Merged: What's up with the run game?

[Ravensfan23]

I think Ray Rice would flourish in a spread, single back type offense. He's often compared to Marshall Faulk and I agree 100%. As many have mentioned, Rice seems to struggle staying true to his FB, despite how often it proves to be the best thing to do. Ray isn't a very patient runner imo.

Ray seems to run much better when the defense is spread out and he's able to pick his holes, no brainer right? haha Who wouldn't have success running against a 5 man defensive front. I actually think the Ravens overall offense fits that spread running style, because you want to be able to get all your guys onto the field, but still be able to run the ball at well.

In most cases the RB makes the FB and oline look great. Ray Rice does make his blockers look good, but he has the potential to make them look much better. I notice Rice getting tripped up at the LOS by his own players and being mad because the hole was huge. But if he just shows a bit more patience, he's be able to explode through that hole and rush for those big totals. Most times when you see a RB go for 100+ yards, it's because he had about 3-5 rushing attempts that went for 12+. I think Rice's patience is what causes him to miss out on those 3-5 rushes per game.

[Moderator 3]

People! It's Steelers Week. Trolls will come out of the woodwork. Please don't feed them.

[Tank 92]

[quote name='allballs' timestamp='1352842639' post='1218382']
rice, sadly, is going to be a bust, i told you guys last year , and this year, he's another marian barber, thats why we pulled that franchise move, but we gave in... i didnt 4get the indy playoff game, the pit playoff game, ...the front office did. i mean you find a running back anywhere. and we are gravitating to molding flacco into that 100 million dollar qb, so why would u give rice 40? look at what foster did in houston when he was only making $605,000. and never complained, listen to what he said sunday night. no arrogance. dwyer, for pit, guarantee you he outrun rice....
[/quote]


Yeah, we suck. Flacco, Rice, pfftt....

[size=1]just go away please[/size]

[arnie_uk]

[quote name='Moderator 3' timestamp='1352934748' post='1219274']
People! It's Steelers Week. Trolls will come out of the woodwork. Please don't feed them.
[/quote]hes been doing it long before now and yet he's still here

[RayLewisHOF2012]

Ray Rice needs to find better holes. We need to be more careful too. Maybe we need to fake it before we run.

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1352936901' post='1219312']
hes been doing it long before now and yet he's still here
[/quote]

Just ignore him then. I actually find it easy since the way he writes hurts my eyes every time I actually try to read it.

[jdynamite]

The run game has slowed up seemingly right along with Harewood's exit from playing. He was creating some gashes on runs early on...

Bobby Williams I thought he shoulda been benched after the Dallas game I think it was, which ever game where he just didn't block anyone at all for 2 or 3 plays in a row. Wait it may have been the texans game because I remember he and McKinnie both watching people run by them like idiots.

[jdynamite]

The run game has slowed up seemingly right along with Harewood's exit from playing. He was creating some gashes on runs early on...

Bobby Williams I thought he shoulda been benched after the Dallas game I think it was, which ever game where he just didn't block anyone at all for 2 or 3 plays in a row. Wait it may have been the texans game because I remember he and McKinnie both watching people run by them like idiots.

I didn't mind if Harewood made the occasional mental error because he was essentially learning on the job but a long time veteran it's not acceptable.

I'm hoping Jah Reid or Harewood can get more playing time this last half of the season.

[PeRK82]

The Run game has looked awful. Don't know if that has to do with the O LINE ( probably a little no matter what ) or Rice not being able to run it.

B.Pierce has looked amazing, the guy just keeps plays alive.

I think he (B.Pierce) should be getting a LOT more carries, i know that sounds crazy but..... i think he gets more consistent yardage than Rice. Rice has been getting tackled by the shoe strings and going down.

Im not Knocking Rice at all but ill be honest , im not the biggest fan anymore ( ever since he put on that extra weight )

I think Rice is the most dangerous RB for Check downs. He is also great in the WR spread, if Rice was a couple inches taller he would have been a GREAT WR. Dude has Marshall Faulk Hands.

[baltravens]

[quote name='allballs' timestamp='1352842639' post='1218382']
rice, sadly, is going to be a bust, i told you guys last year , and this year, he's another marian barber, thats why we pulled that franchise move, but we gave in... i didnt 4get the indy playoff game, the pit playoff game, ...the front office did. i mean you find a running back anywhere. and we are gravitating to molding flacco into that 100 million dollar qb, so why would u give rice 40? look at what foster did in houston when he was only making $605,000. and never complained, listen to what he said sunday night. no arrogance. dwyer, for pit, guarantee you he outrun rice....
[/quote]
Rice = bust? It is kinda like, dude, wake up. If you'd like, I will shake you to wake you up in time for game time. Rice is essential to making the Super Bowl.

[HoldingCall]

[quote name='PolishRifle' timestamp='1352848155' post='1218470']
Yup, Rice is on his way to another 1000+ yards rushing season and might reach another carreer high in TDs scored. The danger he poses for opposing defenses helpes our passing game and he still remains one of Flaccos best options to keep the chains moving in the receiving game. So lets complain about his production, because clearly we ran out of things to complain about.

We have the second best record in the AFC, you guys, lets not set a new record for "the most spoiled fanbase in the NFL" and stick with legit complains (here is a hint: It's not the offense!).
[/quote]

Well stated!

[HoldingCall]

[quote name='allballs' timestamp='1352925826' post='1219161']
as i've quoted b4, i would have got rid of both of them(pit, playoffs '11). when you keep exiting the playoffs the same way, by the same players, thats when you make the change, you don't pay them more money and think they're gonna play harder... draft position only indicates pay scale, and when high price high picks, cost you more than theyre worth, you get rid of them...tom brady 6th round, 3 rings. dominated peyton for a long time. kurt warner, bagging groceries at acme or 'superfresh'.
terrell davis, 6th round, 2000 yd rusher, helped elway over to lombardi land , emmitt wasnt highly touted he got 3. trust me, i want ust to win more than you, if flacco and rice MAKE THE PLAYS IN THE PLAYOFFS, we will be the next afc dynasty before they're done, brady's near his end with peyton, ben had his day 2/3 rings, its our time, cincy and cleveland are making strides, we gotta get this now, i mean 3 of the next 5 rings...
[/quote]

Considering that it is much easier to destroy a team than to build one, who would you replace them with and how would you ensure you get the picks you want/need?

[Purple Punishment]

I love Ray Rice just as much as the next guy but in short yardage and against physical defenses, he just isnt getting it done. Pierce has shown the ability to run better in that aspect. I know I am not the only one that has noticed this. When we are sitting there with 3rd and 2, Im thinking, man I love rice but he isnt the guy I want trying to move the pile. Nothing against Ray. Chime in with your thoughts

[rmw10]

This is exactly what I was thinking. He doesn't dance. He finds the hole and hits it. Great for short yardage.

[T3hRaven]

I said this in the game thread. The kid has talent, let's give him a shot. It can't be any worse than tonight was.

[ravensdfan]

We also have a tank at fullback in Leach.

I hate when we are third and short. It's getting to the point that the play calling is so bad in that situation, I almost wish it was third and long.

[Purple Punishment]

Exactly, I hate seeing Rice take the ball in the crowd and get a yard or stonewalled.

[TXRaven]

I can't lie. I am a little worried about the run game. The last few games the Ravens have been trying to give Rice more touches but he has not seemed to be able to get it going leaving things to the passing game. it hurts because it really takes away the play action which we have great sucsess with.

[BenMir]

Bring back Harewood..Please

[Ed_Reed20]

Over the last three games, Rice has 173 yards on 48 carries (3.6 avg). The o-line shuffling has definitely had an effect. It seems the team can only pick up quality yardage running to the right.

[3-4ravdef509]

20 attempts, 40 yards, yet not once did I see us try to attack the middle of the field, which should have been open considering how they were game planning to take Smith out of the game and were also focused so hard on the run game. I love ray rice but he isn't superman.the fact that pita went down hurts, but Dickson was absent and we Could have send Doss or Boldin over the middle and into the slot. Why is this offense so pathetic on the road? Because we feel obligated top give Rice his touches when we should really just take what the opponent gives us because we have the weapons to attack anywhere on the field. Shop when our opponent tries to take away the run why are we so stubborn? Are Garnish and Can this daft? Our am I missing something? Thoughts?

[Ed_Reed20]

The offense has to try and establish the run because the passing game isn't consistently good enough to generate yards without play-action or run-fakes. Part of that execution, part of that is the play-book.

[callahan09]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1353330448' post='1225797']
Over the last three games, Rice has 173 yards on 48 carries (3.6 avg). The o-line shuffling has definitely had an effect. It seems the team can only pick up quality yardage running to the right.
[/quote]

And in the last two games he has only 75 yards on 33 carries, under 2.3 yards per attempt.

[arnie_uk]

You can't just abandon the run. The issue was we were getting stonewalled up the middle with rice yet he kept going back to it. There was one counter which went for eight yards and one stretch went for about 4. Everything else by my recollection was up the gut.

Remember the browns game were we had tosses, fake fb half back tosses, counters, mis directions. That's what was needed last night to help the run game out.

[I AM LEGEND]

When they pointed out what ryan clark kept doing to disrupt torrey smith, I thought to myself why they werent using Ed Dickson more in the middle of the field...however by keeping Ed in to block we really did a good job of protecting Joe...the oline imo was very good last night..

I wouldve liked to have seen more torrey or jacoby in the slot though once I saw ryan clark essentially doubling smith..that wouldve gave us a chance to attack the middle with speed and make them pay for what they were doing defensively. .

However back to your point on establishing the run. you have to..it keeps a defense honest..and more importantly sets up for the playaction (that we didn't run nearly as much as we should have)...so I didn't mind running the ball..I just hate how it didn't set us up for anything even remotely positive..

[callahan09]

Someone said in another thread that Cam wasn't creative because he didn't have to be to win the game and didn't want to tip his hand for the next game in two weeks. People said Cam isn't that smart but I think it might still be true that that was his plan. We know from past seasons experience that Cam likes to play the passing game a lot early in the season so he can save Rice and lean on him in December and January. That's why Flacco always throws the ball a ton early in the season and much less later while Rice carries it much more later in the year.

Wouldn't surprise me if he does things like that in terms of trying to save the gameplan and play book for later games so the opponent won't know what's going to hit them. The problem is that sometimes this deception means we lose a game we could've won but it also probably allows us to win a game we might've lost later. And this particular time we won this game and are in a great position to win the next meeting against the Steelers, so I have nothing to complaint about. He gambled that we could win this game even if he was being conservative and it worked. Now lets destroy their asses in two weeks, eh!

[I AM LEGEND]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1353330982' post='1225807']
You can't just abandon the run. The issue was we were getting stonewalled up the middle with rice yet he kept going back to it. There was one counter which went for eight yards and one stretch went for about 4. Everything else by my recollection was up the gut.

Remember the browns game were we had tosses, fake fb half back tosses, counters, mis directions. That's what was needed last night to help the run game out.
[/quote]

This is Steelers vs Ravens tho...these are ultimate chess matches most of the time...if given the latter I'd probably go ultra conservative like cam did last night over getting too cute and opening the playbook..the fact remains that once we went up 6..the pressure shifted to the steelers to make big plays happen with a hurt back up qb..

[BenMir]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' timestamp='1353331240' post='1225814']
When they pointed out what ryan clark kept doing to disrupt torrey smith, I thought to myself why they werent using Ed Dickson more in the middle of the field...however by keeping Ed in to block we really did a good job of protecting Joe...the oline imo was very good last night..

I wouldve liked to have seen more torrey or jacoby in the slot though once I saw ryan clark essentially doubling smith..that wouldve gave us a chance to attack the middle with speed and make them pay for what they were doing defensively. .

However back to your point on establishing the run. you have to..it keeps a defense honest..and more importantly sets up for the playaction (that we didn't run nearly as much as we should have)...so I didn't mind running the ball..I just hate how it didn't set us up for anything even remotely positive..
[/quote]
Agreed about the pass blocking. I think 2 of those sacks are on Joe/coverage sacks

[3-4ravdef509]

Yes, I understand you can't abandon the run, but you don't have to lean on it when it isn't working. If the play calling was conservative so as too not tip our hand then we better be lights out come play off time. There's conservative and then there's being asinine. I felt like we were playing not to lose, which is fine when you're up more than one scores which we never really were.

[The Raven]

Pierce please! There were at least two short yardage situations where Rice would have had it if he put his head down.