Norv would be a better play caller than Caldwell, but there has to be someone better than that out there....
[/quote]

With Norv Turner in the Nest, Jim Caldwell can go back to fixing what Cam screwed up with Joe E-Lite!
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Hamiton, undrafted,unproven Dallas Cowboy cast off rookie? Really? Sergio Kindle must be called up or released......Ozzie don't make mistakes drafting did he?
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@roamingcharges,
Very good post & I agree!
This is what they did for Ray Lewis a couple years ago. Ray was getting doubled a lot and had slowed some so they got some big run stuffers to help keep guys off him so he could roam. They'll have to do the same for the O line in order to protect their money guy.
I can see the FO creating a "package deal" for Joe where,
they offer an "average paycheck" but emphasize the Bennies that go with it (Stronger O line). "We would have given you XX million but since you have no pocket awareness and run like a new born deer (Except for that INT chase down!), we'll take a couple mill of that and get you some protection...Deal?"
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I doubt Sean Payton would want just to be just a OC, but if that was possible I feel that he would be better than Norv or others.
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[quote name='akacrow' timestamp='1356017652' post='1271582']
Norv Turner runs the same offense as Cam, slow developing, predictable. Why would anyone want to continue down the path of mediocrity?
[/quote] so they can continue to rant and rave and sound off on something . i actually saw some posts saying trade for tebow and first round tender for flacco ..............really? or Michael vick .......injury prone turnover machine lol i don't get it but opinions are opinions don't have to be rational.
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[quote name='Waka Flocka Flacco' timestamp='1356016939' post='1271570']
Norv says he'd be willing to be a coordinator, wouldn't like to take a year off from coaching and would like to go to a winner ... How does that eliminate him from OC conversation JH?
[/quote]

We don't know ... he didn't say.

Reid - I do see it being unlikely that he'll be an OC. Someone will hire him as an HC, because he's had real success at that position. But Norv?

I'm not sold on Norv being some sort of Godsend ... but if we were interested, I don't see how it would be such a crazy thing to imagine. What, after Norv gets fired, are there teams lining up to give him an HC position? Are there teams with a better pedigree clamoring for his services as an OC? It may not happen, but "pipe dream"? That's a silly comment.
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Caldwell just started calling plays its been a week . stop... do you know how utterly ridiculous it is to expect change in one week . in what world is that even realistic .
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[quote name='KidNme' timestamp='1356017879' post='1271588']
@roamingcharges,
Very good post & I agree!
This is what they did for Ray Lewis a couple years ago. Ray was getting doubled a lot and had slowed some so they got some big run stuffers to help keep guys off him so he could roam. They'll have to do the same for the O line in order to protect their money guy.
I can see the FO creating a "package deal" for Joe where,
they offer an "average paycheck" but emphasize the Bennies that go with it (Stronger O line). "We would have given you XX million but since you have no pocket awareness and run like a new born deer (Except for that INT chase down!), we'll take a couple mill of that and get you some protection...Deal?"
[/quote]

KidNme, thanks for the kind words (and the part about a new born deer and the chasedown that ended with the "Flaccoing"-- classic). Anyway, I do agree that Ozzie and co. will bring up Flacco's limitations at the bargaining table and let him know that if he takes a max deal, they'll have to protect themselves from an abysmal collapse of his career by taking full advantage of low guaranteed dollars built into his contract. Otherwise, he may get a reasonable 6 or 7 year deal with a good chunk of it guaranteed, while leaving some money at the table to sign a good LT-- Jake Long anybody?
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My predictions for the Ravens offseason coming up...

Player moves:

1- Joe Flacco: We resign him to a mid level contract. If he wants more we tender him and hope another team signs him and gives us a 1st and a 3rd round pick for the right to sign him.

1a- If Joe Flacco leaves, we trade for a quarterback or sign one in free agency. Top 3 available to me would be Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins and Matt Flynn.

2- Ask Boldin to take a paycut, or cut him. I like Boldin alot as a slot receiver but he isnt the receiver he used to be in Arizona. Maybe thats the Ravens fault but I dont think he deserves the money he gets. However I would love to keep him.

2a- If Anquan is gone, dont panick. Let Doss step in as the number 2 and have Steeter and Thompson battle for the 3 and 4 spots. Dont forget about Jacoby Jones being in the mix.

3- Ray Lewis and Ed Reed retire. This frees up cap space all around and would allow the Ravens to sign many young talents they have and even dip into free agency for some talent. I love them both and they are the best to ever do it at both positions, and its a shame their talent was no fully capitalized on due to lack of offense for basically all of Eds career and most of Rays (Early on the offense was actually good in the late 90's)

3a- Birk retires as well. I think its time.

4- Sign Cary Williams and Ellerbe. Alot of people may disagree with this but Williams has stepped it up as of late. I dont think he should get more than what was offered before this season however. Ellerbe is a no brainer.

5- Use some of the cap freed from Ed and Ray and possibly Anquans pay cut to sign a LT. Preferably Jake Long. Move Oher to RT. Osemele to LG. Offensive line immediately gets 5x better.

6- SIGN PITTA AND DICKSON. Especially Pitta. If Dickson walks thats okay, find another receiving tight end in the draft or in free agency. Pitta is going to be very good.

7- With Ed gone, try to sign Jairus Byrd from the Bills. I think he is a free agent this year. Someone correct me if im wrong, but I believe he is. He is a monster ballhawk.

Coaching moves: Simple. Sign Rex and Norv Turner as the coordinators.

Draft:

Round 1- Alec Ogletree MLB Georgia.

Other Round 1 if Flacco walks- Dion Jordan OLB/DE Oregon OR Jesse Williams DT Alabama.

Round 2- The best linemen available. Hopefully a Center.

Round 3- Tyrann Mathieu CB/SS LSU. I know what you're probably thinking but the guy is a playmaker. Reminds me of Charles Woodson.

Other Round 3 if Flacco walks- Baccari Rambo SS Georgia

Draft picks beyond that are the best players available.


These are just my predictions. The projected line ups assuming Flacco leaves would be:

QB- Alex Smith/Kirk Cousins/Matt Flynn
RB- Rice/Pierce
FB- Leach
WR1- Torrey Smith
WR2- Tandon Doss
Slot- Anquan Boldin or Thompson/Streeter
TE- Pitta/Dickson
LT- Jake Long
LG- Kelechi Osemele
C- Draft pick used on this
RG- Marshal Yanda
RT- Michael Oher

That offense seems pretty solid to me

Interior DLINE- Ngata, Williams(Draft pick), Jones, McPhee, Cody
Defensive ends- Terell Suggs, Dion Jordan, Paul Kruger
ROLB- Ogletree could move out here or Kruger could play back here
LOLB- Upshaw
MLB- McClain/Ellerbe/Ogletree
CB1- Lardarius Webb
CB2- Cary Williams/Jimmy Smith
CB3- Tyrann Mathieu
FS- Jairus Byrd
SS- Bernard Pollard/Baccari Rambo

Again these are my predictions. Feel free to give me negatives if you wish. I would be excited if this was what the team looked like next year. Plenty of young talent on both sides.
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Raven Maniac20 makes some great projections. One thing I would add. Ngata has to restructure his contract. He is making to much money and he has not been a dominante force consistantly. He faded last year, he has been hurt and non existant this year. He by no means should be the Ravens Highest paid player. Also we need to use Leach more or pay him less too. He makes a lot for the amount of snaps he plays.
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The only reason McKinnie has been a headache off the field for all fans because he's not in the GAME! Oher is not the answer, somebody needs to put there pride in there back pocket and start the best players!

I'm lost! We have to hold poor perfomances accountable. Thats what elite teams do!
Example:
Peyton threw half of his passes to Decker for 8 rec 133 yards and a TD. Hmmmm, Cary is our number 1 corner right now gaurding the other teams number 2 WR. He's horrible! Graham and Johnson held Thomas to 4rec 13yrds. They are 3rd and 4th string!

Sit Cary Down!

Kemo and Cody constantly pushed off the ball! Go to 4-3 or sit both of them down!
Have we considered putting Ngata back at Nose Guard in the 3-4 to get a push up the middle?
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I'm not sure why McKinnie has been relegated to the sidelines other than Harbaugh's personal doghouse. Everybody has a right to their own personal feelings, but when a head coach lets his feelings get in the way of what's best for the team, that's a problem! At this point, anything that may help Flacco be more relaxed or confident that he won't get hit from the blind side should be considered by a head coach trying to get his team out of a slump. There's not much, with all the injuries, that can be done, personnel-wise, for the defense. So, instead, try to improve the offense's ability to keep and move the ball, especially in the passing game. Not only does it help score more points (duh), you keep a limping defense on the sidelines and keep them fresh and rested when they do go on the field. The defense has played pretty well , in the early parts, of some of the most recent games. Where they break down is when the offense keeps going 3-and-out and they have to go back on the field without even catching their breath. Sometimes one player
(McKinnie?) can make a big difference. It's worth a shot!
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Two all beef patties...special sauce...lettuce , cheese pickles onions on a sesame [seed] bun. Come on Harbaugh you have the ingredient's for the Big Mac, now get him out of the doghouse so that he can help out on that O-line!!! Anything would be better than last week!!!!
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I think people need to realize that McKinnie graded out as a bottom 10 LT in 2011 as a pass blocker. Oher hasn't played well the last few weeks, but nobody was complaining about Oher at LT until December.

McKinnie can't play LT in the no-huddle. He's out of shape and lacks the endurance, everybody knows this. If you are going to put him back in the lineup, you can forget about the no-huddle offense, and defenses will pick up on that rather quickly.

I've been much less impressed with the interior blocking (particularly Birk and Reid) than I have been with Oher.
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really really ya see kirk cousin just for two games and ya procaliming as great lmao no just please no. Joe is way better than him. he got two wins ooh wow his running game is better than ours. its a fact alfred morris is having a better year than rice and pierce combined. theyre oline is much better than ours. Please stop with the cousins chant he throws more picks look at his college record. Secondly, smith he will most likely go to cardinals and i believe flacco is better than him.
We should go after norv turner provide a much better creativity in our offense.
In draft we should get a LT, FS, LB
Its time for ed and ray to retire im sorry but they arent playing at a high level. whens the last time ed got a pick this season
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Also remove reid from lg he sucks doesnt do will he gets pushed around like a punching bag, also birk last year. Gino Gradkowski will become a pro bowl center. Teams were drooling over him in the last year draft. So i dont see why we would draft a c when we really need is a left tackle
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[quote name='TheRavengers' timestamp='1356015552' post='1271539']
I'm really sick of hearing about everyone being fined for every little thing.
[/quote] Welcome to modern NFL, run by good ol' Rodger Goodell.
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[quote name='steelcityraven' timestamp='1356019127' post='1271619']
I do think that Caldwell would be fine... but honestly... if we could land TUrner as our OC! WOW we would only need a DC then!
[/quote]
I think we need to give Jim some time to see what he can do. But you're right, Norv would be a real nice pickup....

Is Pees the problem or are the injuries and not replacing JJ and Cory? When you're playing with 3rd and 4th stringers and with players that weren't even on your roster at the beginning of the season, how much can you expect?

I thought the defense played well enough to win the last few weeks.... if the offense would have pulled their weight.
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[quote name='metalraven' timestamp='1356022849' post='1271696']
Sounds like Hensely knows about as much of the situation as we do...NOTHING
[/quote]we do know one thing about the situation, and that is what we had.
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[quote name='akacrow' timestamp='1356017652' post='1271582']
Norv Turner runs the same offense as Cam, slow developing, predictable. Why would anyone want to continue down the path of mediocrity?
[/quote] Norv's Chargers ate us up with crossing patterns, pick slants and bubble screens which is no way near what we run!
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I think the plan this yr was for the offense to be top 10 or thereabouts, reducing pressure on the def. Hence Ozzie & Co didn't mind losing JJ, Cory, Haruki, Zibby, etc etc. As it turned out, offense has been disappointing (middle of the pack, roughly) and half of defense is nearly hospitalized. So not surprising that this is happening, esp at the end of the season. Have faith, though. Ravens can win AT LEAST one of these last two. With a home playoff game and with some help elsewhere, you never know. Let's make sure Eli can't hear himself think on Sunday.
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Norv Turner would take our passing game to a whole new level, and i know for sure he wouldn't forget about Ray Rice. I think he would be great for us, but i don't wanna throw Caldwell under the bus. He has atleast 3 more games to impress, and then i think the FO will decide what to do.

OL needs to be addressed in the offseason. That LG spot has been hurting us. I thought Harewood did a pretty good job, i don't see where he was struggling that bad or anything. I honestly believe that the Coaching staff thinks Reid could be a very good player at LG, so they are getting hard headed and leave him in there to try and prove something. Joe will never be able to play well until he gets better protection, being under pressure does take an effect on a QB.

I think the draft coming up needs to be OL, LB, and FS. We need a guard, if we keep both McClain and Ellerbe then we could draft a MLB late in the draft, but we def need a FS. I really don't care what we do with Ed, i wouldn't mind if he stayed, but i wouldn't be upset if he left. Skill positions on offense are set i believe, we can address them via Free Agency
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Caldwell is like having a rookie QB he needs a few years to gell in the system ,considering hes never called plays since High School says it all,we need to go out and get Norv turner or a Off Coach on this team,if you look around there are to many special teams Coaches and that is clearly Hurting us ,Pees the same thing ,he should have taken notes ,because Rex or Pagano ,Would still be able to surplant a good group out there in sub-packages ,injuries or not if you watch the Game after its over you can see more clearly he does not change his front line and Plays a soft coverage 2 or a man on man which is not fooling anyone at all at this point.
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[quote name='Bates21' timestamp='1356025227' post='1271749']
Norv Turner and Alex Smith are the two we NEED next season...hands down!
[/quote]

Why do we need Alex Smith? He just got benched and has had literally only one good seson in his career. He is no where near Flacco's level.
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