How much should we pay Flacco?

[Sizzlebshu]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1355970147' post='1271228']
I think the first option is clearly the way to go, but I would guess it will be even more backloaded in terms of [i]salary[/i]. The first two to three years he should make 4-5M in base salary but I would imagine he would get something like 35M-45M in guaranteed money with most of it coming in the form of a signing bonus. I would imagine there might also be escalators or performance bonuses worked into the deal as well that would kick in for AFC championship/SB wins and possibly Pro Bowl or number plateaus.

Just to make it simple if he gets the contract you suggested 98M over 7 years, lets say he gets 35M up front.

Then the contract needs to pay him 63M in salary over 7 years, it might look something like this:

4.5M/5.5M/7.5M/9.5M/11.5M/12M/12.5M.

After the first 3 years the new TV contracts should be fully kicked in and the salary cap will be considerably higher, probably in the range of 140M+.
[/quote]
I would be absolutely fine with this because it lets you sign Flacco for his true value in relation to the cap. Ultiamtely we only have to play this game until one of two things happens

1. Ed and Ray retire or are gone in some way

2. The TV contracts kick in.

The first way would clear up about 10 mill in cap at least. The TV contracts would likely increase the cap by the same amount, however, with the second way comes inflation.

[Sizzlebshu]

[quote name='Moderator 3' timestamp='1355969978' post='1271219']
If Flacco gets decent guaranteed money, then his salary the first year or two would be closer to the vet minimum. That also allows some breathing room against the cap.

For example, he gets $40 guaranteed on a 7 year contract. I think teams can spread the bonus only over 5 years now, so that would be $8 million per year. Year 1 he gets $2 million salary for a cap hit of $10 million. That's why a long-term deal is better than the tag. It would free up nearly $5 million in cap space.

They can also do a split bonus (half now, half next year) which would benefit our cap situation even more.
[/quote]
I didnt factor in how the guaranteed money would be paid out, which I should have, I just used the number as an idea to give you guys the amount it would require for Flacco to accept.

[CapoRocky]

I wouldn't sign Flacco beyond 5 years.

[flynismo]

I think $13M base with incentives to reach $17M would be ideal for both sides.
It's enough for Flacco to stop worrying about getting paid, and provides us a layer of protection

[SecretAgentMan]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1355971669' post='1271259']
I think $13M base with incentives to reach $17M would be ideal for both sides.
It's enough for Flacco to stop worrying about getting paid, and provides us a layer of protection
[/quote]
But Flacco cannot play. We are one of those kind of teams who has to take a QB in every round this year so that way we are reassured that [b]one [/b]is at least decent #Sarcasm
[quote name='CapoRocky' timestamp='1355971559' post='1271256']
I wouldn't sign Flacco beyond 5 years.
[/quote]
I would
[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1355970147' post='1271228']
I think the first option is clearly the way to go, but I would guess it will be even more backloaded in terms of [i]salary[/i]. The first two to three years he should make 4-5M in base salary but I would imagine he would get something like 35M-45M in guaranteed money with most of it coming in the form of a signing bonus. I would imagine there might also be escalators or performance bonuses worked into the deal as well that would kick in for AFC championship/SB wins and possibly Pro Bowl or number plateaus.

Just to make it simple if he gets the contract you suggested 98M over 7 years, lets say he gets 35M up front.

Then the contract needs to pay him 63M in salary over 7 years, it might look something like this:

4.5M/5.5M/7.5M/9.5M/11.5M/12M/12.5M.

After the first 3 years the new TV contracts should be fully kicked in and the salary cap will be considerably higher, probably in the range of 140M+.
[/quote]
Meh... Good deal and all. Just begining to turn toward the haters..... Too many of them

[AsianRice]

I think$13mil for 5yr with 40mil guaranteed is good for both side; however, Ozzie probably waits to see how Joe does in the postseason before making his final decision. On the other hand, he can gamble with Joe with 13mil for 5yr before playoff starts. Unless, Ozzie sees something about Joe that we don't see..... Right now, it is a good time to negotiate with Joe's agent...

[steeler hater]

Nothing, if you don't believe in him. Whatever it takes to keep him, if you do.

[Gordo52]

[quote name='CosmicRedPanda' timestamp='1355966554' post='1271154'][i] Make it $42-45M for 3 years, that sounds better, just in case he winds up busting and we have a better option coming up in a draft we can trade up for.[/i]
[/quote]

Johnny Football?

[Gordo52]

35

[kwed76]

Anyone thinking of the idea of maybe getting Alex Smith? Harbaugh to Harbaugh? Smith has shown he can win and be "the man". And why not re-unite him with Norv Turner as the new O.C. just a thought.

[frank21054]

Does it matter. We always wait to long on our stars, franchise them, and then they are in command for the following contract. If we want a number I say front load the deal like Ngata's deal and it helps us in case he does not pan out in the end.

[Malkavian Raven]

[quote name='Ravens<3' timestamp='1355975671' post='1271326']
Johnny Football?
[/quote]

[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]Someone got the hint. [/i][/font]

[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]~ Cosmic[/i][/font]
[font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif][i]Someone give that man a +1![/i][/font]

[cougarpines]

With all the crap Joe gets from the Baltimore fans and media he should play out whats left of his contract and leave. There are a lot of teams out there that would love to have a Flacco. The two north of Balt. in green come to mind.

[flaccopoe]

I'll withhold my opinion on this until after the Ravens are done for the season, whether it be the AFCWCG or the Super Bowl. Only then can one have the proper perspective to view his progress.

[CapoRocky]

Let's just hope we win the last 2 games so people will stop calling Flacco "flunko", "stunko", and "flunccio."

[1/28/01]

We shouldnt at this stage. Franchise him and make him work under a new OC for a year.

[arnie_uk]

Mark Sanchez 5 years, 58.25 mil, pretty much 12 mil average, 20.5 mil guaranteed, 8 mil signing bonus. This year.
Ryan Fitzpatrick 7 year 62 mil, pretty much 9 average, 24 gu, 10 mil signing bonus. Last year.
Kevin kolb 6 years 63.5 mil, 10.5 average, 12 gu, 10 sign bonus. Last year.
Matt Schaub 5 years 66 mil, 13.2 average, 29.5 gu, 17.5 signing bonus. This year.
Vick 6 years 100 mil, 16.6 ave, 32.5 gu, 7 sign bonus, last year.
Carson palmer, 4 years 43 mil, pretty much 11 ave, 7.5 gu, no signing bonus. Last year.
Drew brees, 5 yr 100mil, 20 ave, 40 gu, 37 sign bonus. This year.

So he's better than everyone except brees, and arguably either way, Schaub. But Schaub was 5 years or so older than flacco. So you have to take that into consideration as well.

In summary market value dictates he deserves at least Schaub maybe a bit more for slight inflation adj the fact he is younger.

So anywhere between 13 and 15 per year is what market value is. You can work that by giving him a decent sized signing bonus, which will be guaranteed to spread the cap, or you could give him relatively low guaranteed money so to get out of the deal easily with little dead money.

[nextgen_RavensFan]

I tell you what if we go deep in the Play Offs the guys numbers are gonna go high and if he wins the Super Bowl His Price will sky rocket !! Is a good/bad situation with that contract. We want a Super Bowl but if and i hope we do win he just may be a bit out of our price range or we are going to have to cut costs in a lot of other areas. He will probably then not just be rich but future generations of his family rich.

[The Raven]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1356017409' post='1271578']
We shouldnt at this stage. Franchise him and make him work under a new OC for a year.
[/quote]

I never did want to franchise him, but I'm starting to like the idea. We need to figure out what his problem is.

[Alexir]

Tag. He needs one more year to prove he deserves an elite contract

[1/28/01]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1356023196' post='1271705']


I never did want to franchise him, but I'm starting to like the idea. We need to figure out what his problem is.
[/quote]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1356023467' post='1271713']
Tag. He needs one more year to prove he deserves an elite contract
[/quote]

Ya know, its crazy that there have been the over the top, no flaw-Flacco fans, the "he cant do anything right" fans and then the "tweeners". Yet, we are all kind of saying the same thing these days.

PROVE IT, Joe!!! Please!!!!!

[izvoodoo]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1356019121' post='1271618']
Mark Sanchez 5 years, 58.25 mil, pretty much 12 mil average, 20.5 mil guaranteed, 8 mil signing bonus. This year.
Ryan Fitzpatrick 7 year 62 mil, pretty much 9 average, 24 gu, 10 mil signing bonus. Last year.
Kevin kolb 6 years 63.5 mil, 10.5 average, 12 gu, 10 sign bonus. Last year.
Matt Schaub 5 years 66 mil, 13.2 average, 29.5 gu, 17.5 signing bonus. This year.
Vick 6 years 100 mil, 16.6 ave, 32.5 gu, 7 sign bonus, last year.
Carson palmer, 4 years 43 mil, pretty much 11 ave, 7.5 gu, no signing bonus. Last year.
Drew brees, 5 yr 100mil, 20 ave, 40 gu, 37 sign bonus. This year.

So he's better than everyone except brees, and arguably either way, Schaub. But Schaub was 5 years or so older than flacco. So you have to take that into consideration as well.

In summary market value dictates he deserves at least Schaub maybe a bit more for slight inflation adj the fact he is younger.

So anywhere between 13 and 15 per year is what market value is. You can work that by giving him a decent sized signing bonus, which will be guaranteed to spread the cap, or you could give him relatively low guaranteed money so to get out of the deal easily with little dead money.
[/quote]

Yeah, people hear saying 10-11 million don't reaize the market for quarterbacks.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1356023467' post='1271713']
Tag. He needs one more year to prove he deserves an elite contract
[/quote]
The problem with the Franchise Tag is it greatly hinders the ability to sign other players. I think the FO knows what they have in Flacco and want to keep him long term. Its just a matter of working out the details.

[bMore Heathen]

The telling stat imo is completion percentage. Last year and this year he's right around 50. That's not elite...

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='bMore Heathen' timestamp='1356033231' post='1271915']
The telling stat imo is completion percentage. Last year and this year he's right around 50. That's not elite...
[/quote]

Like most elements of his game, his accuracy is wildly inconsistent. Still, it's pretty tough to maintain a high completion percentage when so many of your throws are deep.

[Ravenseconbeast]

Alex Smith money. Which is 3 years-24mill.


If his agent Linta wants to take him somewhere else, Go for it.

[TT_05_Stang]

Last year we were a catch away... This year, we have a crappy OL. I dont see any changes in Flacco from last year, EXCEPT that he is being hurried 7 times, yes 7 TIMES more than last year... He is getting hit, and stripped, from the blindside. Now should he have improved? Yes, but the majority believes his improvement was hampered by Cam.

HOWEVER... I would be conservative, with huge incentives...

[Ravenseconbeast]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1356019121' post='1271618']
Mark Sanchez 5 years, 58.25 mil, pretty much 12 mil average, 20.5 mil guaranteed, 8 mil signing bonus. This year.
Ryan Fitzpatrick 7 year 62 mil, pretty much 9 average, 24 gu, 10 mil signing bonus. Last year.
Kevin kolb 6 years 63.5 mil, 10.5 average, 12 gu, 10 sign bonus. Last year.
Matt Schaub 5 years 66 mil, 13.2 average, 29.5 gu, 17.5 signing bonus. This year.
Vick 6 years 100 mil, 16.6 ave, 32.5 gu, 7 sign bonus, last year.
Carson palmer, 4 years 43 mil, pretty much 11 ave, 7.5 gu, no signing bonus. Last year.
Drew brees, 5 yr 100mil, 20 ave, 40 gu, 37 sign bonus. This year.

So he's better than everyone except brees, and arguably either way, Schaub. But Schaub was 5 years or so older than flacco. So you have to take that into consideration as well.

In summary market value dictates he deserves at least Schaub maybe a bit more for slight inflation adj the fact he is younger.

So anywhere between 13 and 15 per year is what market value is. You can work that by giving him a decent sized signing bonus, which will be guaranteed to spread the cap, or you could give him relatively low guaranteed money so to get out of the deal easily with little dead money.
[/quote]

Aside from Brees & Matt Schaub, rest of those 5 players you mentioned will be forced to take a pay cut or be dumped.

Alot of those bad teams took a big hit taking a big risk in FA. They wont repeat that move again so they'll draft a fresh QB.

So those values really don't dictate what Flacco's contract will be next year.

[The Raven]

[quote name='Ravenseconbeast' timestamp='1356034069' post='1271945']
Aside from Brees & Matt Schaub, rest of those 5 players you mentioned will be forced to take a pay cut or be dumped.

Alot of those bad teams took a big hit taking a big risk in FA. They wont repeat that move again so they'll draft a fresh QB.

So those values really don't dictate what Flacco's contract will be next year.
[/quote]

The values do dictate it. That's the market value. Period. No debating it. You're the only one who doesn't realize the market value of a QB.

[Dfence4champs2052]

[quote name='CapoRocky' timestamp='1355963304' post='1271096']
If the tag is 14.5, then I'd sign him for 11 per year for 5 years with about 30-35 guaranteed. I'd also like us to draft a decent rookie like A. J. McCarron to be waiting in the wings if we need to jettison Flacco before the contract is up.
[/quote]

Seriously? McCarron is McElroy 2.0.... Both mediocre. And ima Alabama fan. We need to look elsewhere he's a mini-Joe.