Merged: Week 13 Comments on Offense

[Guest RBates]

[quote name='K-Dog' timestamp='1354503082' post='1243851']
Thats not a bad thing.
[/quote]It is when its not working =====Average Joe is his new name until further notice.

[burnell]

1. Unbalanced running attack, only 38% of plays were runs, ZERO runs in opening drive,
2. too many third and longs. thats due to not gaining positive yards on 1st and 2nd down. Rice only had 1 pass so Cam not only ignored the run, he ignorned the screens, except to Leach on the other side.
3. Zero Rice touches / catches in 4th quarter and only 13 for entire game. In most of our wins Rice carrys/catches for 25-steelers, 30-chargers, 27-browns, 26-browns,25-patriots, 17-cowboys (which Ravens almost lost)
Rice carrys/catches in losses: 13-steelers, 14-texans, 22-eagles

[AsianRice]

Cam needs to sit in the booth to see what's working and not working; however, he's a stubborn, not sure will work for him but it's worth a try.....

[ravensdfan]

[quote name='burnell' timestamp='1354545991' post='1244580']
1. Unbalanced running attack, only 38% of plays were runs, ZERO runs in opening drive,
2. too many third and longs. thats due to not gaining positive yards on 1st and 2nd down. Rice only had 1 pass so Cam not only ignored the run, [b]he ignorned the screens, except to Leach on the other side.[/b]
3. Zero Rice touches / catches in 4th quarter and only 13 for entire game. In most of our wins Rice carrys/catches for 25-steelers, 30-chargers, 27-browns, 26-browns,25-patriots, 17-cowboys (which Ravens almost lost)
Rice carrys/catches in losses: 13-steelers, 14-texans, 22-eagles
[/quote]

This too. I kept saying all game, running Rice up the middle on the Steelers' D is not going to be effective the majority of the time. We needed plays that got the ball to Rice in space. We did it once. And he scored. smh. Take Cam out of the offense, period. Hand it to Joe. Sure, we'll have some growing pains, but he's shown the few times they've given him control that our offense is way more productive when Joe has the control.

[Ravens>Steelers]

It blows my mind how these coaches don't realize that Ray Rice needs to get the ball 20-25 times a game. Every loss as of late (even dating back to last year) with exception of the Texans blowout was because Rice did not get the ball enough. How can the coaches not realize the simple equation?? Low touches for rice = loss. It makes things worse when your QB is struggling and you don't hand off the ball. Mike Preston said it best earlier in the year, "The Ravens are the best defenders against Ray Rice because they don't give him the ball."

ps: It was also another classic stupid Harbaugh challenge that cost us. I was praying that the Steelers would run a play because I knew he was going to challenge it.

[H8R]

[quote name='Ravens>Steelers' timestamp='1354551441' post='1244756']
It blows my mind how these coaches don't realize that Ray Rice needs to get the ball 20-25 times a game. Every loss as of late (even dating back to last year) with exception of the Texans blowout was because Rice did not get the ball enough. How can the coaches not realize the simple equation?? Low touches for rice = loss. It makes things worse when your QB is struggling and you don't hand off the ball. Mike Preston said it best earlier in the year, "The Ravens are the best defenders against Ray Rice because they don't give him the ball."

ps: It was also another classic stupid Harbaugh challenge that cost us. I was praying that the Steelers would run a play because I knew he was going to challenge it.
[/quote]

I'm tired of this line.... Pierce did a GREAT job. Rice had ONE large run that went the distance... Lets not forget though, previous to that run he was CRAP. I'm sick of people saying this...

[Twistidfunk]

Mind boggling isn't it?

Other teams know this. Other fans know this. Our own players know this! The whole league knows it! Why can't our own guys, who get paid to do this, see it?

I have had it with Cameron. I try and give the guy his chances but this is the end for me. Losing yesterday is just another slammed door in the season.

[ratedr]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1354551986' post='1244770']


I'm tired of this line.... Pierce did a GREAT job. Rice had ONE large run that went the distance... Lets not forget though, previous to that run he was CRAP. I'm sick of people saying this...
[/quote]Every time you give Rice the ball he has a chance to break one of those runs. It's part of the game, you can't take it away.

[CalvinSmoke]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1354551986' post='1244770']
I'm tired of this line.... Pierce did a GREAT job. Rice had ONE large run that went the distance... Lets not forget though, previous to that run he was CRAP. I'm sick of people saying this...
[/quote]Bernard Pierce was trucking it. Your right, we might be seeing a different approach to our running game.

[H8R]

[quote name='ratedr' timestamp='1354552423' post='1244788']
Every time you give Rice the ball he has a chance to break one of those runs. It's part of the game, you can't take it away.
[/quote]

The point is, Rice needs to PLAY BETTER. He's been more inconsistent then Flacco this year. Rice is great player, but not above criticism. My thing is/was, RUN the ball... We ran the ball... It just wasnt Rice all the time.

[TreTheRaven]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1354551986' post='1244770']
I'm tired of this line.... Pierce did a GREAT job.[b] Rice had ONE large run that went the distance.[/b].. Lets not forget though, previous to that run he was CRAP. I'm sick of people saying this...
[/quote]

He did have a yard 10 yard rush on the next carry, after that touchdown though. After that -- no more touches.

[Militant X 1]

i've said this over and over and over again and my mind has not changed. imo, the Ravens "identity" is running the rock! period! imo, everything works off of that once it has been clearly established (i.e. PA's, screens, slants, curls and in and out routes, pitches, tosses, sweeps and draws with the occasional.....and i do mean....occasional deep ball!). am i saying that the Ravens should keep running even IF it is not working? c'mon! absolutely not! smh! however, all of this offensive going back and forth and trying to be a "multiple" offense (no huddle one minute, focus on the run the next, then run the deep passes the majority of the game etc.) is not working! sure, we definitely need to be creative in the play calling..that's understandable. but do you cats remember back in the day when we had and praised our "3-headed monster?" (i.e. Rice, McGahee and McClain) what about our "unbalanced" formations used for running the rock? where is that lately? as long as our team keeps "trying" to make Flacco a top-tier passing QB in this league....by having him air it out deep...drive after drive....our team will suffer cause he is not that! he is our QB and all we need him to do...is to do what we need him to do. nothing less...nothing more! imo, you need a stout O-line to run this deep passing offense. we don't have that! imo, it is easier for the O-line to push back the defense on run plays than it is to hold them off on passing plays. so, get back to doing what you are built to do Ravens....run the rock...good things will happen in all other areas of the offense (i.e. airing it out for big gains etc.) when you do.

~Mili

[Ravens>Steelers]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1354551986' post='1244770']
I'm tired of this line.... Pierce did a GREAT job. Rice had ONE large run that went the distance... Lets not forget though, previous to that run he was CRAP. I'm sick of people saying this...
[/quote]
are you serious? Rice can take it the distance on any play. That's why you give him the ball

[GotRice27?]

Rice and Pierce didn't get enough touches. 1, 2 combo was nice. Flacco lost the game. Dude just need to learn how to throw the ball away. I understand he's trying to make a play. But COME ON some plays he had all the time in the world back there. Heck he could of ran for some yards. Pierce was pounding up the middle fiercing, Rice was slicing and dicing, Flacco was well just being wakko.

[redrum52]

[quote name='Ravens>Steelers' timestamp='1354551441' post='1244756']
It blows my mind how these coaches don't realize that Ray Rice needs to get the ball 20-25 times a game. Every loss as of late (even dating back to last year) with exception of the Texans blowout was because Rice did not get the ball enough. How can the coaches not realize the simple equation?? Low touches for rice = loss. It makes things worse when your QB is struggling and you don't hand off the ball. Mike Preston said it best earlier in the year, "The Ravens are the best defenders against Ray Rice because they don't give him the ball."

ps: It was also another classic stupid Harbaugh challenge that cost us. I was praying that the Steelers would run a play because I knew he was going to challenge it.
[/quote]

LMAO. How true it is. When we ask Joe to step up against a top defense this is what we get. No steady movement or flow and Ray Rice looking from the sideline. Leach was used more in the 4th than Rice. The coordinator is arrogant and our qb is stupid or does stupid things. Harbaugh shouldn't even be allowed to hold the flags anymore. Let Rossburg or Pees take control(and yes I know he's in the booth). This is that classic game we lose, and seem to every year, that burns us down the line.

[BALTIMOREFLACCO]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1354553007' post='1244806']
i've said this over and over and over again and my mind has not changed. imo, the Ravens "identity" is running the rock! period! imo, everything works off of that once it has been clearly established (i.e. PA's, screens, slants, curls and in and out routes, pitches, tosses, sweeps and draws with the occasional.....and i do mean....occasional deep ball!). am i saying that the Ravens should keep running even IF it is not working? c'mon! absolutely not! smh! however, all of this offensive going back and forth and trying to be a "multiple" offense (no huddle one minute, focus on the run the next, then run the deep passes the majority of the game etc.) is not working! sure, we definitely need to be creative in the play calling..that's understandable. but do you cats remember back in the day[b] when we had and praised our "3-headed monster?" (i.e. Rice, McGahee and McClain) what about our "unbalanced" formations used for running the rock? where is that lately? as long as our team keeps "trying" to make Flacco a top-tier passing QB in this league....by having him air it out deep...drive after drive....our team will suffer cause he is not that! [/b] he is our QB and all we need him to do...is to do what we need him to do. nothing less...nothing more! imo, you need a stout O-line to run this deep passing offense. we don't have that! imo, it is easier for the O-line to push back the defense on run plays than it is to hold them off on passing plays. so, get back to doing what you are built to do Ravens....run the rock...good things will happen in all other areas of the offense (i.e. airing it out for big gains etc.) when you do.

~Mili
[/quote]

I agree 100%

[Gordo52]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1354552740' post='1244797']
The point is, Rice needs to PLAY BETTER. He's been more inconsistent then Flacco this year. Rice is great player, but not above criticism. My thing is/was, RUN the ball... We ran the ball... It just wasnt Rice all the time.
[/quote]
Preach it

[ravensdfan]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1354551986' post='1244770']
I'm tired of this line.... Pierce did a GREAT job. Rice had ONE large run that went the distance... Lets not forget though, previous to that run he was CRAP. I'm sick of people saying this...
[/quote]

I concur. Rice was crap. Once again though, that's because the play kept calling for him to run right up the middle on the #1 defense. Rice is not a power back. If they had more plays that got him the ball in space though, I think he could have done better. Once again, "touches" does not mean runs necessarily.

[ravensdfan]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1354553007' post='1244806']
i've said this over and over and over again and my mind has not changed. imo, the Ravens "identity" is running the rock! period! imo, everything works off of that once it has been clearly established (i.e. PA's, screens, slants, curls and in and out routes, pitches, tosses, sweeps and draws with the occasional.....and i do mean....occasional deep ball!). am i saying that the Ravens should keep running even IF it is not working? c'mon! absolutely not! smh! however, all of this offensive going back and forth and trying to be a "multiple" offense (no huddle one minute, focus on the run the next, then run the deep passes the majority of the game etc.) is not working! sure, we definitely need to be creative in the play calling..that's understandable. but do you cats remember back in the day when we had and praised our "3-headed monster?" (i.e. Rice, McGahee and McClain) what about our "unbalanced" formations used for running the rock? where is that lately? as long as our team keeps "trying" to make Flacco a top-tier passing QB in this league....by having him air it out deep...drive after drive....our team will suffer cause he is not that! he is our QB and all we need him to do...is to do what we need him to do. nothing less...nothing more! imo, you need a stout O-line to run this deep passing offense. we don't have that! imo, it is easier for the O-line to push back the defense on run plays than it is to hold them off on passing plays. so, get back to doing what you are built to do Ravens....run the rock...good things will happen in all other areas of the offense (i.e. airing it out for big gains etc.) when you do.

~Mili
[/quote]

I agree and disagree. Flacco absolutely has the tools to be the "air it deep" QB. What's missing though is the set-up. You can't just air it deep, air it deep, air it deep. You can't run,run, pass (airing it deep). You can't run up the gut all the time. We didn't use the middle of the field except once. We didn't even use the sideline much. A Steelers' weakness. Flacco can put up the pretty numbers, our receivers can be successful. The problem is that does not just happen. He has to be able to audible, he has to have control. Not, here and there with limited play choices like Cam insists upon. He is a fifth year QB that Cam treats like a 2nd year. And because of that, his growth has been hindered as well. Not to mention, I swear after his rookie year, someone told him. "oh no. don't run if the play collapses." Because he had no problem taking off his rookie year and then it just stopped. Furthermore, if you don't have the O line to hold up, you can't keep running deep routes unless you're going to have Joe roll out or you've set up the pass action. There is so much wrong with the way the plays are called on this team it's beyond horrendous. Everyone, and I mean everyone, including the NFL pundits see it but Harbs & Steve won't let go of the problem.

[Tank 92]

[quote name='ravensdfan' timestamp='1354557517' post='1244919']


I agree and disagree. Flacco absolutely has the tools to be the "air it deep" QB. What's missing though is the set-up. You can't just air it deep, air it deep, air it deep. You can't run,run, pass (airing it deep). You can't run up the gut all the time. We didn't use the middle of the field except once. We didn't even use the sideline much. A Steelers' weakness. Flacco can put up the pretty numbers, our receivers can be successful. The problem is that does not just happen. He has to be able to audible, he has to have control. Not, here and there with limited play choices like Cam insists upon. He is a fifth year QB that Cam treats like a 2nd year. And because of that, his growth has been hindered as well. Not to mention, I swear after his rookie year, someone told him. "oh no. don't run if the play collapses." Because he had no problem taking off his rookie year and then it just stopped. Furthermore, if you don't have the O line to hold up, you can't keep running deep routes unless you're going to have Joe roll out or you've set up the pass action. There is so much wrong with the way the plays are called on this team it's beyond horrendous. Everyone, and I mean everyone, including the NFL pundits see it but Harbs & Steve won't let go of the problem.
[/quote]


This ^.....

[T3hRaven]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1354551986' post='1244770']
I'm tired of this line.... Pierce did a GREAT job. Rice had ONE large run that went the distance... Lets not forget though, previous to that run he was CRAP. I'm sick of people saying this...
[/quote]

Oh man, criticism for Rice. Way to speak the truth man, I'm tired of Rice for no gain being ignored as a problem. I don't know if it's necessarily his fault, but he's a very inconsistent runner and I think that plays into the offenses problems. When Rice doesn't get consistent yardage that generally puts us into 3rd and 10, which makes the whole offense look bad since you shouldn't be converting many of those.

[H8R]

[quote name='T3hRaven' timestamp='1354558036' post='1244938']
Oh man, criticism for Rice. Way to speak the truth man, I'm tired of Rice for no gain being ignored as a problem. I don't know if it's necessarily his fault, but he's a very inconsistent runner and I think that plays into the offenses problems. When Rice doesn't get consistent yardage that generally puts us into 3rd and 10, which makes the whole offense look bad since you shouldn't be converting many of those.
[/quote]


I agree. Rice ia a GREAT player by the numbers and very dangerous in space.. HOWEVER, he gets fat off of BAD defenses usually. Not that its his fault.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='H8R' timestamp='1354558388' post='1244958']


I agree. Rice ia a GREAT player by the numbers and very dangerous in space.. HOWEVER, he gets fat off of BAD defenses usually. Not that its his fault.
[/quote]
I agree with this statement. Rice is generally, save for a couple times against the Steelers, nowhere to be found against stout run defenses. Pierce by all accounts is a better natural runner in my opinion. We give the ball to Pierce 20 times last night and he would have run for over 100 on consistent gains that tires out the Steelers defense and actually makes the PA work.

[nextgen_RavensFan]

Here are a few comments from a spectator.

To start with it is a must that we take the ball away from our best player in the 4th quarter when we are trying to protect a lead. Also we need to keep Oher at LT and let McKinnie sit on the bench because that is a great idea. You have a quarterback with zero pocket presence so lets just play to that strength. Oh and instead of playing small ball lets thrown Bombs the entire 4th quarter because we want the other teams offense to get back on the field as soon as possible as our defense is playing so stellar.

Cam and Harbs the new Brain Trust of the NFL. Harb's accepts blame for the screw ups but does nothing to fix anything. Week after Week he says we will run the ball more and that just does not happen. Cam on the other hand is so stubborn and useless that he thinks he does no wrong when a majority of our wins we owe to the Defense and Special Teams.

[DocMartin]

Reality check. We cannot to expect win games with average offensive production. This Flacco's 188 yards passing is below average, Charlie Batch had 260 and he is 3rd string QB.
Cam's plan was to Air It Out, AGAIN, and it bite us in the [profanity deleted].
1) Always going for the deep pass
2) Only 1 pass to TE in the middle all game long
3) Not one sustaining drive, Flacco never got into the rhytm.
4) The best player on offense was Vonta Leach - fullback
I said it for 4 weeks now and I say it again, move Cam upstairs in the booth or you will get same results every week.

[1/28/01]

Flacco cant hit deep ball in stride.
Rice is underutilized.
No work over the middle.
Cam is a moron.
I hate football!!

[flynismo]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1354566130' post='1245158']
Cam is a moron.

[/quote]

Good job, you just managed to offend morons.... sigh..

[Bravens292]

theres no point in saying what cam should do because obviously he won't listen so this is what i want the next OC to do
1. This is sometimes overlooked but let JOE run the ball. make them respect his mobility. we know hes nimble so lets use it to our advantage. He doesn't exactly have bens mobility but its pretty close. i'm just saying he needs to be given more freedom to tuck it and run especially with how many times no one is open. If this is cams problem or joes problem i don't know but he was much more open to going out the pocket in 2010 and back. now cam has him looking like a statue the last 2 years.
2. Use the PA better. Its either we run from the shotgun like all game long or we go PA when we barely ran the ball. they won't respect the PA fake if you're not running the ball. what more on our offense is more effective than faking to the best RB in the league? but somehow we manage to epic fail the PA fake all day long.
3. USE TORREY CORRECTLY. Its like a sprint out there. i wouldn't blame him for asking for more rest because he probably runs a couple miles a game. i can't remember (if ever) the last time a quick slant was thrown to torrey to let him use his best ability - RAC. The last 2 years it has been Q that was misused and now Smith. you have to be kidding me.

if you ask me, these aern't hard things to correct. we have the talent to make it work.

[Purple_ICE 81]

Plain and simple, short and to the point- this offense needs CHANGE. Tired of the mediocrity its pain staking, especially given the offseason hype that lead us fans into thinking the Ravens offense would be elite, or atleast close to it. I feel like the Browns offense is clicking better than this offense...shoot the jaguars offense has even been better!Cam Cameron doesnt trust anyone but himself and for that he instills a high school pee-wee gameplan every week and for that we pay. He doesnt let Torrey run anything but the 9, and a slant/back shoulder or curl [b]once in a blue moon. [/b]Flacco looks bad I'll give you that, but so does our offensive line and obviously the feeble game calling and offensive scheme of things. We need a deeper playbook for our receivers and even our running game too. I feel like Cam has 3 plays per running/passing and of coarse the good ol end around haha. Like I said before he doesnt trust Torrey and must think he is still a 1 trick pony and doesnt give him barely any room to grow. The no huddle is transparent we completely gave up on it and I dont know why, Im not saying its the best gameplan but it helps...and Joe seems to prosper in it and we spent so much time trying to get it right in the offseason IDK why we are just throwing it out the door-->probably Cams idea. Also it seems like We are almost shifting towards a comittee approach in the backfield...this is not good. It needs to be 90-10 Rice-Pierce. Bernard is coming along great but Rice needs the bulk of the carries.

In a nut shell I think its the most obvious understatement of the century saying that our offense needs a change, Cam needs to go anyone will suffice, Flacco+receivers need to step up...Rice needs to step up he hasnt played too well this season. And I am one of those fans hoping for an elite passing game this offseason and at this point...F- it. Cam needs to go back to handing the ball to Rice 30 times because he is the only consistent piece we have. Screw a balanced attack, I think we just need to give the ball to the best player on our team and let hime go to work. Quite honestly I dont think our offense will be able tio lead us to the super bowl and I really hope they dont because I think I speak for Ravens nation when I say we want a new GD Offensive coordinator, and no matter if Cam Cameron has 0 offensive production in the playoffs, if for some reason we made it to the super bowl he would be resigned its just the way things are.

[NJ-Raven]

[size=4]Before I start, let me say I am a HUGE Joe Flacco supoorter, so don't think think this is a Flacco Bashin Post. This is Joe's 5th season and he is by far The best QB we have ever had in our short history IMO. It is also my opinion that we have all of the nesecary parts for a [b]consitently [/b]explosive offense. So why don't we have it???? I have only 3 ideas. #1 COACHING: At times Cam has called great games, but then there are games that vleave you scratching your head. Yeah I no defenses gameplan but the Texans did more than plan, it seemed like they had a spy in the lockeroom. #2 PLAYERS: This is a little unlikely with players like Q, Ray Rice, Pitta, Leach, and company. I know they believe in their QB but again at times it looks like they are beat from the start. and #3 JOE FLACCO: Is it possible that he just does not have the ability to take it to the next level and stay there? I understand every QB has a bad game or two, but when this eason started, there was no way you could tell me Joe wouldn't pass for 4,000 yards and that he wasn't ELITE.Now I must admit, even I question his eliteness. Ravens Nation, help me understand because playing like we have for the last couiple weeks will not make it against much stronger teams than the steelers. [b]WHAT WILL IT TAKE[/b] for the Ravens to permanently be in the conversation of Super Bowl contenders???[/size]